The Big Picture: There Will Never Be Another Watchmen

[Vault101]

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arnt half of those owned my DC/Marvel anyway? like image?

I seem to be favour Vertigo (are they owned by DC?) , anyway after recently getting inot comics the state of the industry is somthing that I am now obligated to give a shit about....though I dont know much about it...its not good is it?

snip?

Ive been reading alot of comics latly, and only one has been about a superhero (spawn)

 

[punipunipyo]

Agreed, I like the movie version better, WAY better, because it actually made sense! (MOVIE) That's why blue man's gotta go away, because the world hates him now, and I also love the cut out the newspaper stand, and the comic books... just because it's time saver, but they added the boy, and the newspaper stand old guy in the explosion, just so people who read the book knows that the source materials were not "forgotten", just left out because of time constrain... love the fights, and REALLY LOVE THAT TRAILER! yes, to me, the movie IS BETTER than the book, for it's devotion toward "true to source materials"!

 

[Mr_Jellyfish]

Nicely put Moviebob, although that ending wasn't my problem with the Watchman film, for me the general tone was all off, Snyder's world was heavily stylised where as it would have had more impact if it were played for reals. For me the Watchman films was a series of little problems that added up to make an underwhelming film, and Snyder's direction didn't do much to improve matters, he is the new Joel Schumacher after all haha: http://gorillafilmmagazineblog.wordpress.com/2011/08/05/zack-snyder-is-the-new-joel-schumacher/

But yeah, I'm actually surprised it took them this long to start exploiting the Watchman series in this way. It's certainly a story that doesn't need to be added to, so it'll be a real shame if people go out and buy these new comics.

I haven't read comics since I was a kid (and even then it was mostly Spider-man and 2000AD) so I don't know what the industry is like at the moment, but it would be nice if people started coming up with new iconic heroes that better reflected a new generation, rather than holding onto characters that were created in the 30s...

 

[Woem]

By the way: DC has a new logo starting last month: http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/01/13/dc-comics-gets-logo-here/

 

[bravetoaster]

Comic watchmen's ending: Makes sense
Movie's ending: Doesn't make sense.

And that's all I can say without going in to spoiler territory.

Given the amount of set-up necessary to pull off the comic's ending, I was actually okay with the movie's ending not making sense--or at least I could look the other way. The problem, for me, with the movie, was (aside from some of the truly awful acting and the jarringly awful score) how the characters were re-written (throughout the story and in the very end).

Spoiler

Maybe nobody else took this from the original comic, but what drew me in--and seemed to be one of the major themes of the work--was that most of the characters really were pretty normal, flawed people. So the cartoonish, impossible violence of the film (what with breaking more baddies' bones than Tony Jaa, causing compound fractures left and right) took me out of it and seemed to convey the message "These aren't normal people, these are superheroes."

When I first read the comic and got to the end, I'm pretty sure I just froze, turned to my wife, and cried. In the end of the comic, the only "hero" who objects at all to the revealed (evil, ends-justify-the-means) plan gets murdered--no one else cares. In the movie, instead of compromising their morals, integrity, honesty, and belief in/love for humanity, all the characters are outraged by the revelation of the plan.

Perhaps I was taking something away from the story that no one else took from it, but most of the movie was so loyal to the comic--why suddenly make this small change that dramatically alters the entire message of the film?

 

[Frost27]

I found Watchmen to be pretty much awful to be honest, but the concept of a much later new writer prequel is something that just reeks of bad idea.

Prequels never work period.

 

[lead sharp]

With perhaps a slightly differing view I beat ya' to the punchline...

http://fourcolouralchemy.blogspot.com/

We even used some of the same imagery.

I think what bugs me is the most is two things.

1. That somehow this detracts from the original work. How? No one is pulling a Lucas and changing anything to do with the original and as I say, it stands by itself, no one is forcing anyone to buy it/accept it/acknowledge it as 'cannon'.

2. It's preventing the creators on these comics from creating 'new' work. How? The only one on there who might have trouble doing more than one book is JMS and he's still doing The Twelve (after how many years?). Point of fact these guys have been writing for DC and Marvel for a long time, how is that not the same as Before Watchmen? No one is saying they can't work on other things they've just been given an opportunity to play with someone else's cool toys.

 

[lead sharp]

Apologise I had to do the 'I agree' thing it made me double post somehow

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

Film ending was better as it was the big bluff to make humanity work together - i liked that he fooled the world. The book failed as it gave an obvious reason for humans to work together. Sounds vague....but don't want to spoiler it. Look it up on wikipedia if you want to know.

I say wait till the comics are out and read them. If they suck then bin them, if they are great then excellent. Fans are the worst people to get opinions from, like with Heath playing joker....all the bitching about that. If the movies people listened to fans their would be no Dark Knight movie and no Heath Joker.

Also Alan Moore can fuck off, he sold the writes to the characters so no point him moaning. If he hates DC then just self publish, but i guess he doesnt want to use his own money for that.

We dont need another Watchman, we just want another writer/artist to come up with the next new thing. Same with movies and music. They will come along eventually.

 

[Zom-B]

There Will Never Be Another Watchmen

You may as well stop asking about it.

Watch Video

Mark "Wide"? You meant, Mark Waid with an "aid" right? Or is Neil Gaiman now Neil Guyman?

 

[AdamRBi]

I read a quote by DC on this subject. It went along the lines of "A publisher's responsibility is to keep all their characters relevant," which is what is at the heart of all this fuss as I see it. It's a half finished statement that just seems to focus on current characters and reinventing them instead of shepherding new ideas and characters that readers may be able to enter into more freely.

The former is easier to market though and usually more profitable. It's also easier for writers and artist, who at this point are just writing and drawing official fan-comics. Not the worst thing you can do,especially for the artists, but if that's the backbone of your business plan you're never going to publish the next Watchmen.

I could state my opinions on why I felt the book ending, just in a scaring countries to work together sense, works better but would have dragged the film out, but this topic isn't really about that.

 

[rembrandtqeinstein]

I would be perfectly happy with a Rorschach movie. Like Dark Knight but with less brooding and more murdering.

And they have a perfect setup. He was the only one who didn't quit when capes were disbanded. So what happened to him between that time and the start of the Watchmen story?

I'm still holding out for a movie or Game of Thrones quality series of this:

 

[Calendor1]

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arnt half of those owned my DC/Marvel anyway? like image?

I seem to be favour Vertigo (are they owned by DC?) , anyway after recently getting inot comics the state of the industry is somthing that I am now obligated to give a shit about....though I dont know much about it...its not good is it?

snip?

Ive been reading alot of comics latly, and only one has been about a superhero (spawn)

No, none of those are. DC has Vertigo and Marvel has Icon, but the ones I mentioned are completely separate companies. Image is a company that publishes creator-owned comics without taking part in any ownership of the characters. It is the most diverse and creator-friendly comic company there is, and they publish a wide range of genres. It's my favorite company. Image, IDW, Dark Horse, Oni Press, Archaia, and many others are examples of non-Marvel/DC related companies where you can find great, original comics.

 

[SandroTheMaster]

Is Bob ever gonna talk about Vertigo in his Comics Are Weird?

 

[The Random One]

"There. Are you satisfied? No? OK. COMICS ARE WEIRD!"

Then I was satisfied, so the whole episode was kind of a bonus.

I think there won't be anything else like Watchman because nowadays if a writer has a crazy new idea for a comic he'll publish it independently, or put it online, or both. Hell, Warren Ellis published Freakangels as a webcomic; it's no Watchman, but it's certainly pushing boundaries (let's try to put a graphic rape scene on a DC/Marvel comic to see if they're cool with it). While a freer venue for creators, it's also bound to create some fragmentation of the fan base, as usually only big fans will seek those out, while Watchman was just a regular mainstream comic that everyone knew about. There are no more Alan Moores nowadays pushing the mainstream, they all left.

It's not that they shouldn't make the prequels because it's Alan Moor's characters.
They shouldn't make the prequels because it's Watchmen.

I don't have this sort of reverent appreciation for Watchman, but I can tell it's a complete work that needs no further elaboration; in fact, any apparent gap it leaves behind is deliberate and meant to foster ambiguity. I know I won't be buying the prequels, and if more geeks had a smidgen of self control to not buy things they do not like being published we would be seeing a lot less money grabs such as these.

 

[kuros_overkill]

2 things
1: good comics, you have to check out Atomic Robo.
2: my opinion on watchmen ending, the books version was vastly Superior. here is a take that rarely comes up:

I don't care about the squid one way or the other, In fact at first I shrugged my sholders and said, squid/Manhattan frame job, same diff. But then I got thinking about the larger picture, and I can't stand the move ending anymore. My issue is with the conveyed message. The novel (also having been published while the fear of the cold war was still a very fresh memory) ended with the message "We (as a species) have to put our differences aside, and learn to work together if we hope to survive the into coming millennium." (remember - published pre 2000) - in the movie the final message is "Play nice or god will punish you." I have MAJOR issues with this change, and I believe it undermined the integrity of the work as a whole.