What happened to the Escapist?

remnant_phoenix

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So here's my story...

Like so many others, I first came here for Zero Punctuation. For me, it was late 2010. It didn't take long for me to discover other great content: Extra Credits, Escape to the Movies, The Big Picture...

And then, not long after I stopped lurking, Russ Pitts left, which was weird, but I was still newish to the site so I figured, "Hey, these things happen." Then, the Extra Credits controversy went down; that was when I first started to lose a little faith in the people in charge, but I conceded that I don't know much about the business world and it was probably more complicated than I knew, so I let it go. Under Susan Arent's tenure was the window of time in which Jim really hit his stride and the Jimquisition soon became my favorite weekly show, I started listening to the Escapist podcast, the first Escapist Expo was organized, it was just a great time all-around for content and community. I had at least one show to look forward to every weekday and the Escapist just felt like a great place to be.

Then Susan left after...what...a year in the position? The podcast was never same after that, but things stayed pretty well all-around. Then Anita Sarkesian and then later GG happened to the forums. Then the turnover was even faster for Greg Tito. Then Jim and now Moviebob leave within months of one another, taking their presence and continued content with them.

I'll still come here for Zero Punctuation--mostly out of habit, though I do genuinely enjoy it most of the time--and I'll still poke around on the forums--though I don't read/post nearly as much as I used to--but I can't shake this growing feeling:

When I started frequenting The Escapist, it felt...warm. It felt like a personable place. Now? As each of these unceremonious departures followed by a remainder of people who just keep going and pretend like nothing of note happened...the Escapist is a colder place to be. It once had this wonderful energy about it, like the community was something more than the sum of its members and contributors. Now it seems like the cold machine that technically is: a collection of computers and a web site for people to use as an inherently lifeless tool, nothing more.

What's your take on the trends at hand? And/or what's your abridged Escapist story?
 

BreakfastMan

Scandinavian Jawbreaker
Jul 22, 2010
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Some people might point to GG as the cause, but I don't think it is (though it certainly wasn't good for the forum community, holy hell). No, the real problems started when the Escapist got bought by Alloy Digital (which later became Defy Media). If you want to know when things started down the slope, that was it. Things weren't bad in the beginning, it was even pretty good for a while, but eventually the corporate overlords started instituting changes, and, well... Yeah.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
15
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content produers come and go all the time...its the normal flux of things

the recent mass exodus however...is clearly related to something
 

shrekfan246

Not actually a Japanese pop star
May 26, 2011
6,374
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The scorched wasteland is a pale reminder of times long past; hollow, blasted pits are all that remain of the places we once called "home". The war changed everything. Splinter groups of "SJWs" were known to be hiding here, and the People's Militia of Reddit aligned themselves with the anarchic 4channers in an earnest attempt to salt the earth. To bring about a new beginning through reckoning. We fought, some would say bravely, as we tried to defend the honor of our home.

We lost.

Now, with our leaders fallen and removed from power, most of us have been driven into hiding. We fear the retribution that will be brought down upon us if we dare show our faces again. Cowed into silence, most of us wish only to be allowed to eke out our meager existences. A few speak up here and there, but inevitably they are beaten down by the Moderators, those beleaguered law-keepers who restlessly preside over this forsaken stretch of virtual space. Still the war rages along the outskirts, with more casualties every day. The central hub has been allowed a respite, but the fighting merely gave way to rioting. The chaos is even taxing to the Moderators themselves as it seems they are no longer the final word of law in these parts. Judge, jury, and executioner have been superseded by a power even they fear, a corporation which holds their reigns tightly.

As we kneel before our posters of Anita Sarkeesian each night, praying for the strength to get through tomorrow, we will forever know this purge as "GamerGate".
 

Sniper Team 4

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Apr 28, 2010
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I can agree with that. The feeling of fun has certainly fallen lately. I have my own beliefs as to why that is, but yeah, it does seem like the forums are not as fun as they used to be. More and more I see, "I'm complaining about (insert topic here) because of (selfish reason here)" and less, "Hey, what are your thoughts on this?"
 

IceForce

Is this memes?
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Dec 11, 2012
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BreakfastMan said:
No, the real problems started when the Escapist got bought by Alloy Digital (which later became Defy Media). If you want to know when things started down the slope, that was it. Things weren't bad in the beginning, it was even pretty good for a while, but eventually the corporate overlords started instituting changes, and, well... Yeah.
You know what the funniest thing is? The site management at the time swore up and down that nothing would change.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/jump/18.393948.15941537
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/jump/18.393948.15940948

Oh how wrong they were.
 

Johnny Novgorod

Bebop Man
Legacy
Feb 9, 2012
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I came for Yahtzee and for Yahtzee I'm staying. In my early Escapist days I kept confusing his personal site - Fully Ramblomatic, nowadays a "biannually updated blog" - with this place. It's always been The Yahtzee Show to me. I never understood the reverie surrounding Jim or Bob (especially considering Bob's tackiness and lack of professionalism). I'm surprised they're gone because it goes against habit, and I wonder how does this benefit the staff seeing as how they were responsible for a lot of the site's traffic. But I don't lament their departure, and if it means getting better content producers (because they're gonna get someone, right?), I celebrate it.
 

Colour Scientist

Troll the Respawn, Jeremy!
Jul 15, 2009
4,722
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IceForce said:
BreakfastMan said:
No, the real problems started when the Escapist got bought by Alloy Digital (which later became Defy Media). If you want to know when things started down the slope, that was it. Things weren't bad in the beginning, it was even pretty good for a while, but eventually the corporate overlords started instituting changes, and, well... Yeah.
You know what the funniest thing is? The site management at the time swore up and down that nothing would change.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/jump/18.393948.15941537
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/jump/18.393948.15940948

Oh how wrong they were.
Everyone was so happy and blissfully unaware
of what was to come in that thread.

I envy them.
 

Redlin5_v1legacy

Better Red than Dead
Aug 5, 2009
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Been on the site every Wednesday since Yahtzee jumped from Youtube to here. Made my account two years later, and then I posted a bunch in forum games in 2010-2011. I've seen the content and the staff shift and I know that things could have been done better throughout the years but I don't regret choosing this site as the one to stick to. It's going to take a LOT more shakeups in the site's management for me to start saying "END TIMES ARE HERE!". Don't feel like going on an old fart rant right now but I do have to say I miss the old probation system. People actually got embarrassed by getting wrathed back then.

Oh well.

This place has my patronage and the people in charge have my sympathies for all the hostile messages they get. Like I said, I think The Escapist will pull through just fine unless they start getting rid of more pillars of the community.

Like if we lost Kross.

WHO WOULD WE BLAME THEN?
[sub][sub]plz give Kross a raise[/sub][/sub]
 

Redlin5_v1legacy

Better Red than Dead
Aug 5, 2009
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TopazFusion said:
Redlin5 said:
I do have to say I miss the old probation system. People actually got embarrassed by getting wrathed back then.
Really? That's interesting. Because nowadays, most of the time, people just don't seem to give much of a shit.
Those were also the days where "Getting your Neo" was a huge accomplishment. Moderation was considered much more harsh, there were few warnings if any before getting a probation and very few people had over 10K posts.

Obviously a lot has changed that way. I'm sure nobody cares about that badge now. XD

*still keeps it shiny on his profile*

<.<
 

Sleepy Sol

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Feb 15, 2011
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I'd say a combination of management issues and a continued festering of hostility created from...that thread. Aye.

I don't want the site to go down but they're going to have to pull out a miracle in terms of any new content to keep people coming back. I love the new CM, but I don't think he can just keep putting out the galleries without some different content supporting him consistently, unless we want to bleed more people from the site. I appreciate his efforts to communicate with us, and he seems like a swell fella, but continuing to take the low-hanging fruit with the galleries without more substantial content available as well just feels like a recipe for eventual disaster (for some, already a huge disaster).

That said, I'm still going to keep coming back to the forums. Regardless of any hostility generated in the recent months, I'd like to contribute to keeping this place active.
 

BathorysGraveland2

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Feb 9, 2013
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TopazFusion said:
Really? That's interesting. Because nowadays, most of the time, people just don't seem to give much of a shit.
Why are you surprised? Since you have a generous 8 strikes rule, it's hard to really get all that bothered by one or two warnings. If you had the more typical 3 strikes rule, then it'd be a much more significant situation to receive some mod wrath. But as it is? It's a minor problem. Hell I've seen people outright break the rules while adding a message along the lines of "I know I'll receive mod wrath, but I have a full health bar, so I'll take the hit" etc.

People say the mods here are harsh. I say they're the most generous, soft moderators with the most lenient rules on the net.
 

Serinanth

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Apr 29, 2009
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TopazFusion said:
Redlin5 said:
I'm sure nobody cares about that badge now. XD
I think you're probably right.

Neo is fairly easy to get now, and not to mention there are other far more rare and sought-after badges than that one.
Like the red button right?
 

Josh123914

They'll fix it by "Monday"
Nov 17, 2009
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Well ever since Gamergate started advertisers have been in a bit of a pickle.
Gaming websites targetted at gamers suddenly were blasting their own demographic, with thousands within that demographic e-mailing said companies NOT to support said sites.
In a climate like that, websites will take whatever ad revenue they can get, which usually means less money. Now, this wouldn't just affect Polygon, Kotaku and Gamasutra, no. With a few big guns going cheap, and no guarantee other sites wouldn't start posting the same economically suicidal stuff it drives the entire market of game site ad revenue down.

Defy Media..... is a whole other story upon itself, but suffice to say they are willing to cut the fat when need be. If the Escapist wasn't breaking even before the "restructuring", then it is now (or at the very least preparing for worse ad deals). Some of IGN's crew leaving last month was no coincidence. I'm predicting that bigger sites are preparing for a cold snap of bad ad revenue, with other sites not (presumably hoping to wait it out), but those like The Escapist and IGN letting people go before things get too bad.

So I think this is what's happened to the Escapist. Basically, the "Gamers are Dead" articles set off a lot of e-mail campaigns and boycotts, which baffled a lot of advertisers, who either pulled out or demanded they pay less for ad space.
This left many sites with less revenue (despite whether or not your site has been the one publishing them) and so gaming sites with ambivalent owners deciding they should save money and fire people now rather than wait for things to get worse.

How's that? Can someone with a degree in Economics or Finance let me know if I'm in the ballpark here?
 

VanQ

Casual Plebeian
Oct 23, 2009
2,729
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TopazFusion said:
Redlin5 said:
I do have to say I miss the old probation system. People actually got embarrassed by getting wrathed back then.
Really? That's interesting. Because nowadays, most of the time, people just don't seem to give much of a shit.
Pretty much. Anyone here for more than a few months knows exactly how to evade the banhammer. So you can be entirely certain that the majority of people with any strikes on their health meter weighed up whether calling that one poster a dildo or not was worth the warning and decided that it was.
 

Hoplon

Jabbering Fool
Mar 31, 2010
1,840
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Josh123914 said:
Well ever since Gamergate started advertisers have been in a bit of a pickle.
Gaming websites targetted at gamers suddenly were blasting their own demographic, with thousands within that demographic e-mailing said companies NOT to support said sites.
In a climate like that, websites will take whatever ad revenue they can get, which usually means less money. Now, this wouldn't just affect Polygon, Kotaku and Gamasutra, no. With a few big guns going cheap, and no guarantee other sites wouldn't start posting the same economically suicidal stuff it drives the entire market of game site ad revenue down.

Defy Media..... is a whole other story upon itself, but suffice to say they are willing to cut the fat when need be. If the Escapist wasn't breaking even before the "restructuring", then it is now (or at the very least preparing for worse ad deals). Some of IGN's crew leaving last month was no coincidence. I'm predicting that bigger sites are preparing for a cold snap of bad ad revenue, with other sites not (presumably hoping to wait it out), but those like The Escapist and IGN letting people go before things get too bad.

So I think this is what's happened to the Escapist. Basically, the "Gamers are Dead" articles set off a lot of e-mail campaigns and boycotts, which baffled a lot of advertisers, who either pulled out or demanded they pay less for ad space.
This left many sites with less revenue (despite whether or not your site has been the one publishing them) and so gaming sites with ambivalent owners deciding they should save money and fire people now rather than wait for things to get worse.

How's that? Can someone with a degree in Economics or Finance let me know if I'm in the ballpark here?
Conjecture, conjecture everywhere! not even informed conjecture. the escapist has been going though an EiC per year for at least the last 4 years, nothing to do with GG. Ad revenue for gaming sites again has been falling for longer than GG has existed. it's been falling for pretty much all web sites for years, mostly not because of less views but less and less per view. On top of that the ads have started to be filtered by people fed up with the constant spam and sites don't get any income from such people.
 

Guffe

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Jul 12, 2009
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I still log on almost on a daily basis, check the two user groups I'm part of and if there's some interesting thread going on. I don't usually jump into the "big" things going on since I mainly just see people ragin at each other throwing the same arguments back and forth, not having the slightest interesting in trying to understand the other side of things. And I mean understand, you don't need to accept another persons views on things, but at least try to understand someone might have a different opinion from yours, it won't be the end of the world -.-

So the forums aren't that "toxicated" for me, mainly because I choose what topics I check out. The reason for some people to feel the Escapist has become more hostile? Simple, we got people like Yahtzee, MovieBob, Jim, ExtraCredit and other good shows about what's going on in the gaming world. That could be one reason this site pulled in a lot of new users in maybe 2012/2013? So that means more people, which means more opinions, which on the internet usually ends in stupid arguments.

But I still visit, I still enjoy myself, I post a little now and then and of course the few users who are regulars in the two usergroups. I get a little gaming and movienews which I don't really get elsewere. So I am still staying, not sure if anyone gives a damn, but I will be around :D
 

BathorysGraveland2

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Feb 9, 2013
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TopazFusion said:
Yep, and I mean, if someone actually gets banned on this site, they must have really been working hard at achieving it since this site's rules are so forgiving. You literally have to fuck up 8 times to be banned. Now, with all the hostility and battlefield mentality in that GamerGate thread, I wouldn't be susprised if bands were given our galore, but on the average Escapist thread? It kinda baffles me.
 

Josh123914

They'll fix it by "Monday"
Nov 17, 2009
2,048
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Hoplon said:
Josh123914 said:
Well ever since Gamergate started advertisers have been in a bit of a pickle.
Gaming websites targetted at gamers suddenly were blasting their own demographic, with thousands within that demographic e-mailing said companies NOT to support said sites.
In a climate like that, websites will take whatever ad revenue they can get, which usually means less money. Now, this wouldn't just affect Polygon, Kotaku and Gamasutra, no. With a few big guns going cheap, and no guarantee other sites wouldn't start posting the same economically suicidal stuff it drives the entire market of game site ad revenue down.

Defy Media..... is a whole other story upon itself, but suffice to say they are willing to cut the fat when need be. If the Escapist wasn't breaking even before the "restructuring", then it is now (or at the very least preparing for worse ad deals). Some of IGN's crew leaving last month was no coincidence. I'm predicting that bigger sites are preparing for a cold snap of bad ad revenue, with other sites not (presumably hoping to wait it out), but those like The Escapist and IGN letting people go before things get too bad.

So I think this is what's happened to the Escapist. Basically, the "Gamers are Dead" articles set off a lot of e-mail campaigns and boycotts, which baffled a lot of advertisers, who either pulled out or demanded they pay less for ad space.
This left many sites with less revenue (despite whether or not your site has been the one publishing them) and so gaming sites with ambivalent owners deciding they should save money and fire people now rather than wait for things to get worse.

How's that? Can someone with a degree in Economics or Finance let me know if I'm in the ballpark here?
Conjecture, conjecture everywhere! not even informed conjecture. the escapist has been going though an EiC per year for at least the last 4 years, nothing to do with GG. Ad revenue for gaming sites again has been falling for longer than GG has existed. it's been falling for pretty much all web sites for years, mostly not because of less views but less and less per view. On top of that the ads have started to be filtered by people fed up with the constant spam and sites don't get any income from such people.
Figured GG was a catalyst of some sort given the..... questionable put out by major sites.

And do you have any links for that thing about declining revenue?
I'm not accusing, it actually sounds quite interesting.