The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword Review

BishopofAges

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Shia-Neko-Chan said:
SNIP for long arguement's sake
So then after reading your many points and prods at the series as a whole I have to ask, are you a fan of split off of Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks?(or heck even the four-swords adventures!) Those seem to have broken that 'repeating story' issue you flung so carelessly over the series as a whole, each added new weapons and tools while keeping some of the old, yes kept some of the old.

Why?

Why does Link need a new item to do the same thing as a a sword/shield? The weapons/tools are mainly kept because they mostly accomplish what you need them to do, what else is there to blow stuff up besides a bomb? What can fetch an item, hit a far switch, or cold-cock an enemy better than a boomerang? What can you use to cross great distances besides the hover-boots, hook-shot or double hookshot? edit2: I do like what they add in as well, however, like the dousing sword ability, the statue moving staffthing, etc.

I'll tell you right now when I saw the double hookshot premere I nearly shat myself at the possibilities!

Now I do want to add that I am not trying to 'argue an issue' I am merely trying to understand your standpoint, I just fail to see most of it. Yes the 'gather items, play puzzles, save princess' plot point is an old mainstay, but it is HOW the story is told that attracts me, not the overarching point of 'save the princess' I want to know HOW I get there, WHO helps me or deters me, WHAT can I use to get there, WHERE do I go, and finally WHY which got wrapped up finally with this segment's storytelling.

tl;dr: If you can only see the surface, how do you know you're floating? Look deeper and let your mind open to the possibilities the Zelda series has, because remember, we began this as a shlub asking an old man for a sword and having not a clue where the first dungeon was.

edit: I want to repeat that I am not trying to argue, but to have a conversation, none of this ought to be read in rage.
 

Shia-Neko-Chan

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BishopofAges said:
Shia-Neko-Chan said:
SNIP for long arguement's sake
So then after reading your many points and prods at the series as a whole I have to ask, are you a fan of split off of Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks?(or heck even the four-swords adventures!) Those seem to have broken that 'repeating story' issue you flung so carelessly over the series as a whole, each added new weapons and tools while keeping some of the old, yes kept some of the old.
Wind Waker, I do have and have played, but in the end it was just about saving Zelda again. That was around the same time I began to just tire of the entire series, so I just became too tired to care that much anymore.

I'll admit, it was handled in a way that was different from the other Zelda games, but I felt like it was just hidden, kind of like how at the end of Twilight Princess I felt like
Ganondorf was just hidden the whole time.Like they thought the game wouldn't be complete without him. It's not like his motifs or methods are ever any different from the last time, he always has the same fascination with Zelda as last time and always finds a way to kidnap her.
He's pretty shallow, all things considered and he's nothing special. Give us another person or problem to deal with, like Majora's Mask. For that matter, he was in Wind Waker, too!

Why?

Why does Link need a new item to do the same thing as a a sword/shield? The weapons/tools are mainly kept because they mostly accomplish what you need them to do, what else is there to blow stuff up besides a bomb?
Why do things always need to be blown up? There are other ways to make a puzzles, you know, it doesn't always need to be the same thing every time.

Or for that matter, keep in the bombs and make Link already start out with them. I mean, the chosen one is always a 'reincarnation' of Link, but he's always someone who doesn't know what he's doing at first. What if for once, he, by occupation, was a bombs expert and already had them or was already a combat expert, so already had a sword (but not the master sword) and some other tools for battle? What if one of the reincarnations already had experience fighting with his fists?

Wouldn't that make Link a little more dynamic and less predictable? Every Link would really be a different character with different skills, in that case.

Kind of like how Bruce Wayne Batman is different than the new Robin-Batman. If the two were one and the same what was the point of changing the character? Wouldn't it be boring if he just acted the same as the regular batman after the whole passing of the torch?

What can fetch an item, hit a far switch, or cold-cock an enemy better than a boomerang?
What about a zip-line? What about climbing gloves of some sort? You can come up with something if you try and that's all I want, really. Something different out of the series that's been running for a good 25 years.

Now I do want to add that I am not trying to 'argue an issue' I am merely trying to understand your standpoint, I just fail to see most of it. Yes the 'gather items, play puzzles, save princess' plot point is an old mainstay, but it is HOW the story is told that attracts me, not the overarching point of 'save the princess' I want to know HOW I get there, WHO helps me or deters me, WHAT can I use to get there, WHERE do I go, and finally WHY which got wrapped up finally with this segment's storytelling.
Usually it's because of Ganondorf, usually you gain the same items over and over again (Something they stopped making Samus do in the third Metroid Prime), usually you have a helper character that does the same thing as the last helper character ("Link, don't you think it's a little strange that there's a crack in this wall, here? Isn't the entire palace made out of indestructable steel?), and you usually go to the same temples.

Isn't there another way to present challenges and puzzles than fire temple, spirit temple, water temple? What if in one game, Link had to do something that went away from temples all together, like a different threat entirely? Something like an opposing kingdom's dungeon, a mansion, or an old haunted house? Maybe a magic-scientist's laboratory? What if an entire kindgom were corrupted by an evil miasma, putting them at war with Hyrule? Why does it always fall back to temples, sages, and saving Hyrule from Ganondorf? It certainly doesn't have to be that way. (Granted, this game doesn't have Ganondorf in it, but he
wasn't supposed to be in Twilight Princess, either.

Why does it always have to be a Boss Key every game? There are other ways to have puzzles leading up to a boss fight, you know.

This is mostly context, but nonetheless, it's context that could've been experimented with or changed at least once during the entire series' lifetime. Context can make a huge difference.

tl;dr: If you can only see the surface, how do you know you're floating? Look deeper and let your mind open to the possibilities the Zelda series has, because remember, we began this as a shlub asking an old man for a sword and having not a clue where the first dungeon was.
Well, of course I know that, I'm no Zelda newbie. Pretty much the only Zelda games I haven't played is the Wind Waker branchoff series and that's because I got a too tired of the copy and paste dungeon crawling to think they were any different.

Every game, Zelda's all about saving Zelda from her kidnapper, but what about the rest of the world? Is the entire world's band of villians only interested in Zelda? Aren't there other kingdoms? Wouldn't Zelda's Kingdom have troubles with other Kingdom's armies? Couldn't things like the master sword, other godly swords, or negative miasma create wars that Link could be summoned to resolve? There's an entire world the Zelda series always neglects to let come into play, except in a few instances. The Wind Waker saga that you mentioned earlier were different, but it seems that because they were different, they shouldn't be on any of the main systems with 3d graphics in all.

Does my point seem more clear to you now? The problems Link has to face are normally the same or very similar to the last time, Link is always the same character, despite being a different reincarnation in a different timeline, the context in which puzzles and the sort are presented is usually the same, the time period remains stagnant as always, the entire world of Zelda besides Hyrule has yet to be explained or even touched upon outside of Majora's Mask,

Even Mario has had a more varied series of threats that he's been summoned to resolve than Link, and he's not even supposed to be a serious character.

I want to repeat that I am not trying to argue, but to have a conversation, none of this ought to be read in rage.
Great, that's all I want, too. Sometimes I think people don't realize that, but genuinely, I'm just trying to have a conversation on these message boards because it's entertaining.

I wish I could've went more into detail, but I have some important studying to do.

Venats said:
Shia-Neko-Chan said:
Well, if I were given the game or given a discount on the game, it probably would turn out to be pretty good, but it's definitely not something I'd give anything over an 85, just because of the series' long track record of being the same thing as last time, reimagined every 4 years to keep Nintendo's core gamer satisfied.
A suspect phrase; most things you encounter in gaming, literature, and general story telling now-a-days are re-imagined concepts. This isn't even an issue limited only to today, it has been happening forever.
Someone sees an idea, likes it but thinks they can tell it better, and then proceeds to attempt to retell the story in their own way. I am not sure why this is used as condemnation for the game. If anything, a concept that has been iterated more times than *1* tends to be smoother and more streamlined in its focus and desires.

But who am I to say, haven't played the game yet.
Not by the same guy and company, though! What if Micheal Bay, after the transformers series of movies, created the changer series, the alterers series, the converters series, the reconstructors series, and the transmuters series, then gave them all the same base story while changing a few things here and there for each one. Now imagine he'd done this for 25 years. People would definitely start to call him uninspired, like he's just making movies because it's a job! That's... kind of how I feel about the Zelda series right now.
 

BishopofAges

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Well after all that I feel I ought to clarify some of the different story points. Majora's Mask, no Zelda, different land, no Ganon/dorf, and different point (moon friggin falling, man!), so I am guessing this should be a shining star in the field of reworking the storyline, but at the same time it deals with the same stuff (also they stole a bit from Metroid of how you lose all you fun toys before the mission begins).

Phantom Hourglass I admit you do have to save Zelda, but she was with you when she got taken so its kind of a switch up being that she's the same from Wind Waker, and also no Ganon/dorf as far as Spirit Tracks she got pwnt and has to help you in ghost form in order for you to get her body back I believe (still playing).

As far as Link's character, the reason he never speaks and seems like the same bland chap is that the player can imprint on him, theres actually a Zelda Manga for a few of the games that made my day to let Link speak without having a voice (if that makes sense). There are subtle nuances in his story from time to time, however, in Ocarina of Time he's just that weird kid with no fairy, in Twilight Princess he's the community Gofer and a farmer. These settings set up how people react to him from being an annoying kid to fairy-boy to farmer to sailor and so on.

Hell, in Link to the Past the only thing that kept you going was avenging your uncle (who didn't really die) and saving that mysterious telepathic broad who got your uncle in that situation. I believe I see your position now, but I can say for sure that it probably won't deter me from enjoying Zelda's to come, besides you got to admit that those magnetism bits in Twilight Princess were fun and a good change up from the regular thing.
 

super_smash_jesus

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well, everyone on earth minus shia-neko-chan appears to think this may be the best Zelda game made yet, and from the content, visuals, etc. I must say that I am more excited for this game than I have been for any single game in the past 10 years.

on the other topic....some may call the zelda franchise stagnant, copy/paste games with a different sheen, but I also say, why mess with a formula for such a successful game? You want drastic changes, you might as well not call it Zelda, because this franchise is based on dungeon crawling, exploration, items, and yes saving a princess for the most part. you want something different? play a different game, because zelda is not for you, and I bid you bon voyage while I stay back and enjoy the hell out of my copy pasting.

All I can say is that I am pumped for a game to come out that is colorful, imaginative, un-realistic and still manages to have fun without having to go online. C'mon 20th, hurry up!
 

Epona

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ELCTea said:
Well what a kick in the nads by nintendo!, well unfortunatly this is off of my gaming list now as i don't see why i should have to shell out extra for the limited edition or a stupid add on specially as money's tight at the moment! Why could they not stick with TP controls.
Seriously? You want to stick with the waggle that everyone and their grandmother whined about? The motion plus accessory has been out for a couple of years now and is now integrated into all new wiimotes, it would have been foolish of them to not use it.

If you buy the bundle, you get the Wiimote for half price ($20 instead of the retail price of wiimotes which is $40).
 

McMarbles

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*inb4 inevitable trashing by Yahtzee/his fans jumping on the bandwagon*

Yahtzee will inevitably trash it, and his fans will jump on the bandwagon.
 

Mister Linton

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BiH-Kira said:
She told much more than just the beetle. Upgrading weapons and shield, real side quests (which are a completely new thing in Zelda), new real use for items that where purely for collecting in past games, new ways of fighting monster, MUCH harder dungeons, better world exploration than in WW, different story, much better physics for bombs (they don't just stand there but roll of if it's not on even ground) and much more.
New and improved! Weapon upgrades! Side quests! Item uses! Difficult bosses! Exploration! Physics!

*sigh* The fact that these are considered "innovations" simply highlight how stale and out of date this franchise really is.
 

D Moness

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hurricanejbb said:
McMarbles said:
*inb4 inevitable trashing by Yahtzee/his fans jumping on the bandwagon*

Yahtzee will inevitably trash it, and his fans will jump on the bandwagon.
Yeah, as much as I like his style, Yahtzee's bias will invariably be present when he gets to this game. He has no problem bashing good games just because they're on the Wii. So I'll just ignore whatever vitriol he has in store and enjoy it on my own merits.
I always do that. I just enjoy Yahtzee for the silly overblown nitpicking it is. Nothing he will say will make me feel different about the games i like. I enjoy games like Wet and Bayonetta I also enjoy his eps about those games but it will not make the fun i have with those games less. The problem is not with Yahtzee it is with the ignorant fanboys that just blindly parrot him without even knowing themselves what they are talking about.
 

Ice Car

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ELCTea said:
Well what a kick in the nads by nintendo!, well unfortunatly this is off of my gaming list now as i don't see why i should have to shell out extra for the limited edition or a stupid add on specially as money's tight at the moment! Why could they not stick with TP controls.
I'm pretty sure that one of the complaints about TP was the way motion control was used in the game. You could basically swing your arm around like a moron and kill any enemy you came across. I doubt anyone actually swung the remote like they would a sword, tell me you weren't doing that too.

I'm kind of on the fence for this too. I know where my Wii was, and this game sounds just awesome, heard nothing but great things about it. The WiiMotion Plus requirement kind of discourages me though. Not only because I have to spend more money to buy it, but because I have a feeling it'll take away from the experience.
 

Moosejaw

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I think my primary complaint so far is the graphics. Going from Skyrim to this...eye strain, things 20 feet away being rendered as a pointy blur. It may be nostalgia but I remember TP running WAY prettier than this, even Wind Waker.

The MotionPlus is certainly taking some getting used to as it jumps around all over the place. Aside from that, though, I'm enjoying it at least. I still miss the gamepad.
 

Darth_Dude

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I was incredibly cynical about this game, I thought it would be terrible, as have most other recent Mario / Sonic / Zelda games. But damn, I was wrong..

Still not gonna get it though, I havnt played a Zelda game to date, and besides, I got Skyrim to waste my holidays on :D
 

-Dragmire-

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Susan Arendt said:
-Dragmire- said:
Susan Arendt said:
I really disliked the dungeons in Twilight Princess, the tower dungeon in particular where you needed to get a statue from the top floor to the front door. My issue wasn't the act of bringing the statue down(though it got a little tedious), it was that there was about five enemies in the entire dungeon and I got really bored of the game by that point.

Does Skyward Sword put more emphasis on combat than Twilight Princess? I like puzzles but they wear down on me when it's not broken up by action sections.
If you want a lot more combat, I think you'll likely end up disappointed. The dungeons are definitely about the puzzles, with a few enemies thrown in here and there.
...I broke down and bought it... on the first day...

sigh... ok, I'll admit it. It's good, the lack of large wide open connecting areas keeps each area well populated and never seems as small as it is. The combat controls, while not my preference as I will always prefer to just press buttons, does it well enough that I can't fault the system if I get hit or blocked. The story is well paced so far(just got the sling shot so I'm not very far) and the more information I'm given about the world, the more interested I become, very different from how I felt playing Twilight Princess.

The only real complaints I have about the game are purely aesthetic ones. I hate the lips... it's a petty gripe but they seem to suit everyone except Link and Zelda. The other issue I have is the style of field of view blur they chose. The mosaic works well but I wish it would dim far away objects more, it draws attention to itself as opposed to blending into the scenery, at least it did for me.

She seems too eager to push Link off cliffs after nearly killing him by doing so earlier that day! Seriously, what if Link dropped the Sailcloth?!
 

Agayek

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Finally got a chance to play this, and I have to say: I love everything about it, and it would easily be my favorite Zelda game of all time... if I could use a gamecube controller for it. It would have been infinitely better with a normal fucking controller. The Wii-mote bullshit is so poorly designed and implemented that I can barely play the damn game. Even with the Wii Motion Plus thing, it keeps reading my movements wrong and is basically completely useless. The boss of the first dungeon took me 45 minutes to beat because of that.
 

GoddyofAus

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Agayek said:
Finally got a chance to play this, and I have to say: I love everything about it, and it would easily be my favorite Zelda game of all time... if I could use a gamecube controller for it. It would have been infinitely better with a normal fucking controller. The Wii-mote bullshit is so poorly designed and implemented that I can barely play the damn game. Even with the Wii Motion Plus thing, it keeps reading my movements wrong and is basically completely useless. The boss of the first dungeon took me 45 minutes to beat because of that.
Then you just suck; I defeated the first boss without a single game over screen; if you go into this game flailing the wii-mote around like you have a Spider on your hand, you will get torn a new one.

I'm about 5 hours in to Skyward Sword, and prior to playing it, Skyrim had my Game of the Year without dropping a set. Not anymore, now I'm stumped as to which deserves it more.

Perhaps Skyward Sword, if only for finally justifying the Wii's existence.
 

Agayek

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GoddyofAus said:
Then you just suck; I defeated the first boss without a single game over screen; if you go into this game flailing the wii-mote around like you have a Spider on your hand, you will get torn a new one.

I'm about 5 hours in to Skyward Sword, and prior to playing it, Skyrim had my Game of the Year without dropping a set. Not anymore, now I'm stumped as to which deserves it more.

Perhaps Skyward Sword, if only for finally justifying the Wii's existence.
I didn't get a single game over either. The problem is that I'd point my sword somewhere then make an attack from the opposite direction and he would always block it. It didn't matter how quickly or precisely I attacked, he would block the attack coming from the exact opposite angle.

He couldn't hit me, I couldn't hit him. It was stupid.
 

LadyRevolverGiggles

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Hehehe, can't wait to give it a shot, the sword controls look more promising than Twilight Princess ones. Although I loved TP. Really only cause of the horse. And the howlling stones. They were cool too.