The Pokemon design Guide, Nintendo you're doing it wrong.

mightybozz

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I agree with everything you've said, and it's the reason why I can't get into pokemon any more. The designs on many of the new ones are utterly unfathomable (a fridge? Jesus...). Basic character design needs to be exercised.

This is also a key reason why I can't get into pokemon anymore. Back when it first started, catching them all was an achievable goal, and there was something special about the rare ones, and especially the legendaries. There were some cock-ups (porygon anyone?) but themes were generally clear, which meant the creatures were memorable. Which means on coach journeys in late secondary school we often played the game of trying to remember all of the original 151. Sheer numbers and poor design has overwhelmed any attachment to the creatures, and now that there are dozens of legendaries, who really cares anymore?
 

Brotherofwill

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Jan 25, 2009
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Counter_Southpaw said:
So much discussion for a game that is centered around animal abuse..
I personally like the look of the pig. He's the only one with a decent design.. but the other two are atrociously created. They look worse than the London 2012 Olympic mascots.
Checks for the design. Hahahaha. Holy shit they look horrible. One-eyed space aliens? What the fuck...and I thought the logo was already pretty bad.
Artemus_Cain said:
I'm sorry. I'm just hearing "BAWW! PLZ DON'T RAPE MY MEMORIES!"

I love pokemon, but it is just a simple game where humans force creature to fight, and when we lose sight of that pretentious stuff like this happens.
Your hearing probably isn't too good then. I like the new games, the gameplay is much better. I just think the visuals of the Pokemons have on a general note gotten worse, and tried to write about it. It is a simple game about animals fighting. If the animals aren't well executed then the game falls apart, or atleast loses some charm.
 

Amnestic

High Priest of Haruhi
Aug 22, 2008
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yeah the originals weren't perfect.
Thank you. I think we're done here. Old designs had their suckage. New designs have their suckage. Charmander had a stupid face, Squirtle was uninspired, Bulbasaur is...are you sure it's a toad? Doesn't look like any toad I ever saw.

Also, Diglett does not look like a mole. It looks like a long, thin, brown balloon with a face drawn on it.
 

Chogg Van Helsing

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May 27, 2010
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how many legendaries is there now? coz its seems there is like 5 every game! in heartgold/soul silver you can actually find in game like 15+ legendary pokemon. thats crazy
 

SharPhoe

The Nice-talgia Kerrick
Feb 28, 2009
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Brotherofwill said:
Your hearing probably isn't too good then. I like the new games, the gameplay is much better. I just think the visuals of the Pokemons have on a general note gotten worse, and tried to write about it. It is a simple game about animals fighting. If the animals aren't well executed then the game falls apart, or atleast loses some charm.
Would it help to point out that the original artist/creature designers left the team after the 2nd gen? That would probably be the root of what you consider to be a "problem".
 

Mandal0re

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Oct 18, 2008
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I always thought 2nd gen had the nicest designs with 1st gen coming in at a strong second,3rd gen coming in a mediocre 3rd place with a respectable amount of cool pokemon and 4th gen in the dust with only a couple of evolution lines i genuinely liked as well as butchering a few i had previously liked(likiliki and mamoswine im looking at you). I read just the other day that after 2nd gen it was no longer the original artists working on it which would certainly explain this trend. Personally i dont have an issue with new generations introducing new pokemon but they shouldnt do a whole new hundred every time,half that would be plenty.

having said all that every generation has had a few pokemon with terrible aesthetic design i mean look at jinx/mr mime ffs.

Oh ye and whilst i do agree with most of your points op i dont think there has to be a real life link between the thing a pokemon is based on and its elemental type as this is very limiting although i agree with every other point made especially about the colour scheme. Simple 2 or 3 colour schemes are the way to go with regards to most design i think.
 

Uber Waddles

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Wait, your judging the games as "Horrible", based off of, what. A minute of actual game play, 20 or so odd photos, and a pictures of only 7 out of the ATLEAST 100 Pokemon that are always added?

How about you wait to see the other Pokemon this generation, and actual gameplay, before judging.

Lets tackle your arguement though.

1. Grounded in Reality:

The first generation wasnt even spot on with this arguement. The first Pokemon, Bulbasaur, makes no sence. Its just a generic, 4 legged animal with a plant on its back. Blastoise. It has guns, in its shell. Never saw a turtle with Guns before. Lets move onto Paris, a Crab with Mushrooms in its back. Lots of the First generation Pokemon had bland typing because it was Game Freaks first attempt. The gameplay was so unbalanced that they had to add two new types for balance. The fact is, most Pokemon share a relation to a real life animal, besides the legendaries.

In the newer generations, the Grass type is the least-explainable; it looks like a type of Geecko, or lizard. Then we have the fire-pig and the Water-Otter. All of which are explainable. Do they fit the role? A fire pig makes as much sense as a Mushroom Crab. Its not like they have a Blue Pokemon you catch during fishing thats a Fire Type. Most Pokemon fans LOVE the second generation. By your arguement, Sudowoodo is a bad Pokemon; he should be Grass Type (he looks like a tree, afterall... Ive never seen a stone that looks like a tree. NOT REALISTIC)

Typing revolves more around color and role; not "it should be realistic". Seriously, worst game to have a "realism" arguement for.

2. Form after Function:

This arguement confused me. You CANT make that arguement yet; you dont know ANY of the stats of the new Pokemon. Not only that, but those functions are generally kept. Nosepass was a bulky rock. He had a HIGH defence. Granted, he was a shit Pokemon; that was his intent (a tank for lower tier battles). Probopass, his evolution, is an improved Tank. Not great, but useable. Most Pokemon server the purpose they look. There are always exceptions though. Lets go back to Sudowoodo. Hes a Pokemon that disguises himself as a Tree, even though hes Rock. Therefore, you'd assume he'd get lots of moves for Blending in; mimicing and Evasion. He gets the move Mimic and Copycat; thats about it.

The form of a Pokemon usually shows you what it does. When you see a Pokemon like Magmar, you say "Thats a Fire Pokemon". Thats the way it should be. Some Pokemon are set up in ways that you cant tell their purpose. Thats part of the mystery.

3. Simple Color Design

Once again... I dont see your issue. You've seen 7 Pokemon; and NONE of them have clashing colors. And this isnt a huge issue in other generations either. Yes, some Pokemon have more complex color designs. Thats because of Technology. You can have more colors, and more colors usually make the Pokemon look better. As far as Im concerned, this is just nit picking.

4. Similar Design Themes

Small Pokemon are Cute, Big ones look mean. Fair enough. But there are always inbetween Pokemon that have a look, well, inbetween.

Honestly, we would all get sick of Pokemon if all the small ones shared an "aww, cute" appeal. It would get boring, and really kill variety. Plus, a flawed arguement once again. Would you want to cuddle with a Weedle?

5. Evolution.

Blastiose has guns. In its shell. A tree on a Pokemons back (which, isnt that big if you look at the Pokedex) isnt that big of a deal. No one complained about Venasaurs tree.

GameFreak wanted more variety in the game. Yes, they made a Grass type turtle; I thought it worked out well. Torterra, the final evolution, has a tree on its back because, well, it fit. Its a land turtle. If they made EVERY turtle Water, EVERY newt Fire, every blah blah have the type blah, the game would get bland. Mixing things around is good.

6. Pokemon Should be Physically Equipped:

Nit-Picking again. Noespass doesnt have a Snort attack? If you read the data about Nosepass; his Nose is a Magnet. Thus equiping him with Magnet based attacks, and Electric attacks. In his attacks; he has attacks such as Lock On, Zap Cannon, Discharge, Magnet Rise, and Thunder Wave. Lets not also forget hes a rock, and has Rock based attacks (Earth Power, Earthquake, Rock Throw, Rock Polish).

Lovedisc was a Pokemon designed to just exist. An interesting idea; a nice idea, but a Crap Pokemon. Its a fish; it has water attacks. And I believe its designed after a real type of fish. ALSO, it gets Attract, Charm, Captivate, and Sweet Kiss. Moves that involve LOVE, and GENDER.

7. Simple = Better

No, simple brings you back, 10 years ago, to the GameBoy Color, when games couldnt have Complex designs.

This entire rant is just because YOU think Pokemons gotten worse because its changed.

Let me put it to you this way. Do I like Nosepass or Luvdisc? Hell no. Some of the new Pokemon look uninspired, and some arent good. A good portion are good, however.

The designer of the originals (the 251) has changed; and yes, the Pokemon are different. Still doesnt make the games any less fun. To be honest, I like the newer Pokemon because they make the Gameplay better (Ya know, the thing that makes games fun).

And yes, I have fond memeories of the originals. But that time is over. The originals Gameplay is NO WHERE NEAR AS GOOD, or engaging, as todays. I understand you have nestalgia, but seriously. The games are good enough, and the Pokemon, while they arent the greatest, arent bad. There different.
 

Artemus_Cain

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Brotherofwill said:
quote="Artemus_Cain" post="9.198149.6438939"]I'm sorry. I'm just hearing "BAWW! PLZ DON'T RAPE MY MEMORIES!"

I love pokemon, but it is just a simple game where humans force creature to fight, and when we lose sight of that pretentious stuff like this happens.
Your hearing probably isn't too good then. I like the new games, the gameplay is much better. I just think the visuals of the Pokemons have on a general note gotten worse, and tried to write about it. It is a simple game about animals fighting. If the animals aren't well executed then the game falls apart, or atleast loses some charm.[/quote]

Okay, fair enough. But this is all opinion, and in my opinion the new pokemon look great and the starters are believable as starters. There really is no pokemon with a perfect desigsn if you want to get into details.

I will give you this though, The recently revealed legendaries look ass to me. They look like yugio cards and I vehemently hate yugio.
 

reg42

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Mar 18, 2009
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Nintendo doesn't develop the Pokemon games, Game Freak does. Why do so few people realise that?

I'm just putting that out there.
 

Soxafloppin

Coxa no longer floppin'
Jun 22, 2009
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Mr. Grey said:
I agree somewhat... but I don't agree with elements needing to be tied in. I mean they should at least look anatomically correct, but the element shouldn't factor in their appearance. Maybe color, but not really their physical appearance.

Radeonx said:
The only problem I have with the new starters is the water one, and that's because I don't know what the fuck it is.
I think it's supposed to be an otter.
Im stuck between Cat, Polar-bear, Otter, and snowman.
 

Danpascooch

Zombie Specialist
Apr 16, 2009
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Rabid Meese said:
Wait, your judging the games as "Horrible", based off of, what. A minute of actual game play, 20 or so odd photos, and a pictures of only 7 out of the ATLEAST 100 Pokemon that are always added?

How about you wait to see the other Pokemon this generation, and actual gameplay, before judging.

Lets tackle your arguement though.

1. Grounded in Reality:

The first generation wasnt even spot on with this arguement. The first Pokemon, Bulbasaur, makes no sence. Its just a generic, 4 legged animal with a plant on its back. Blastoise. It has guns, in its shell. Never saw a turtle with Guns before. Lets move onto Paris, a Crab with Mushrooms in its back. Lots of the First generation Pokemon had bland typing because it was Game Freaks first attempt. The gameplay was so unbalanced that they had to add two new types for balance. The fact is, most Pokemon share a relation to a real life animal, besides the legendaries.

In the newer generations, the Grass type is the least-explainable; it looks like a type of Geecko, or lizard. Then we have the fire-pig and the Water-Otter. All of which are explainable. Do they fit the role? A fire pig makes as much sense as a Mushroom Crab. Its not like they have a Blue Pokemon you catch during fishing thats a Fire Type. Most Pokemon fans LOVE the second generation. By your arguement, Sudowoodo is a bad Pokemon; he should be Grass Type (he looks like a tree, afterall... Ive never seen a stone that looks like a tree. NOT REALISTIC)

Typing revolves more around color and role; not "it should be realistic". Seriously, worst game to have a "realism" arguement for.

2. Form after Function:

This arguement confused me. You CANT make that arguement yet; you dont know ANY of the stats of the new Pokemon. Not only that, but those functions are generally kept. Nosepass was a bulky rock. He had a HIGH defence. Granted, he was a shit Pokemon; that was his intent (a tank for lower tier battles). Probopass, his evolution, is an improved Tank. Not great, but useable. Most Pokemon server the purpose they look. There are always exceptions though. Lets go back to Sudowoodo. Hes a Pokemon that disguises himself as a Tree, even though hes Rock. Therefore, you'd assume he'd get lots of moves for Blending in; mimicing and Evasion. He gets the move Mimic and Copycat; thats about it.

The form of a Pokemon usually shows you what it does. When you see a Pokemon like Magmar, you say "Thats a Fire Pokemon". Thats the way it should be. Some Pokemon are set up in ways that you cant tell their purpose. Thats part of the mystery.

3. Simple Color Design

Once again... I dont see your issue. You've seen 7 Pokemon; and NONE of them have clashing colors. And this isnt a huge issue in other generations either. Yes, some Pokemon have more complex color designs. Thats because of Technology. You can have more colors, and more colors usually make the Pokemon look better. As far as Im concerned, this is just nit picking.

4. Similar Design Themes

Small Pokemon are Cute, Big ones look mean. Fair enough. But there are always inbetween Pokemon that have a look, well, inbetween.

Honestly, we would all get sick of Pokemon if all the small ones shared an "aww, cute" appeal. It would get boring, and really kill variety. Plus, a flawed arguement once again. Would you want to cuddle with a Weedle?

5. Evolution.

Blastiose has guns. In its shell. A tree on a Pokemons back (which, isnt that big if you look at the Pokedex) isnt that big of a deal. No one complained about Venasaurs tree.

GameFreak wanted more variety in the game. Yes, they made a Grass type turtle; I thought it worked out well. Torterra, the final evolution, has a tree on its back because, well, it fit. Its a land turtle. If they made EVERY turtle Water, EVERY newt Fire, every blah blah have the type blah, the game would get bland. Mixing things around is good.

6. Pokemon Should be Physically Equipped:

Nit-Picking again. Noespass doesnt have a Snort attack? If you read the data about Nosepass; his Nose is a Magnet. Thus equiping him with Magnet based attacks, and Electric attacks. In his attacks; he has attacks such as Lock On, Zap Cannon, Discharge, Magnet Rise, and Thunder Wave. Lets not also forget hes a rock, and has Rock based attacks (Earth Power, Earthquake, Rock Throw, Rock Polish).

Lovedisc was a Pokemon designed to just exist. An interesting idea; a nice idea, but a Crap Pokemon. Its a fish; it has water attacks. And I believe its designed after a real type of fish. ALSO, it gets Attract, Charm, Captivate, and Sweet Kiss. Moves that involve LOVE, and GENDER.

7. Simple = Better

No, simple brings you back, 10 years ago, to the GameBoy Color, when games couldnt have Complex designs.

This entire rant is just because YOU think Pokemons gotten worse because its changed.

Let me put it to you this way. Do I like Nosepass or Luvdisc? Hell no. Some of the new Pokemon look uninspired, and some arent good. A good portion are good, however.

The designer of the originals (the 251) has changed; and yes, the Pokemon are different. Still doesnt make the games any less fun. To be honest, I like the newer Pokemon because they make the Gameplay better (Ya know, the thing that makes games fun).

And yes, I have fond memeories of the originals. But that time is over. The originals Gameplay is NO WHERE NEAR AS GOOD, or engaging, as todays. I understand you have nestalgia, but seriously. The games are good enough, and the Pokemon, while they arent the greatest, arent bad. There different.
You need to actually READ the OP, he isn't talking about the games not being good, just about the physical appearance and design of the pokemon.
 

AdamRBi

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Amnestic said:
yeah the originals weren't perfect.
Thank you. I think we're done here. Old designs had their suckage. New designs have their suckage. Charmander had a stupid face, Squirtle was uninspired, Bulbasaur is...are you sure it's a toad? Doesn't look like any toad I ever saw.

Also, Diglett does not look like a mole. It looks like a long, thin, brown balloon with a face drawn on it.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_FL9EaqicjX8/TAF43EDXjRI/AAAAAAAAAMg/LeGjATHiN9c/Subadult_Am_toad.jpghttp://lh5.ggpht.com/_FL9EaqicjX8/TAF42jW1zCI/AAAAAAAAAMY/6zmu4ZuiWJs/Bulbasaur.jpg
Funny, looks like a green toad to me. (That and technically Bulbasaur is a Dinosaur.)


One thing I'd add though, as a Rule is:

These are wild creatures, not sentient beings.

They should really stop having so much personality in their faces and actions, with this much intelligence they could easily overthrow us.

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_FL9EaqicjX8/TAF42-7kdcI/AAAAAAAAAMc/af_FYoSS2L8/bulbasaur.png
Sure, he looks harmless enough showing all that emotion... except for the fact that he probably secretes poison. Go ahead, hug him.
(Bulbasaur is a Grass/Poison type.)
 

Soxafloppin

Coxa no longer floppin'
Jun 22, 2009
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Amnestic said:
Please explain to me how whatever Bulbasaur is (a...thing?) with a plant bulb on its back is "grounded in reality".
I think its actually a small Dinosaur, Hense the "Saur" part, Bulba is in relation to Bulb, where a plant starts.

Bulbasaur is where this evolution starts, It grows into Ivy and then into a Venus Fly trap, keeping the "Saur" thoughout to indiciate its a Dinosaur.

Hope that helped.
 

molester jester

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Sep 4, 2008
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The connection between fire and pig are virtually non-existent.
there is a very obvious connection between them, Fire + pig = bacon, thus the second evolution should be some sort of bacon monster.
 

Stone Wera

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Feb 13, 2010
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Mr. Grey said:
Radeonx said:
Mr. Grey said:
Radeonx said:
The only problem I have with the new starters is the water one, and that's because I don't know what the fuck it is.
I think it's supposed to be an otter.
That's what I guess, but from what some people have said, it's a cross between that and a platypus.
It still makes no fucking sense.
I agree with you 100%.

Then again, the platypus doesn't make sense and that's a very real thing. So maybe that's the point? I don't know, I have no idea what Nintendo has up its sleeves anymore. I honestly think they stopped caring about this franchise.
It's a beaver maybe?
Beaver/otter?
Bunny/pig.
I guess that makes sense.
 

DarkRyter

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Dec 15, 2008
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The new water starter is one of the most divisive pokemon I've ever seen.

Comparatively, the leaf starter, Tsutarja(Japanese name), is relatively popular. I'm guessing that smug, arrogant look that says "I'm hanging out with these two guys, ironically" is giving him massive cool points amongst the fans.

The fire one has seen an overall neutral reaction. It's a pig. It can shoot fire.

On the other hand, the water starter, Mijumaru, has only two possible reaction. "It looks fucking stupid." and "It's so goddamn ADOWABLE"
Personally, I have high hopes for Mijumaru. It gives off an aura of awkwardness in both its design and expression, that somehow endears him to me. At the same time, being a cutesy starter pokemon means one thing. POTENTIAL.

If a starter looks cute in its first form, it will become infinitely more badass in its final evolution.
Example 1: Torchic. It's a little orange chick. it waddles around on its tiny legs, maybe launches a adorable little ember. It eventually becomes Blaziken, a powerful humanoid, martial arts master comparable to even the most powerful of fighting types.

Example 2: Piplup. This thing was engineered by game freak (not nintendo. When will people realize that Nintendo doesn't directly make this. Years of having GAME FREAK appear in the opening to every pokemon game ever has somehow not helped) to be as adorable as possible. big eyes, small size, soft coloring. The anime has even been trying to make it a mascot on par with Pikachu. It eventually becomes Empoleon, a black amalgam of Steel and Bird, capable of slicing glaciers in half with its wings and exudes a strong aura of pure pride and dignity.

Now, looking at Mijumaru, you can see its white and light blue color scheme reflective of an arctic theme. Now what other animal is mammalian and arctic themed? No, not walruses. We already have Walrein.

Fucking Polar Bears.

That's right, that cute little thing waddling around next to a smug leafy reptile and a pig wearing a bandana, eventually becoming the biggest land carnivore on the planet, capable of dragging out Beluga whales to feed.

(While I'm at it, Game Freak should make a Narwhal pokemon. Narwhals, Narwhals, swimming in the ocean...)
 

Uber Waddles

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May 13, 2010
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danpascooch said:
You need to actually READ the OP, he isn't talking about the games not being good, just about the physical appearance and design of the pokemon.
You need to put your critical thinking cap on.

I did read. What he says almost directly correlates into GamePlay. Specifically, hows looks correlate to abilities.
 

Danpascooch

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Apr 16, 2009
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Rabid Meese said:
danpascooch said:
You need to actually READ the OP, he isn't talking about the games not being good, just about the physical appearance and design of the pokemon.
You need to put your critical thinking cap on.

I did read. What he says almost directly correlates into GamePlay. Specifically, hows looks correlate to abilities.
Right, he is talking about physical appearance and moveset tweaks on a pokemon by pokemon basis.

That is hardly calling the game HORRIBLE or the core gameplay bad, he simply thinks abilities should be more closely tied to looks.

I am a Pokemon fanatic, but criticism is a core part of the evolution of any game series, and I think he makes great points.

He does not say that core gameplay or concept is a problem, simply that looks need to correlate more to movesets on a pokemon to pokemon basis.
 

^=ash=^

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Brotherofwill said:
Now look at their joined features: They all have different eyes. Their moods are pronounced and seem strange by giving Pokemon overly human emotions. Their leg and arm shapes are vastly different and don't look unified at all. They all have different mouths. To be honest they hardly have any similar features.
while i disagree with you views and wasn't intending to follow them up, this last bit i thought was a little ... well stupid in my opinion .. you're mad because the starters don't look the same as each other .... surely the should look completely different since they are DIFFERENT.