The 'whats the point in marriage?' debate :)

[Danzaivar]

Marriage is a prison for the naive and idealistic, and a financial burden beyond any but childbirth - but at least childbirth completes a biological imperative.

Yeah gotta hate the tax breaks and all the legal conveniences it brings as well.

Course, it's harder to be edgy that way.

 

[Xojins]

Some people get married because they love each other, but in my opinion it's turned into more of a status thing than anything else. People want the appearance of stability by being in a committed relationship.

 

[CaptainMurasa]

I myself don't find the point in marriage. Sure it's a statement that you're willing to commit yourself to the person for the rest of your life, but doesn't that promise mean more when you're not bound by a contract to keep it? And the staggering divorce rate shows that people aren't holding to those contracts anyway.

Then again, I'm gayer than a rainbow-shitting unicorn so this might just be the bitter lesbian in me talking.

 

[Thunderhorse31]

This is just me, but whenever I see someone arguing against marriage, I assume they are a teenage boy, or they have the maturity level of a teenage boy.

*And after checking the age of everyone else that has posted, and finding the oldest of you is 22, I kind of stand by that.

lol, I struggle against drawing similar conclusions, as if spouting off some soliloquy about the "arcane institution" somehow makes you cool, or somehow justifies promiscuity.

If you don't want to go through a ceremony, pledge commitment before various state and religious organizations, or promise to stay with one person forever, then don't do it. But don't attempt to shit on those of us who have.

 

[bdcjacko]

That is nice, but not going through with some sort of ceremony isn't going to impress your girlfriend.

Frankly if that's all you're getting married for, you probably won't have much to do after the marriage.

No, she will find other things to nag about.

But there are benefits to being married if you do it right. Now I'll agree there is no point in getting married more than 3 times.

 

[bdcjacko]

Also, this debate is silly to have on the internet because the laws vary state to state, province to province and country to country. In a common law state or province, if you have already been together for x number of years, you are defacto married so besides officially stating your feeling about each other in front of friends and family, there isn't any legal need to do it.

And to the people who simply are simply looking at an emotional ritual through the eyes of logic, you will never understand until you are there.

 

[bdcjacko]

This is just me, but whenever I see someone arguing against marriage, I assume they are a teenage boy, or they have the maturity level of a teenage boy.

*And after checking the age of everyone else that has posted, and finding the oldest of you is 22, I kind of stand by that.

I'm 42, and married with a young daughter. Like you I am an accountant by training. I see no purpose in non religious marriage.

Now instead of just throwing out insults, what purpose do you see in it?

Best feeling in the world knowing you have someone who will say she wants to be with you and only you forever. It is nice not wondering if you are going to grow old alone. It is emotional security that nothing else can really offer.

 

[Dags90]

I would get married for the medical, tax, and other legal and financial incentives even though I'm not religious. I'd probably get a prenup though.

 

[kickyourass]

Well from my perspective marriage has become close to meaningless in terms of "Sanctity" I mean if someone can get married and end it almost immediately, it's no longer sacred as far as I'm concerned.

For me a Marriage is more of a really elaborate promise that both people will stay with each other no matter what happens and all that sorta stuff. Plus there's a couple hundred legal and financial benefits, that's probably a factor.

 

[Iron Lightning]

Meh, personally I don't see the small tax incentives as being worth the risk of an expensive divorce followed by alimony payments. Why should I risk losing half my stuff in a few years just to make a hollow symbolic gesture?

Then again, I'm gayer than a rainbow-shitting unicorn so this might just be the bitter lesbian in me talking.

Nah, the bitter lesbian in you is clamoring to be married, I think it's the rational human being talking

Also, welcome to The Escapist, and remember to stay out of the basement!

 

[pulse2]

Well, first off, marriage is not strictly related to religion. People have been getting married before Christianity even existed for example. Non-religious people usually don't have a religious ceremony in a church, they have what's called a civil ceremony. And they can chose where they have this ceremony, ei. City Hall, outdoors etc.. So they don't employ the church's services at all. I don't know where you got the idea that marriage has to go through the church.

Second of all, from your post, I'm going to assume that you don't know that marriage is actually a legally binding contract that the government recognizes. There are a couple benefits to this: like certain social services, certain tax breaks, also can make a joint bank account that can come with lots of other financial benefits.

And thirdly, and this is probably the most important point of marriage, is that it's a commitment. When you marry someone, your basically telling them in a fancy, and elaborate way that you will love, and support them, and be faithful to them for the rest of your life. If you think of marriage in a cold, rational way, then you will never understand. You have to use your emotional side. I really hate to pull the age card, but how old are you? It's likely that you'll understand this concept when your older.

No, I know about the contractual benefits, but I personally don't see that as any more than a means to financial gain or stability or to otherwise be granted permission to use, achieve or gain something. But this simple means, such as using it as a means to stay in a country to which you were not born in is pretty much reaffirming the point to what I stated in the first place, that has nothing to do with love, it is only for the interest of both parties, and in some cases only used to get past something rather than a commitment between the two lovers.

I say this because divorce rates (at least in the UK anyway) have been rising, and there are many who don't take marriage as a whole serious, rather, seeing it as a curse or a handcuff to the person you are tied with.

How is one to say they are in love at age 20, get married and realise 5 years down the line they no longer have those feelings any more, but instead are more madly in love with someone else they are not married to. The way I see it, marriage is often used as a way to 'posses' someone, sort of like signing a contract to confirm a house is yours and a car is yours, but a house and car do not have free will or a change in decision, they can't 'decide' that they no longer want you to drive or live in them and would much rather have the nice lady across the street who treats her house better than you do.

This is going off tangent a little, so back on topic. My point is, that while I appreciate the romantic value of marriage, why don't many people take it seriously, why is it so easy to fall out of love with someone you only two years ago confessed to look after and be commited to. At least if you weren't married, there would be less to concern yourself with other than if you have kids, you can happily live life with someone you believe to be a better partner and be happy, rather than force yourself to live a farce JUST for the sake of a commitment you made in your naivity.

Should one be forced to stay with the person they married for the rest of their life when we have the free will as humans to do as we wish within the law?

I've been told that not getting married leaves the option open to cheat, I personally don't think you are any more inclined to cheat if you love someone you are not married to than if you are when you are married, I only have to look at Ashley Cole or several other closer to home examples like a cousin of mine who fell for the nanny and left his wife.

I'm 22 by the way, almost 23, old enough to understand the concept of marriage and the values of it as I too am capable of getting married, maybe I'm too young to, but I like to see it this way, if you think you are old enough to do it, you should be old enough to understand the consequences.

Edit: Sorry about my limited understanding of the history behind marriage taking place at the church, that's why I said 'correct me if I'm wrong', I'm open to corrections, I've just always linked marriage to religeon as it quotes in bible after bible that sex before marriage, etc etc.

 

[CCountZero]

Anyway, the point is, is there a real need for marriage? First off, I was under the impression marriage was religeous related, correct me if I'm wrong

In some places religion encouraged it, in other cases civil concerns, mainly property rights, were behind it. The civil may well predate the religious.

In the province I live you gain 99% of the rights and obligations of being married after living together for 3 years. Many of those rights kick in as quickly as 1 year. You can make them kick in on day 1 through a civil contract called a "cohabitation agreement", and in such an agreement you can lock yourself into any conditions you want, not those that the government of the day sets as the defaults (basically it works like a prenup that is more widely used/known).

I know some (most?) non religious people that marry do so because of old societal expectations, because they think it "proves" that attachment of the other, or that they are "owed" a ring after XX amount of time, or they just want the pretty party where they dress in white and get to be the star of the day.

I am married for religious reasons. If it were not for those reasons I don't know that I would bother to get a civil marriage. What's the point?

Interestingly my great grandfather, for his third marriage (he was 86, she was 73) opted for a religious marriage but he and his wife never bothered with a civil marriage.

Basicly this.

Like so many things before it, it was useful, but has overstayed it's welcome.

If you want to prove your love, you do it on ALL days, not ONE day.

 

[Iron Lightning]

This is just me, but whenever I see someone arguing against marriage, I assume they are a teenage boy, or they have the maturity level of a teenage boy.

*And after checking the age of everyone else that has posted, and finding the oldest of you is 22, I kind of stand by that.

I'm 42, and married with a young daughter. Like you I am an accountant by training. I see no purpose in non religious marriage.

Now instead of just throwing out insults, what purpose do you see in it?

Best feeling in the world knowing you have someone who will say she wants to be with you and only you forever. It is nice not wondering if you are going to grow old alone. It is emotional security that nothing else can really offer.

That would be the case if divorce didn't exist. Fortunately, that is not the world we inhabit. I don't understand why you appear to believe that such emotional security is impossible to achieve without a ring, a ceremony, and a binding legal contract.

 

[CaptainMurasa]

Best feeling in the world knowing you have someone who will say she wants to be with you and only you forever. It is nice not wondering if you are going to grow old alone. It is emotional security that nothing else can really offer.

Sure, it must be an amazing feeling for the people that don't get divorced after a few months of wedded bliss.

Also, welcome to The Escapist, and remember to stay out of the basement!

Thanks for the welcome and the warning about the basement!

 

[bdcjacko]

Best feeling in the world knowing you have someone who will say she wants to be with you and only you forever. It is nice not wondering if you are going to grow old alone. It is emotional security that nothing else can really offer.

That would be the case if divorce didn't exist. Fortunately, that is not the world we inhabit. I don't understand why you appear to believe that such emotional security is impossible to achieve without a ring, a ceremony, and a binding legal contract.

Marriage is the emotional security. The wedding the day that you have the big fancy ceremony, and the binding legal contract is just an insurance policy to get your stuff if it doesn't work out

 

[bdcjacko]

Best feeling in the world knowing you have someone who will say she wants to be with you and only you forever. It is nice not wondering if you are going to grow old alone. It is emotional security that nothing else can really offer.

Sure, it must be an amazing feeling for the people that don't get divorced after a few months of wedded bliss.

Yeah...you shouldn't enter into marriage lightly, and probably shouldn't get married until you are old enough to see past the wedding day.

 

[Steve Butts]

This is just me, but whenever I see someone arguing against marriage, I assume they are a teenage boy, or they have the maturity level of a teenage boy.

*And after checking the age of everyone else that has posted, and finding the oldest of you is 22, I kind of stand by that.

Ha! Thanks for the reality check.

This is all a matter of perspective. To say marriage is "no big deal" or "pointless" is to suggests everyone defines thing according to your point of view. Marriage means a lot of very important things to a lot of very sincere and intelligent people.

For some, it's a civil convenience that comes with numerous legal and financial rights. Just try visiting your sick girlfriend in the hospital, or negotiating with the IRS for your boyfriend's debt. For others, marriage is a social (and possibly even biological) habit that reinforces the stability of families, which is tremendously important when you consider how slowly humans develop compared to other species. Still others see marriage as a profound religious relationship that reflects a certain belief about God. If people who don't believe in God still have church weddings, it's because the various definitions and purposes of marriage overlap in our culture. We have one word for it, but it has to stand for a number of very different meanings.

To say you don't need a piece of paper to prove your love is fine, but that's as far as it goes. To say that marriage has no point assumes that everyone should share your limited perspective on the subject. Thankfully, that is not the case.

 

[New Troll]

Marriage to me is a feeling of being complete. Not there yet but hope to be one day.

The act of getting married though is to give myself fully to that one special person. I am thiers till they decide otherwise. With all the ups and downs my ex-wife and I went through, I was always there for her, even when she was never there for me.

I don't know, maybe it's all those mushy movies I had to watch as a kid. Maybe it was from being raised by two females, my mother and my older sister. Maybe it's just me not wanting to be anything like my father who always took marriage for granted. Maybe I'm just a hopeless romantic at heart. But whatever the reason(s), I still dream of that bond, both spiritual and physical.

Wouldn't want it any other way.