gardian06 said:
So it holds that underhanded wheeling, and dealing are good things, and the way change is done? great lest just hope that current politicians don't get that message to.
The scary thing is that many, many politicians--especially members of the GOP--do believe "The End Justifies the Means" no matter WHAT they're ultimate goals may be (reversing Roe vs Wade, etc).
tmande2nd said:
I am going to be seeing this since I am taking an American history class.
I wonder if any actor found it hard to argue FOR slavery. I know its just a role...but I would have a hard time actually saying something like:
"Certain people are not born equal!"
Countless people did support slavery with a clear conscience because they could use passages from the Bible to support it.
It was a different world, back then. More so than any of us could probably truly grok.
Good actors take that sort of thing into consideration when preparing for their characters. My sister is an actress (not famous, just starting really, but doing well) and "getting into character" necessitates focused detachment.
I doubt that Steven Spielberg hired any amateur actors or actresses for important parts.
Baresark said:
I am interested in this movie, but I'm also interested in it's accuracy.
There is also the element where Lincoln didn't agree with slavery because he felt that colored folks bring down the white people, and he spent at least part of his time trying to find a way to have all freed slaves deported somewhere.
But, that is just the other side of the coin. No one can deny good things happened after the fact... well, except for the part where black folks weren't allowed to integrate into normal white society.
The question of whether Lincoln's well documented preference to deport blacks back to Africa arose in my mind, too.
Gunnyboy said:
Baresark said:
You don't know what you're talking about, and the sad part is you type with some pompous tone like you know anything. Lincoln was against slavery because he found the practice of enslaving men detestable. And this has been documented for decades prior to him being a president. It had nothing to do with "bringing down white people" and the movie makes a point to show they were going a step at a time, and slavery was a separate issue than blacks having the right to vote. (In fact, it's a huge point of discussion between Stevens and Lincoln, and Stevens on the House floor.)
A little harsh there, don't you think?
Plenty of Americans, of all racial backgrounds, object to racism and inequality, etc. But that doesn't stop most of them from preferring not to "mix the races".
I'm white. I remember asking a black girl out in high school and she said that very thing. I didn't take insult, but I wasn't the only white guy she turned down either. She never dated whites.
Does that make her a racist?
Yes, Lincoln was on the record as despising slavery. That's not the same thing as saying that he would have wanted to marry a black woman or have any children of his marry blacks.
MrGalactus said:
I hope they do it accurately, and it's not just a massive BJ for Lincoln. He was not what we'd call progressive, accepting, or anything other than a racist. He gets a lot of credit he only partially deserves. It'd be interesting to see Abraham Lincoln for real, for once.
-Abraham Lincoln said:
I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races; that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.
(4th Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois, September 18, 1858)
Lincoln was progressive...for his time! Don't forget "The White Man's Burden" mentality that dominated American and European whites throughout the late 19th and early 20th centuries. There are
degrees of prejudice.
George Washington was also progressive...for his time.
He owned slaves all his life. Genetic and historical research has revealed that he even sired a child with one of his female slaves.
He wanted to do away with slavery, but never moved towards it politically because it would have torn the freshly founded USA apart.
Instead he freed his slaves in the only "politically correct" manner available to him...
in his day and age.
He freed them through his Last Will and Testament after he died.