The GOP's rampant legal attempts to Usurp Power After Biden Win.

ObsidianJones

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As always, fuck the GOP. May you all rot in hell, and be Mundus or Fleming's eternal slaves of damnation.
Just doing God's work.

It really isn't. A constituency can be represented without their candidates being in power. It just needs to be done from the opposition rather than the government.
Upvoted for Truth.

There are a group of people who believe Epstein and his cronies did nothing wrong. They are a small, small, thankfully microscopic part of our poplution.

But they are the dudes with the money. Should they buy votes and make it law that Epstein's island because the way of things? Because God, I hope not.

The political power you get is directly proportional to how many people who think they same way as you and votes the same way as you. If your politics are now suffering from numbers that will not make you the majority, you do not get to throw away others people's voices so you become stronger.

How about... I don't know... maybe amending your politics and your base so your ideals become more appealing so people would vote in step with you? That's an idea.
 
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happyninja42

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So of course they are trying to frame the issue as "Oh, it's just waiting in line. Everyone does it at the Grocery Store"

Greene said so much herself just now.

But she doesn't get the fact to make it true, it would be literally what she just said. THE Grocery Store. As in, no other opportunity to shop anywhere else.



I would love to see how she and other Republican leaders would react if what people are trying to do to the minority vote would actually happen to them, in terms of the Grocery store availability analogy they trot out so often. If the state came in, mandated that you could only shop at the grocery stores in your district, and then limited their available stores to just five per district. Also, you can only shop at the day the state said and no other time, lest you break the law.

I'm hard pressed to believe Greene and others who attempt to misrepresent how much of a 'non issue' this is would be ok with trying to get their groceries on their scheduled food day of the month, with literally thousands of other people in their district having the same food shopping day, and their employers being under no obligation to give them the day off to get food.

When your options are artificially limited, your choice stripped from you, and your ability to do for yourself hamstrung by mandates that do not have your best interest at heart... yeah, you tend to get angry.
The thing I find the funniest about greene's dismissal of waiting in line for HOURS, is that she says the real crime is that she had to.....wait for it....WAIT IN LINE...for just a few minutes, to go through a metal detector. THAT was the true crime to her.

How about... I don't know... maybe amending your politics and your base so your ideals become more appealing so people would vote in step with you? That's an idea.
That would require humility, self reflection, and the capacity to admit they were wrong about something. It would also require having a motivation for genuine fairness and equality, and not personal gain at any cost. And I think we know how likely that is to happen.
 
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Hades

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How about... I don't know... maybe amending your politics and your base so your ideals become more appealing so people would vote in step with you? That's an idea.
The sad thing about the American system is that its not required for the Republicans to connect to the electorate. They have consistently lost the popular vote for over a decade now and their policies are significantly more unpopular than the alternative. But that doesn't matter as long as the American system allows a minority of the vote to seize a majority of the power. The Republicans aren't required to change because they don't need to win the election. They just need to win in a few random places so that the electoral vote can overwrite the people's vote.
 

Gergar12

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I bet if the GOP actually believed in hell, there wouldn't be this many televangelists and even conservatives.
 

Thaluikhain

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I bet if the GOP actually believed in hell, there wouldn't be this many televangelists and even conservatives.
Oh I dunno, there's always some reason why it doesn't count as wrong. Lots of rabid anti-abortion types justify abortions for themselves or their mistresses, for example, and then go back to picketing afterwards.
 

Agema

You have no authority here, Jackie Weaver
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tstorm823

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In a way, it makes a lot of sense. If Republicans can commit enough election fraud, that fraud can worry people enough to let Republicans pass election laws that disenfranchise Democrats.

It's the "Justify fixes to a system by deliberately breaking it first" tactic.
Or people from both parties (or neither party) commit election fraud, but nobody is putting the non-Republican fraud in front of Adam Jensen's face.
 

Buyetyen

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Or people from both parties (or neither party) commit election fraud, but nobody is putting the non-Republican fraud in front of Adam Jensen's face.
And here's why conservatives have a hard time making allies: the assumption that literally everyone is just as dishonest as them.
 

Hades

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And here's why conservatives have a hard time making allies: the assumption that literally everyone is just as dishonest as them.
That does seem to be a constant stance within the demagogic right. On some level the demagogues demonizing all their opponents is part of the strategy to convince the electorate that they alone have any sort of legitimacy, but on another level they might actually sincerely believe that. They might justify their unacceptable actions to themselves and their electorate as something that's just a natural part of the political arena and that everyone is just as bad as them. Trump might really believe every other politician either is as corrupt as himself or would be if they could get away with it, Erdogan and Putin might believe any other politician would have overthrown their democracy if they could so it might just as well have been them, and so on.
 
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tstorm823

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And here's why conservatives have a hard time making allies: the assumption that literally everyone is just as dishonest as them.
I mean...
Notary arrested for stamping more mail in ballots illegally than the difference in votes for an election where the Democrat won. Judge has to order a new election take place. Judge takes note of potential witness intimidation by the candidate that "won" that election and the town mayor. The mayor is listed in the article as "the former mayor", because he recently lost that position after being convicted of embezzling funds. Both elections, the alderman race being redone and the mayoral race, involved no Republicans. Both races were between Democrats and Independents, without any visible Republican presence at all.
 
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Agema

You have no authority here, Jackie Weaver
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In a way, it makes a lot of sense. If Republicans can commit enough election fraud, that fraud can worry people enough to let Republicans pass election laws that disenfranchise Democrats.

It's the "Justify fixes to a system by deliberately breaking it first" tactic.
I don't think either party carries out much fraud, and certainly not "officially" sanctioned at a high level. They have much more sophisticated (and legal) ways to swing elections. I don't think the Republican Party's proposed solutions will do a lick of good against most of the very small amount of fraud that does exist, either. That it is finding solutions for a non-existent problem is a lot of why I don't have any trust in their motives for those policies.
 

tstorm823

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I don't think either party carries out much fraud, and certainly not "officially" sanctioned at a high level. They have much more sophisticated (and legal) ways to swing elections. I don't think the Republican Party's proposed solutions will do a lick of good against most of the very small amount of fraud that does exist, either. That it is finding solutions for a non-existent problem is a lot of why I don't have any trust in their motives for those policies.
You're thinking about major national elections, where I agree with your assessment, but local and state-level elections are critically important, and can absolutely be swung by fraud. Most of the time when this topic comes up, all my examples of election fraud are local elections and/or Democratic primaries, because that's where you can steal an election and also arguably where it counts the most. Local elections are important. And like, Democrats are pushing for votes to count if made in the wrong precinct, focusing only on the effect on large elections, ignoring that they're going to mess up local elections by having people voting on the wrong ballots (either they count the whole ballot and screw up local elections with out of district voters, or they only count the votes that would be legal and de facto encourage people to ignore local elections).
 

Agema

You have no authority here, Jackie Weaver
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You're thinking about major national elections, where I agree with your assessment, but local and state-level elections are critically important, and can absolutely be swung by fraud. Most of the time when this topic comes up, all my examples of election fraud are local elections... because that's where you can steal an election and also arguably where it counts the most.
There's barely any fraud at the small scale, either. It may be true that 20 votes in a local election makes a difference where it doesn't in a statewide election, but it's besides the point if it barely happens.

Shifting the debate to the local level is about Republicans recognising that the argument facually fails at the higher level, so moving the frame to somewhere less publicised and harder to dig up evidence. It's still a huge amount of noise about very little to justify inadequate policy.
 

tstorm823

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There's barely any fraud at the small scale, either. It may be true that 20 votes in a local election makes a difference where it doesn't in a statewide election, but it's besides the point if it barely happens.

Shifting the debate to the local level is about Republicans recognising that the argument facually fails at the higher level, so moving the frame to somewhere less publicised and harder to dig up evidence. It's still a huge amount of noise about very little to justify inadequate policy.
Dont ellipsis out my complaints about Lyndon Johnson. That's cold, Agema.