The White Male

[sageoftruth]

Well, in terms of games, the only thing I'm really concerned about regarding this is when publishers step in and demand white male protagonists, namely because it once again means telling developers how to write their own stories. The scary thing is reading what Zontar said. I'd never thought of that. Are publishers avoiding non-white characters because they see each it as the only way to avoid controversy? That's kind of troubling.

Anyway, in the end, I'd never endorse telling developers how to pick the casting in their games. When you try to force it, the results are always stilted and kind of awkward. Of course, that's why I also would endorse telling publishers to leave those guys alone when it comes to creating the world for their game. I believe that developers should be comfortable writing characters of other races into their games, but that requires a mindset that people often acquire at an early age, so I suggest paving the way for a more diverse and open-minded generation of developers in the near future, rather than trying to change the guys already working on our games now.

 

[kitsunefather]

Yes, the games industry, and mass media needs to expand their roster, by nationality, race, and gender. This is a thing that really does need to happen, as homogeneity and clichés need to be worked against in order to create stories of varied substance and worth, not just for the sake of diversity.

However, it should be noted that in the current media climate, the use of white male characters being 'safe' isn't just a matter of sales.

When a female protagonist is hurt or endangered, the media screams misogyny, or rape culture. When a black character is given a criminal history, the scream is racism. This doesn't just extend to main characters, mind you.

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

So, imagine, when a bunch of creators are sitting in a room, bouncing ideas around. They know the media slog they're jumping into, because they've done it before. If their character is a woman, she better not be in too dangerous a situation, or act too provocative, or be too manly, or look too sexy, or not sexy enough. Any misstep will get the journalist outlets that will be the sole original source for information about their game haranguing them as monsters.

While I think more creators need to buck this trend; to create more varied characters from different backgrounds/races/what-have-you, it is pretty easy to understand why people marketing a product to sell would take the path with the least offensive complaint that can be levied against it.

"Your white male character is boring" does a lot less damage to sales than "Your female characters are misogynistic" or "Your ethnic characters are racist".

The best way to encourage companies and creators to expand their diversity in games and other media, is to promote media that shows these types of characters as people, warts and all. Until they see they can make a profit (and yes, in the end, it is about profit) off of breaking a mold that works, they won't.

 

[Sexual Harassment Panda]

Yes, the games industry, and mass media needs to expand their roster, by nationality, race, and gender. This is a thing that really does need to happen, as homogeneity and clichés need to be worked against in order to create stories of varied substance and worth, not just for the sake of diversity.

However, it should be noted that in the current media climate, the use of white male characters being 'safe' isn't just a matter of sales.

When a female protagonist is hurt or endangered, the media screams misogyny, or rape culture. When a black character is given a criminal history, the scream is racism. This doesn't just extend to main characters, mind you.

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

So, imagine, when a bunch of creators are sitting in a room, bouncing ideas around. They know the media slog they're jumping into, because they've done it before. If their character is a woman, she better not be in too dangerous a situation, or act too provocative, or be too manly, or look too sexy, or not sexy enough. Any misstep will get the journalist outlets that will be the sole original source for information about their game haranguing them as monsters.

While I think more creators need to buck this trend; to create more varied characters from different backgrounds/races/what-have-you, it is pretty easy to understand why people marketing a product to sell would take the path with the least offensive complaint that can be levied against it.

"Your white male character is boring" does a lot less damage to sales than "Your female characters are misogynistic" or "Your ethnic characters are racist".

The best way to encourage companies and creators to expand their diversity in games and other media, is to promote media that shows these types of characters as people, warts and all. Until they see they can make a profit (and yes, in the end, it is about profit) off of breaking a mold that works, they won't.

I don't know that this is entirely accurate, but I applaud your ability to muster some empathy for the creators. I get sick of people ignorantly asserting that they're feckless or else evil.

 

[Hoplon]

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

Nope, still in the game. And it was racist, it was something strait out of a film in the 30's.

 

[Nirallus]

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

Nope, still in the game. And it was racist, it was something strait out of a film in the 30's.

It was something straight off the streets of modern-day IRL Detroit. Or any major city in North America, but Detroit is by far the worst. Homeless people exist, some of them talk like crazy people, and some of them are black women. What's the problem?

 

[Hoplon]

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

Nope, still in the game. And it was racist, it was something strait out of a film in the 30's.

It was something straight off the streets of modern-day IRL Detroit. Or any major city in North America, but Detroit is by far the worst. Homeless people exist, some of them talk like crazy people, and some of them are black women. What's the problem?

I find it really hard to believe anyone actually talked like that, sounds like someone off the black and white Minstrel show.

 

[Ryotknife]

Remember in Deus Ex, when one of the early gameplay videos showed him meeting a homeless black woman in Detroit, and she talked like a crazy homeless person? That character was removed because people screamed racism.

Nope, still in the game. And it was racist, it was something strait out of a film in the 30's.

It was something straight off the streets of modern-day IRL Detroit. Or any major city in North America, but Detroit is by far the worst. Homeless people exist, some of them talk like crazy people, and some of them are black women. What's the problem?

I find it really hard to believe anyone actually talked like that, sounds like someone off the black and white Minstrel show.

Ive known non-homeless people in the South who talk that way.

 

[Silvanus]

I wasn't taking a side, so much as I was stating the fact that the "diversity at any cost" crowd is full of hypocrits because they are both the first and the loudest to cry out against any portrayal of women and minorities which doesn't conform to their very narrow view of how they should be portrayed.

While there are assholes on both sides, the hypocrisy which is exclusive to one of them is what makes them worst then the other.

I've seen this claimed a few times, but my experience has been quite the opposite-- those who I recognise who often argue in favour of greater diversity tend to be the ones defending instances in which it occurs (including myself).

 

[Zontar]

I've seen this claimed a few times, but my experience has been quite the opposite-- those who I recognise who often argue in favour of greater diversity tend to be the ones defending instances in which it occurs (including myself).

I'm not saying all people who call for greater diversity are attacking it when it happens, what I'm saying is those who tend to be the loudest about it tend to also attack the very types of characters they called for when they are not the perfect image of what they thought it would be.

I'll admit they are a minority voice within the community, but then again so are the people actively oppose greater diversity, and I find myself hating those extremists less due to the fact they aren't hypocritical in their stance.

 

[shrekfan246]

Those gosh darned Americans! They make American movies, for a primarily American audience, and they have the audacity to cast Americans! And take them from the racial group that makes up two-thirds of the population!

Perhaps I'm misreading something here, but Asia has a higher population than every other continent on the planet combined. China has a higher population than North America, Europe, and Oceania combined. Once you add in South America and South Africa, sure, the numbers finally skew out of China's favor, but over half of the population of the world lives in Asia. And not everyone who lives in North America, Europe, or Australia is white, and even less of South America and Africa are white (only 1% of the population of China is not Asian).

 

[Redryhno]

Those gosh darned Americans! They make American movies, for a primarily American audience, and they have the audacity to cast Americans! And take them from the racial group that makes up two-thirds of the population!

Perhaps I'm misreading something here, but Asia has a higher population than every other continent on the planet combined. China has a higher population than North America, Europe, and Oceania combined. Once you add in South America and South Africa, sure, the numbers finally skew out of China's favor, but over half of the population of the world lives in Asia. And not everyone who lives in North America, Europe, or Australia is white, and even less of South America and Africa are white (only 1% of the population of China is not Asian).

I think he's still talking about the U.S. there buddy. I mean, he does make reference to it like five times in his post.

 

[shrekfan246]

I think he's still talking about the U.S. there buddy. I mean, he does make reference to it like five times in his post.

Fair enough, just seemed like a very odd way of continuing the thought to me. Problems of communication over the internet, sometimes things get lost in the interpretation other people make of your words. EDIT: I did acknowledge that I may have just been misreading it, too.

 

[Lightknight]

Yup, just as boring

Nothing wrong with the archetype inherently , but let's not pretend it isn't a massive safe zone that gets treated as default for arbitrary reasons.

Massive safe zone? You mean "safe investment with a reliable rate of return"? You might as well be calling it a good business move.

Yep, it certainly is safe. Especially since the vast majority of their customers are also white.

Tell me why you find other demographics inherently more interesting? Isn't that an inherently racist/sexist/bigoted belief? That Hugh Jackman is less interesting because he's white, straight, or male? Not that it's the bad kind of racism/sexism of course. It's a lot more subtle form of it. But it certainly fits all the criteria.

I think the problem we see more frequently is that the character they make is boring. The skin color, sex, gender, and orientation. Those don't make someone more interesting. But a character with interesting conflict, interesting behaviors and emotions? A story arc and all that? That's good. That's interesting. But seeing a pained grizzled soldier type protagonist? That's an overplayed archetype. Not an overplayed race. I'm tired of other stereotypes I see in media too. The gay stereotypes or the various woman stereotypes (Ms. Male and whatnot where they make her be "strong" by behaving like a man). Sorry, but any race/gender/sex/orientation can be boring. None of them are inherently more interesting.

But please, let's stop imposing subtle racist notions that something is less valuable because we don't like the race or sex being used.