The Elder Scrolls Online Will Have Subscription Fees

[Sight Unseen]

I don't understand the resistance to a subscription model.

Guild Wars 2 supports itself by putting all that shiny stuff for you to buy on the store, and it's not cheap either. A new armor skin is 10 dollars, and a new weapon can be about as much too. To even change your character's appearance costs 5 bucks, and don't get me started on how they managed to monetize the ever living crud out of dyes.

I, personally, don't like that. When I pay a subscription, I know that when I log in, I get all those weapons, all that armor, all the functionality and inventory space, everything for one cost up front. I don't have to play the "Let's roll the dice for the dye I want" at 2 dollars a pop. That dye will drop from a mob, in game, or be accessible to me through a tradeskill.

Subscriptions also give the company more peace of mind in the long run. They're more stable, easier to predict the bottom line of.

15$ a month is NOTHING, also. The cost of going to a movie for two hours of entertainment costs about as much. If the game is good, and has a wealth of content, you're going to spend dozens of hours a month on the thing should you have the time, and hundreds of hours a year, all for a little north of 100$ per year. Hell, a new game at launch costs about as much.

Again, looking for a good reason to rally so hardcore against something like this. If someone tells me that "They just don't get the time worth the subscription", I will ask if they have seen a film in the theater at all during that timeframe... because you just spent more for less overall entertainment.

You do realize you will also be paying that initial 60 on top of the subscription cost right

Do you have a source for this? As far as I know this has never been confirmed anywhere. Maybe it's just a free download once they receive your subscription payment. Until I see a confirmed source for this I'm going to be skeptical of that.

Spoiler: Spoilered quote due to length

I don't really get why everyone is so gung-ho against the very idea of subscriptions. Sure, the price for this partiicular subscription might be a bit steep, that's a legitimate concern, but to complain about the entire financial model is weird to me. Subscription services are a legitimate alternative and offer plenty of benefits that other MMO monetization methods do not. As long as companies don't "Mix and match" payment methods and throw in Buy to Play and microtransactions, subscriptions are nice because they guarantee that you can access all of the content available in the game without worrying about being nickel and dimed or subjected to pay walls to access content. It also avoids having the ever floating temptation in "f2p" games of being able to just drop money to win the game for you or buy super rare items for a few dollars. It provides some level of balance because all players are on the same footing.

A common argument is that some people dont have time to play it as much as they'd like and feel like that subscription is wasted on them. If you predict that you won't be able to play much for a certain period in extreme circumstances you could just temporarily drop the subscription until you have more time. And even if you regularly only have a few hours a week to play, $15 a month still isn't THAT expensive. That's less than the price to see two movies (minus any snacks or food), which combined would only amount to at most 5 hours of entertainment, yet I'm sure many people still go to see movies at that price. Even if you only get to play it for 10 hours a month (~2.5 hours a week) I still think that $15 is a reasonable value for your time. I pay more than $15 a week just to buy lunches at work and they don't provide me with a months worth of unlimited enjoyment whenever I feel like it (or have time to)

Is it because a lot of us (especially PC gamers and myself included) have become spoiled with how cheap games are with steam and humble bundles and all of these other platforms of great sales, that we don't appreciate how much value we get for our money anymore? I just don't really get it. Sure, the game is more expensive in the long run (read: more than four months of play) than a new AAA release game unless they give discounts for pre-purchasing longer subscriptions. But this game (if it's good... if it's bad then it'll fail subscription or not) will likely provide tons more content and enjoyment opportunities than most AAA games will over those 4 months.

If you don't like subscription games, then that's fine I guess, nobody is forcing you to play it. I just don't understand why its such a turn-off to so many people and why so many people are already declaring this game dead in the water before it even launches purely because the game is subscription based. If the game is really good, people will pay to play it and it will succeed. If it's not good enough then people won't and they'll either have to adjust their business model or take the game down. I don't think the subscription itself is a death sentence though...

I'd like to hear other peoples' opinions on this matter.

Whether subscriptions are good or bad is pretty irrelevant. ESO had a chance to attract its own fanbase, the people that liked The Elder Scrolls in the first place, and with this move it has pretty much instantly blown it. Every TES fan is used to paying £40 (at most) and getting hundreds upon hundreds of hours of gameplay, which they can play whenever they want, for as long as they want, and which even has an endless supply of both free unofficial and paid official content to go alongside it.

I think @Maxtro had the best idea. By abandoning the monthly subscription and replacing it with paid "DLC" you could get pretty much the same profits for the same amount of work without alienating the TES audience. Now it seems like they want to compete with World of Warcraft instead, and that only ever ends one way.

I don't buy this idea that all ES gamers will refuse outright to buy it just because it has a slightly different (and not necessarily more expensive) method of paying for it. Hell I'm an elder scrolls gamer and I'm ok with paying a subscription for it if the game is good enough. TES:O is NOT Skyrim. Skyrim doesn't need to keep dozens of servers online perpetually or have a ton of the components that make it an MMO, so it makes sense to pay a one time fee. With TES:O it's a persistent world that costs money to maintain and upgrade and expand. This is just a reality of the game. The gameplay itself and the world is reminiscent enough of TES that I think if the game quality is as good as it appears to be, that TES fans will want to experience it regardless of whether it's a subscription.

And that's the key point for me I think. If the game is good, people will play it. This subscription cost may alienate some people but it's not so exorbitant that it will keep people who actually like the game and the world from playing it. I guess we'll find out.

The only subscription game I've ever paid for was Runescape and I enjoyed the hell out of it, so I don't see why it's such a death sentence to have a subscription model.

The thing is a movie is 2 hours, you can just go out when you've got the time and see that movie. With Guild Wars 2 depending on how much spare time I've got I can just decide to boot up and play when I'm feeling like it. I can leave the game untouched through busy periods of work and exams. I can decide to not play for a while because I'm having more fun with another game, maybe a new one that comes out.

With a subscription model I have to plan my periods of gaming in advance. I can't just decide to boot up and play because there's an extra financial obligation involved - I have to spend £9, and for a student, £9 for the chance to play a game is a lot of money especially for such a non-social activity, compared to going out for a meal or seeing a movie.

You have to base your life around this game you're continually paying for rather than the other way around, which just puts me off paying for such a hassle.

This argument makes no sense. If you have time to spend $15 at a movie theater once a month then you have time to spend $15 a month on a game that you can get unlimited enjoyment out of whenever you want. And if you're really so busy you can just cancel it and come back later.

 

[Vrach]

Doubt I'd ever have paid any money for it, so don't care much myself. As a few people have stated in the thread, the PPM model can beat a FTP model, it's just about whether a game's good enough for you to pay for.

Sadly, I don't think TESO is. It's a shame really. I saw it, knew it was gonna tank since the announcement, but honestly, looking at some game footage, the game looks pretty awesome for an MMO. I like the whole 1st/3rd person mode and it looks fun, more familiar-looking to the franchise than I've expected. However, it also looks dated as hell. If this came out 10 years ago, sure, it'd be something to look out for, but at the moment, the only reason it stands out to me is because I'm very much sick of the standard hotkey MMO gameplay (and it still keeps it to a point, so not brilliant there either.). I feel it's a step in the right direction, but sadly not a big enough one and one performed with a franchise name that could be so much more.

I hate that the MMO genre has become this "oh but it's an MMO, you can't expect it to be as good as singleplayer games" thing. With the current technology (and I'm expecting a big boom with the new console generations, when PCs can stop holding back progression cause of the current generation), that argument just falls into the water. It's time to just make a singleplayer-like game and add a persistent online world to it, that's what an MMO should be, not a dried out husk of another game that tries to get away with it through the massive multiplayer component.

 

[Charli]

God dammit ZeniMax!

Fixed.

Trying hard enough to be a Wow clone huh? If I'm correct (UK here), $14.99 is the same for Wow.

I pay 8.99 quid for WoW so this is...more? I...pffft, I have no idea what the fuck they're thinking with this.

WoW gets to keep their subscription fee because of 8 years worth of end game content and stuff to do.

This...is psychotic unless this MMO utterly blows people's minds, which It doesn't look like it will be.

 

[Nocturnus]

15$ a month is NOTHING, also. The cost of going to a movie for two hours of entertainment costs about as much. If the game is good, and has a wealth of content, you're going to spend dozens of hours a month on the thing should you have the time, and hundreds of hours a year, all for a little north of 100$ per year. Hell, a new game at launch costs about as much.

Again, looking for a good reason to rally so hardcore against something like this. If someone tells me that "They just don't get the time worth the subscription", I will ask if they have seen a film in the theater at all during that timeframe... because you just spent more for less overall entertainment.

The thing is a movie is 2 hours, you can just go out when you've got the time and see that movie. With Guild Wars 2 depending on how much spare time I've got I can just decide to boot up and play when I'm feeling like it. I can leave the game untouched through busy periods of work and exams. I can decide to not play for a while because I'm having more fun with another game, maybe a new one that comes out.

With a subscription model I have to plan my periods of gaming in advance. I can't just decide to boot up and play because there's an extra financial obligation involved - I have to spend £9, and for a student, £9 for the chance to play a game is a lot of money especially for such a non-social activity, compared to going out for a meal or seeing a movie.

You have to base your life around this game you're continually paying for rather than the other way around, which just puts me off paying for such a hassle.

Why think so hard about it? Do you buy a game for the Playstation and then thing that you must spend X number of hours that week to compensate for the fact that you bought it?

Subscription fees are just what I've said before: They're a (supposed) guarantee of linear growth for the game that you then get access to for paying said subscription. Like a Magazine that you pay a subscription for; you know that every month (Or in the case of MMO's, often every three months), there will be content for you to read (or play) on a regular basis that grows the breadth of your experience.

Some game companies don't deliver on that. Some game companies have, in the past, taken subscriptions and sat on them. Good MMO companies, including Blizzard, SOE, etc, haven't though. Zenimax is made up of people who did this for a very, VERY successful series of MMO's. I doubt they'll make the same mistake that The Old Republic did.

And hell, if they do, they'll fail. About that simple. But it is rather silly for them to fail because someone didn't have the foresight to see the amount of stuff they get for that 15$ a month, compared to any other medium of entertainment that costs about as much if not more. (I'm not saying this is you, specifically, by the way.)

 

[SerBrittanicus]

Annnnnnnddddddddddd TESO is dead to me. I have never and will never pay a subscription for a video game and believe that anybody who does is three fries short of a happy meal. However I would put money on this model being unsustainable and the game going free to play within a very short period of time, so I will just check it out then.

 

[Makabriel]

15$ a month is NOTHING, also. The cost of going to a movie for two hours of entertainment costs about as much. If the game is good, and has a wealth of content, you're going to spend dozens of hours a month on the thing should you have the time, and hundreds of hours a year, all for a little north of 100$ per year. Hell, a new game at launch costs about as much.

Again, looking for a good reason to rally so hardcore against something like this. If someone tells me that "They just don't get the time worth the subscription", I will ask if they have seen a film in the theater at all during that timeframe... because you just spent more for less overall entertainment.

The thing is a movie is 2 hours, you can just go out when you've got the time and see that movie. With Guild Wars 2 depending on how much spare time I've got I can just decide to boot up and play when I'm feeling like it. I can leave the game untouched through busy periods of work and exams. I can decide to not play for a while because I'm having more fun with another game, maybe a new one that comes out.

With a subscription model I have to plan my periods of gaming in advance. I can't just decide to boot up and play because there's an extra financial obligation involved - I have to spend £9, and for a student, £9 for the chance to play a game is a lot of money especially for such a non-social activity, compared to going out for a meal or seeing a movie.

You have to base your life around this game you're continually paying for rather than the other way around, which just puts me off paying for such a hassle.

You know you can Unsub, right?

When I was having money issues while I was playing Wow, I'd unsub until I had the 15$. I'd pay for it a month at a time, sometimes through game cards. You're not locked into a contract. You don't HAVE to pay every month.

 

[kenu12345]

You do realize you will also be paying that initial 60 on top of the subscription cost right

Do you have a source for this? As far as I know this has never been confirmed anywhere. Maybe it's just a free download once they receive your subscription payment. Until I see a confirmed source for this I'm going to be skeptical of that.

Not sure if this is considered a good source but I did a quick search and got this http://www.walmart.com/ip/20895851?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222227015557193&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=18156486550&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=40018939270&veh=sem

 

[endtherapture]

15$ a month is NOTHING, also. The cost of going to a movie for two hours of entertainment costs about as much. If the game is good, and has a wealth of content, you're going to spend dozens of hours a month on the thing should you have the time, and hundreds of hours a year, all for a little north of 100$ per year. Hell, a new game at launch costs about as much.

Again, looking for a good reason to rally so hardcore against something like this. If someone tells me that "They just don't get the time worth the subscription", I will ask if they have seen a film in the theater at all during that timeframe... because you just spent more for less overall entertainment.

The thing is a movie is 2 hours, you can just go out when you've got the time and see that movie. With Guild Wars 2 depending on how much spare time I've got I can just decide to boot up and play when I'm feeling like it. I can leave the game untouched through busy periods of work and exams. I can decide to not play for a while because I'm having more fun with another game, maybe a new one that comes out.

With a subscription model I have to plan my periods of gaming in advance. I can't just decide to boot up and play because there's an extra financial obligation involved - I have to spend £9, and for a student, £9 for the chance to play a game is a lot of money especially for such a non-social activity, compared to going out for a meal or seeing a movie.

You have to base your life around this game you're continually paying for rather than the other way around, which just puts me off paying for such a hassle.

Why think so hard about it? Do you buy a game for the Playstation and then thing that you must spend X number of hours that week to compensate for the fact that you bought it?

Subscription fees are just what I've said before: They're a (supposed) guarantee of linear growth for the game that you then get access to for paying said subscription. Like a Magazine that you pay a subscription for; you know that every month (Or in the case of MMO's, often every three months), there will be content for you to read (or play) on a regular basis that grows the breadth of your experience.

Some game companies don't deliver on that. Some game companies have, in the past, taken subscriptions and sat on them. Good MMO companies, including Blizzard, SOE, etc, haven't though. Zenimax is made up of people who did this for a very, VERY successful series of MMO's. I doubt they'll make the same mistake that The Old Republic did.

And hell, if they do, they'll fail. About that simple. But it is rather silly for them to fail because someone didn't have the foresight to see the amount of stuff they get for that 15$ a month, compared to any other medium of entertainment that costs about as much if not more. (I'm not saying this is you, specifically, by the way.)

No, in fact I buy games on Steam then don't play them for ages. Some months I'll have a lot of free time so I'll game loads. Sometimes I won't and I'll hardly game at all, because you know....life.

Either way, even with the subscription model of WoW, you still have to still buy big expensive expansion sets.
And with GW2 updating content with no subscription system, there's little or no reason to play TESO when it can offer content without a sub fee when TESO claims they NEED this extra money.

 

[Vivi22]

In return the developers plan to offer consistent premium updates that add new quests, zones, skills, dungeons and overall content after the game launches. Whether or not this will be enough to hold onto gamers' wallets, however, is the emergent question. In turn, we're curious as to what our readers think.

So basically the monthly fee gets you... everything you'd get in every F2P MMO out there. You know what, maybe, just maybe, the Elder Scrolls game carries enough weight to pull off a $15 sub, but I'm doubting it quite strongly. There are very, very few games still running on the subscription model that succeed. Most that do go F2P inside of a year and make more money doing that than they ever did with the subs. I honestly think that the days of releasing a new MMO with a subscription model and being successful are done. There's a lot more competition out there than there was 5-10 years ago, and we're simply never going to see a success like WoW again.

 

[kenu12345]

15$ a month is NOTHING, also. The cost of going to a movie for two hours of entertainment costs about as much. If the game is good, and has a wealth of content, you're going to spend dozens of hours a month on the thing should you have the time, and hundreds of hours a year, all for a little north of 100$ per year. Hell, a new game at launch costs about as much.

Again, looking for a good reason to rally so hardcore against something like this. If someone tells me that "They just don't get the time worth the subscription", I will ask if they have seen a film in the theater at all during that timeframe... because you just spent more for less overall entertainment.

The thing is a movie is 2 hours, you can just go out when you've got the time and see that movie. With Guild Wars 2 depending on how much spare time I've got I can just decide to boot up and play when I'm feeling like it. I can leave the game untouched through busy periods of work and exams. I can decide to not play for a while because I'm having more fun with another game, maybe a new one that comes out.

With a subscription model I have to plan my periods of gaming in advance. I can't just decide to boot up and play because there's an extra financial obligation involved - I have to spend £9, and for a student, £9 for the chance to play a game is a lot of money especially for such a non-social activity, compared to going out for a meal or seeing a movie.

You have to base your life around this game you're continually paying for rather than the other way around, which just puts me off paying for such a hassle.

You know you can Unsub, right?

When I was having money issues while I was playing Wow, I'd unsub until I had the 15$. I'd pay for it a month at a time, sometimes through game cards. You're not locked into a contract. You don't HAVE to pay every month.

I think he is talking more about the fact that if he pays for a month then he feels he has to organize that month around that time limit for that game so that he can get the most out of it which can be down right hard sometimes

 

[Nocturnus]

In return the developers plan to offer consistent premium updates that add new quests, zones, skills, dungeons and overall content after the game launches. Whether or not this will be enough to hold onto gamers' wallets, however, is the emergent question. In turn, we're curious as to what our readers think.

So basically the monthly fee gets you... everything you'd get in every F2P MMO out there. You know what, maybe, just maybe, the Elder Scrolls game carries enough weight to pull off a $15 sub, but I'm doubting it quite strongly. There are very, very few games still running on the subscription model that succeed. Most that do go F2P inside of a year and make more money doing that than they ever did with the subs. I honestly think that the days of releasing a new MMO with a subscription model and being successful are done. There's a lot more competition out there than there was 5-10 years ago, and we're simply never going to see a success like WoW again.

I referenced Guild Wars 2 already. I still play Guild Wars 2, and it's an aggravating reminder of why either ArenaNet is collectively losing their mind if they think this is a good development model, or buy to play just can't sustain the release of broad, permanent content that grows their game.

And before Guild Wars 2 is referenced as an example, I want you to stop and consider just how much the game as actually -grown- since it was launched. Most of their instanced and dungeoned content is not only using existing art assets (IE: Scaled down versions of a zone that was already made), all of it has been TEMPORARY. The game hasn't grown at all since its release, because nothing has been permanent. I returned to the game now a year after I left it, and guess how much linear growth that formula has produced. None whatsoever. No new, permanent dungeons for me to explore. No new starting areas or races. No new quest paths. It's all been this temporary stuff that lasts two weeks and then is taken out.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

The game doesn't even look that good. It doesn't look like it deserves $15 a month. I give it 7 months before they switch to F2P. A freakin' Star Wars MMO couldn't sustain a monthly subscription model for a full year.

 

[endtherapture]

In return the developers plan to offer consistent premium updates that add new quests, zones, skills, dungeons and overall content after the game launches. Whether or not this will be enough to hold onto gamers' wallets, however, is the emergent question. In turn, we're curious as to what our readers think.

So basically the monthly fee gets you... everything you'd get in every F2P MMO out there. You know what, maybe, just maybe, the Elder Scrolls game carries enough weight to pull off a $15 sub, but I'm doubting it quite strongly. There are very, very few games still running on the subscription model that succeed. Most that do go F2P inside of a year and make more money doing that than they ever did with the subs. I honestly think that the days of releasing a new MMO with a subscription model and being successful are done. There's a lot more competition out there than there was 5-10 years ago, and we're simply never going to see a success like WoW again.

I referenced Guild Wars 2 already. I still play Guild Wars 2, and it's an aggravating reminder of why either ArenaNet is collectively losing their mind if they think this is a good development model, or buy to play just can't sustain the release of broad, permanent content that grows their game.

And before Guild Wars 2 is referenced as an example, I want you to stop and consider just how much the game as actually -grown- since it was launched. Most of their instanced and dungeoned content is not only using existing art assets (IE: Scaled down versions of a zone that was already made), all of it has been TEMPORARY. The game hasn't grown at all since its release, because nothing has been permanent. I returned to the game now a year after I left it, and guess how much linear growth that formula has produced. None whatsoever. No new, permanent dungeons for me to explore. No new starting areas or races. No new quest paths. It's all been this temporary stuff that lasts two weeks and then is taken out.

Guild Wars 2 has actually added new dungeons (Fractals of the Mists), new tier of items (Ascended), a new area (Southsun Cove), and 6 months of temporary "living world" content, as well as reworks to the metagame, loot and champions, and new skins etc.

For a game that's only a year old I think that's actually quite a lot of content, considering how much effort making a game involves.

 

[Vivi22]

-snip-

Not seeing the relevance here since I never actually mentioned Guild Wars 2.

 

[Nocturnus]

In return the developers plan to offer consistent premium updates that add new quests, zones, skills, dungeons and overall content after the game launches. Whether or not this will be enough to hold onto gamers' wallets, however, is the emergent question. In turn, we're curious as to what our readers think.

So basically the monthly fee gets you... everything you'd get in every F2P MMO out there. You know what, maybe, just maybe, the Elder Scrolls game carries enough weight to pull off a $15 sub, but I'm doubting it quite strongly. There are very, very few games still running on the subscription model that succeed. Most that do go F2P inside of a year and make more money doing that than they ever did with the subs. I honestly think that the days of releasing a new MMO with a subscription model and being successful are done. There's a lot more competition out there than there was 5-10 years ago, and we're simply never going to see a success like WoW again.

I referenced Guild Wars 2 already. I still play Guild Wars 2, and it's an aggravating reminder of why either ArenaNet is collectively losing their mind if they think this is a good development model, or buy to play just can't sustain the release of broad, permanent content that grows their game.

And before Guild Wars 2 is referenced as an example, I want you to stop and consider just how much the game as actually -grown- since it was launched. Most of their instanced and dungeoned content is not only using existing art assets (IE: Scaled down versions of a zone that was already made), all of it has been TEMPORARY. The game hasn't grown at all since its release, because nothing has been permanent. I returned to the game now a year after I left it, and guess how much linear growth that formula has produced. None whatsoever. No new, permanent dungeons for me to explore. No new starting areas or races. No new quest paths. It's all been this temporary stuff that lasts two weeks and then is taken out.

Guild Wars 2 has actually added new dungeons (Fractals of the Mists), new tier of items (Ascended), a new area (Southsun Cove), and 6 months of temporary "living world" content, as well as reworks to the metagame, loot and champions, and new skins etc.

For a game that's only a year old I think that's actually quite a lot of content, considering how much effort making a game involves.

Follow the Trend. The game sold really well at launch. 3 Million Copies. This sustained a the beginning release of new artwork and new weapon skins that were available to everyone.

Fast forward to now... the new artwork is becoming non-existent. The new weapon and skins are gated behind the microtransaction store at ten dollars a pop, and content has become pretty much all temporary.

NCSoft's numbers have shown this. Their sales are still good, but they're dipping. Sustaining a development team the size of ArenaNet is not easy without guaranteed monetization. "Free" just can't keep up sometimes.

Honestly, I expected them to release an expansion by now, similar to what they did with Guild Wars 1.

 

[Church185]

I think he is talking more about the fact that if he pays for a month then he feels he has to organize that month around that time limit for that game so that he can get the most out of it which can be down right hard sometimes

But if you break it down, a $15 a month fee is like $.50 a day, and if you purchased a month only to find yourself playing another game, then just unsub and don't pay for more game time until you get the itch to jump back in. If you are paying constantly for a game you aren't playing then you are doing it wrong.

 

[Reeve]

It looks like only middle class kids will be playing this game.

 

[kenu12345]

I think he is talking more about the fact that if he pays for a month then he feels he has to organize that month around that time limit for that game so that he can get the most out of it which can be down right hard sometimes

But if you break it down, a $15 a month fee is like $.50 a day, and if you purchased a month only to find yourself playing another game, then just unsub and don't pay for more game time until you get the itch to jump back in. If you are paying constantly for a game you aren't playing then you are doing it wrong.

You still paid 15 dollars for something you didnt use. If say it gave you a month worth of in game time then sure that would work

 

[Church185]

I think he is talking more about the fact that if he pays for a month then he feels he has to organize that month around that time limit for that game so that he can get the most out of it which can be down right hard sometimes

But if you break it down, a $15 a month fee is like $.50 a day, and if you purchased a month only to find yourself playing another game, then just unsub and don't pay for more game time until you get the itch to jump back in. If you are paying constantly for a game you aren't playing then you are doing it wrong.

You still paid 15 dollars for something you didnt use. If say it gave you a month worth of in game time then sure that would work

Honestly I would love it if subs switched over to allowing you to pay for in game time like you mentioned, that would be pretty awesome, but I don't see it happening any time soon.

My point is, if you get engrossed in another game, then just don't pay for your sub until you come back. If you keep getting pulled away from a sub based game right after you payed for a month of game time, then maybe MMOs aren't your thing and you should wait for ESVI (not meant to be insulting).

 

[itsthesheppy]

That's all I needed. I'm out. I was maybe going to try it as a curiosity, but a sub fee? No thanks.

Good job Bethesda. You made and Elder Scrolls game I don't want. A heroic effort, and you should be commended.