The Future of Movies (Maybe)

madigan

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krazykidd said:
madigan said:
I'm kind of surprised Bob didn't mention the growing trend of movie theatre grills/restaurants. That is, movie theatres with table space in front of the rows of chairs and full food/drink menus available. I've seen places do it old-school style where you order your food and drinks outside the theatre and then bring them in and find a seat, and others (like Alamo Drafthouse and Studio Movie Grill) where you write your order down on a provided card or slip of paper (there are dim lights under the table-top so you can see the menu and your own order card once the movie actually starts) and waiters come by every now and then before and during the film to pickup orders, drop off food, re-fill beverages, and drop off/pick up bills.

It's a pretty great system that didn't exist in my area before the turn of the millennium, and I still run into people all of the time who have never heard of or consider going to a theatre that serves full meals (and alcohol!) during the showing.

*shrugs*
Iv'e never heard of that . But isn't it distracting to have people come a take orders/food during the movie?
For the Alamo Drafthouse at least, once the movie starts the "servers" only come by if you put an order card up and to drop off the bill at the end, and there's an aisle for them to move in (they stoop while they walk to not obstruct your view) on the other side of the table so they don't have to skooch past customer's knees. They just grab the order card and leave without bothering you unless you want to tell them something. The Alamo Drafthouse also lets the audience in and find seats some 45 minutes prior to the movie starting, and they also provide relevant pre-show entertainment while the house lights are still up. For example, when I went to see Pacific Rim they showed clips from Godzilla, Mothra, N.G.E., Power Rangers, etc. in the 45 minutes leading up to the start of the feature film, as well as relevant pop-culture clips from Youtube, Blip, College Humour, etc. During the pre-show period the servers come by to each guest as they sit down and explain the order card system and generally act how normal servers would in any other restaurant. The Alamo theatres then run a short, catchy clip on the main screen as the lights go down explaining the whole system before they move only preview trailers.

All in all it's a pretty well-oiled machine, and the Studio Movie Grill seems to have copied quite a bit from the Alamo from the few times I've visited their theatres in the past couple of years.
 

Deacon Cole

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Nouw said:
Going outside, being in the presence of others.
But if you're not interacting, what's the point? It may as well be the bus or the line at the bank. I hesitate to even call this socializing since the idea is to interact as little as possible. Try not to look at one another and only acknowledge one another if it's absolutely necessary. I don't see this as desirable for anyone.

You'd mention teens, and that may be where theater will continue to find an audience. Teens don't really have a space to call their own. They may have a room and such, but this area is largely controlled by their parents, so they desire to get away from that to be a bit more free when out with their friends. Of course, it's been this way since the 50's when teens started to have disposable income to spend on things like cars and movie tickets. I don't know how long that can continue, but it's possible that teens will either find something else to do with their time or the costs will outweigh the profits. Arcades used to be a popular hang out for teens, but they're all but gone, with only a few places still in operation and no major chains that I'm aware of. They might still exist, but the last time I saw an arcade they didn't have any games I really wanted to play.

...and with the introduction of the Occulus Rift it may soon become the next big controversy/challenge for us to overcome.
I don't think the Occulus Rift offers anything but an empty hand. But that's beyond our scope here.
 

Lightknight

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harrisonmcgiggins said:
Can the Occulus rift really create a theatre experience? And is it really only $300? I might actually get one then. Hook it up to my xbox or something
The Occulus Rift has a lot of neat stuff being produced right now but I wouldn't jump the gun if I were you. It carries all the risks that being an early adopter of anything else would carry. Including the very next version being 100x better. Also, please keep in mind that the $300 option you're looking at is a Dev kit. It is not the consumer version. The dev kit will be rougher and potentially more expensive than the eventual client version and we don't even know if it'll be compatible with apps available on the final version. From the site's FAQ:

http://www.oculusvr.com/faq/

I'm not a developer. Should I buy a developer kit now or wait for the consumer version?


If you are asking this question, the answer is most likely "Wait".

The consumer product will improve on almost every aspect of the developer kit, which is essentially an early prototype of the consumer version. This includes comfort, immersion, features, software support, etc? for the absolute best virtual reality experience possible.

If you absolutely must have one, please understand that the developer kits are more or less early prototypes of the consumer version and with very limited software/game support when they ship.

So if you?re not a developer or hardcore enthusiast, sit tight for now. We promise the consumer Rift will be worth the wait!


But to answer your question, yes, they have developed an application that makes the user feel like they're looking at a much larger screen and that also gives the impression of space. The biggest complaint at the moment is actually just the screen resolution which is supposed to be 1080p for the consumer version but I believe is 720 for the dev kit. So you can get the screen door effect if you move your head around a lot.

To begin with, the Rift is only compatible with the pc. They do plan on making it compatible with the consoles soon though. But this means you couldn't plug it into your 360 and it work, at least not yet though someone may have modded it to work. This is a product to be excited about but I would try to forget it exists until a consumer model exists.

the antithesis said:
I don't think the Occulus Rift offers anything but an empty hand. But that's beyond our scope here.
You mean no controller? No, you still need a controller to play several types of games but not all. I think the occulus rift offers a lot more than just an open hand. The ability to look around the world is the first major advancement in ACTUAL game immersion (as opposed this graphical immersion people talk about). It really is different to be able to look around your area like you can in real life. That movie theater app? It gives the illusion of actual space. An empty room in front of a large screen. That really is something novel.

The ability to actually put yourself in an environment even just optically causes some interesting things.

Here's some reactions to some types of apps that are being developed for it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjNLvgqZgUI

Keep in mind that Team Fortress 2, Hawken, and Doom 3 are are all playable on it if you're a gamer like me.
 

Deacon Cole

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Lightknight said:
The ability to look around the world is the first major advancement in ACTUAL game immersion (as opposed this graphical immersion people talk about).
Discussing the Occulus Rift and its virtues or lack thereof is better left to another thread, but suffice to say that I think the Occulus Rift is the uncanny valley of display technology the same way someone once said that motion controls are the uncanny valley of input devices.

I find the movie theater app idea to be like the menus on some retro compilations that that are like being in a 70's or 80's bedroom and you have to sift through the cartridges to play them. This sort of thing can fuck right off, get the fuck out of my way and let me play the fucking games. The problem with novelty is that it is paper thin, shallow and substanceless. Hence why novelty tends to wear off pretty fast, before the kickstarted Android console even gets into the hands of backers, much less onto store shelves. So a movie theater app on the Occulus Rift can fuck right off, get the fuck out of my way and let me watch the fucking movie.
 

Nimzar

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As far the phone usage thing goes, I'm going to resist this push to the last.

Meanwhile I'll just sit smugly knowing that people who use their phones in the theater are going to the special hell
 

Silverspetz

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chikusho said:
Silverspetz said:
Still not at all the same. Part of the cinema experience is the size of the room as much as the screen, not to mention the people around you. Simply fooling your brain into thinking that it is looking at a bigger screen than it really is will never compare.
An Oculus could just as easily emulate a larger room as well, but you're right. It will never compare. For some people it will be superior. Hell, part of the reason so many are investing in super huge TV's and massive surround sound systems is to get away from as much of the bullshit "movie experience" as possible with the actual movie still intact. Getting away from noisy, talking, phone fiddling people; dirty, sticky floors; poor view from seats at the edge of the theater; supporting lobby organization making the customer the villain; being forced to watch commercials even though you paid to see a movie and still getting shilled on the prices of tickets and popcorn.

Personally I hope that enough people will get fed up with the movie theater industry that it dies a slow terrible death.
And for some people it will never be anything but a hollow imitation of the real thing. I don't know what wretched theatres you have in your neighborhood, but my movie-going experience usually involves people turning off their cellphones before the viewing (I can only remember 1 notable time when someone just wouldn't put it down), the floors are usually clear as can be with the exception of an occasional popcorn and some salt sprinkled about, and the personal have always been helpful and serviceable. And I quite like the commercials and trailers honestly. There is something that just gets you all the more hyped about seeing a movie that looks like it will be good when you see the trailer in theatres than it is to see them during some commercial break on regular TV or in some clip on Youtube.

My point is that for better or for worse I don't agree that home-entertainment systems will ever be able to deliver the SAME experience as cinema only with the bad parts cut out. There are just too many variables of the experience as a whole that involves GETTING OUT OF YOUR HOUSE and interacting with other people on some level for it ever to be accurately emulated by some little machine. Whether you LIKE those other variables or if they are something you personally would rather just avoid is a completely different matter.

the antithesis said:
Nouw said:
Going outside, being in the presence of others.
But if you're not interacting, what's the point? It may as well be the bus or the line at the bank. I hesitate to even call this socializing since the idea is to interact as little as possible. Try not to look at one another and only acknowledge one another if it's absolutely necessary. I don't see this as desirable for anyone.
There is a very notable difference between going to the movies or taking the buss that connects people, PURPOSE. The reason WHY they go there and what they take away (or hope to take away) when they leave. When I'm sitting on the buss, I know nothing of the people around me or why they are there aside from the fact that they apparently have to get somewhere and that they have chosen the buss as a means of transportation. I do not know where they are going or where they come from and it is quite unlikely that they have the same destination as myself, nor do I know if they chose the buss because they think it is more environmentally sound or if they just don't have a car or a drivers license. It's the same thing with the bank. I don't know if these people I'm standing in line with are there to make a deposit or a withdrawal. If they are making a withdrawal, how much are they taking out? Are they excited that they have finally saved up enough to move the family into that dream house they always wanted? Or are they terrified because they have lost their job and need to know how much time they have before they get kicked out of their home? Or maybe they just heard about some new service app that they wanted some more information on. I know nothing about these people aside from the fact that they apparently have some business being at the bank.

But with movies, every single person in that room with you have come there for the same purpose, to watch a movie. And not just A movie but the same movie you wanted to see. Maybe their reasons for going to see it are different from yours, but fundamentally they all went there because they had SOME interest in the film that was on screen. And at the end of the day, every single one of them walked out with some opinion about what they had seen. That is something that connects people, that brings them together even if they never even speak with eachother. And nothing is stopping you from starting up a conversation either. After all, you just watched the same movie so you have an excellent ice-breaker.
 

Lightknight

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the antithesis said:
I find the movie theater app idea to be like the menus on some retro compilations that that are like being in a 70's or 80's bedroom and you have to sift through the cartridges to play them. This sort of thing can fuck right off, get the fuck out of my way and let me play the fucking games. The problem with novelty is that it is paper thin, shallow and substanceless. Hence why novelty tends to wear off pretty fast, before the kickstarted Android console even gets into the hands of backers, much less onto store shelves. So a movie theater app on the Occulus Rift can fuck right off, get the fuck out of my way and let me watch the fucking movie.
I wouldn't imagine anyone would force you to use it. That still doesn't change the notion that virtual reality, even just optical virtual really, may play a significant role in the future of movie going.

As you stated, it may also be a passing fad. Either way, it should be considered.
 

Deacon Cole

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Lightknight said:
That still doesn't change the notion that virtual reality, even just optical virtual really, may play a significant role in the future of movie going.

As you stated, it may also be a passing fad. Either way, it should be considered.
Uh, no it won't. Virtual reality was considered fairly heavily in the 90's, but people lost interest and not because there wasn't a thing to strap to your head but because the idea is inherently flawed for the reasons I've already given. I predict a lot of buyer's remorse in the future.
 

Lightknight

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the antithesis said:
Uh, no it won't.
Please feel free to show me your crystal ball but please don't show me any other kind of ball than that (joke). There is a huge amount of excitement generated around the rift in general. From reviewers of all walks to developers to customers. I get that you don't want it around and feel very strongly about it not getting in your way. Probably the same frustration I'd feel if the kinect 2 required me to wave my arms to throw a grenade in an otherwise non-kinect game. But the ability to use the occulus rift shouldn't be mandatory for you. It should just be an option for those that want it. Either way, what you want isn't going to get in the way of what society as a whole wants. People only really have one of two choices if they don't want this option. They can be people who say it just isn't for them and so they don't pursue it, or they have to be the equivalent of an old man shouting at kids to get off his lawn when they aren't on it. Someone who doesn't want anyone else to enjoy something if they don't like it.

Virtual reality was considered fairly heavily in the 90's, but people lost interest and not because there wasn't a thing to strap to your head but because the idea is inherently flawed for the reasons I've already given. I predict a lot of buyer's remorse in the future.
The reason it was flawed was because the tracking tech wasn't there and the latency was horrendous. Have you played VR games recently? I have. The field of view is extremely limited and any time you turn your head the screen takes a few seconds to catch up, it's entirely noticeable. And even then, those products were thousands of dollars and only had one or maybe two games developed for any one model. The setup of virtual reality hardware was also generally huge and bulky. The graphics were quite bad. The VR of the 90's was actively frustrating.

But these are the issues that the Occulus Rift has resolved. The price is affordable (dev kits are $300). Graphics have improved and the rift has encorporated 3d stereoscopic vision that really lends to immersion. Even the dev kits are relatively small and manageable. The latency has been significantly reduced. The field of vision is spectacular. And, the Rift is already in the hands of developers across the world who are integrating existing games (Skyrim, Team Fortress 2, Hawken, Doom 3, etc) and are developing other things specifically for it.

This is the first time virtual reality has been practical and has had a fighting chance. I don't think it'll be as good for FPS games as people may think. But I can see a lot of real promise in exploration, horror, and other such non-rapid movement uses (Neck issues and such with rapid movement). As such, it is particularly well suited for things like rendering a movie theater. You can specifically toggle on or off 3D in the app as well as many other options. It looks like you're watching a big screen. Honestly, there's several movies that I wish I had seen in theaters that I'll now have an option too. Can't wait to see some classics like Casablanca on it.

But this time it's legit. For example, John Carmack just got named the CTO of the Occulus Rift company (he's staying with ID though, must be nice to make two incomes). That's breaking news as of a couple hours ago.

Here's a couple videos you may want to watch and examples you may like to see if you haven't yet:

Here's an article regarding the new High Def version of the app. [http://www.penny-arcade.com/report/article/the-perfect-3d-movie-theater-how-re-writing-reality-in-vr-creates-a-better] He lists a lot of actual advantages over real theaters that should be considered. More realistic 3D rendering than theaters can offer without the dimming that 3D glasses cause. Lighting of the environment in general is also optimized. You're able to create a better environment when you don't have to worry about real issues like lighting the walkways to prevent tripping or having to put a projector in the back of the room that may be noisy and bright.

This is the first review of the theater app before High-def was aavailable. [http://www.penny-arcade.com/report/article/virtual-reality-an-empty-movie-theater-and-peace-how-the-rift-could-change]

The Rift in general:
A technical explanation of how the rift provides enough data to actually trick the brain a little bit into thinking the environment is real. [http://www.gamespot.com/shows/reality-check/?event=what-does-the-oculus-rift-do-to-your-brain-20130804] This will only improve with time.
Warning message that tells players not to lean on virtual objects. [http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/6/4595062/new-oculus-rift-cover-shooter-fps-ulta-realistic] The game is just a small indie dev demo but it shows promise as far as the future of Time Crises-esque games which I enjoyed in arcades as a child and on home consoles later on.

Just check out videos on Youtube regarding it. There's a lot of neat stuff.

This could provide a lot of other benefits too. From learning how to drive to medical and pyschological therapies like the fantom pain therapy mentioned in the gamespot video above.

I'm specifically spending the time explaining this to you in case this is the future of a lot of stuff. Don't wait too long to get on the bandwagon just because the 90's sucked at it. You may miss out on a lot of stuff if you do. Still aren't convinced? That's your prerogative.
 

Drake the Dragonheart

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Bob, I will be right there bemoaning with you how it got to that point on the whole "my phone is my life thing" and with phones in the theatres. Heck, I bemoan such already!