Undue Entitlement: A Growing Issue?

[Vivi22]

"Why do I have to sit here and patch my game? I wanna play NOW!"

I'd make a snide "how dare we want a finished product" remark, but it's been made a thousand times already.

Yes, because a "finished" product is always going to be considered much better than a buggy and glitchy game that requires several patches for game breaking bugs and major glitches. I mean, it's not like there's an incredibly successful game, and that the parent company just stopped patching that REALLY buggy game after a while because they figured the fans could do it, right?

Oh, wait.

You say that as though any of it is a good thing or somehow excuses Bethesda's lazy game development. It's not and it doesn't.

 

[Strazdas]

I would say it is a growing issue. One where the publishers are at fault for. The "paid DLC" one is especially visible.
10 years ago we would get months of support for games released with more content than most DLCs give, for free. they were called "patches". What we now call patches used to be caleld "hotfixes", because thats what they are. You know what we called DLCs? What we now call Expansions. And we paid for them.
10 years forward, we get patches for hotfixes, pay for patches and they even ahve the nerve to create arbitrary DRM to lock people out of moding just becuase modders come up with better content than their "paid DLC".

A similar thing came with patches, where patches meant fixing things and enchating experience before, now they mean "you can actually play the game without crashing every 10 minutes".

I do agree that the whole "i didnt like the ending i deserve a refund" thing is ridiculous, but thats another topic and not one of entitlement.

Now i dont have much time now to post a long reply about pirates, but let me tell you quickly that far from majority of pirates are entitled. or at least pirates from communities i participate in. (i dont pirate games, i however go to pirate sites because some of them have amazing forums)

 

[GonzoGamer]

I thought overuse of the term "entitled" was a shrinking issue. Oh well. What's funny is that many don't realize that a part of living in a capitalist society is that you are "Entitled" to complain about a product that you believe didn't deliver.

Imagine if you had to go online to activate your new vacuum cleaner. What if they tried to limit where you could use it? What if the attachments that used to come with a vacuum were now only available if you pre-ordered the vacuum and then the attachments were different depending on which retailer you pre-ordered from.

Would those vacuum cleaner consumer be entitled for complaining?

In a industry where the customer isn't treated like a idiot?Of course not,but the strangest thing about the game industry is that they have legions of people who try to tell others that their rights as a consumer mean nothing.

Yes, or it would be funny if you want to pay more for games. I've often wondered about this too; why some gamers seem to want to pay more and more for less and less content. I think it may be an exclusivity thing, some affluent gamers just want gaming to be for the affluent or just want to show off. I don't get it; I'm comfortable but I don't want to pay more for less with any of my pastimes.
Or it could be the stereotype of the nerdy gamer who is happy to be bullied out of his milk money. But that's what I think of when I hear some gamer say that when they buy a game they assume they're entitled to nothing.

But unless you're a bigwig at the publisher, I dont see why you should feel insulted another doesn't feel they got their money's worth.

As for Mass Effect 3, I haven't played it but maybe it was just a crappy game. I know that with Fallout 3, we had to pay more for a proper ending but most of us were ok doing that because the original release had 3 or 4 times the content you would normally get in a game.

 

[Hawkeye21]

It's funny how entitlement has taking a negative shade of meaning lately. It's almost like all those overpayed PR departments in EA, Activision, Ubisoft, etc has had something to do with it... Naaaah, it can't be that, surely. Them are nice companies, and would never stoop to something low like that.

 

[BloodSquirrel]

Ever since the whole snafu with Mass Effect 3's ending and that ludicrous "Take back Mass Effect" campaign, I'm starting to notice more and more of a feeling of (unearned, in my opinion) entitlement on the part of gamers. Granted, I'm sure it's been a large issue before this, but I've been more aware of it recently.

I've seen hundreds of posts about different games to the effect of:

"That ending sucked! I want a refund!"

"Why are they CHARGING for the DLC? This is ridiculous!"

"I'm pirating this game because $60 is too expensive!"

"I didn't like how this person wrote this character! BURN THE WITCH!"

"Why do I have to sit here and patch my game? I wanna play NOW!"

etc, etc.

I mean, what is UP with this? Seriously?

There's nothing "undue" about a sense of entitlement when you've paid full price for something and expect it to actually work properly.

If anything, it's the developers who are developing an undue sense of entitlement when they treat their customers as owing them sales, even when they can't even be bothered to have their game work out of the box or write a proper ending to the thing.

Bioware, in particular, has come under the impression that its our job to support their auteur bullshit regardless of how we feel about the final product. The amount of smug, passive-aggressive whining they direct toward anyone daring to criticize their self-perceived genius is ridiculous.

 

[bug_of_war]

I have entirely skipped the PS3 and XBox360 consoles, instead preferring to play my PS2, my Sega Genesis, and my Super Nintendo, and my Nintendo DS, because when I choose a game for those systems, I can play it. I don't have to go online and download data/patches/content, I don't have to input registration codes, I don't have to input online passes or any of that other stuff. I put the game in, I play it. Its just that simple. Even if it could be difficult for me to find a game, or that in the case of most of those systems, there is no new content being created/published, I can still play games without problems or hassles that are inflicted upon me by the publishers and developers outside of the game's world or environment.

Of course, the fact that I can also choose from hundreds of millions of FREE games on my android tablet or android phone doesn't factor into this........


And that is the root cause of the issues between gamers and publishers. The publishers are mostly just not listening to or respecting their paying customers, and the gamers are mostly stuck being sheep about it, because they don't look for alternatives. Not that there are a plethora of alternatives to some games, depending on its specific genre.
If gamers were really and truly upset by the amount of crap that publishers keep shoving into their faces, they would look elsewhere, or support different publishers, instead of continually giving their money to those that they don't like.
If publishers actually respected their customers, then they would start to offer things differently.

Your opinion seems heavily based on hear say (especially seeing as how you have said you actively avoided the current gen). I've bought ALL my games on Xbox 360 without EVER needing to hook up my console to the internet to download a patch. Also, gamers aren't sheep, I've seen many outright boycott certain companies because they don't like their policies, and there's a reason why most games with micro transactions end up going under or free to play, because people don't just follow suit and begrudgingly hand over their money. Just look at the Xbox One initial launch and you'll see that gamers don't just sit down and follow every word said by publishers like sheep. I think you need to maybe sit this argument out seeing as how you have no first hand experience and are merely using references to base your opinion.

OT:

"That ending sucked! I want a refund!"

Only entitled if they say, "the developers and writers are wrong the ending should have been this way!", simply not liking something is not being entitled, and as for asking for a refund there's just too much grey area to be able to say it's good or bad.

"Why are they CHARGING for the DLC? This is ridiculous!"

DLC should be charged yes, so long as that DLC is content being added on.

"I'm pirating this game because $60 is too expensive!"

That's not so much entitled as it is just being a huge fucking dick. Seriously if you can afford a computer and internet you can shell out some cash for a pc game.

"I didn't like how this person wrote this character! BURN THE WITCH!"

This is more like an extremist view. Not liking a character is perfectly fine, threatening someone or their family makes you a ****, saying that you know better and that a character should have acted like *this* can border along entitled.

"Why do I have to sit here and patch my game? I wanna play NOW!"

This really isn't entitled at all. We all want to play the game we bought and having to download a patch is annoying, it's not the end of the world, but it's understandably frustrating.


There are entitled gamers, but not as much as the internet would make you think. Also, entitled is becoming about as mis-used as Deus ex Machina, people use it far too much and it's meaning is begining to become warped.

 

[Eve Charm]

Eh I'm not seeing it as Entitlement, even in the mass effect case. If anything we're seeing like pc games the failure of the 60 dollar game and triple A market. While other markets like Indie and PC embraced Cheaper games and constant sales, The price of console games just keep going up, While most of the complaining tend to be coming from the console side of things, expect for things like unoptimized pc ports which is just lazy.

The market is just saturated, with really good games like Grand theft auto 5, Bioshock, and last of us, and the new slew of greatest games ever, comparing those games to like the lastest of call of battlefield's creed people tend to ask " Why are you charging 60 bucks for this?" Even worse " Why are you asking for 20-50 dollars of dlc right off of the bat." I just bought a xbone and Dead rising and forza, They wanted me to buy another 80 bucks of season passes for it, even after paying extra for a LE forza ;p

Now they are obviously going for the method of get more from their existing fanbase, While pc is going for cheaper ='s more sales ((with a market so saturated games over 10 bucks better be really good if they are gonna sell)) But right now in ME's case, When you ask for more money you should Expect a better product or expect back lash for it.

your hard core mass effect player probably bought each game new for 60 bucks a piece, and each game probably averaged at least 20 bucks of dlc. So if you spent 240 bucks on a game and aren't happy about it, Expect people to voice an complaint. Now they weren't "entitled" to a new ending, but they were well within anyone's right to be pissed off about it.

 

[CannibalCorpses]

I absolutely agree on the ME3 thing. People putting around 60 hours into the game and then demand a refund because they didnt like the ending. The stupidity of that notion expands on a lot of other games where people, or Fanboys more adequatly, were unhappy with the direction a games story or its character took. It is, however, not unusual for discussions to escalate into borderline-retarded shitstorms in a matter of days on the Internet. As soon as a train like that gets moving, people will jump on.

But the non-story aspects you mentioned, like DLC, Patches and the whole pirating-thing, isnt really about entitlement in my eyes, even if people are acting retarded nonetheless. At least you could ignore the mass of ME3 Fanboys who dominated the Internet for a few days, you could drown out the angry screams of DMC-kiddies leaving not one good hair on the game out of rage. But what pisses me off is the people who cry about bad business practices, patches, day-one DLC and the like, but then STILL walk to the next store and buy the damn games. Im fine with letting your voice be heard and complain about stuff you dont like, but its a giant doublestandard to just cry, ***** and moan about something, but still throwing money at the guys you are complaining about. We just reached a point where people like to rant and whine all day long, but actually do something that helps? Fu*k no. I NEED that new Capcom/EA-Activision-game, even though i will write the first whine-post before I even finish the tutorial.

Maybe this is where gaming becomes an addiction or becomes noticable. Maybe the loud mouthed crying and then still going out and endorsing it with a purchase is a clear indication that some people need serious help. Not in the comedy 'go get your head checked' sort of way but actual medical help for their computer game addiction. If someone said 'i fucking hate heroin, it's ruining my life' and then rushed out to buy it you'd be thinking 'rehab' i'd guess.

 

[DEV1ANTGAMER]

Entitlement happens because the games industry has made a habit of constantly lying about their games... putting stuff in trailers thats not in the final product or promising things that are greatly exaggerated and flatout lies in every sense of the word unless you're a rules-scumming lawyer.

See Mass Effect 3 and the promises that choices would matter. (Also on-disc Day-One-DLC)
See every Halo trailer pre-Halo 4.
See Aliens Colonial Marines.
See Sim City and always-online DRM that made the entire product UNPLAYABLE for weeks.

It's not entitlement IMO when a company is basically pulling a bait-and-switch on you. That simple. I do NOT condone piracy in these situations... but at the same time I think being angry at the publisher is completely justified.

 

[hermes]

Yes how dare gamers expect a company to release a competently made and functioning product, to exercise good and ethical business practices and to charge a fair price for their product. I mean who do they think they are? Game companies can do whatever they want and to question or to criticise them is unwarranted entitlement.

Which interestingly, does not apply to the most popular example.

Mass Effect 3 was competently made, it was functioning and it was charge the same price as any other game. If the topic was about SimCity 6, it would have been different.

 

[Bruce]

I absolutely agree on the ME3 thing. People putting around 60 hours into the game and then demand a refund because they didnt like the ending. The stupidity of that notion expands on a lot of other games where people, or Fanboys more adequatly, were unhappy with the direction a games story or its character took. It is, however, not unusual for discussions to escalate into borderline-retarded shitstorms in a matter of days on the Internet. As soon as a train like that gets moving, people will jump on.

I never played Mass Effect because it was boring as fuck, so correct me if I'm wrong. But I thought the outrage was less about disliking the ending, and more about the fans feeling like they had been lied to about the nature of the ending. For example, weren't they promised that there would be at least 7 endings or something, and each one would be based the player's previous choices? To me the ME3 debacle seemed like the developers getting away with misleading advertising. They should have come forward and revised their previous statement, making it clear that there would only be two endings.

Pretty much yeah. The head writer specifically said it wouldn't be an A, B, C ending - and then they proceeded to present an A, B, C ending.

It didn't help that the ending didn't follow from the events of the game (not even in broad brush strokes) at all, and came off as condescending philosophy 101 student crap.

The thing that really made the whole thing explode though was games reviewers and journalists getting all huffy at gamers for calling a shitty ending shitty.

 

[hermes]

Ever since the whole snafu with Mass Effect 3's ending and that ludicrous "Take back Mass Effect" campaign, I'm starting to notice more and more of a feeling of (unearned, in my opinion) entitlement on the part of gamers. Granted, I'm sure it's been a large issue before this, but I've been more aware of it recently.

I've seen hundreds of posts about different games to the effect of:

"That ending sucked! I want a refund!"

"Why are they CHARGING for the DLC? This is ridiculous!"

"I'm pirating this game because $60 is too expensive!"

"I didn't like how this person wrote this character! BURN THE WITCH!"

"Why do I have to sit here and patch my game? I wanna play NOW!"

etc, etc.

I mean, what is UP with this? Seriously?

There's nothing "undue" about a sense of entitlement when you've paid full price for something and expect it to actually work properly.

If anything, it's the developers who are developing an undue sense of entitlement when they treat their customers as owing them sales, even when they can't even be bothered to have their game work out of the box or write a proper ending to the thing.

Bioware, in particular, has come under the impression that its our job to support their auteur bullshit regardless of how we feel about the final product. The amount of smug, passive-aggressive whining they direct toward anyone daring to criticize their self-perceived genius is ridiculous.

You know, you keep coming back at it, but I don't know how Mass Effect 3 equates to "not working properly".

In the case of games and other software products, not working properly means game breaking bugs, it means a game overheating your video card, formatting your disk, locking your OS or simply not running. It does not mean "I didn't like how it turned out".

 

[josemlopes]

People not satisfied with the products they are buying or feeling they are not getting value for their money are complaining? OMG what a bunch of spoiled brats! What have we come to.

A customer is only entitled to a working product as advertised, if you like that product or not is none of their business. You can complain (and should) if the product is malfunctioning (patches and fixes) but complain that something isnt the way you like it just isnt valid (Mass Effect 3, The Stanley Parable "racist" painting, female multiplayer characters not being present, etc...).

If the customer doesnt like the product then he shouldnt have bought it

 

[Soundwave]

Can we call it dissatisfaction instead of 'entitlement' ? I hate to argue for the "buyer beware" mentality, but nobody should be buying the game the day it comes out, without having researched it first, if they are that concerned about the money being spent on it.

I'm not even going to address the mass effect 3 ending, beyond saying that it's been argued to the point that I was fine with the ending, but that hate surrounding it managed to ruin the series for me.

People not satisfied with the products they are buying or feeling they are not getting value for their money are complaining? OMG what a bunch of spoiled brats! What have we come to.

A cosplayer is only entitled to a working product as advertised, if you like that product or not is none of their business. You can complain (and should) if the product is malfunctioning (patches and fixes) but complain that something isnt the way you like it just isnt valid (Mass Effect 3, The Stanley Parable "racist" painting, female multiplayer characters, etc...).

If the cosplayer doesnt like the product then he shouldnt have bought it

sorry, those typos really got to me

 

[BloodSquirrel]

You know, you keep coming back at it, but I don't know how Mass Effect 3 equates to "not working properly".

In the case of games and other software products, not working properly means game breaking bugs, it means a game overheating your video card, formatting your disk, locking your OS or simply not running. It does not mean "I didn't like how it turned out".

1) Not everything in his list is about Mass Effect

2) A game doesn't have to be doing damage to your computer to not be working properly. If it's supposed to have X feature, and it doesn't have X feature, then it isn't working properly. And the ending to a very narrative-focused game series is a very important feature- it's not just any random 1% of the game, it's the 1% of the game that is supposed to resolve and put final context on the other 99%. A story is like a air plane flight- it doesn't matter how well 99% of it goes if the last 1% involves a fiery crash.

 

[Nakts]

Did you know, EA pays people $0.15 per posts to shill their products, shift blame, and throw the word "entitled" around until it looses all meaning? Now you do.

 

[Vegosiux]

Did you know, EA pays people $0.15 per posts to shill their products, shift blame, and throw the word "entitled" around until it looses all meaning? Now you do.

*thwacks with a newspaper* Bad captain Purr! You know you shouldn't just be saying stuff like that, imagine the riots it would cause if anyone took it seriously!

*ahem*

No really, I think the problem isn't people thinking EA pays people to troll the forums in its favor.

The problem is people who willingly let themselves be screwed over and still buy the next thing the screwer-over produces. At the risk of controversy, the behavior often seems similar to a battered wife who knows her husband is an abusive piece of filth, but keeps retuning to him and even defending him for some reason. It's irrational, it's also liable to cause harm to oneself, it's self-destructive and as such it's a cause for concern.

Nevermind that my analogy is kind of delicate, but when people start behaving in a knee-jerk way to dissenting opinions even while knowing the side they're defending is generally shit, that's a cause for concern.

 

[josemlopes]

Can we call it dissatisfaction instead of 'entitlement' ? I hate to argue for the "buyer beware" mentality, but nobody should be buying the game the day it comes out, without having researched it first, if they are that concerned about the money being spent on it.

I'm not even going to address the mass effect 3 ending, beyond saying that it's been argued to the point that I was fine with the ending, but that hate surrounding it managed to ruin the series for me.

People not satisfied with the products they are buying or feeling they are not getting value for their money are complaining? OMG what a bunch of spoiled brats! What have we come to.

A cosplayer is only entitled to a working product as advertised, if you like that product or not is none of their business. You can complain (and should) if the product is malfunctioning (patches and fixes) but complain that something isnt the way you like it just isnt valid (Mass Effect 3, The Stanley Parable "racist" painting, female multiplayer characters, etc...).

If the cosplayer doesnt like the product then he shouldnt have bought it

sorry, those typos really got to me

Great, now everyone will think I wrote cosplayer lol.

Just to clear things up for anyone else (since I now edited my original post) the typo was costumer intead of customer.

 

[Something Amyss]

Umm... I'm not entirely sure "entitlement" means what you think it means.

In fact, one could say this is a growing issue.

"That ending sucked! I want a refund!"

The ending they lied about? Because that was kind of the main reason behind the refund.

In fact, we are entitled to a reasonable expectation that a commercial product will work as advertised.

"Why are they CHARGING for the DLC? This is ridiculous!"

Depending on the context, it is ridiculous.

Being cheap, however, is not being entitled.

"I'm pirating this game because $60 is too expensive!"

Okay, here we actually get to something that might count. People are not entitled to games. They choose to purchase them or not. Something being too expensive is never a justification to pirate a luxury item.

"I didn't like how this person wrote this character! BURN THE WITCH!"

Being a sociopathic asshole is not entitlement. Nobody should be threatened for being a bad writer or writing something you don't like, but again, that doesn't mean there's an entitlement issue.

"Why do I have to sit here and patch my game? I wanna play NOW!"

One of the selling points of consoles is that they are simplified and 'just work.' The idea that games should play out of the box is not unreasonable. Otherwise, why are we even shelling out so much for simplified PCs?

Even then, wanting to play now doesnt' make you entitled.

The Verdict: Five examples, with one example of entitlement, one example of a false sense of entitlement. A 20% accuracy rate AND you're berating people for actually feeling entitled where entitlement is due.

This s the growing trend: berating people as entitled when they're not being entitled, or actually have a legitimate reason to feel that way. Are you also going to complain about people feeling "entitled" to a working PS4?

Special treatment could be mean that the games industry (or other large body) should bow to a sole person's (or interest group's) will.

It could, but contextually doesn't. Besides, by that definition, you could call shooter fans entitled because they are effectively coercing the industry.

Or we could stop trying for backdoor justifications.

The game designers are entitled to make those design choices for good or for ill.

Unless they lie or violate business practices. Bioware/EA was not entitled to lie. They can claim artistic integrity until they're blue in the face, but when they make commercial statements about a retail product, they no longer have artistic freedom.

Funny how if someone tried to use the "entitled" card in any other industry then they would get funny looks.Hell most companies wish they could get away with stuff like many in the game industry are currently doing.

Even funnier how someone who dislikes a movie or a meal can still ask for a refund. When gamers do it, it's entitlement and companies should have artistic freedom.

It's like the gaming industry survives on bile or something. Even Hollywood knows it's a good idea to perform basic customer service, despite being a billion follar industry and being able to afford o piss off a few people. Instead, Gaming has got away with a lot of their shtick because they've somehow managed to convince a ton of people that the same sort of basic standards of quality (and I use the term loosely) in other industries are 'entitlements' in the negative sense and that consumers who want these 'entitlements' are somehow seeking special snowflake status.

 

[hermes]

You know, you keep coming back at it, but I don't know how Mass Effect 3 equates to "not working properly".

In the case of games and other software products, not working properly means game breaking bugs, it means a game overheating your video card, formatting your disk, locking your OS or simply not running. It does not mean "I didn't like how it turned out".

1) Not everything in his list is about Mass Effect

2) A game doesn't have to be doing damage to your computer to not be working properly. If it's supposed to have X feature, and it doesn't have X feature, then it isn't working properly. And the ending to a very narrative-focused game series is a very important feature- it's not just any random 1% of the game, it's the 1% of the game that is supposed to resolve and put final context on the other 99%. A story is like a air plane flight- it doesn't matter how well 99% of it goes if the last 1% involves a fiery crash.

1) Based on your response, I will assume it does.

2) If I have to review the definition of "entitled", you might want to review the definition of "feature". Multiplayer is a feature, Voice Acting is a feature, being playable is a feature... Having a story that will satisfy 100% of the audience, 100& of the time is not a feature, its a pipe dream. GTA V Online not working was a problem and people should complain about it, Batman Origins having a bug that prevented a lot of people to complete the game was a problem and they should complain about it. Having a problem with the way a story was resolved is an opinion, and while you are free to complain as much as you want, they are free to frame your complains as an opinion.