The REAL reason why RWBY failed(You're not gonna believe it)

[DirectorK]

No, I'm serious. You are seriously not going to believe what I just found out about RWBY's script writing process. As if it couldn't get any worse. Yesterday I watched fatmanfalling's latest video on YouTube about RWBY talking about how Yang was such a poorly developed and bland character through the first volume and even the second volume to a extent. Here's the video:


While I was scrolling through the comments to see other people's thoughts and I came across a comment from the poster himself that made me think he was making it up. I actually had to ask the guy if this was true. And it was, because it came straight out of Volume 1's DVD/Blu-Ray commentary from the writers. And I have no reason to doubt this guy. I'm going to use the exact comments from the video.

"Pyrrha does have a good design, but aesthetic stuff doesn't really sway me.
Finding out that her character arc was based on an adlib hurt her reputation for me."

Wait, what? Oh, but wait! It's gets better!

"Jaune Weiss and Pyrrha's romantic arc was added because of an adlib during casting. Apparently in the original version of the script Pyrrha wasn't supposed to be interested in Jaune. and Jaune wasn't supposed to be hot for Weiss. And those two things take up a lot of volume 2, so that's why the story seems so unfocused."

My reaction:


AD-LIBBING?! FUCKING AD-LIBBING?! ARE YOU FUCKING SERIOUS?! AD-LIBBING! THIS HAS GOT TO BE A JOKE! FUCKING AD-LIBBING?!

I... I can't... I just don't...

I'm totally speechless! I am totally speechless! No wonder this show became such a fucking disaster! Because of AD-LIBBING! Rooster Teeth and Monty Oum allowed this shit to go on and it ended up in the fucking script! Ad-lbbing. Fucking Ad-libbing. The stupid romance arcs between Jaune, Pyrrha, and Weiss, all came into existence because of fucking ad-libbing! I just can't believe it! I just can't!

This is the real reason why RWBY failed so hard because of fucking ab-libbing! The original script might have actually been a lot better had it not been for fucking ad-libbing! It's all crystal clear now, thanks to fucking ad-libbing. You fucking idiots!

YOU CAN'T BE THIS STUPID ROOSTER TEETH! YOU JUST CAN'T! YOU LITERALLY STATED OUT LOUD THROUGH THE COMMENTARY WHY THIS SHOW IS SUCH A FUCKING MESS! WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?! ARE YOU HIGH ON SOMETHING?! DID EBOLA AFFECT YOUR BRAINS?! I'M SORRY IF I SOUND LIKE A JERK BUT HOW THE HELL DO YOU EXPLAIN THIS?! HOW COULD YOU FUCK IT UP THIS BADLY?! WHO THE HELL IS RUNNING THIS COMPANY?! WHO THOUGHT THIS WAS WAS A GOOD IDEA?! WHO APPROVED THIS?! WHO?! JUST WHO?!

*sighs heavily* Give me a moment everyone...

I guess I shouldn't be all that surprised seeing how RWBY's writing is absolutely terrible, but this goes beyond appalling. Never in all my entire life have I seen such a colossal fuck up such as this one. Honestly, there's nothing wrong with doing ad-libbing or in-prov, Robin Williams did plenty of that through his career. But where it works in some products it doesn't work in others, as this guy who was just as speechless as I was commented on the same video.

"It doesn't even WORK! Jaune being infatuated with Weiss doesn't come off as charming or funny. It comes off as passive aggressive and awkward! Yet the audience finds him sooooo charming anyway, like the guitar scene wasn't physically painful to watch. To say nothing of the fact that one of Jaune's reasons for liking Weiss is based on stuff from the trailer that Monty declared NON-CANON. And Pyrra wasn't even SUPPOSED to be attracted to Jaune, because "we believe she acts this way towards everybody." So basically they retconned it into affection for Jaune."

And I agree with him! Because he's right! Remember the rant I exploded into on Volume 2 Episode 6: Burning the Candle when Jaune asked the question "Have you ever heard her sing?" even though it was never established that Weiss was a singer? Apparently through the ad-libbing process they forgot about the the first two trailers being non-canon and put it into the script! And Monty, not paying attention because he was too busy day-dreaming about his next big fight scene, didn't do anything about it!

This new revelation has proven one thing to me and it's the final nail in the coffin for this show. They don't give a damn about RWBY, how could they after this? The reason why they did it, aside from Monty just wanting to make money and get attention, is because they had nothing better to do. Hell, they even admitted they were pandering to the audience in Volume 2 with all the shipping.

I can tell you right now Volume 3 is not going to be any better. With their current attitude toward this series I can't see it becoming any better that what we've seen so far. Maybe it will but I wouldn't get my hopes up. This revelation destroyed my last hope for RWBY.

Ad-libbing. Fucking ad-libbing.

I'm losing it, guys. I'm gonna repeat those words going into Volume 3 when it premiers. And if we see another stupid romance arc, we'll have a pretty good idea of where it came from.

 

[Able Seacat]

What do you mean failed? Did they loose money on this show or something? Also, calm down.

 

[Zontar]

What do you mean failed? Did they loose money on this show or something? Also, calm down.

Critically the series has been much more poorly received then people expected it to be (especially season 2)

 

[Queen Michael]

So... I, uh, take it you're no big fan of RWBY, then?

 

[DirectorK]

So... I, uh, take it you're no big fan of RWBY, then?

I don't hate it, it's just so frustrating from start to finish. When it was first announced I was really looking forward to it because I thought it was not going to be another typical anime with a story that we've seen a million times over and instead it was going to be an epic fantasy/adventure show similar to that of an RPG video game like the Tales of the Abyss and Star Ocean EX anime, something I've been so desperately wanting to see more and more of.

Nope, instead that's exactly what we got and I was being unpleasantly reminded of what happened with Sailor Moon(both old and new). So you can see why many of us are upset about RWBY because it was nothing like what we expected, and wanted, it to be. I can give all you all the details why that is but I would just end up going into another rant. Just look at the reviews on this forum and you'll why.

I like RWBY because it has a great concept that could develope into something greater. But under the hands of Rooster Teeth, it will never have an opportunity to do so.

 

[Armadox]

Can.. can I now be a fan of it if only because of how the OP handles it? I mean, I think I've now gotten more entertainment from him then if I watched or knew what the show even was.

Also, ad-libbing happens a lot in television and movies. A lot of really classic parts came from an actor or many going off script. Hell, I think half of Bill Murray's career was built on the random things he'd do. So I wouldn't really put down ad-libbing as a demon to cinema.

Anyways, this isn't really a big deal, as Rooster Teeth have always kinda seemed like the company to have really good ideas, and let whatever happens happen.

 

[Mikeyfell]

Yep, that Fatmanfalling guy sure makes great videos. I think everyone should subscribe to him.

 

[Erttheking]

Anyways, this isn't really a big deal, as Rooster Teeth have always kinda seemed like the company to have really good ideas, and let whatever happens happen.

Pretty much. It was a company founded by a bunch of friends and every new hire is pretty much letting someone else into the group. It's part of their charm.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

I don't think there's a reason to be mad about the ad-libbing if only for the fact that the writing for the show was never good anyway. Take a look at the first episode, that's the most polished their script ever got and the writing is absolutely attrocious, so if anything the ad-libbing could only have helped.

Then again I've never been a fan of the show. I watched the first two episodes and then never touched it again. Like I said, the writing was terrible and the whole "magical academy" thing is so overused already that I felt like I'd already seen everything they have to offer in other better made anime. There's just nothing for me there. I think that Rooster Teeth really shot themselves in the foot when they decided that they wanted to make their anime specifically like others in the genre rather than attempting something entirely unique, so any criticism of the show always comes with a comparison to other, better shows.

 

[Spartan448]

I don't hate it, it's just so frustrating from start to finish. When it was first announced I was really looking forward to it because I thought it was not going to be another typical anime with a story that we've seen a million times over and instead it was going to be an epic fantasy/adventure show similar to that of an RPG video game like the Tales of the Abyss and Star Ocean EX anime, something I've been so desperately wanting to see more and more of.

Nope, instead that's exactly what we got and I was being unpleasantly reminded of what happened with Sailor Moon(both old and new). So you can see why many of us are upset about RWBY because it was nothing like what we expected, and wanted, it to be.

I like RWBY because it has a great concept that could develope into something greater. But under the hands of Rooster Teeth, it will never have an opportunity to do so.

So the problems you have with RWBY stem from the fact that you were overhyped for promises that were never made, because you had this perception that the show was going to be completely different from how it was advertised or even described, because you were so desperate for what would have essentially been a giant stroke of luck (like most good media are) that you immediately expected a golden goose?

I'd say your problem there isn't the show, but with expecting a Western company that has never done anything remotely close to anime before working with an entirely green staff to pull off things on the same level as studios that have been working professionally for many years with staff who are the absolute best in their fields.

It's like asking one of the random guards in Metal Gear to pull off the Shadow Moses infiltration. They're not going to come anywhere close to what you expected. And it irks me whenever people complain about RWBY for it not being what they expected, rather than the more obvious concerns of animation quality, pacing, and number of characters, which most of the other problems stem from. I just have to think what did you people expect? I went into RWBY expecting a quality much lower that of more well-known and well-established franchises. Truth be told I actually expected RWBY to start not far from the bottom of the barrel, much like RvB and YGOTAS did. And that's where RWBY was a pleasant surprise, because there is quite a bit out there that is vastly worse than RWBY V1 was. So I'm honestly impressed - they've largely met or beaten my expectations thus far with the exception of a certain scene in V2. And the show can only get better from here.

As for the aforementioned romance plot, while as a short term play it seems foolish, it opens up a plethora of golden opportunities in the long-term. The main thing about Jaune is he's incompetent, and he's still very much incompetent. I'd love to see that incompetence get his entire team killed in the worst way possible, and it's all the sweeter if Jaune looses his sweatheart because of it. You could even introduce a suicide subplot. As for Weiss, that's pure comedic relief and to see it as anything serious is to severely misinterpret that part of Jaune. Hell, the entire thing with the guitar was purely done to make fun of the classic American trope of the looser high school jock winning over his sweetheart by going up to her window at night and incessantly playing love songs badly on guitar or a broken radio.

More serious is the fact that Jaune's team has on the whole more screen time than the actual protagonists, who we still know basically nothing about. We know that Ruby isn't Yang's complete biological sister and that she lived on an island. Cool... more details needed. We know that Weiss is the heiress to a massive energy corporation and that she dislikes the practices and stances her family has taken in the past, and wants to undo them by... becoming a Huntress instead of just inheriting the company and forcing it to change because "I'm the owner fuck you"? Yeah we need more details as to why Weiss thinks this is a good idea. Also why she hates her sister. For Blake - We know that she used to be part of the huge terrorist organization that is the major antagonist of the show. And it's hinted that her former partner while part of the organization is kind of the head honcho there. AND YOU GIVE US NO MORE DETAILS ON THIS?! That is inexcusable. And Yang... Well given the ending of V2 I think V3 is going to give us a lot of characterization for Yang, so I'll hold my judgement on that for now. We also still know nothing about the bad guys either. Hell, Super Robot Wars by this time laid out basically half the plot and exactly why the first set of bad guys was bad and what exactly they wanted. This is taking too long.

I like RWBY because it has a great concept that could develope into something greater. But under the hands of Rooster Teeth, it will never have an opportunity to do so.

Also, this is exactly the line that everyone towed with Red vs Blue when it first came out. Hell you could literally swap RWBY out for RvB in this sentence and exactly match some of the first opinions on RvB. RT is very much a company whose style revolves around easing themselves into their work. It's gonna take a few seasons, yeah, but they'll start getting it right. And there's clearly enough people who think they've already got it mostly right to tide the company over until they do.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

What is ab-libbing?

Ad-libbing is basically "going off the script". Sometimes actors will forget lines or become inspired and make up their own dialogue on the spot. Sometimes this can lead to fantastic material that the producer decides to keep in; more often, though, it falls flat (which doesn't preclude the producer from also leaving it in for whatever reason).

 

[Sniper Team 4]

Um...I've never watched an episode of RWBY. It didn't interest me. But ab-libbing isn't the devil's work. Sister from Red vs. Blue came straight from that process. They just kept giving her voice actress lines, seeing if she would eventually say no, but she just kept on running with it.
It seems more like the writers and producers should have cracked down and used a bit more editing and executive decision making than anything.

 

[LawAndChaos]

Ad-libbing is not the devil, but keep in mind it should not be a significant part of the writing process. You know that scene in Indiana Jones where he shoots that sword guy? That was a scene that came simply from Harrison Ford being tired that day and just shrugging his shoulders and going "fuck it, I'm just gonna shoot him." And despite that scene being hilarious and iconic, the guy who spent all that time practicing for the big fight that was supposed to happen ended up practicing for nothing, and was rightfully pissed off (he still fell when he was shot anyway, which was pretty cool of him).

There are lots of scenes like that, but they're not planned in advance or put into the script on purpose. You can't make significant plot points out of improv and ad-libbing, because ad-libbing is literally making something up on the spot. Plus this implies the team on RWBY is literally just having these "improv sessions" to brainstorm ideas for the plot, and then taking whatever and throwing it in there because "why the hell not?" Improv is not something a bunch of amateur writers working on a brand new IP should be doing. It shows they're not taking this IP seriously, and thus just throw whatever at the wall to see what sticks.

They could've told a compelling story here. Instead they're doing improv.

And Spartan, I agree with a lot of what you're saying there.

Roll with me on this:
Was the food fight in significant to the plot?
Was the dance significant to the plot? And not the side arc, the MAIN PLOT.
Has anything the villains done so far had any sort of narrative weight?

To answer them in order:
1. No, it was filler.
2. No, it was a quick and easy band-aid on love triangle melodrama that the writers never initially intended but retconned in volume 2 to pander to shippers.
3. No, because we don't know what exactly they're doing, and have been left completely in the dark about what they're trying to do, without so much as a hint.

Also, tone isn't a switch you flip. Having people suddenly die horribly would be a jarring tonal shift. There are two kinds of tonal shifts: the one that you're eased into, and the "wham" where a single moment or line of dialogue completely changes the context of prior scenes and sends the story in a different direction. I honestly cannot trust the writers to do either effectively.

Also also, Monty has outright stated he wants to tell this story without having people die. The only character to die in Volume 2 is a one-shot character they introduce solely for the purpose of being murdered. If the puma dude turned out to not be dead and survived thanks to his aura thingy, that would be a bigger twist than anything the writers have come up with thus far.

 

[Izanagi009_v1legacy]

Okay,
One: really, you use one of the clips I used for my RWBY reviews? it's a good clip but really?

Two: WHY, your show has barely gotten off the ground, why would you adlib lines so early? If it was a small throwaway gag like "birdie, no" that Ruby does while falling, I can take it but having an entire arc because of an adlib without editing your script is stupid beyond all comprehension


Oh dear god, I might as well put on Linkara's attire and just start doing a web series because I will have reviewing gold for the third volume given the stupidity of Miles and Kerry.

 

[Drummodino]

Really guys? Bashing RWBY the day that this happens?

http://roosterteeth.com/news/entry.php?id=5427280

"It is with great regret that I must inform you that our co-worker and our dear friend, Monty Oum, has had a medical emergency. He is currently hospitalized in critical care and it is not known if he will recover."

You're free to criticize RWBY all you want but maybe just for today give it a rest out of respect for its creator.

 

[Shinkicker444]

I've never seen RWBY, but I've seen a bunch of the merchandise in stores around the place, so I figured it was pretty popular/good. I have been meaning to watch it for a while now. Is it not actually that good or whatever?

 

[Spartan448]

I've never seen RWBY, but I've seen a bunch of the merchandise in stores around the place, so I figured it was pretty popular/good. I have been meaning to watch it for a while now. Is it not actually that good or whatever?

It's middling. It's got two seasons so far, and with maybe three or four exceptions the entire team is green, and the production is low-budget to boot. It certainly has it's good points, and it was good enough to warrant a Japanese dub, and one of the VAs got picked up for the Fairy Tail English dub, but it definitely has it's negatives as well. There's a particularly bad rooftop running scene in the second season...

 

[Shinkicker444]

It's middling. It's got two seasons so far, and with maybe three or four exceptions the entire team is green, and the production is low-budget to boot. It certainly has it's good points, and it was good enough to warrant a Japanese dub, and one of the VAs got picked up for the Fairy Tail English dub, but it definitely has it's negatives as well. There's a particularly bad rooftop running scene in the second season...

Hmm, guess I shall still check it out then. I've seen some pretty bad anime, can't be as bad as some of them.

 

[omega 616]

Say ad libbing one more time, I dare you, I double dare mother fucker!

I watched the first episode and thought "this is crap, I'm outtie". It had this super bright, mirrors edge look to it, even I could tell the writing was crap and the animation was just bad.

It's like somebody who is into anime said to their rich daddy, "can I make an anime" and of course the dad spoils the kid and say yes, so the kid learns how to animate, then with the most basic of skill, knocks together half baked crap. Thing is rich daddy is also very popular, so everybody watches it.

I also find rooster teeth are uploading an enormous amount of crap. I know they recently got bought or part bought by a bigger company, so they can make more stuff, but the stuff they are making is crap!

Trying to do these comedy shorts that are just awkward 'cos none of them are actors, they are geeks.

The coolest ones are the only bearable ones, gus, burney, Barbra and the achievement hunter crew ... people like Blaine, monty, kerry and the others that occasionally show up on the podcast are like cringe comedy ... just awkward and unfunny.