Top ten greatest weapons in history

Shadows Inc.

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Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
HandsomeJack said:
Before I read the thread I knew katana would be listed as #1. It is worth noting that during the westernization of Japan rapiers/sabers were quickly overtaking katanas. The curved blade is an excellent design, good for swift movement and deeper cuts, but is much less effective against armor. When it bares down too it though, when armor is of little concern, the fastest wins out (all other factors being comparable). When armor is a factor, you want mass and leverage (while retaining balance and versatility). This is where the honorably mentioned claymore shines. Penatrating power without the unwieldy balance of an axe or polearm (though some polearms were every bit as good and in some situations much better, though the greatsword was fielded specifically to take out the long-shafted types). Katana is a good balance to be sure, though. There is no "King of Swords" so to speak. Many are situational or there wouldnt be such a variety even within cultures.

I would love to hear some more feed back from other sword fanatics.
I think the main reason katanas were over taken in Japan wasn't because rapiers/sabers were better, but that they were cheaper, and easier to make, and the heavy western influence drove many Japanese people away from their own culture, though this statement is just idol speculation as are 99% of my replies. You do have a very good point, there is no king of swords, and most are situational, but out of all the swords I think the katana could handle the most situations, but let it be known that the Claymore is very close to the katana, and that it, and a few other swords like the kilij, and rapier would have been on this list if I didn't want just one sword on it. I knew people would complain about the katana being on the list no less than being number 1, but it was one of those weapons that I'd get hated on for leaving in, or leaving out so it was kinda hard to put it there at all.
The first part is true, one Katana takes approximately 6 months at least to fabricate. Most Japanese military soldiers had a family sword passed through the generations, and anyone who didn't was provided one by the military, though most of the people who ended up getting one that way had wished that they had a family sword, because the military Katana were sub-par because they had to be made in bulk. As for the western swords, Rapier was forced on the citizens for the fact that Westerners thought (and still think) that they, and everything they do is superior. Using a Rapier was a different combat style entirely and needed teaching, while it was more efficent to have the citizens use what they already knew. Sabers were forced on for close to the same reason, Western civilization believed it to be similar to a Katana, so they thought that not much change needed to happen. (and pardon me for asking, but just exactly how is a Claymore like a Katana?)
There's more but I don't want to bore anyone.
Heh, I should elaborate on the katana Claymore thing. I didn't mean the claymore was like the katana I meant the they were almost equals as weapons. Very interesting comment though.
Studies, combined with the fabrication and forging of bladed weapons that I do and the training in the blades that comes with it, you tend to learn quite a lot. (well, except for the "Custom Fantasy Blades" that I do, mainly for fun/sometimes commisions... there's no real training style for that)
Yea, I have a great collection of practical use weapons, and bokken to practice with. I only own one fantasy sword though which happens to be a massive buster sword from FF7 http://api.ning.com/files/GgczIXFRODUbDq5MIVxBxBL4Y9gqrJn1ev1VOE33chvZzBwZHy*5JSyBjVaFsI3--bWvZcY9woUZdMMMVavFT8kk8SKZrjIN/swords3.jpg I own a copy of the top one.
I have two Katana Bokken, one Wakizashi Bokken, and one Ninjato Bokken.
I tried forging a cloudbuster, but it didn't turn out the way I wanted and since the iron was already used, I couldn't use the steel, so I threw it away. I never tried making another one.
Damn, sounds like a pain to just through away something you worked on. Though I'm a perfectionist too, for example I'm a game designer, I've taken weeks worth of work, and trashed it cause I couldn't work around a bug(which was the characters faces would turn into stretched out polygons)
Was it a skeletal mesh problem? Or maybe the Actor itself is acting up, or perhaps the texture was not quite working right with the Actor Model.
(I'm in college for animation and game design, by the way)
I'm not sure it was most likely the skeletal mesh since more than one character did that. It's worth mentioning I'm relatively amateur, and mostly self taught with the exception of one game design course I took. I never was that good with animations. The shoulders would always look jagged, and the walking animation would look stiff and sloppy like an old ps1 game.
Go to a Tech College (I don't know where you are so I can't suggest one), and take "Intro to Maya". It will help you with everything you just said you're at fault to.
 

Shadows Inc.

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thedoclc said:
I say old chap said:
thedoclc said:
If we go by the "own merits, doing what they're made for," per the OP, the rapier and other smallswords are absolutely, positively missing from this list. (I'd also consider weapons which are meant to be used together as a single "weapon," and that would put hoplon + dari + xyphos and scutum + gladius + pilum very close to the top of the list. So I'll treat it as "rapier + main gauche or buckler or pistol".)

The rapier was not designed as a military arm nor as an armor breaker. The reason was because at the time of its development, armor was very, very quickly disappearing from warfare and civilians don't use armor. The rapier was never intended as a military weapon; it was a sidearm for civilian use. These objections aren't well-suited to this list.

What the rapier did do was overcome the cut-and-thrust weapons of its era handily, eventually forcing anyone who wanted to survive a sword fight to adjust what they used. Cutting weapons were very quickly replaced in Europe because hold-outs who rejected the rapier and linear fencing died in droves. A rapier's lunging attack and ability to disengage underneath or over an opponent's hands made it extraordinarily difficult to stop and kept someone using a rapier at a safe distance. Paired with a main gauche and buckler, it retained defensive capability even in a committed attack. If an opponent with a heavier weapon attempted to parry, the blade could be slipped under their weapon with a swift wrist movement and the same attack continued. And while the wounds dealt were hardly the spectacular gorefests of Deadliest Warrior, let's remember a popped lung was just as fatal as decapitation back before modern medicine, and a hell of a worse way to go.

Estimates of the number of nobles killed by these swords gets into the very high tens of thousands. How many common folk were killed in the street or by highwaymen with these weapons I can't imagine anyone can tally.
You clearly seem to have a lot of knowledge about the rapier and its application, how it works, the innovation of the Capo Fero lunge, the disengage, the sheer fucking speed of the thing. Not too much I can add. Armour was not entirely absent when it was used. You still had the buckler and sword combination holding out in England for a while, light brigandine had been worn by nobles concerned for their safery for some time (goes under the puffy outfit) and still lasts into the Renaissance. Pikemen and equipping them with some armour lasted for a while and depends on time and place. Go east and the Ottomans and Arabs still used lamellar, leather, leather-scale for a damn long time. Brigands and highwayman would equip themselves with whatever they could get away with and afford.

The rapier is not a heavy armour puncturer (just go round and find the opening), you would want a pick or a polearm for something like that (bec de corbin perhaps, or spetum or awlpike). Then again the tuck or estoc is a two-handed rapier designed to pierce armour

http://www.myarmoury.com/feature_euroedge.html

I find the Spanish and German basket-hilt rapier designs the most pleasing, combining buckler and sword together, as the epee in fencing illustrates. Course I also find some of the European one-handed falchions quite nice and look to be useful and used more amongst Europeans then we might think, but then again, the Swiss also made two-handed sabres which look a lot like the lauded katana).


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falchion
http://bjorn.foxtail.nu/h_conyers_eng.htm
http://www.myarmoury.com/review_lut_10006.html

Did you know, despite a lot of criticism, some cavalry units actually went for rapiers over sabres or cavalry swords? (Cohen 2002). Some generals said it would never work and would break, others insisted it was just fine in the field. Suppose it could be used like a swift light lance in a way.
I say old chap said:
thedoclc said:
If we go by the "own merits, doing what they're made for," per the OP, the rapier and other smallswords are absolutely, positively missing from this list. (I'd also consider weapons which are meant to be used together as a single "weapon," and that would put hoplon + dari + xyphos and scutum + gladius + pilum very close to the top of the list. So I'll treat it as "rapier + main gauche or buckler or pistol".)

The rapier was not designed as a military arm nor as an armor breaker. The reason was because at the time of its development, armor was very, very quickly disappearing from warfare and civilians don't use armor. The rapier was never intended as a military weapon; it was a sidearm for civilian use. These objections aren't well-suited to this list.

What the rapier did do was overcome the cut-and-thrust weapons of its era handily, eventually forcing anyone who wanted to survive a sword fight to adjust what they used. Cutting weapons were very quickly replaced in Europe because hold-outs who rejected the rapier and linear fencing died in droves. A rapier's lunging attack and ability to disengage underneath or over an opponent's hands made it extraordinarily difficult to stop and kept someone using a rapier at a safe distance. Paired with a main gauche and buckler, it retained defensive capability even in a committed attack. If an opponent with a heavier weapon attempted to parry, the blade could be slipped under their weapon with a swift wrist movement and the same attack continued. And while the wounds dealt were hardly the spectacular gorefests of Deadliest Warrior, let's remember a popped lung was just as fatal as decapitation back before modern medicine, and a hell of a worse way to go.

Estimates of the number of nobles killed by these swords gets into the very high tens of thousands. How many common folk were killed in the street or by highwaymen with these weapons I can't imagine anyone can tally.
You clearly seem to have a lot of knowledge about the rapier and its application, how it works, the innovation of the Capo Fero lunge, the disengage, the sheer fucking speed of the thing. Not too much I can add. Armour was not entirely absent when it was used. You still had the buckler and sword combination holding out in England for a while, light brigandine had been worn by nobles concerned for their safery for some time (goes under the puffy outfit) and still lasts into the Renaissance. Pikemen and equipping them with some armour lasted for a while and depends on time and place. Go east and the Ottomans and Arabs still used lamellar, leather, leather-scale for a damn long time. Brigands and highwayman would equip themselves with whatever they could get away with and afford.

The rapier is not a heavy armour puncturer (just go round and find the opening), you would want a pick or a polearm for something like that (bec de corbin perhaps, or spetum or awlpike). Then again the tuck or estoc is a two-handed rapier designed to pierce armour

http://www.myarmoury.com/feature_euroedge.html

I find the Spanish and German basket-hilt rapier designs the most pleasing, combining buckler and sword together, as the epee in fencing illustrates. Course I also find some of the European one-handed falchions quite nice and look to be useful and used more amongst Europeans then we might think, but then again, the Swiss also made two-handed sabres which look a lot like the lauded katana).


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falchion
http://bjorn.foxtail.nu/h_conyers_eng.htm
http://www.myarmoury.com/review_lut_10006.html

Did you know, despite a lot of criticism, some cavalry units actually went for rapiers over sabres or cavalry swords? (Cohen 2002). Some generals said it would never work and would break, others insisted it was just fine in the field. Suppose it could be used like a swift light lance in a way.
Thanks for the info. We're in total agreement as for the look of the weapon. Granted, I would much rather have a full buckler in the off hand were I somehow caught up in a sword fight (how the hell would that happen?, but that beautiful ping on the piste when you block with the handguard is very satisfying and drives home the importance of that guard.

Sure, there was some armor in the Renaissance and beyond, and you've done a good job pointing out where and when you could find it. However, as a whole it was going away very quickly, and I'll stand by the generalization "armor was disappearing" while still agreeing with your specifics. That's why I believe the rapier should be on that list; it transformed how individual combat took place at a pivotal moment, and pretty much everything and everyone had to respond to it.

I'm enjoying the articles. Do you happen to have the Cohen article online somewhere?

I'm going to avoid commenting on the katana, since it seems its detractors and fans are already close enough to slapping each other silly.
Good choice.
 

Instant K4rma

StormFella
Aug 29, 2008
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Aww, the M1911A1 only makes an appearance at #8?

If Tom Hanks can blow up a tank with one, I think it deserves a slightly higher spot.
 

the clockmaker

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I'm going to go with the liscenced Australian version of the fabrique national FAL. The self loading rifle.

It had as much hitting power as the AKM and was almost as easy to produce.
It was more accurate than the armalite series and was easier to maintain.
With a simple addition of a matchstick, it could be converted to fully automatic. This could be done in the field.
It's nickname was not 'the scorpian' or 'the peacemaker' by the diggers, it was called the *****. It didn't need to justify itself, because it was the *****.

And finally, behind it was an Australian digger, the only soldier more at home in the jungle than the Viet Cong. Which is strange, because our only Jungles are in Queensland and the first experiance most have of a rainforest is Canungra.
 

Knifewounds

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dathwampeer said:
A Katana....... seriously?

fffffffffffffffffff


Did you get all of this information from an anime? I mean I like anime as much as the next guy but there was never a guy who ran around slicing bullets in half and decapitating monsters.

Katanas were status symbols. They're practically useless in war. They were used for duels and drunken slaughtering of peasants. You hit a bone in a body about 6 times and the damn things going to dull.

The fucking Katana shouldn't even be on this damn list.

:[

There are other daft choices. But that one took the cake.
uhh, no I didn't. Yes I do like anime, but I know whats real, and whats not. What I do know from my experiences with a katana is that it is far from being as weak as that. I took apart a rusty junkyard car with it before it started getting dull. Calling it useless in a battle outside of duels isn't true ether. After all Miyamoto Musashi took on a clan of samurai while using the kenjutsu technique that involves wielding two katana (all of which is documented history) Uhh, in hind sight most swords usually do get dull pretty fast so its hardly worth dwelling on.
 

Knifewounds

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Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
HandsomeJack said:
Before I read the thread I knew katana would be listed as #1. It is worth noting that during the westernization of Japan rapiers/sabers were quickly overtaking katanas. The curved blade is an excellent design, good for swift movement and deeper cuts, but is much less effective against armor. When it bares down too it though, when armor is of little concern, the fastest wins out (all other factors being comparable). When armor is a factor, you want mass and leverage (while retaining balance and versatility). This is where the honorably mentioned claymore shines. Penatrating power without the unwieldy balance of an axe or polearm (though some polearms were every bit as good and in some situations much better, though the greatsword was fielded specifically to take out the long-shafted types). Katana is a good balance to be sure, though. There is no "King of Swords" so to speak. Many are situational or there wouldnt be such a variety even within cultures.

I would love to hear some more feed back from other sword fanatics.
I think the main reason katanas were over taken in Japan wasn't because rapiers/sabers were better, but that they were cheaper, and easier to make, and the heavy western influence drove many Japanese people away from their own culture, though this statement is just idol speculation as are 99% of my replies. You do have a very good point, there is no king of swords, and most are situational, but out of all the swords I think the katana could handle the most situations, but let it be known that the Claymore is very close to the katana, and that it, and a few other swords like the kilij, and rapier would have been on this list if I didn't want just one sword on it. I knew people would complain about the katana being on the list no less than being number 1, but it was one of those weapons that I'd get hated on for leaving in, or leaving out so it was kinda hard to put it there at all.
The first part is true, one Katana takes approximately 6 months at least to fabricate. Most Japanese military soldiers had a family sword passed through the generations, and anyone who didn't was provided one by the military, though most of the people who ended up getting one that way had wished that they had a family sword, because the military Katana were sub-par because they had to be made in bulk. As for the western swords, Rapier was forced on the citizens for the fact that Westerners thought (and still think) that they, and everything they do is superior. Using a Rapier was a different combat style entirely and needed teaching, while it was more efficent to have the citizens use what they already knew. Sabers were forced on for close to the same reason, Western civilization believed it to be similar to a Katana, so they thought that not much change needed to happen. (and pardon me for asking, but just exactly how is a Claymore like a Katana?)
There's more but I don't want to bore anyone.
Heh, I should elaborate on the katana Claymore thing. I didn't mean the claymore was like the katana I meant the they were almost equals as weapons. Very interesting comment though.
Studies, combined with the fabrication and forging of bladed weapons that I do and the training in the blades that comes with it, you tend to learn quite a lot. (well, except for the "Custom Fantasy Blades" that I do, mainly for fun/sometimes commisions... there's no real training style for that)
Yea, I have a great collection of practical use weapons, and bokken to practice with. I only own one fantasy sword though which happens to be a massive buster sword from FF7 http://api.ning.com/files/GgczIXFRODUbDq5MIVxBxBL4Y9gqrJn1ev1VOE33chvZzBwZHy*5JSyBjVaFsI3--bWvZcY9woUZdMMMVavFT8kk8SKZrjIN/swords3.jpg I own a copy of the top one.
I have two Katana Bokken, one Wakizashi Bokken, and one Ninjato Bokken.
I tried forging a cloudbuster, but it didn't turn out the way I wanted and since the iron was already used, I couldn't use the steel, so I threw it away. I never tried making another one.
Damn, sounds like a pain to just through away something you worked on. Though I'm a perfectionist too, for example I'm a game designer, I've taken weeks worth of work, and trashed it cause I couldn't work around a bug(which was the characters faces would turn into stretched out polygons)
Was it a skeletal mesh problem? Or maybe the Actor itself is acting up, or perhaps the texture was not quite working right with the Actor Model.
(I'm in college for animation and game design, by the way)
I'm not sure it was most likely the skeletal mesh since more than one character did that. It's worth mentioning I'm relatively amateur, and mostly self taught with the exception of one game design course I took. I never was that good with animations. The shoulders would always look jagged, and the walking animation would look stiff and sloppy like an old ps1 game.
Go to a Tech College (I don't know where you are so I can't suggest one), and take "Intro to Maya". It will help you with everything you just said you're at fault to.
Ahh, I'll look into that.
 

Knifewounds

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Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
Shadows Inc. said:
Knifewounds said:
massaffect123 said:
Shadows Inc. said:
massaffect123 said:
Pirate Kitty said:
The pen.

Saves lives and ends wars.
And can make a decent weapon when honed to a fine point and dipped in fast acting poison, then thrown from 10 feet away.
Or you could just walk up behind someone and stab them (in the skull for me because it's more fun), there's no need to get too technical. Humans are a very, very easy thing to kill.
Oh I know that. Not even my idea. I was quoting a comedian whose name escapes me at the moment. I was trying to be funny and (apparently) failing.
And why can't I be technical? What's the point of killing people if it can't be done in an elaborate and unnecessarily complicated manner?
Don't worry dude. Your atempt at being funny worked on me, but I find great humor in irony. Honestly you comment makes me think of a war where armies had to take state tests and whoever had the highest grade point average won, but then America would lose every war.
Not to say I didn't find it humorous... I just seem to take things quite literally most of the time. Sometimes it's a burden.

More to the point, I found Knifewounds joke to be more humorous, simply for the fact that it is true.
My humor will wear on people after a while. Its mostly ironic wit, and jokes constructed like this "(insert silliness here) and (insert realistic comparison to the silliness)"
Why not? It's a safe way to go about humor.
Well, I guess. Hell it's work for zero punctuation so far.
 

Cmwissy

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How could you have ignored the Colt Paterson or Smith and Wesson model 1?

Being the first cartridge firing revolver, the Smith and Wesson model 1 pretty much nailed the last err nail in the coffin for steel weaponry.

It was the gun that changed warfare as we know it from slash slash to shoot shoot.
 

thedoclc

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Jun 24, 2008
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Knifewounds said:
Throughout the course of our history we've constantly been inventing new ways to kill each other in more brutal, devastating ways, precise, and hilarious ways. We've made a lot of great & deadly weapons in our history haven't we? Anyways, those weapons that are on my top ten list will be graded by how good its design is, and how innovative, or devastating it was in its era of warfare.


Note 1: The weapons will be judged by their own merits, and by how well they do at the job they're made for.

*snip*

_______________________________________________________

Honorable mentions:

*snip*

Intercontinental ballistic Missiles: This is the most powerful weapon made in existence however I cannot add a weapon that's never, and never should be, used.

______________________________
*snip - see original post of the thread*
I will expand the ICBM to include all state-sponsored means of employing strategic or tactical nuclear weapons.

A perfectly valid argument exists that the ICBM and nuclear weapons (whether delivered by submarine, bomber, or missile) are being used all the time - by creating such fear of an attack that conventional warfare between nations which have such weapons has all but disappeared. Ideally, no weapon should be used.

The ability to deliver a nuclear counterattack renders warfare between two states virtually impossible. If the weapon is judged on the merits of "can this weapon fulfill its role?" and the role is, "scare anyone with sense into refraining from conventional warfare," then the answer is yes. These weapons have caused the biggest changes in strategic thinking in history. Nothing, nothing, ever, has changed how strategists have thought of war as dramatically as nuclear arms.
 

Roamin11

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I guess I'm the only fan of things like napalm and high explosives?

Not saying a man walking up to me in a fight with a katana isn't respectable, but just if I'm going to pick anything I want the most damage in the smallest amount of time, and it doesn't take long to split a atom!
 

Knifewounds

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thedoclc said:
Knifewounds said:
Throughout the course of our history we've constantly been inventing new ways to kill each other in more brutal, devastating ways, precise, and hilarious ways. We've made a lot of great & deadly weapons in our history haven't we? Anyways, those weapons that are on my top ten list will be graded by how good its design is, and how innovative, or devastating it was in its era of warfare.


Note 1: The weapons will be judged by their own merits, and by how well they do at the job they're made for.

*snip*

_______________________________________________________

Honorable mentions:

*snip*

Intercontinental ballistic Missiles: This is the most powerful weapon made in existence however I cannot add a weapon that's never, and never should be, used.

______________________________
*snip - see original post of the thread*
I will expand the ICBM to include all state-sponsored means of employing strategic or tactical nuclear weapons.

A perfectly valid argument exists that the ICBM and nuclear weapons (whether delivered by submarine, bomber, or missile) are being used all the time - by creating such fear of an attack that conventional warfare between nations which have such weapons has all but disappeared. Ideally, no weapon should be used.

The ability to deliver a nuclear counterattack renders warfare between two states virtually impossible. If the weapon is judged on the merits of "can this weapon fulfill its role?" and the role is, "scare anyone with sense into refraining from conventional warfare," then the answer is yes. These weapons have caused the biggest changes in strategic thinking in history. Nothing, nothing, ever, has changed how strategists have thought of war as dramatically as nuclear arms.
Oh god your absolutely right 0_0 I really cant argue that point.
 

TOGSolid

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Starke said:
The AK wasn't the first assault rifle, that would probably be the MP-43/MP-44/StG 44.
The Fedorov Avtomat is the precursor to the modern assault rifle.

I'm really tempted to go on a tyrannical rant about all the bullshit people are spewing in this thread and all the armchair soldier garbage being thrown around, but I really don't want to give myself an aneurysm so instead I'll just say this:

Just because you saw a Discovery Channel special about a weapon once doesn't make you an expert. Just because you own a weapon does not mean you know anything about that weapon. Just because you saw it on TV does not mean it's correct. Most of you probably don't even know how to swing a sword correctly nor spend enough time at the range to really have a firm grasp of firearms. It's safe to say most of you really shouldn't even be posting in this thread.
 

Starke

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TOGSolid said:
Starke said:
The AK wasn't the first assault rifle, that would probably be the MP-43/MP-44/StG 44.
The Fedorov Avtomat is the precursor to the modern assault rifle.

I'm really tempted to go on a tyrannical rant about all the bullshit people are spewing in this thread and all the armchair soldier garbage being thrown around, but I really don't want to give myself an aneurysm so instead I'll just say this:

Just because you saw a Discovery Channel special about a weapon once doesn't make you an expert. Just because you own a weapon does not mean you know anything about that weapon. Just because you saw it on TV does not mean it's correct. Most of you probably don't even know how to swing a sword correctly nor spend enough time at the range to really have a firm grasp of firearms. It's safe to say most of you really shouldn't even be posting in this thread.
So long as that rant wasn't directed at me. :p The StG44 thing was more because I wasn't willing to burn the time to verify, hence the probably. Though, now that I think about it BAR is another possible contender.
 

TOGSolid

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Starke said:
TOGSolid said:
Starke said:
The AK wasn't the first assault rifle, that would probably be the MP-43/MP-44/StG 44.
The Fedorov Avtomat is the precursor to the modern assault rifle.

I'm really tempted to go on a tyrannical rant about all the bullshit people are spewing in this thread and all the armchair soldier garbage being thrown around, but I really don't want to give myself an aneurysm so instead I'll just say this:

Just because you saw a Discovery Channel special about a weapon once doesn't make you an expert. Just because you own a weapon does not mean you know anything about that weapon. Just because you saw it on TV does not mean it's correct. Most of you probably don't even know how to swing a sword correctly nor spend enough time at the range to really have a firm grasp of firearms. It's safe to say most of you really shouldn't even be posting in this thread.
So long as that rant wasn't directed at me. :p The StG44 thing was more because I wasn't willing to burn the time to verify, hence the probably. Though, now that I think about it BAR is another possible contender.
It wasn't directed at you, it was a rant directed to everyone else. Sorry if you got that impression.

Most people haven't even heard of the Fedorov Avtomat. Hell, for a while I thought the StG44 was the first until I did some reading about assault rifles. The Avtomat was a select fire, shoulder fired weapon with a detachable, 25 round box magazine that fired the 6.5x50 Arisaka round. The Avtomat launched in 1915 making it the earliest weapon of this sort ever made.


Knifewounds said:
uhh, no I didn't. Yes I do like anime, but I know whats real, and whats not. What I do know from my experiences with a katana is that it is far from being as weak as that. I took apart a rusty junkyard car with it before it started getting dull. Calling it useless in a battle outside of duels isn't true ether. After all Miyamoto Musashi took on a clan of samurai while using the kenjutsu technique that involves wielding two katana (all of which is documented history) Uhh, in hind sight most swords usually do get dull pretty fast so its hardly worth dwelling on.
You're trying to sound impressive. It's not working. Musashi founded the two sword technique known as Niten Ichi-ryū. Kenjutsu is a general term that means the Art of the Sword and encompasses various traditional Samurai sword arts.

Musashi won his fights because the way he fought was his own. The people he fought could not think outside the box due to the rigidity of their traditional training which allowed them to be easily picked apart.
 

Aur0ra145

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May 22, 2009
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Okay, I'll post.

#10 Stone Spear Point - Look at the Clovis people.

#9 Long bow - oh yeah.

#8 percussion cap rifles - revolutionized warfare.

#7 Center fire cartridges - yep, hello bolt action rifles and all modern long arms.

#6 Maxim machine gun - yep, changed warfare yet again

#5 Tanks - the advent of Armour has had enormous repercussions across all military's today.

#4 Airplanes - Yeah, completely changed warfare forever

#3 Aircraft Carrier - projection of power much?

#2 Cruise missiles - so you can reach out and tough somebody.

#1 Nuclear Weapons - Cold war anyone? Largest impact on modern history.
 

Aphroditty

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Nov 25, 2009
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The "greatest" weapons in history were often not the best of their kind (assuming we can even settle on what "best" means, and whether or not we want to discuss specific makes and models or broad weapon-types). The greatest weapons were those that changed warfare the most. The AK-47, while a fine weapon in the right hands, is not the greatest--I'm sure others have been more reliable, or more accurate, or more powerful, or some combination of these. Neither was the AK-47 the first of its kind. But it was a revolutionary weapon in a lot of ways--partly because it was one of the most powerful firearms a revolutionary could reliably get their hands on. Cheap to manufacture, durable and long-lasting, any tiny insurrectionist could suddenly have an amount firepower in his hands that, only fifty years earlier, was almost always restricted to a small gun carriage and water-cooling. That was the powerful lesson of the AK-47, and what makes it important.

In the Middle Ages the crossbow, although outperformed by the English longbow in rate-of-fire, and often range and accuracy, was closer to the AK-47 of its time. Pikes (which had been around for a long damn time, I might add) and other long pole-arms, though too clumsy to be used as an individual weapon, allowed Flemish peasants defeat heavily-armed, armored, and better-trained French men-at-arms.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's actually more rare that the weapon itself is what really matters, it's the world it's born into--for every weapon that's changed the face of warfare, there's an arguably 'better' weapon that has ultimately done nothing (see: the Brown Bess musket versus the Ferguson Rifle in the American War of Independence). That's stating the obvious, but I think it's important to note in this sort of thread, which tends to devolve into weird apples-to-oranges comparison and mildly disturbing weapon-fanboyism.

"The katana is the best sword ebber, it's all about honor and being able to cut Korean children in half it's so sharp!"

"Nonsense, the katana is ineffective against mail, one of the earliest and least-developed of Medieval armors, clearly it is a sissy weapon for girly girls!"

NOTE: The above examples are caricatures made for humor, not meant as an attack on anyone.