TotalBiscuit says Microsoft won E3

CaitSeith

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Well, the title is kinda click-baity. Yes, he said that. Although he questions if E3 can actually be won, and delved from his perspective the meaning of the E3 and the differences between Sony and Microsoft approaches (in E3 and gaming in general). His position is that the winner of E3 should always be the consumer, and that Microsoft presented bold pro-consumer decisions and pro-consumer changes in business practices; while Sony presented only games that will eventually be released. So, as enjoyable the Sony conference was; the one who announced more beneficial stuff for the consumer (according to him) was Microsoft.

*blows party horns and confetti pops*


Personally I disagree. And you? What are you thoughts about what the meaning of "winning the E3"?
 

Saelune

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Hes a PC elitist who is probably just glad that Microsoft is apparently giving up on console gaming.
 

Maximum Bert

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Well he says if he looks at it from a purely consumer perspective the people that won were MS. He doesnt say MS won E3 and to be fair I am not quite sure if he is referring to the people as the consumer or the people at MS as a whole possibly because they released the most varied information across topics?

He doesnt outright say it but I also get the impression he enjoyed the Sony conference more however and he does say he enjoyed it a lot.

As for winning E3 it means nothing since there are no fixed rules of competition and it depends on how you look at it. I mean if all I ever played were Madden and Fifa and desperately wanted more I could say EA won E3. People would call me crazy on here anyway (rightly so imo please let me know if I ever lose it like that) but from my perspective they would have offered exactly what I wanted and no one else would have had anything of note.

I feel in this case Winning is ascribed to who gave me what I wanted most, who excited me with what they showed. In some ways I agree with TB in that MS were more pro consumer they did give you more choice with the linking with PC but for me the thing I want to see at E3 is not new tech (as in slightly upgraded stuff) or hear about new ways of playing (unless they are really good i.e not and now you can stream to your laptop) I primarily want to see new games. Indulge me show me that the money I paid on your console is being rewarded by allowing me to play new exciting games and while the exciting part is subjective Sony did focus more on the games which is what I wanted to see and I believe many others did as well.

While Microsoft was much more here is our new slimmer console bet you wish you never had that brick one now, here is our newer more powerful one next year (dont think Sony mentioned the Neo) oh and you can also play our games on PC. I feel some people instead of seeing choice of wow now I can get a slim one or I can upgrade and get a more powerful one soon plus I can even choose to play the games at potentially higher levels on PC saw it more as ok looks like it was a waste buying the Xbox One I may as well just go on PC, PS4 and NX. I felt their reliance on older IPs still did not help for many myself included it felt like more of the same.

If there is any battle at E3 and sense of winning I feel it is with the hearts and minds of its core audience to play up and if possible exceed expectations and to me I felt Sony did a better job at that this year. Show me games dont tell me boring business strategy stuff keep that to another time not when you are on main stage or at least keep it very minimal.
 

CaitSeith

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Microsoft revealed multiplats and a few underwhelming exclusives for an hour, and then talked about how they're going to release an updated XBOne next year, along with an "S" model and that no one will be left out.

Cool I guess, but what will actually be worth playing on all those systems that people can't get on Windows? That was a crucial part of their pitch, that all their games will be available on any platform. Also, not sure why PC gamers would even be excited over that since Xbox brand has always raked PC gaming over the coals.
 

Fox12

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Microsoft is easily the most anti-consumer company out there. Not just in gaming, either. If they're acting pro-consumer now, it's because they got spanked. The moment they're back on top they'll go back to their old ways. Microsoft has yet to prove to me that they care about the consumer when the chips are down.
 

spartandude

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I more or less agreed with him to be honest. As some one who has yet to buy a Xbox One or PS4 I can say that Microsoft was more appealing to me this year. Apart from Android LA Noire, Horizon and Crash Bandicoot there was nothing in the Sony one that appealed to me. Where as the idea that I could own games on my xbox and pc is cool, they had more games that interested me and a piece of hardware named after my favourite Simpsons character. But from Sony did do a really nice presentation with theatre and the live orchestra (that was a nice touch).
 

spartandude

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hanselthecaretaker said:
Also, not sure why PC gamers would even be excited over that since Xbox brand has always raked PC gaming over the coals.
Buying my game on one system and being able to own it on another? Yeah why would that possibly be a good pro consumer thing? And to be honest if the game is good on both systems then thats fantastic. If it's only good on one then still fine.
 

nomotog_v1legacy

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spartandude said:
hanselthecaretaker said:
Also, not sure why PC gamers would even be excited over that since Xbox brand has always raked PC gaming over the coals.
Buying my game on one system and being able to own it on another? Yeah why would that possibly be a good pro consumer thing? And to be honest if the game is good on both systems then thats fantastic. If it's only good on one then still fine.
Only if you buy it in the windows store. It's not like you can buy on steam and play on your xbox. You also can't buy a physical copy and then play that on both either. It's only if you jump into that place called the windows store.
 

Cowabungaa

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He said that after saying it's silly to say this "won E3" stuff anyway. So c'mon man, that title is nonsense.

Regardless, he made a good case for why Microsoft had the most to offer for every consumer this E3. It does hinge on a lot of maybe-s but he acknowledged that. We'll see what Microsoft actually does with all of this. It could go incredibly wrong. It wouldn't be the first time something like that happens.

It was especially interesting to hear him and his wife talk about this at the end of their Microsoft press conference. They both came at it from a different perspective.
Saelune said:
Hes a PC elitist who is probably just glad that Microsoft is apparently giving up on console gaming.
No, it's the fact that console players might have more choice that gets him excited over this. And I can see merit in that argument.
 

shrekfan246

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Uh, good for them?

Until they stop trying to make Games For Windows Live 2.0 a thing, though, I can't say I care about any of their supposedly "pro-consumer" actions. The Windows Store is not pro-consumer, and as cool as it is that they'll be allowing cross-buy for Windows Store/Xbox One games, the key factor there is "Windows Store games".

EDIT: But then, given that despite his assertions TB is only pro-consumer when it's convenient, this doesn't surprise me either.
 

JayRPG

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How is moving consoles into a cell phone release schedule pro-consumer?

TB is just getting further and further from a person who is actually reasonable. He only recently argued that the microtransactions in Overwatch were a good thing.

I don't know what hard drugs he has been taking lately but I've pretty much given up on him ever saying anything intelligent again.

His reasoning is just stupid. Microsoft's conference was about the furthest thing from pro-consumer I have ever seen. "Hey look guys, here is a new slightly upgraded console, probably the console that should have been initially released because there is so much empty space inside the original Xbox One that we definitely could have at least fit an internal power supply in there"

"And better yet, you can buy yet another new Xbox One next year! yeah! we are so pro-consumer!"

All Microsoft does is lie, mislead, and exaggerate. We all know how "Backwards compatibility" turned out. What a crock of shit. TB is a fucking moron. When I wasn't falling asleep watching MS's conference I was shaking my head and thinking what the fuck.
 

Mangod

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Well, it depends on how you define "winning", doesn't it?

Who's more pro-consumer? Who's revelaed the most new titles? Who's revealed most new hardware?

Personally, I'd define it as which Conference was more funny, in which case Ubisoft won E3 for me (Darkhorse! Darkhorse!), because of two things:

1) That glorious opening [https://youtu.be/43gFXafFKBM?t=6m11s].
2) Jason Vandenberghe's voice [https://youtu.be/43gFXafFKBM?t=1h4m5s] (To quote TB: Can this guy be my DM?).
 

Cowabungaa

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shrekfan246 said:
But then, given that despite his assertions TB is only pro-consumer when it's convenient, this doesn't surprise me either.
Does he? Do elaborate.
Whatislove said:
Yet you don't make any real arguments why his reasoning is stupid outside of calling him a 'fucking moron'. You also seem to conveniently forget that he acknowledges that this is all still hypothetical, that it remains to be seen what Microsoft will actually do with it. He likes the idea but the execution remains to be seen.
 

Poetic Nova

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Well, it isn't the first time he comes with a oppinion not many will agree with.
And this is another case where I disagree with him.
 

gigastar

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Ill credit Microsoft where its due, during thier conference they kept probably the most rigid focus on showing off thier games.

But nothing i saw is about to sway me towards the Windows store, Windows 10, an XB1/Scorpio or UWP versions of games for that matter. Even Scalebound, the thing i could argue i was looking most forward to, looked lethargic for a game by Platinum and im pretty sure it wasnt a result of the borked stream.
 

shrekfan246

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Cowabungaa said:
shrekfan246 said:
But then, given that despite his assertions TB is only pro-consumer when it's convenient, this doesn't surprise me either.
Does he? Do elaborate.
Well, the main problem is that he doesn't seem to actually remember the perspective of a consumer who doesn't have thousands of dollars of disposable income. Things that are potential dealbreakers for other people, say, micro-transactions in full-price releases, only register as worth mentioning because everyone else thinks it's a bad idea for them to become more and more commonplace, while he repeatedly argues about how they're really not that much of a problem, guys. And hey, maybe you agree with him, but it's still a huge issue for a large number of consumers and openly telling them that they're worried about nothing is insulting.

(Quick tangent, anybody else remember the days when alternate skins, costumes, and sometimes even characters were "unlockables"? Ah, how I miss those times.)

Then there are all of the times he's very ardently advocated for the death of physical copies of games, stating that brick&mortar stores have outlived their usefulness and need to be thrown out so that we can all just move to a digital future. Because, you know, taking options away from consumers is a great idea, even ignoring the fact that tons of people still have incredibly bad internet and don't really have any choice to get anything better.

Oh, and his grudge with Sega. He refuses to report on any Sega games because of what they pulled with Youtube years ago, because they haven't apologized to him (let's conveniently ignore the fact that he treats his viewers with the same level of dismissal that Sega has apparently shown him). How pro-consumer of him, to deny giving his viewers information because he doesn't like a company. (Yes, he's entitled to cover what he wants, and yes, I understand the actual gravity of what Sega did, but holy shit, the ego. He didn't lose his job, and them apologizing now isn't going to give back jobs to all of the Youtubers who got knocked down.)

EDIT: Don't get me wrong, I still occasionally watch his videos because I find him informative, but as a consumer, he does not advocate for me.
 

Adam Jensen_v1legacy

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I like TB, but here's the problem with his theory. YOU CAN'T TRUST MICROSOFT. And their games suck compered to Sony's offer. This is coming from a PC gamer by the way.

Microsoft had always been and continues to be a control freak. They're like drug dealers. They'll give you stuff for free to draw you in and then they'll do whatever it takes to lock you in and fuck you up. Once they have you where they want you, they stop giving a fuck.

So basically Microsoft wants to control everything about my experience and they don't offer any interesting exclusives in return. Sony just wants to sell me a console and a game. Very old school approach. And their first party games are some of the most unique titles in the industry.

It's also obvious as FUCK that Microsoft is planning to abandon Xbox in the future and shift their focus entirely on Windows as the primary platform for providing their services. Xbox is just going to become another Windows gadget. At least for a while until they finally gather enough balls to try to take everything to cloud. That's Satya Nadella's ultimate dream. Microsoft wants all of your games to be tied to your Microsoft account and accessed only on cloud. They want to take every ounce of control away from the consumer. Never forget that.

shrekfan246 said:
Well, the main problem is that he doesn't seem to actually remember the perspective of a consumer who doesn't have thousands of dollars of disposable income. Things that are potential dealbreakers for other people, say, micro-transactions in full-price releases, only register as worth mentioning because everyone else thinks it's a bad idea for them to become more and more commonplace, while he repeatedly argues about how they're really not that much of a problem, guys. And hey, maybe you agree with him, but it's still a huge issue for a large number of consumers and openly telling them that they're worried about nothing is insulting.
This isn't true. He often criticizes microtransactions. Especially in full-price releases.
 

Cowabungaa

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shrekfan246 said:
micro-transaction stuff
That's not really fair, I remember from that video and the Overwatch video that he definitely takes lower budget people into account. He mentions that more than once; there's people with more money than time and there's people with more time than money.

Next to that, he's also very clear in agreeing with you, and me too, that he'd rather not have any of this at all. Yeah, all of us miss the time when skins and such were not just unlockable but simply available from the get-go. If I recall correctly, his argument regarding micro-transactions is more along the lines is "If they want to do this, sadly, this is the way to go." A sort of lesser of two evils kind of thing. It seems like an unfortunate side product from the thirst for progression systems, something he strongly dislikes. And if it has to be there, well, better keep that shit in line. That's the context in which TB's argument has to be placed, the context of the regrettable state of progression systems.

Regarding the consoles it seems that he's hoping that this'll bring graphical/quality options to console games. That people on the lower end of the scale can at least choose to tune some things down and no longer have to deal with sub-par performance. Of course, this is a hope, it could very well be that nothing good will come of it. And considering it's Microsoft, ehhh...

stores stuff
I can't recall that at all, that must've been a while ago. That was relevant like, 5 years ago or something? Can you recall where you heard that? I'm a little curious now.
Sega stuff
He can definitely be lofty towards his viewers, it's why I don't really watch his Twitch stuff (once he spent more time explaining why he wouldn't answer a question about the game he was playing than he would've on just answering the question, like, dude, c'mon), but like Sega? At least he doesn't risk his viewers' source of income. But I don't know, I get his position on this. Sega screwed him big time and he's not obliged to work with them. It's not so much that he denies his viewers information as such, but only his perspective.

I mean, I see what you mean though. Yeah him not giving his perspective might not be technically the very best for the consumer. But can a person only hold one ideal to heart? Are there not other lines that can be crossed or things that are important? Someone trying to bring down your business sounds like a good one to me. In the end he has runs a business, and has a business relationship with Sega. And if business A fucks over business B, doesn't that business B have plenty of good reason to no longer do business with business A?

[small]Also, I write business so much that it stopped being a word. It looks weird now.[/small]