Users Accidentally Buy Items on PS4 PSN Store Using DualShock 4 for PS3

[commasplice]

So. For all that this sucks for the people involved, I can't help but imagine that someone out there might think of this as an opportunity for an added difficulty mode in Dark Souls: try to beat the game while spending less than a certain threshold in the PS4 shop.

 

[Saltyk]

I don't know. I find this highly suspect. I once tried to have my PS3 and PS4 on at the same time to download PS+ games. And it didn't seem that I could. Maybe I need to set something up, but it seemed I couldn't be connected to PSN on both at the same time.

Due to that, I'm not certain that this actually happened. Which would explain Sony denying the refund.

If it actually happened, they deserve refunds. I'm just not certain that it actually happened.

 

[Evil Smurf]

According to Australian consumer law, Sony will have to offer refunds. Say what you want about us, at least we treat consumers with respect.

Shame that UK law doesn't offer the same. Downloads are still in legal limbo as noone has decided if they're a product or service yet, and the most useful of our consumer protection laws apply to products.

It's odd, companies like Apple and Nintendo say "no refunds" to downloaded content even in Australia, it's good to know the law I suppose.

 

[A-D.]

According to Australian consumer law, Sony will have to offer refunds. Say what you want about us, at least we treat consumers with respect.

Shame that UK law doesn't offer the same. Downloads are still in legal limbo as noone has decided if they're a product or service yet, and the most useful of our consumer protection laws apply to products.

It's odd, companies like Apple and Nintendo say "no refunds" to downloaded content even in Australia, it's good to know the law I suppose.

Its kinda that, Apple and so forth can put that in their EULA/ToS or whereever they want to, but at the end of the day, the respective countries laws override whatever is in the EULA anyway. For the most part the EULA isnt even legally binding in some countries and can therefore be utterly ignored. For example i know there is a british law that you can quote at Valve to get a refund no matter what.

 

[fix-the-spade]

Yep, very good point. If Sony does this, what's stopping people from buying something online, finishing it and asking for a refund.

That's an easy one, you need a PSN account to make digital purchases, your PSN account tracks how much time you have (or haven't) spent in a game and whether you've installed it or not.

Steam, Origin etc do the same, from Sony's end it would be extremely simple to look up an account, see that it bought product X less than 48 hours ago and that it's never been used.

Unfortunately most companies have figured out that when it comes to digital purchases they can ignore consumer protection law and not many people will come after them. Both the people in the article are in the UK, Sony has to give them a refund, it's not aloud to say no, but nobody's there to enforce it so away they go to abuse the system.

 

[Smooth Operator]

Well I don't know why people thought the controller wouldn't affect both machines, but I absolutely do not let accidental buys slide and refusal to refund when it happens even less so.

Also while your government laws might protect you against such awful business, digital downloads providers do not abide by them, obviously the matter can be taken to court but you better have a lawyer wallet as big as the other guy.

 

[Bad Jim]

The problem is, this is absolutely unprovable. Everyone can now claim for a refund on literally anything you've bought out over the PSN and claim you didn't know the controller was controlling both.

Yep, very good point. If Sony does this, what's stopping people from buying something online, finishing it and asking for a refund.

If you've been playing it, won't you have at least a few achievements/trophies?

 

[Alex Co]

The problem is, this is absolutely unprovable. Everyone can now claim for a refund on literally anything you've bought out over the PSN and claim you didn't know the controller was controlling both.

Yep, very good point. If Sony does this, what's stopping people from buying something online, finishing it and asking for a refund.

If you've been playing it, won't you have at least a few achievements/trophies?

Not if you play it on another PSN account.

Yep, very good point. If Sony does this, what's stopping people from buying something online, finishing it and asking for a refund.

That's an easy one, you need a PSN account to make digital purchases, your PSN account tracks how much time you have (or haven't) spent in a game and whether you've installed it or not.

Steam, Origin etc do the same, from Sony's end it would be extremely simple to look up an account, see that it bought product X less than 48 hours ago and that it's never been used.

Unfortunately most companies have figured out that when it comes to digital purchases they can ignore consumer protection law and not many people will come after them. Both the people in the article are in the UK, Sony has to give them a refund, it's not aloud to say no, but nobody's there to enforce it so away they go to abuse the system.

Damn. That's a very solid solution -- one that's doable even. At this day and age, digital refunds should be the norm as long as it's justified.

Yep, very good point. If Sony does this, what's stopping people from buying something online, finishing it and asking for a refund.

I would say, a timelimit? "Ask for a refund within 4 hours and get it right away, no questions asked"-kind of thing?

Yep, that would work, no? Maybe 4-6 hours? Or the steps mentioned above.

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

I love how people keep saying "Sony" as though Sony is a single sentient being. This isn't Sony refusing a refund, this is a customer service rep listening to some guy's story and thinking "Something like this has never come up before, and as far as anyone knows it isn't possible to control two systems at once; so this guy is probably lying out of his ass to cover-up for some buyer's remorse or something along those lines," and then refusing to refund based on what he figured to be a load of hogwash.

And heck, has anyone calling foul on Sony even tried controlling both systems at once? Because Lord knows that NO ONE would ever make-up a false story in order to garner sympathy or just shine a bad light on a company he doesn't like (or has a momentary beef). Hell, Cracked does articles all the time talking about the bogus stories that get reported as fact; yet here we are taking the word of some guy that we've never heard of before, all because it means the chance to demonize a company that some people look for any excuse to demonize.

 

[Caiphus]

I love how people keep saying "Sony" as though Sony is a single sentient being. This isn't Sony refusing a refund, this is a customer service rep listening to some guy's story and thinking "Something like this has never come up before, and as far as anyone knows it isn't possible to control two systems at once; so this guy is probably lying out of his ass to cover-up for some buyer's remorse or something along those lines," and then refusing to refund based on what he figured to be a load of hogwash.

And heck, has anyone calling foul on Sony even tried controlling both systems at once? Because Lord knows that NO ONE would ever make-up a false story in order to garner sympathy or just shine a bad light on a company he doesn't like (or has a momentary beef). Hell, Cracked does articles all the time talking about the bogus stories that get reported as fact; yet here we are taking the word of some guy that we've never heard of before, all because it means the chance to demonize a company that some people look for any excuse to demonize.

Oh sure. And it's important to remember this every time a customer service rep does something stupid, as frustrating as it might be. One shouldn't extrapolate the actions of one employee (especially one reasonably far down the greasy pole) to judge the entire company. Especially when, yeah, unconfirmed story.

However, IF the story is true, then it does sound like the service rep got the "no refunds" line drilled into him pretty hard. Which shows that at least one manager somewhere in Sony America has a pretty miserly outlook towards customer service.

But yeah, can anyone actually confirm that a PS4 controller can control two systems at once? Not to make people do work for me for free, of course.

Edit: looks like this took place in the UK, not America.

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

Sony has always been crap to its customers. I think with online refunds they have to give proper time limit, maybe 12 or 24 hours. 6 hours is rubbish if you did it just before bed. Also have to take into account people working all day so may not find out till the following evening. Also im sure Sony has information on whether the game has been played or not, same way Steam does. If the game was never played then a refund should be done.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

Yeah, I'm going to side with Sony on this one. They're not obliged to give refunds due to you using an unsupported controller and being too dumb to check if it's still connected to another device.

That being said, this could be an opportunity for some easy PR...

 

[RoonMian]

According to Australian consumer law, Sony will have to offer refunds. Say what you want about us, at least we treat consumers with respect.

Shame that UK law doesn't offer the same. Downloads are still in legal limbo as noone has decided if they're a product or service yet, and the most useful of our consumer protection laws apply to products.

In Germany it's a bit murky. Every purchase not made in person (phone, internet) the consumer has the right to back out of inside of 14 days without giving any reasons.

"I don't want this stuff anymore, give me back my money"

"May I ask you why?"

"Fuck you, that's why."

And it is perfectly legal.

With software, music and video it's a bit difficult though. There you do not have the right to back out if the product has been "unsealed". If that guy could proof that he for example hasn't downloaded the stuff he at least would have a leg to stand on in court.

 

[Vivi22]

So I'm guessing their psn accounts or purchases weren't password protected, because if that's the case then I'm sorry but I have no sympathy to spare on this one.

Really doesn't matter if they had password protection on their purchases or not. Using a PS4 controller on your PS3 should not result in the thing making purchases you didn't intend. Hell, it shouldn't result in it doing anything you didn't intend at all. That's a clear failure on Sony's part.

Assuming the story is true of course. I'm not sure if this is actually possible.

 

[Mersadeon]

I don't understand why Sony should refund this (apart from good PR). Don't get me wrong, it's a mistake that's understandable and unfortunate, but technically they used a piece of hardware not made for your hardware (and Sony, as far as I know, never said "you can use the PS4 controller for your PS3"), so Sony isn't at all to blame.
Not to mention, come on guys - this is pretty logical, this would probably be the first thing I'd think about when I discover that my controller works for both, because how is the PS3 gonna know that the controller is also controlling a PS4?

Now again, I understand that they would refund for PR reasons, but I don't think they are doing anything morally wrong by refusing. I mean, it's really your own fault. Not to mention, you probably still have your PS3 controller.

 

[Whateveralot]

Wait.....if the PS4 is turned off, how can it control both consoles

It was turned on.

Do you realise how stupid it is to have a PS4 being ON while the controller is being used elsewhere? It is however very unfortunate and I hope Sony turns around on this one.

 

[Buizel91]

Wait.....if the PS4 is turned off, how can it control both consoles

It was turned on.

Why the hell would someone keep the PS4 turned on while using the PS3 with the controller that controls the ps4, but using it to control the ps3...

That makes no sense -.- i would of thought it would of been obvious this would happen.

 

[RicoADF]

Well I don't know why people thought the controller wouldn't affect both machines, but I absolutely do not let accidental buys slide and refusal to refund when it happens even less so.

Also while your government laws might protect you against such awful business, digital downloads providers do not abide by them, obviously the matter can be taken to court but you better have a lawyer wallet as big as the other guy.

Well here in Australia that's not the case, if you have a disbute then you go to the department of fair trading, they review the case and if they find in your favor they order the company to provide the refund. To refuse would be like refusing a court order, a very bad idea for a business (fines etc).

Why the hell would someone keep the PS4 turned on while using the PS3 with the controller that controls the ps4, but using it to control the ps3...

That makes no sense -.- i would of thought it would of been obvious this would happen.

Never underestimate the stupidity of most people, especially in regards to technology.

 

[lacktheknack]

And heck, has anyone calling foul on Sony even tried controlling both systems at once? Because Lord knows that NO ONE would ever make-up a false story in order to garner sympathy or just shine a bad light on a company he doesn't like (or has a momentary beef). Hell, Cracked does articles all the time talking about the bogus stories that get reported as fact; yet here we are taking the word of some guy that we've never heard of before, all because it means the chance to demonize a company that some people look for any excuse to demonize.

I actually tried this. What happened was that I was automatically disconnected from the PSN from one system when accessing it from another. So, began with PS3, then activated the PS4 and PS3 was automatically disconnected. For that reason I have to call out some bullshit on this story.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

This of course raises the question of "Why would these two clowns think they could get away with something so easily tested?"

Maybe it has something directly to do with Dark Souls 2?