Just... take my word on it. Changing a core feature is much more difficult (even if it's easy in theory) than adding a cute gimmick like the Konami Code.IceForce said:
WGDF
- Thread starter The Wooster
- Start date
Actually, it was partially a joke. I asked to have it replaced for that because 1.) A dakimakura reads more like a 'beta male' thing and is more ripe for hilarious and disturbing subtext (at least, that's how I see it; could be wrong); and 2.) I wanted to appeal to Corey/Grey's sensibilities, and I know that either one or both of them don't like Evangelion too much (or like it enough and are secure in their admiration of it to make fun of it), so I suggested using Rei Ayanami. In reality, it could be any female anime character that a lot of fanboys like calling their waifu; even better, they could draw up their own generic waifu character for Beta to fondle.erttheking said:
Still, it IS Corey and Grey's comic, and they can do with it as they please...Though, I wonder if Beta still has the Twilight Sparkle pony doll, seeing as how he threw it away so he could grab his gun, then used both hands to fly away.
Not understanding that your position in a massive majority confers some benefits is willful and obtuse ignorance. So no, I'm not making up lies. I was stating my opinion, specifically; that gorrath's first post was crap, and that 1life0Continues' response was both entertaining and eloquently stated. Am I dealing with an alt maybe?nikago said:
Why?IceForce said:
Who cares if the featured content threads are locked or not?
The thread has been going for so long because people obviously still want to post in it. I don't see how if affects the quality of life of anyone who isn't posting in it, bar the mods who have to deal with people who break the rules.
I really don't get your obsession with moderation. You seem to bring up the same few questions repeatedly, even though I've seen multiple people, not just mods, answer your questions.
To be honest though, I don't get this site's obsession with moderation in general. I don't see how volunteer mods on a gaming forum making the occasional mistake or having some vague sections in the CoC of a gaming forum has such an impact on people.
Edit: In relation to the comic, I thought it was hilarious last time when people were changing the dialogue in the comic and posting it in the comments section thinking they were being really clever or "countering" the points of the original.
I hope that happens again, they were the best.
It's sort of like a wave of highly contagious flu went through a community, and then several months later, at the mere mention of that flu coming back, a bunch of people started getting sick again.
(Seriously. Seven pages already? Wow.)
For my money, I think I'd be just as happy if the recurrence of that flu were just a rumor. I've been looking back through that forum a bit, and it looks like there was far more venom and outrage than discussion and enlightenment going on. I'm not willing to say out of hand that someone being goaded by a comic like that (or the resulting shockwave) is a damning indictment of that person's unworthiness to be part of all other forum discussions, and if Grey and Cory are effectively using a second one, now fully aware of the likely result, to try and stir up people who might be so goaded... well, that really doesn't speak very well of them.
The satirical point has been made. A little tact would be appreciated.
(Seriously. Seven pages already? Wow.)
For my money, I think I'd be just as happy if the recurrence of that flu were just a rumor. I've been looking back through that forum a bit, and it looks like there was far more venom and outrage than discussion and enlightenment going on. I'm not willing to say out of hand that someone being goaded by a comic like that (or the resulting shockwave) is a damning indictment of that person's unworthiness to be part of all other forum discussions, and if Grey and Cory are effectively using a second one, now fully aware of the likely result, to try and stir up people who might be so goaded... well, that really doesn't speak very well of them.
The satirical point has been made. A little tact would be appreciated.
However, just because some people overreact does not mean that there is not a problem. Whites are heavily mistreated, victims of racism, and other things. However that isn't really the entire point here. The point here is that a complete mockery was being made of a fairly legitimate position, held by a lot of people, and ironically sort of proving the "point" made by the WGDF so to speak because you are literally seeing a case where it's fine to mock people who have issues with the pushy liberal/minority crowd, but god forbid you make an offensive statement or depiction of a minority. Understand WGDF is invoking a strip where "Critical Miss" literally had people invoking Zimmerman as they blew some black dude away out of hand... which is a big part of why the Zimmerman case has shown up in this thread.briankoontz said:
That said though, it's not so much about the issue. I honestly don't care of Critical Miss wants to engage in what it sees as a social justice crusade, and mock some of the opponents they do have. What I have an issue is when you start seeing people who were being insulted as a group firing back and being banned or moderated for it. That's fundamentally what this is about. The original WGDF had like 50 moderator actions and was an absolute bloodbath as Critical Miss was pretty much defended from blowback they provoked. Then here we are a while later, they are pretty much going for an encore, and we had scads of messages going "oh wow, these guys just poked the hornet's nest again". To be honest what they have been doing would have gotten them banned if they weren't running a feature. My entire point has largely been that if they are going to do this, then the mods should be kept out of the forum, and allow the other side to retaliate. Understand your not dealing with some tiny, radical, fringe here, which is why you saw an unprecedented number of mod actions, and the "OMG" response when they decided to go here again... and let's be blunt, despite claims to the contrary about this not being "any worse than any other Critical Miss" yeah it was, as the mod actions and reactions have shown, that's not "business as usual" for this strip or it's forums. While simply allowing the forums to act as a "Free fire zone" when attached to features where people do things like this would be ideal (free speech on both sides so to speak) the other option would of course for some editorial control to be exercised, which is to say that Gray and Cory would be required to get their material/strips approved ahead of time, and The Escapist simply wouldn't run/print/purchase strips that are inflammatory attacks against major viewpoints, largely because The Escapist doesn't want to either curtail free speech and present things in a one sided fashion, or invite flame wars even on some of it's forums.
Don't misunderstand, I don't expect either of those things to happen, but I figured I'd say my piece on the subject. I'll be blunt, I say a lot of controversial things online, but I stick to my guns, and invite counter-arguments and criticism, and even turn the other cheek when I'm flamed. I have absolutely zero respect for guys like this who can dish it out, but can't take it, and are pretty much hiding behind the mods to avoid having to reap what they sow. I kind of figured the first time it was a bit of a misfire and after that much mod action they probably would have figured "okay, we went too far" but now with them doing it again and seeing how intentional it is... I figured something needed to be said.
They have every right to their opinion, and I'd prefer they weren't edited, but if they are going to be allowed to wield an attack platform the other side should be able to respond with equal vigor. Understand these guys pretty much associated those people who have a different opinion on whole issue of minorities in video games, with casual murder, which is also a statement about the Zimmerman case which is divisive to say the least. It shouldn't be a surprise that this POed a lot of people unlike their other strips, and rubbing salt in the wound after that whole mess is just plain wrong. This is again, simply my opinion, and one I do not expect to go anywhere.
Well, you have to understand that right now there is a sort of battle between ultra-liberal crusaders for "social justice" through the media, and those who oppose them. I wouldn't go so far as to really give the opposition a direct political affiliation (as most would disagree with me heavily politically) but it's a resistance to trying to force political correctness onto gaming and fandom. It's a response to things like long-running comic characters having their ethnicity changed to create a more diverse cast, while minority characters are entirely overlooked or written out (for example in the recent X-men movie, they should have given Bishop a leading role since this was *his* storyline. There are valid complaints to be made there. On the other hand making Heimdall black was kind of ridiculous, and the kind of thing this movement tends to oppose). The example being used in the original WGDF basically had the WGDF "intervening" in a discussion about the lack of black video game characters, where you had a typical argument being made, devoid of any real context or rebuttal. The point being "well, why can people associate with an anthromorphic fox, but not a black dude", devoid of the entire point about political baggage and issues like whenever you bring in a black character it invites criticisms of tokenism, or whether the character is "black enough" or a "Hoho" black on the outside but gooey and white on the inside. Something that goes into discussions about how characters like Storm aren't REALLY black since they aren't involved in black issues, and of course black issues tend to get highly political and in many cases turn into them expressing how bad white people are. Those two sides can literally go at it for hours (or dozens of messages) and introduce many other arguments as well. This group represents one of the biggest actual obstacles that media liberalism actually has right now, in part because a lot of the people involved are otherwise liberals (oftentimes identifying as democratic or libertarian... the "euphoric" Fedora-guy is usually typically a libertarian in stereotypes). The strip didn't just poke some good natured fun at this either, it portrayed them as being casual murderers, in a double-whammy punchline that was also sort of a slam on anyone who doesn't think Zimmerman was wrong, which is another huge issue. If someone pokes the badger like that, they should expect a response.Callate said:
One of the other reasons why this upset so many people is how anti-white racism is actually being trivialized. For example if someone did a strip where the punch line was how blacks are inferior monkey people who rape white women, there would be some pretty mainstream outrage. The Escapist would probably fire whoever did that, and really that isn't much different than a racist-political strip that has casual murder over video game arguements as a punch line, and nothing happens. Perhaps a better example would be how in recent articles like Jim's review of Watch Dogs he makes a casual slam on this being "another photogenic white guy". The comment isn't a big deal, and I don't much care, I'm just using it as a recent example of the kind of thing this group is talking about when it comes to anti-white racism. You insert digs like that about minorities and it's an entirely different ball game, yet it's becoming increasingly common as a specific kind of viewpoint begins to dominate gaming media. A better example would be the going back to say "Just Cause 2" and it's review here, which while dated made a crack about how the black market system was slow, because "obviously it's not the white market" or something like that.
Overall I think people are entitled to these opinions, heck I express a lot of them that upset a lot of people. They are entitled to express them, and I actually encourage expression even when I disagree with it. I simply have an issue when there is a dual standard preventing rebuttal, especially when it becomes highly insulting. What Jim did for example was no huge thing (though it illustrates the position the group Gray was mocking holds), but what Critical Miss did... well there is a reason why Jim's example would get lumped into a general trend being very minor and probably not mentioned specifically, where Critical Miss got enough fire to result in 50 mod actions as the site policies basically acted to protect them from their own fallout.
Some people don't like the way I argue, but when I say give an opinion on militant global politics, talk about my opinions on gay rights, and all kinds of things, I don't get all upset or demand protection when people argue with me. I'm also big enough to avoid flames. Of course I also tend to be pretty polite and reasonable, especially when presenting controversial material for the audience, I don't say turn it into an offensive joke, and then pretty much
let the response bounce off a shield, expecting to be protected from response to my own comments. I've been basically saying let it flow both ways when someone running a feature chooses to start it, that would be ideal. If not, well,
part of the reason why a publication has editors as much as I hate the idea is to try and stop things pre-emptively
that are going to invoke this level of conflict. The way I see it, we're already seeing censorship, which is The Escapist's right mind you, ideally I'd like to see it balanced, or removed entirely in cases like this. But this is simply my opinion, not any kind of ultimatum, or demand. It will either get positive attention, or it won't. I don't expect my thoughts to go anywhere, but I figure I'd still say my piece.
Apologies for the length of the post yet again, while long (and redundant with other posts) hopefully some of it clarified things.
... and for anyone reading this, just so it won't be taken out of context (which happens with long posts) I'm not trying to make a big thing about Jim's comments (overall he's one of my favorite contributors, even if I strongly disagree with him). I'm simply using his comment as a recent example of the kind of thing the guys that inspired the "WGDF" talk about as being a dual standard. The point of such movements is pretty much that yes, crap like that has been aimed at minorities, and it's wrong. It's STILL wrong when directed at whites, "payback" in the guise of social justice (which I don't think was Jim's intent) doesn't excuse it or make it right, and what's more it's become incredibly casual to the point where a lot of people don't even think about it and realize the issue. There are other ways someone could express similar thoughts. For example if I was a professional quality writer and I had Jim's platform, despite not being politically correct, if I wanted to make the same point, I might have commented somewhere that some of the supporting characters would have been more interesting protagonists than Aiden... which now that I think about it is something I agree with, as I figured a certain punk girl probably would have worked perfectly for what is fundamentally a cyberpunk "out of control computer technology" story.
Well this wasn't poking fun at a group of fans of fictional material. This was more of a socio-political statement aimed at a large group of people who happen to oppose a specific agenda. Making fun of Trekkies is one thing for example, heck Trekkies make fun of themselves. Ditto for Anime fans, heck years ago there was even a part live action, part anime series called "Otaku No Video" that was basically a bunch of Japanese nerds making fun of their entire subculture. MLP fans and Evangelion fans are a little different than say making attack on a major political party (Democrats OR Republicans) especially in a nation polarized pretty much 50-50 along party lines. While this wasn't attacking a political party, it was pretty much about extreme liberals attacking those who oppose them (many of whomerttheking said:
are technically liberals themselves). Rather mean spirited nerd on nerd mockery conveyed as a comic strip.... and
again, part of the whole reason I've commented like I have is the sheer number of bans, and the responses this thread got to the sequel. Make fun of say Bronies and you might get one or two in the thread tops (though there are going to
be exceptions). WGDF was a bloodbath and went into territory that's hard to really find other analogies for. The point was that this was a mean spirited joke specifically for a group of people, at the expense of another, and one where the target wasn't exactly laughing cleverly at themselves. The first one was perhaps excusable, but a sequel know what happened? I think that's pushing the limits especially when the policies that lead to those initial bans are still in force (which is why we got so many posts about the impending bloodbath, though we've seen little serious action because thankfully not many are taking the bait this time).
I am extraordinarily confused as to why you bothered to type out 'slash' rather than just using the symbol. I don't really have anything else to say.erttheking said:
OT:
I eagerly await the antics of the WGDF. There's only one possible outcome, and that's hilarity. Now the form of that hilarity remains to be seen. I imagine something along the lines of good comic --> shitstorm --> banhammer --> hilarity or bad comic --> shitstorm about the bad quality and lack of shitstorm --> banhammer --> hilarity.
Bring it on guys, the forums are chomping at the bit for the next piece of flamebait.
[exaggeration]RatherDull said:
[Theatrical Reenactment of Above Comments]
Cory and Grey: [satire]lol beta fat white guy bronies lol they are all beta males also fedoras and U MIRIN BBY?[/satire]
RatherDull: [Stands up in front of crowd of bronies] Please! Even if it is satire, the mockery of bronies in that last comic was just going too far. Already they are hated on by much of the internet just because they like ponies, I cannot let an affront to these people stand! How dare you hurt their feelings!
Pinkamena: [a brony among the crowd stands up] Um...It's fine...we don't really care? That was only satire, and most of us are rather mature, we know how to laugh at ourselves-
RatherDull: [turns around] WOW OK JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE MATURE ENOUGH TO LAUGH AT YOURSELF DOESN'T MEAN YOU ALL ARE, SHUT UP AND HAVE HURT FEELINGS GODDAMNIT!!!!
[/exaggeration]
Honestly, dude. You might notice that most of us aren't five years old and cry whenever somebody makes fun of us or something we like. Sure, we have those fans, but who doesn't? So while it's certainly nice that you don't like that the internet dislikes us, it would also be nice if you didn't assume that we, as a whole, were so sensitive that we needed defending in the first place.
OT: With even more recent controversial events to work with, I fully expect this WGDF to be a masterpiece of satirical flaming, one that makes the previous WGDF look like an equality movement in comparison. I wait, Cory and Gray.
For all those people arguing about the Trayvon Martin case- you wanna know what the best part about it is? It's so fucking easy to paint the victim as the killer. After all, this case couldn't have been any easier for Zimmermans defense if they tried. The best victims are the dead ones. Because they are the only ones that can give you the other half of the story. Especially when nobody else was around to see it. Because now all you have left is the word of the perpetrator and and a phone call that only went up to the cops saying to leave the Trayvon be.
You can argue theories and hypothetics all you want. At the end of the day someone was told to stay in the car. That someone didn't stay in the car. Now one person is dead, and the very person who disobeyed cop orders is absolved of all charges. Didn't even get a charge for order disobedience.
You can argue theories and hypothetics all you want. At the end of the day someone was told to stay in the car. That someone didn't stay in the car. Now one person is dead, and the very person who disobeyed cop orders is absolved of all charges. Didn't even get a charge for order disobedience.
That's actually incorrect as well, he was asked by the operator where the person went, he left the car to find out, and while pursuing was asked if he was running after them, then told "we don't need you to do that", which is more of a "don't put yourself in harms way, we'll send cops" message than a "stop now".Dragonbums said:
Heck this misinformation you're going by has been factually rebutted earlier in this thread as well.
madwarper said:
What the operators asked did not require Zimmerman to get out of the car. At all. Trayvon doesn't know he's calling the cops. For all he knows he could've been calling his gang buddies. Anything goes when your being fucking stalked in the middle of the night.Cerebrawl said:
However my point still stands though.
The best victims are dead ones. Because while they rot in a grave we can make up all sorts of colorful scenarios about how it went down after the call and in turn easily paint the stalked the perpetrator.
this is true, however I've yet to see anyone respond to that kind of thoughts with "better sit on this guy and start beating him to death". Zimmerman was probably following the kid in a stalking like manner, and was taking his neighborhood watch to social justice warrior levels (above 9000 in particular), and he should've probably gotten time, I won't disagree with that.Dragonbums said:
this point goes both ways though, it's your ace in the hole because at this point no one can prove anything beyond what we know before and after the situation, and you're taking the route of making martin a huge victim in all this and making it black and white.
To warn us. Why else? Why does anyone ever do a "coming soon" poster?Sseth said:
Some users have been spreading the word. I've seen Friday's strip on Reddit already, and I heard someone else say that it was on 4chan. There's gonna be a reckoning, and I appreciate the warning.
