What Has Nintendo Done Right Lately?

[Riverwolf]

I think he means in terms of software stability. In that way, they're very much superior to pretty much everyone else (one game-breaking bug in two games is hardly equal to the dozens of game-breaking bugs in other high-profile games).

But again, that's so broad as to be meaningless. Most major games are released without game-breaking bugs. If you are to offer examples like SimCity and Battlefield, those are the minority and should not be portrayed as the norm.

Most non-Nintendo games I've played have all been far more generally glitchy than recent Nintendo games I've played.

So if that's the mark of quality.,

For the software, not for the game. Nintendoland seems quite like a solid piece of software that holds absolutely NO interest for me.

it brings me back to the question I've been beating around: so what? If it's something so easily achieved, it no longer has any beneficial meaning. So while I'll concede I can't name a Nintendo-published title in the last decade or so that's as broken as SimCity was, I have to ask, so what? Aside from Steam's marketplace, I'm hard pressed to name five games like that, period.

I've heard that SimCity was particularly bad with game-breaking bugs (didn't play it myself; no money from me will they get), but most games in general I've played have had small bugs that broke the experience for me, even if not the game, except for Nintendo games. Game-breaking bugs aren't the only kind, and when talking overall software stability, Nintendo has generally been superior to everyone else, as aside from those few game-breaking bugs, I can't think of any bugs at all in recent Nintendo games I've played beyond a few instances of clipping.. Though, again, that's not a statement on the quality of the games themselves, which has been pretty lacking on Nintendo's part compared to other companies (though I hear Super Mario 3D World... or was it Land...? ... wow, Yahtzee was right, that IS confusing. SUPER MARIO CATS was pretty good). I'm just trying to clarify what he was trying to say.

...and I don't think "aside from Steam's marketplace" is much of an aside, since that encompasses over 2500 games from all generations(not counting add-ons, DLC, etc.), many of which are also found on both the 360 and PS3.

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

The last console I bought from Nintendo (excluding my DS, not a 3DS) was The Gamecube. I am only considering a Wii U because Bayonetta 2 is an exclusive, for some reason. None of the constant Mario/Zelda rehashes hold interest for me, I have never really liked those games to begin with. But that seems to be all the Wii U is offering in the way of games. So unless B2 is super-duper stellar, I fear I may be passing it over.

They need to be investing in new IPs and breaking new ground. If they keep trying to be Niche, they will go the way of Sega.

 

[Darmani]

I think what Nintendo really needs to do is open up to other developers rather then go software only (why do people even keep asking for that?).

Because they want the 1-4 games you must buy from Nintendo available and tuned to hte audience andmedia of pc gaming or other consoles.



I am REALLY disappointed in Yatzhee here. I know he gets flack from Nintendo fans but this go like SEGA is beyond ridiculous. I respect his opinion on base of creative writing, game design, and vision. Go third party lacks of that its an attempt to better the consumer who's not invested in Nintendo...because they are invested into something else.

 

[weirdee]

eh, while i understand the sentiment, it's sort of like saying, "well, nintendo's already at this point, if they go completely third party, what's the worst that could happen?"

that is generally not a great question to ask

right, sega?

 

[schmulki]

The N64 was immensely successful.

No, it wasn't. I loved the system at the time, but it got DESTROYED by the PS1. It was the start of the end of third parties really working with the big N. And that controller was built horribly (those thumbsticks were just make to break).

The GameCube is probably my favorite console of all time.

That's nice, doesn't make it more successful. It was wrecked by the PS2.

The Wii won last generation in sales.

It won in that it sold an absolutely ridiculous amount of systems. But then no one bought games. The attachment rate of games to that system was HORRID. It was still a huge win for them, but kept going in the same direction of 3rd parties not making games (other than shovelware) and didn't bode well for what came next....which is what I "think" I said before. There's no way to say they did anything but win last gen. But they didn't set themselves up well for the long run.

The WiiU had its problems because Nintendo told third party developers that they were gonna wait a year to release their flagship franchise games, so no real competition from Nintendo for a year on their own console. Few took them up on that. How is that Nintendo's fault, really?

Because of a history of the past 30 years of them effing over 3rd parties because, first they could, then they thought they could, then they could again, finally caught up to them?

 

[COMaestro]

Nintendo will not go third-party any time soon, if at all. Whether they should or not is another question. Right now, no, they probably should not. The WiiU is pretty much a failure at this point, and I personally don't believe that any games they have in the pipe is going to change that. Wouldn't care if I was proved wrong on that point though. Still, Nintendo needs to continue to support it as much as they can or they will totally eliminate any consumer confidence in their consoles.

I don't think anyone can honestly argue that their handheld division isn't doing wonderfully, though. It keeps getting exclusives (much to my dismay, as I would love some of their games to be ported to the Vita) and is pretty much printing money as quickly as the WiiU bleeds it.

I do not plan on picking up a WiiU this generation. I purchased a Wii and all it does is sit and collect dust. I feel like once my kids get older (a number of years from now as I have a 2 year old and a 2 month old) I'll break it out so they can play some Mario Kart, Brawl, NSMB and other titles. Meanwhile the only games that I really care to play on it are the Metroid Prime games. I might break it out now and then if I feel the urge to play Mario Kart or if a group of us wanted to play Mario Party, but Smash Bros. bored me quickly, as do fighting games in general, so that series just doesn't interest me anymore. I've also learned that the old school side scrolling platformers just don't really entertain me much anymore, which encompasses a lot of Nintendo's titles. I barely played NSMB, and I got Rayman Origins for free on my Vita and put it down after just one or two levels. I don't need a new system to play the same games again and again.

Stories are what get my attention for the most part when it comes to gaming now. Most of Nintendo's games just don't bother with a story short of "princess is kidnapped by bad guy, go rescue her". The Zelda games are better about this, and there is usually a charm to the characters in the games. Metroid Prime managed this as well with all the log entries, and the Paper Mario games are pretty good about it. Still I'm not going to buy a console for one or two games.

Nintendo needs to bring out new and interesting IP if they want to save the WiiU. They appear to be trying with games like X and Wonderful 101, though viewing gameplay of the latter really didn't impress me. Otherwise, they're just going to have to weather this storm and put some thought into their next console. They need to make sure it's easy for third-party developers to work with and they need to lose the gimmicks. No one cares about motion controls anymore, and the gamepad is apparently too hard to work with or something, since NO ONE is doing anything GOOD with it.

They also need to realize that the casual consumer who picked up a Wii is not going to bother getting a new console. They already have the Wii and the two or three games they wanted for it. They'll pull it out now and then to play golf or bowling or whatever, and then put it away until the next time. They don't need a new system in order get this same experience. They aren't looking for bigger and better things from their console. These are the people who didn't even care about gaming consoles until the saw how fun and accessible the Wii was. These people made up a majority of those who purchased a Wii. They are not going to be repeat customers, and Nintendo did not realize it.

Nintendo had it best when they were the only game in town. They've been steadily declining in popularity since the SNES as other systems came along offering more variety of games, some of which were willing to address mature themes that Nintendo rarely approached. As new gamers grow up with their parents gaming systems, less and less people are going to have a Nintendo platform as their first console. Nostalgia is not going to be the same for them as it is for gamers of my generation. They need to bring in new blood and that means less reliance on nostalgic titles. Somehow it seems they've figured that out for the handheld, as there are a slew of games on there that don't draw upon characters created in the NES days. Why the hell they can't do it for their console is beyond me.

 

[Something Amyss]

...and I don't think "aside from Steam's marketplace" is much of an aside, since that encompasses over 2500 games from all generations(not counting add-ons, DLC, etc.), many of which are also found on both the 360 and PS3.

How many of those games on the 360 and PS3 are actually broken? The point of excluding Steam's marketplace is solely the number of low-quality indie games, which would grossly skew things away from any fair estimation. Besides, shitty shovelware isn't a thing that's alien to Nintendo consoles, either.

 

[Riverwolf]

...and I don't think "aside from Steam's marketplace" is much of an aside, since that encompasses over 2500 games from all generations(not counting add-ons, DLC, etc.), many of which are also found on both the 360 and PS3.

How many of those games on the 360 and PS3 are actually broken?

Not many of them. But being "not broken" doesn't mean "not full of bugs." Red Dead Redemption is FULL of bugs, but it's hardly broken. Nintendo games I've played generally have far fewer bugs, if any bugs at all, than most other games from other companies.

I WILL however, concede that I could be misremembering, as it's been a while since I've actually played a modern Nintendo game except Skyward Sword which I just recently finished.

The point of excluding Steam's marketplace is solely the number of low-quality indie games, which would grossly skew things away from any fair estimation.

Ah. Fair enough (though I remember browsing the XBLA marketplace at one time before Steam really started getting a slew of bad indie games and found all kinds of titles that looked like absolute garbage, or paid-for clones of free flash games.)

Besides, shitty shovelware isn't a thing that's alien to Nintendo consoles, either.

Certainly isn't. When I say "Nintendo games are generally good software" I'm generally referring to games I've played from Gamecube-on. Earlier Nintendo consoles had games that tended to be overall as glitchy, if not far more so, as modern games on other consoles (which I blame on the fact that those early games were limited in programming sophistication; games before the 16-bit era were always coded directly in Assembly, and it wasn't 'till the Genesis, as far as I'm aware, that consoles started allowing a modified form of C programming, and I don't think Nintendo started allowing C programming until the 64.)

As much as I love the Virtual Console (and other implementations of old-school ports to modern systems), there's a LOT of games they're bringing back that really should have been left in the past.

 

[VG_Addict]

Honestly, I'm skeptical to the notion that going third party would be good for Nintendo. Just going by evidence, such as how it didn't help Sega, SNK, or Atari, I say that it would not help them.

 

[Ed130 The Vanguard]

Nintendo had the highest reviewed games last year. They sold the most hardware last year too. Telling them to abandon everything and say there games arent good is stupid.

Yes the WiiU beat two ageing consoles at the end of their production run who had their successors waiting in the wings, well done Nintendo. slow clap That's like beating two geriatrics in a 100m sprint in which you proceed to faceplant every ten metres or so.

And then the PS4 dropped in and bettered the WiiU numbers in less than four months. And that's with the PS4 yet to release in Japan, a major Sony stronghold.

If you meant handhelds only then yes Nintendo moved the most stock.

As for 'highest reviewed' that don't mean diddly, sales is what keeps a corporation afloat.

Because consumers like you are buying into ignorant hype. The PS4 WiiU currently has very little to justify buying it. Hardly any exclusives and all of it's 3rd Party support is also being released on the PS3 or the PC. There is no reason whatsoever to buy it and I hate that Sony Nintendo gets that kind of money despite this. is making no profit from it.

FIFY. ALso, I'm a PC Gamer only.

The same criticisms you level at Sony can also be levelled against the WiiU, as most Nintendo releases have been at best rehashes of previous titles with very few actual 'new' games like Wonderful 101 and what third party exclusives it did get were either failures or were released onto other platforms.

Also, sales may keep a corporation running but they don't denote quality and Sony has only shown me so far that they don't provide enough quality to justify those 4 months' sales. Proving that consumers and gamers today are getting dumber.

Now that's where third party sales come in, lets face it the Sony launch titles were bunk for the most part but people are banking on third party support. Combine that with the PS4's superior performance its becoming a good investment for future gaming, something which the WiiU isn't looking to be.

 

[GamerFromJump]

I can see Nintendo succeeding as a software-only publisher, as long as their headquarters has an eternal flame in front of it, kept lit by the burning corpses of anyone who suggests joining the Day 1 DLC model.

Nintendo is basically the last place where you get what feels like a complete game for your money, instead of "Hey, here's what you get for your $60, and here's the 2nd disc's worth of stuff we put behind a $15/ea. paywall, instead of making the aforementioned $60 game complete and working.", or "Here's a seven-hour campaign for your $60; we know what you REALLY want is to pay extra per month to go online against 12-year-olds expressing their inner psychopath."

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

Really, Ben, you just admitted that Sony and MS are just making "shit PCs" in your review, so why on earth would you encourage Nintendo to drop out of consoles so that we're literally stuck with shit PCs and nothing else?

It's probably because those "shit PCs" come with games worth playing that don't have to be from 30 year old IPs. That's Nintendo's major problem right now. The third party can't sell anything on Nintendo's consoles so they're not wasting money with the Wii U.

Now I don't think Nintendo should drop out, but it needs to find a way to not rely on Mario and Zelda to selll units. The "shit PC"s have the benefit of people getting excited for new IPs every generation. Nintendo consoles sell on old IPs. Problem is, with old IPs comes a shrinking market for Nintendo because people have grown up and no longer play video games. Then there are people who simply don't want to buy a new console to play a game with the same structure as something they played 20-30 years ago.

I think most die hard Nintendo fans these days grew up playing N64. Those who grew up playing NES or SNES for the most part left the pack of the mega fan. The kinds of games that were released on the SNES (i.e. JRPGs such as Chrono Trigger) went over the the PlayStation in the 90s. The N64 had 3D Platformers 3D adventure games and great local multiplayer titles, but if you wanted JRPGs, you have to admit, the PS1 ran that shit. As did the PS2.

Like I said, the "shit PCs" have a bigger variety of games people want. and not just the franchises that you can't count with both hands.

 

[Sir Christopher McFarlane]

I recently sold my Wii U and 3DS, I've reached that point where Nintendo leaves me cold. I guess the countless days of the SNES, N64, Gamecube and Wii have taken their toll on me and I found myself in the curious position of both not looking forward to and then not enjoying the recent first party releases. The recent Mario on Wii U and Zelda on 3DS are great examples, when I was playing it I knew I should be adoring it, singing its praises, but I just couldn't be bothered to play it. I feel nothing for the upcoming release of Mario Kart, I always hated Super Smash Bros. so I was never looking forward to that. And scanning the future release list for the 3DS and Wii U I didn't want a single game. So I sold them on to someone who will hopefully find the joy I once found in Nintendo's games.

It's odd but such is life I guess.

But you still have third party titles, especially on the 3DS.

 

[tstorm823]

My favorite part of this chronic discussion about the wii u sucking is when people claim the future is all about multifunctionality and the wiiu misses that, all of which I'm reading and responding to on the wiiu gamepad while the same machine streams hd anime from the internet directly to my tv.

I only have 3 games for it and already regret nothing because this one machine has totally reshaped my lounging. I use it as my current game console, my internet tablet for the living room, my tv remote control, my video stream machine... hell, I've even looked up recipes and carried the controller with me to make dinner. If they'd just let the thing play media off of dvds and usb drives, I'd never need to plug anything else into the tv.

The games will come and people will buy the console. In the mean time, I'll just keep enjoying my perfect relaxation machine.

P.S. While playing magical card games, my friend and I for a bit just set the wiiu to stream twitchplayspokemon for us. If that's not completing my living room experience, what is?

 

[Ed130 The Vanguard]

That's utterly ignorant because practically every 3rd Party title I looked up for the PS4 is also being released on PC or PS3. So to hell with that damn "superior performance" if it's going to be wasted on games that I can already get on the previous generation console w/o having to blow $400?

Oh and speaking of that performance. If it's so superior, why am I hearing talk of some people's PS4s breaking down on them?

The same reason why people are still not playing on the original Playstation, new games shifting towards the newer platform and abandoning the old combined the the belief that the PC is too complex and every other excuse that gets screencaped and shown on the PCmasterrace subreddit for others to laugh at.

Apart from those failures there really hasn't been much of a widespread failure of the next generation of consoles. When the PS4s went blue people (and the media) started exclaiming "Oh Noes! Its RROD MK2!" Of course then the rest of the consoles didn't fail like the 360 and the whole thing has seemingly been forgotten. Which is pretty much par for the course for some sensationalist titles.

I again point out that people are buying the PS4 expecting future titles will be released and that PS3/360 versions of games won't be made forever. I for one wouldn't be on having the next CoD on them for starters.

 

[C14N]

That's utterly ignorant because practically every 3rd Party title I looked up for the PS4 is also being released on PC or PS3. So to hell with that damn "superior performance" if it's going to be wasted on games that I can already get on the previous generation console w/o having to blow $400?

Oh and speaking of that performance. If it's so superior, why am I hearing talk of some people's PS4s breaking down on them?

They're currently released on older platforms because most big budget games can't currently afford to release on a console with an install base as small as the PS4 or Xbox One. They generally look far, far better on the newer consoles though. Once the new consoles have larger install bases, they're pretty quickly going to stop bothering with the PS3 and 360. PC will always get them but the PC exists in a different world and there will always be plenty of games that don't make it to PC.

Superior performance has nothing to do with hardware reliability. I've heard nothing about these PS4 breakdowns but assuming it's true, that doesn't mean the actual game performance is any worse. The most powerful computer in the world can still break if it overheats.

I agree with Yahtzee about Nintendo on this point, they do seem to be regressing back into SNES-era 2D games which can be fun but they're a side-order at best and something that indie devs are already throwing at us for much less. It's even worse when you consider that Nintendo are the ones who figured out how to do 3D platforming so well in the first place. It's pretty telling how stagnant Nintendo have become when you look at the tiny number of new character's introduced to Smash Bros in the latest instalment. Even then, most of the old favourites aren't getting much love. We've still got plenty of Mario but other than that there's the infrequent Zelda release and that seems to be about it. No Starfox, Earthbound, F-Zero or Metroid.

From where I see it, Nintendo had an easy time last gen and managed to rake in tons of cash from dirt-cheap, low-quality "Wii [whatever]" games and peripherals and now that the extreme casuals have gotten tired of that, they're going to need to get down and work again. The Wii U is the cheapest of the 3 consoles, even if it doesn't get as many big games I'd still be happy to play it for high-quality Nintendo goodness. Stuff of the quality of Nintendo's Gamecube games could at least help them not flop completely. Get a few Japanese studios to help out too, they've traditionally been the strongest supporters imo.

 

[C14N]

They've only made two so far to my knowledge: Link Between Worlds and the upcoming Yoshi's New Island. What's this nonsense that they're regressing back into SNES-era 2D games when they've only made two so far?

No they haven't. They've also released New Super Mario Bros, New Super Mario Bros Wii, New Super Mario Bros 2, New Super Mario Bros U (as well as a standalone New Super Luigi U expansion), Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze and Kirby's Epic Yarn.

You can't assume we've seen every newcomer yet when Smash Bros. doesn't even have a release date. So that argument is unfounded.

Wikipedia had it listed as a 2014 release so in my mind that was probably going to mean November or December.

You lost me at Earthbound. Creator Shigesato Itoi has stated that the Earthbound franchise is DONE! Completed! Even Mother 3's story made it clear that there was no way you continue the story at that point.

Okay, so what about the other franchises?

You want Nintendo to do something other than Mario and Zelda? I'll say the same thing I always say: Next time Nintendo releases a game that's not part of another IP, BUY IT! People complain that Nintendo doesn't make any new IPs but when they actually do, they don't bother to buy them because of other stupid reasons. Or do you want to tell me why Wonderful 101 bombed?

I don't have a Wii U yet but if they start doing that I will buy one straight away. Wonderful 101 wasn't made by Nintendo though, it was made by Platinum. It also didn't exactly kill it in the critical acclaim department which is never good for sales in this industry. Coupled with the fact that the Wii U as a console isn't doing so hot right now and it's not that surprising that it bombed.