What do you think separates humans from other animals?

[koether]

An exceptionally well developed frontal lobe

 

[Wushu Panda]

Why am i better than an animal? Different?

Me specifically? Because i have planted, roughly 20 years ago, 15 Apple trees together with my brother and my dad in my grandfather size able garden. There are still 13 of em around today (2 had to b removed) and they have grown quite a lot. Enough actually to supply my gramps and the local long finger children with free apples. And the apples that aren't used are helping re-fertilize the ground.

My trees work for the good of the planet. What does that fucktard gorilla up in the mountains ever do to save the planet? jack shit, that is.

When i get my hands on my own piece of land i'll plant more apple trees.

Heck, perhaps one of those apples has helped create (helped by being delicious, healthy apples) another human being, someone who has or will at some point do something great.
Like cure alzheimers. Or cancer. Ore develop a surefire way to murder doom rocks incoming from the sky.
Perhaps the appletrees i plant later will save some child from getting sick (by being delicious, healthy apples) and said child will grow to be a amazing person that helps enlighten our species as whole. who knows.

I helped prepared the ground for those trees. I watered them (at least those years i was still living in the old big family home). Helped pruning whenever i could and harvest fruit (and as had to learn: thats a freaking important thing to do until the branches have grown strong enough to carry more weight.).
These trees will remains there until the ground under them withers, people take them out or naturals causes do them in. And thats probably a good 20 years or more away. (and then we will planet new ones, if we still can)


Many animals have pretty darn useful roles. Just think insects. Others only seem to exist to allow others to do their job and then there are those who generally do the cleanup.

But while all that i well and good, none of these species chose to do what they did. they developed into doing it.

A simple earthworm is amazing when it comes to keep ground good but it wont decide to one day build a asteroid smashing device.
Humans will. Perhaps a human who ate apples from my tree.

Or from the trees of others.
Again, never seen one of them coveted endangered species do anything useful but, you know DIE and be food for more useful people/animals.


Yes humankind makes mistakes, but face it, we are the one with the best chances to keep this planet non-nuked-from-space. And its up to us to fix our mistakes, and as such it would be pretty useful if we would not be interrupted by people telling us that animals are equals. they are not. if our getting ahead means they must go, then so be it.
Most vital eco system related things are run by insects and the microcosm anyway.

Tell me, did you invent the apple tree? Were there in fact no apple trees in existence before you decided to plant some? Did you go tree to tree pollinating as to make sure apples did in fact grow?

Answer Key- No you didn't. Plenty existed. You don't even know how to pollinate, do you?

You and countless other animals before you dropped seeds somewhere and a tree popped up. You didn't do anything special or particularly unique. Besides, I'm sure, the Human obsessive disorder of planting them in a row.

This wasn't human ingenuity. It was Nature and humans, in their own way, acting just like any other animal. For millions of years apple trees sprouted, grew. Animals carried seeds around the earth spreading apple tree growth.

I like apples, and I like that you did this with your family. I only wish to point out how this is no different behavior from any other animal before you. Minus the obsessive compulsive disorder.

But while all that i well and good, none of these species chose to do what they did. they developed into doing it.

That's what Nature is, developing into it. You said only 13 out of 15 trees remain. For whatever reason they "had to b removed". Did you personally choose for those trees to be removed? Did you choose to randomly discard them? Or did they develop poorly and removed due to sickness? You can decide where to plant trees, but that's as far as human intervention goes. Even with your planning and preparation, you still lost trees. Your control over the matter isn't real. In the end, you're just another animal in the grand scheme.

As for those animals that you know, DIE. Without them to die, you wouldn't be around. It might be a terrible job, but without them you wouldn't have a garden. If it weren't for the non-human animals before you that spread apples across the Earth for millions of years, you wouldn't even have the seeds to plant within your garden, would you?

How would you define useful? According to what you've said. Being useful is performing a task 20 years ago once. That was performed COUNTLESS times for HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF YEARS before your grandparents had even been conceived.

we are the one with the best chances to keep this planet non-nuked-from-space

Exactly why are we the best chance? What do you think would have been the odds of the Earth being at risk of getting nuked from space if humans had not placed the nukes there in the first place? Since you don't think animals could ever do this, I assume the odds would be zero. Because no other animal on earth is stupid enough to destroy their own species and habitat for the next several million plus years.

Let me tell you of another apple orchard someone planted roughly 50 years ago. Near my college campus there exists a large chunk of land designated as "Nature area". This is so because when that orchard operated they decided to use arsenic-based pesticides. Now, what does that tell you about Humans and how great they are? My class took samples of soil from all over the land, both in and outside the bounds of the orchard from our maps. We analyzed those samples in the lab to figure out the composition of elements. Arsenic being an element, would show up. 50 Years later we found somewhat dangerous levels of poisoning still within the soil. Not even to affect someone if they simply walked over the area. But dangerous enough they should wash their hands should they for some reason scoop up dirt.

What separates us from other animals? We poison our environment, so even other humans cannot inhabit the area. What happens when we run out of fresh land? Human extinction. Just over 200 years humans have been accelerating their growth, and in just over 200 years we have been able to damage the Earth in more harmful and long lasting ways than ANY OTHER animal before us in the billions of years the Earth has been around.

 

[Da Orky Man]

People spend a lot of time getting degrees in philosophy so they can use words in a pointless argument with others, while animals spend their time eating, fucking, and fighting.

Sounds like Valhalla. The Norse afterlife always was one of the best.

 

[chstens]

I don't want to say "soul" because I don't think everyone believes in one, but, personally, that is one to me.

I'm going to have to go with the ability to stray from instinct and making certain decisions based on critical thinking.

Out of curiosity, what is a soul, and why don't animals have one?

 

[killercyclist]

ipods......... yeah, there's really nothing that separates us from animals, they know how to use tools, they have war, murder, understanding, laughter. we are all pretty well the same.

 

[Mau95]

We kill each other and other species for fun and giggles. Other species don't.

Yes they do: cats kill mice, play with the body and then leave it to rot. Another example: wolves. Do you know why wolves are hated and feared by sheperds? Wolves, when they hunt sheep, don't just kill one or two (just enough to eat) but as far as 20 or 30. Why? cause there's so many that they can't stop and don't care if one is enough.

And dolphins. They play with fish and squid before eating them.

 

[Mau95]

Why am i better than an animal? Different?

we are the one with the best chances to keep this planet non-nuked-from-space

Exactly why are we the best chance? What do you think would have been the odds of the Earth being at risk of getting nuked from space if humans had not placed the nukes there in the first place? Since you don't think animals could ever do this, I assume the odds would be zero. Because no other animal on earth is stupid enough to destroy their own species and habitat for the next several million plus years.

I think he means against aliens.

 

[Mau95]

Our ridiculously long time to mature.

 

[Yopaz]

This is crap, animals such as dogs and elephants have painted pictures which have sold for tens of thousands of dollars.

Want to know why those paintings sold for so much?


They fetched those prices not because of artistic merit or vision, not because the author wanted to send a message, but solely because they weren't painted by machine or human. That's it. They paintings are fucking awful and, if painted by a person, would be spurned left right and center. But, because they were painted by animals, people spend thousands on them.


All your mention of these paintings proves is that some humans are just fuckin' stupid with their money.

So where does this leave human creativity?

find me a dog or elephant that has built a rocket capable of launching them into space, letting them visit another orbital body entirely, build their own goddamn orbital body, probe the stars and assert how everything works.


Go on. I'm waiting. Tell ya what, I'll widen the criteria to anything that isn't human. Find me another species that is capable of building a spacecraft capable of travelling to the moon, retreiving samples, leaving a flag and safely returning.



Can't do it? Thought so.


Humans are the only species creative enough to build such things. Animals do not posess the creativity to design such things. Nor do they really care. When an animal looks up in the night sky the most it will think is "Ooh, dark...don't see any predators...I'm horny, where's something to hump?", whereas mankind looked up at that same night sky and said "I wonder what's up there...".


Fact of the matter is mankind has been to space, mankind has walked on a body other than the Earth, mankind has built a home in space, while the best the animal kingdom can come up with is a beaver dam. Thus, mankind is infintiely more creative than nature, and on top of that posesses the drive to actually put that creativity to use.

Unlike humans who just destroy everything and fuck shit up, how do you call wasting natural resources and spilling toxins everywhere rational thought?

Have you seen what animals do to areas they frequent? You're naive as hell if you think they don't trash the environment too.

Now tell me what the fuck building a rocket has to do with crativity. Can you build a rocket? I know I can't.
Seriously you can find paintings made by animals that actually look like what they're supposed to look like. Colours being mixed from a very basic set to get new more fitting colours. Saying that animals can't be creative is really arrogant when looking at some of the art made by huimans. Remember a few months back when a cleaning lady thought one of the works were garbage? That's how good humans are. That is what we define as art.

 

[Wushu Panda]

Why am i better than an animal? Different?

we are the one with the best chances to keep this planet non-nuked-from-space

Exactly why are we the best chance? What do you think would have been the odds of the Earth being at risk of getting nuked from space if humans had not placed the nukes there in the first place? Since you don't think animals could ever do this, I assume the odds would be zero. Because no other animal on earth is stupid enough to destroy their own species and habitat for the next several million plus years.

I think he means against aliens.

This isn't an alien topic but ok. If aliens did appear in our orbit, and rained downed nukes from above...we would die. Humans dont have anything that could shoot nuclear missiles out of the sky. Even if they could, they would be detonating nuclear missiles in the sky. Its a lose/lose situation. We either get nuked dieing fast, or rain radioactive material upon us killing us slowly.

Here is a likely conversation:
Alien 1 "Oh look. We seem to have found a Class E planet."
Alien 2 "I LOVE CLASS E PLANETS! The inhabitants are so interesting and the scenery is so beautiful. Where do the scanners suggest a landing point?"
Alien 1 "No where. My scanners indicate massive amounts of radiation pockets in several locations and even more areas contaminated with a rainbow of toxins."
Alien 2 "What could have happened?"
Alien 1 "Scans show all the material isn't natural. Material level is indicative of artificial creation...they did this to themselves."
Alien 2 "What kind of terrible life forms would poison their own planet? Nuke it, they don't deserve to have interstellar travel and alien orgies."

 

[MammothBlade]

Humans... have written language and complex spoken language, use far more advanced tools and technologies than any other animals, and have a deeper understanding of reality than other animals. Humans... have free will. We are not bound so much by instinct as any other creatures. This affords us a deep insight into the nature of the world. Our technology and culture has developed to the point that we now call it "civilisation", we create our own rules within this civilisation, to the point that there are two worlds - that of wild animals, and that of humans and captive creatures - though the latter world is ever supplanting the former. A lot of the distinctions between humans and animals are the imagination of humans themselves; but there are still plenty of differences in the first place which caused animals to remain wild, and humans to build farms, villages, towns, and cities. Mankind bit the forbidden fruit of wisdom, and was thus cast out of the Garden of Eden. Yes, that biblical tale has some meaning.

 

[SyphonX]

Unnecessary, methodical cruelty.

Animals can be pretty cruel, but it's usually for a specific reason (battle, domination) or out of sheer animal curiosity (studying prey before you end it's life, to sate your pride, learn about it up close etc.).

Humans.. well, we're a bit different. We exterminate ourselves and other animals for ideologies or just because we can. We shit where we eat, destroy our environment when we don't have to, animals generally don't "shit where they eat" (aka live a filthy, unkempt life) unless their environment is cramped/collapsed and threatened (often because of humans).

So yea.... systematic abuse. That's the one variable, in my opinion.

 

[Zersy]

Boobs.

 

[Wushu Panda]

i'm not gonna dissect your post so ill answer in shorts:

- the trees got removed to make room for various herbs to be grown (and make the setup visually more appealing).
- yes, apples are around for a long time, but no animal grows them like we do, in as efficiently. Animals also did not crossbreed them to create BETTER(tm) ones. In fact animals did nothing of that intentionally which is what i was getting at. Humans do these things with a plan, intentionally and with efficiency (most of the time anyway).
We are GOOD at this because we aren't stupid animals. We are DIFFERENT. (oh and yes, humans did "invent" better ones by crossbreeding and will continue to do so as our prowess in genetic manipulation increases). Again this makes us DIFFERENT and that was the point of this thread and this post.

- As for nuked from space: large asteroid hitting the earth = nuked from space. Nuking the planet does indeed not prerequisite an actual nuclear device being involved.

Finally you offer a decent argument as to how humans differ from animals. Humans cross breed plants for better food purposes. The big example I know of from studying Archaeology is the Teosinte plant. Early peoples of the Americas bred Teosinte to have more and more kernels, which eventually evolved into the modern corn stalks we know today.

However, nuking DOES imply a nuclear device being involved.

nuke- noun, adjective, verb, nuked, nuk·ing. Informal.
1. a nuclear or thermonuclear weapon.
2. a nuclear power plant or nuclear reactor.
3. nuclear energy: to convert from coal to nuke.
4. of or pertaining to a nuclear or thermonuclear weapon or to a nuclear plant.
5. to attack, defeat, or destroy with or as if with nuclear weapons.
6. Slang . to cook or bake in a microwave oven.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

Please, everyone in this thread, learn your words before making pseudo-intellectual, arrogant, condescending posts.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sentient
Pretty much all animals are sentient.

 

[GrungyMunchy]

You too. There is no such thing as "ABDUCTIVE REASONING", mostly because "abductive" is not a word. Perhaps you meant "deductive" reasoning?

No, I meant abductive reasoning, look it up. Deductive reasoning is to extrapolate from previous experiences, that's exactly what i DIDN'T mean.

Using a stick you pick up off the ground to complete a task is called an implement. Many animals have demonstrated the ability to use implements, and is in fact the first step into creating tools. It took humans tens of thousands of years of playing with rocks to doing anything else. So why don't you stop acting like you're brilliant when I'm willing to bet you wouldn't even be able to make your own stone tools, should all contemporary technology be rendered inoperable.

That's funny because I actually can sculpt things. Way to throw away a chance to be quiet.

Also, animals do in fact have hierarchy. Same as humans. A leader is always elected for the group. In other animals it tends to be an Alpha Male, one that has in someway shown itself as the most able to lead others. You still see this in humans. Bullies in schoolyards, leaders of gangs, kings, and even politics. Why do you think its referred to as a "political race". Each candidate is competing for the leadership of the group.

Way to miss the point. I specifically said "the ability to CHANGE their hierarchic structure", which is the difference between instinct and choice. Don't pick and choose words from me and twist what I said.

Ask for "asking themselves why". Why not share with us some of your philosophical thoughts on the workings of the universe? And explain just how you're so sure that other animals have in deed not been able to think. Have you personally watched every second of animal behavior on Earth? How do you know other animals haven't thought "why" and then answered to themselves "ignorance is bliss. perhaps I will live harmoniously with nature in health instead of poisoning my environment with waste and by-products."

A bit exaggerated, yes. But still, you have no proof that indicates one way or another that some other species of animal have not had moments of self-awareness. Do you label non-sociable children as not showing signs of self-awareness? No, you label them self-aware simply because they're human. Just as you label other animals not self-aware because they are NOT human.

The burden of proof is on you, you idiot. Can you actually prove that animals can show signs of self-awareness and reasoning? Because researchers haven't find any that's not pre-programmed behaviour.

I really don't care if you're bitter with humanity or something, that's your problem. To deny that people are actually a level above animals due to, you know, DOMINATING the earth and MONOPOLIZING everything, is something that only the most rabid, irrational PETA-drones are capable of doing.

 

[AngloDoom]

I'm pretty much going for language and the whole 'asking why' thing.

Humans at some point started asking 'why does this do this?', figured it out, and when their kids asked 'why does this do this?' too, there was an answer. That child had no need to spend its life looking for the answers to that question; it had already been done for it. Instead, it moved onto the next question, which is answered, and then passed on to it's own child.

Not that I've got pockets full of science to back me up on this, but I think that's pretty much how my niece can access and browse the pictures in anyone's iPad at age two and I could barely put my own clothes on without a mental breakdown.

 

[Kron_the_mad wants to be deleted]

i think it's probably the delusions of grandure and the assumed self entitlement just because of our species.... although cats also share this trait with us, they're not animals though just haughty bastards.

 

[Filiecs]

Free will. To an animal, instinct overrides any form of thought that they might have. They are slaves to natural selectiion and their only purpose in life is to reproduce.
In humans, we don't need to follow our instincts and, as such, don't need to reproduce to have a purpose in life. Instead, we can be creative and achieve our dreams.

This is also why animals don't have natural rights but humans do.

 

[Caverat]

I find it irritating when people discuss animals, the differences/similarities of humans/animals, and morality. Morality is an entirely human concept, it applies solely to humans, or other sentience. When there is proof of animals being capable of the same kind of reasoning as humans, or they begin taking part in philosophical debates like this, I'll acknowledge another species as sentient. Until there is such evidence, I will not. Humans are the only sentient life that we know of in reality.

That makes us special(beyond the simple sense-making of wishing to preserve/promote one's own species), and while it is a shame when any species goes extinct, or any organism experiences pain, if it benefits humanity it is for the best.

We need to eat, so we have subjugated several species, both plant and animal, for the purpose of consumption. This is progress. It's nice to say all life is equal, naive, but nice.

Cats and dogs will eat the corpses of their owners 10 times out of 10 should the owner die, and they have no food source easier to access. Living things have to eat living things to survive, a plant is no less alive than an animal, it just isn't cute, or capable of screaming when in pain. Hence I always find it confusing when vegetarians cite moral reasons for not eating animals, yet still be all over eating other living organisms. But of course, everything needs to eat, it'd be silly (and suicidal) to promote a lifestyle of not eating anything. Again, it just annoys me when people are so blatantly inconsistent/hypocritical, and don a cloak of morality to cover their stench of smugness. And being a complete twat. Don't like the idea of eating an organism that can express pain, fine, it's a personal dietary choice, morality doesn't need enter it.

Humans and every predator with a mammalian brain hunt for sport, kill for pleasure. Chimps have even been documented killing a social rival to gain status in the group. Granted, they are closer to humans than most animals, but it is seen in many other genus. (Species of Canine, Feline.)

I agree that every trait humans possess can be seen in other organisms, this is to be expected as every subject for study has evolved on the same planet, even if in a slightly different environment.

Humans are the first among all others.

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