"Touch-screen gadgets alienate blind"

[TheHorizon]

Hey, OP.
I know a blind kid who watches TV.
He can see enough that he can vaguely make out the different shades and figures on a TV but definitley cannot read the buttons on a remote.

EDIT: Although I do think it a bit rediculous that people say things like this.
Is it really a persons place to tell someone else that they cannot make and sell a product because it doesn't necessarily work for some groups?

WHY THE HELL AM I NOT ALOUD TO USE TAMPONS, HUH GOD?!

Well, anyway, he'll hear from MY lawyer.

 

[dcheppy]

A few blind guys say: "Hey, industry, try to think about me when you make stuff! I want to be able to buy your product, too."

You guys hear: "I demand you do what I say! OMG political correctness everywhere or I sue!"

Good job.

-- Alex

Except for this guy, the stupidity on this thread is amazing. No blind person says that all products must adapt to be blind friendly, or we will call the PC police on you. Blind people, or even whoever wrote the article aren't a bunch of complainers, whining about how technology alienates them. They're simply pointing out that new technology isn't designed with the blind in mind and maybe product makers should take notice.

There's nothing wrong with being politically correct, and there is a backlash in modern society against PC that is unbelievable. Political correctness and designing things with the handicapped in mind is a sign of a progressive society. Should we get rid of CC because deaf people have no right to watch TV because they can't hear it? Of course not, we should be designing our products to be accessible to as many people as possible, unless it's a niche specialty product. Not the other way around. An option that provides audio cues to what's going on onscreen, combined with a double clicking interface could make these products more accessible to the blind and since you could turn off these features, no different for the rest of us.

 

[arcainia]

WHY THE HELL AM I NOT ALOUD TO USE TAMPONS, HUH GOD?!

Well, anyway, he'll hear from MY lawyer.

..uh, actually, no one said you couldn't. But I'd like to know what you want to use them for.

 

[Trivun]

Simplest solution is research screens that can rise in parts, so Braille could be used on a touch screen by having the screen create little rising dots at different points. Then use a more sophistictaed version of audio technology like what Stephen Hawking's wheelchair uses so that blind people can still use it for things like reading and writing/typing. A combination of sound and touch will overcome the lack of sight that blind people suffer with gadgets.

God i hope that was sarcastic. The simplest solution is to tell them to stop complaining, many technologies aren't made with the handicapped in mind. If they feel so ostracized by this someone can come up with a solution and (probably) make tons of money, just like how most other solutions are found for handicapped people.

Excuse me, someone did just come up with a solution, i.e. me. The thing is they aren't going to stop complaining so we may as well do something useful instead of telling them all to shut up. We say that and they'll just rise up even more. I was just throwing my idea into the ballpark and if you don't like it then fair enough. However, I don't see you coming up with any ideas...

 

[Calobi]

Simplest solution is research screens that can rise in parts, so Braille could be used on a touch screen by having the screen create little rising dots at different points. Then use a more sophistictaed version of audio technology like what Stephen Hawking's wheelchair uses so that blind people can still use it for things like reading and writing/typing. A combination of sound and touch will overcome the lack of sight that blind people suffer with gadgets.

God I hope that was sarcastic. The simplest solution is to tell them to stop complaining, many technologies aren't made with the handicapped in mind. If they feel so ostracized by this someone can come up with a solution and (probably) make tons of money, just like how most other solutions are found for handicapped people.

Excuse me, someone did just come up with a solution, i.e. me. The thing is they aren't going to stop complaining so we may as well do something useful instead of telling them all to shut up. We say that and they'll just rise up even more. I was just throwing my idea into the ballpark and if you don't like it then fair enough. However, I don't see you coming up with any ideas...

I'm sorry if I came across as rude towards your idea. I wrote that post quickly just to get my view out there and was hoping to revise it before you responded. Also, my thoughts weren't quite right as I didn't read the article very thoroughly. Apologies to you and anyone else I may have offended with my thick sounding response.

I just meant that the blind, or indeed any other minority, should not demand equal rights on all new technologies immediately. And while touch screens have been around for a while, they are still relatively new for the general public. While we should actively seek ways to make allow all people to use all technologies (for the record, I liked your idea of braille raised on the screen; even if it is some time off most likely), we should not limit ourselves to releasing only what everyone can use.

When I stated that someone should come up with a solution, I more meant that the people who feel they are being left behind should look into some ways of pushing further research. This may be more difficult as their handicap affects all aspects of their lives, but even if they just donate or start a petition something will come out of it. The way the people from the article did it was along the lines I was thinking about. By asking the developers to look into it, they are trying to find solutions; maybe in a slightly passive way, but they are doing something.

Edit: Hooray long-winded thoughts!

 

[samsprinkle]

Actually one time in my state some people were lobbying for remote controls to have brail on them so blind people could use the t.v.

quote]Did it fail because the road maps didn't have brail on them, so they went to the wrong place?

 

[Trivun]

Simplest solution is research screens that can rise in parts, so Braille could be used on a touch screen by having the screen create little rising dots at different points. Then use a more sophistictaed version of audio technology like what Stephen Hawking's wheelchair uses so that blind people can still use it for things like reading and writing/typing. A combination of sound and touch will overcome the lack of sight that blind people suffer with gadgets.

God I hope that was sarcastic. The simplest solution is to tell them to stop complaining, many technologies aren't made with the handicapped in mind. If they feel so ostracized by this someone can come up with a solution and (probably) make tons of money, just like how most other solutions are found for handicapped people.

Excuse me, someone did just come up with a solution, i.e. me. The thing is they aren't going to stop complaining so we may as well do something useful instead of telling them all to shut up. We say that and they'll just rise up even more. I was just throwing my idea into the ballpark and if you don't like it then fair enough. However, I don't see you coming up with any ideas...

I'm sorry if I came across as rude towards your idea. I wrote that post quickly just to get my view out there and was hoping to revise it before you responded. Also, my thoughts weren't quite right as I didn't read the article very thoroughly. Apologies to you and anyone else I may have offended with my thick sounding response.

I just meant that the blind, or indeed any other minority, should not demand equal rights on all new technologies immediately. And while touch screens have been around for a while, they are still relatively new for the general public. While we should actively seek ways to make allow all people to use all technologies (for the record, I liked your idea of braille raised on the screen; even if it is some time off most likely), we should not limit ourselves to releasing only what everyone can use.

When I stated that someone should come up with a solution, I more meant that the people who feel they are being left behind should look into some ways of pushing further research. This may be more difficult as their handicap affects all aspects of their lives, but even if they just donate or start a petition something will come out of it. The way the people from the article did it was along the lines I was thinking about. By asking the developers to look into it, they are trying to find solutions; maybe in a slightly passive way, but they are doing something.

Edit: Hooray long-winded thoughts!

Alright then, fair enough and apology accepted. Just wanted to put the idea across, although on reflection it is definitely a while off. Glad you liked the idea though

 

[MarsProbe]

There's nothing wrong with being politically correct, and there is a backlash in modern society against PC that is unbelievable.

I'd be inclined to disagree - to an extent - with that comment. I believe there is a difference in what is these days referred to as Political Correctness and the more long standing tradition of basically not being unnecessarily offensive to other people. The concept that terms such as "brainstorm" and "blackboard" and even "learning disabilities" are now too offensive to use is quite frankly preposterous.

As way of an illustration, there was an articly in the newspaper today reagrding the pidgeon problem that has plagued my fine countries parliament building in recent times. The powers that be came up with the solution that having a hawk stationed at the building would keep the lfying rats at bay. The concept worked, but now some bright spark has stated that the use of the hawk to keep the pests at bay is not such a good idea, due to the fears that children from the nearby school (not that I've seen a school that close) may actually be at risk of seeing the hawk catch and kill a pidgeon.

I mean, seriously, is this all they have to do with their time? I'm sure these kids, being kids these days, have already seen a lot worse things happen on youtube anyway.

That's only one example, but it's hardly the worst...

 

[mattttherman3]

Well I am not blind so I don't know what the blind go thru. If I were to lose my sight, I would want to be dead, it is probably different than people born blind.

 

[Datalord]

Please specify more in the name of your thread, i thought this was a joke thread for
(a)books never written
(b)sign bloopers
(c)epic fails in newspapers and journal hadlines

 

[Auron555]

That went on a little long, but here's my point of view:
If you're against something that gives other people pleasure (as long as it's legal and all that) because it offends you, don't buy/do/see it and live your life.
The iPhone was made for normal people to have a neat little all-in-one gadget. There have been sufficient advances in technology to allow the disabled to live as best they can in today's society, and what more can you ask for?
Less QQ, more pew pew.

 

[barryween]

Well its your falt for being blind....
NO! Just kidding! but, sorry, you just cant buy touch screen items.

 

[shadow skill]

Wow some of you are a bunch of morons, really you are. Are they just not supposed to say anything at all while this type of technology becomes more and more prevalent? Perhaps the Iphone has a few programs that could be adapted to be usable by the blind that are simply not available on a phone that is better for a person with a severe visual impairment. Hell perhaps the phone itself works great but there is this killer app that is available for the phone that has no way of working without using the touch screen.

 

[s0denone]

Yeah, touch-screen gadgets aren't made for the blind, whereas all other gadgets are made with blind people in mind. I can't imagine how easy it is for a blind person to use anything that aren't made with them in mind specifically.

Blind people can't use anything that doesn't have a "Gadget for the blind" stamper on it. Computers can't be used by blind people. "Blind People Computers" can be used by blind people.




Edit:

Wow some of you are a bunch of morons, really you are. Are they just not supposed to say anything at all while this type of technology becomes more and more prevalent? Perhaps the Iphone has a few programs that could be adapted to be usable by the blind that are simply not available on a phone that is better for a person with a severe visual impairment. Hell perhaps the phone itself works great but there is this killer app that is available for the phone that has no way of working without using the touch screen.

Please read above.

 

[Vivvav]

Technology in general isn't exactly the best incorperated of the blind, but you've got to think that it's hard to cater for anyones needs.

Exactly. But the blind do have a point. I think there's an easy solution to this though:
STOP FUCKING MAKING EVERYTHING TOUCH SCREEN! I don't get the fascination! You're dirtying up the screen, anybody who wants to pick up your phone could fuck up everything, and if it bangs around, who knows what the hell can happen? Buttons need to have some extra force applied to them. Touch screens barely need any. I mean, it's cool and all, but totally unnecessary!

 

[Amoreyna]

Most people are at a complete loss for even remotely understanding how the blind use technology at all, as seen in the original post. This isn't surprising since most people take sight for granted and figure that those without it probably don't need to use technology in the first place since they can't enjoy the stunning visuls.

In real life I am a computer networker and have a couple of blind clients. And when I say blind I do not just mean legally blind - these women cannot even see shadows. After working with them for a couple of years it is amazing to see just how much of technology is a massive headache to them. It is already unintuitive to those with sight who can see what the hell is going on - imagine trying to navigate windows with your eyes taped shut.

Enter the software for the blind, such as Jaws. This software narrates everything that is going on on th screen at any given time. From where the cursor is, to what program you are opening to what letters you are typing in word. It's so good that it sounds out mispelled words so you can correct them. It speaks at about 100 words a minute and without some practice it sounds like a constant stream of gibberish in the back ground. And while it is far from perfect it works well.

Current media does not support this kind of technology. A lot of web pages that make use of flashy graphics disarm Jaws and make it complex to even impossible for those with limited or no sight to navigate. Forget using a cell phone, imagine not being able to check your email or having to start an entirely new account because the service you went with decided to use images not supported by your reading software.

There are so many devices that are off limit to the blind. The OP seemed to think it was funny that one man had difficulty using his microwave. It's not funny, nor are there any microwaves friendly to those with limited sight. We have printers that print in brail, ATM's with brail on the buttons, yet we are going towards technology that alienates the blind because it relies on touch screen technology.

Ironically, making certain devices friendly to the blind would be relatively simple and would mostly consist of just incorporating speaking programs so that they would know where they are. Not just on phones with touch screens which are becoming more popular but also on everyday household appliances. Most ovens consist of a digital read out with buttons - you have no idea where it starts or how hot you've set it to if you can't see it unless someone with sight has helped you operate it before. How hard would it be to simply add an anolog voice telling you what the temp was?

The blind make valuable contributions to society and our technology is singling them out. Already they are forced to rely on seeing people for help to even learn how to use appliances, and now they are being pushed even more out of the way with technology solely based on sight. A few simple changes would be all that it would take to make technology accessiable to anyone but companies won't do this.

 

[Amoreyna]

Screw the blind, it's not like they can read this post so it doesn't matter that I said that.

Really though it alienates more than just the blind. What about the people who can't touch the screen do to paralysis? What about about the mentally retarded? Surely they'll have difficulty figuring them out.

Ummm, you really can't be stupid enough to believe that blind people can't navigate forum posts. There is software that is capable of reading all your self centered rubbish to them.

Your comments just go to show that people have no clue to how those with any type of disability are able to function. Ignorance really is a disease that seems to bring down society a little more each day.

 

[shadow skill]

At any rate people shouldn't be hated for simply aying "Hey you are fucking us with all of your touch based hardware. Don't forget to throw in a mechanism for those that can't see, where it is possible." it's not as if more phones cannot include physical keyboards to supplement the touchscreen. The biggest problem in my mind is that some devices are pretty much only touch with no keyboard etc. If they do have such items they can be a bit difficult to find because this sort of thing is not listed in the specs.

Oh and Jwan the article you claimed to read only mentioned that with touchscreen phones the menu system can be so convoluted that even if you had physical buttons navigating the menus is a complete non starter for some stuff. In fact the iphone is only mentioned once in the entire article!

Amoreyna: You know I have always wished that keyboards incorporated braile into their design as it would make it easier for me to touch type. People should realize that many adaptive technologies can help normal people work better.

 

[Enigmers]

I don't think they should worry about it, really. For every iPhone, there are a thousand or a million not-iPhones. (or other touch-screen phones.) We're not going to abandon them just because Apple has a new gimmick that everyone suddenly thinks is amazing for no real reason (omglol thers a cowbell applakashun 4 teh iPhoen!11!!!)

 

[Elexia]

I have a friend who is blind and plays World of Warcraft (has a level 72 Druid) through a self-made and designed add-on. Text-to-speech plays a huge part too. When she turns, the game tells her 'you are facing east' and such. And chimes sound louder and louder whenever she gets close to a quest to pick up, turn in or something she needs to pick up.

If they had a text-to-speech for touch-screens, that can be utilised with earphones or something, it'd help vlisually impaired/blind operate one. Having a blind friend, I constantly think about the things she misses out on and it doesn't seem fair to me.