I don't think anyone has ever used dog shit as pizza topping. That doesn't make it a good thingxaszatm said:
What's with the extreme Nintendo Hate?
- Thread starter xaszatm
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My breach with the Big N began in the N64 era, because that generation was when they truly lost the 3rd party developers to Sony and Microsoft by being dictatorial about their hardware. They thought they could take their proprietary cartridge technology (a technology that allegedly doubled developmetn costs and increased manufacturing times nearly tenfold) and jam it down the throats of developpers, who would have no choice but to support the tech unwaveringly. Instead, the 3rd party developpers almost universally ditched Nintendo in favour of the PSX and later the XBOX, systems which were far cheaper and easier to develop for.
At the time, I was still riding the euphoria of the prior generation, which had maybe the best game lineup of any hardware generation to date. I held off on buying the PSX and saved instead for an N64. when the N64 was released, I played the crap out of Mario 64, but when I was finally done with that, it took 8 months for anything new and worth playing to come out, and to be honest, most of those few titles were kinda bad.
After this lesson, I went out and got a PSX. I still remember the N64 fondly thanks to great title like Goldeneye, Ocarina of Time, and Mario 64, but I also remember it as the system that killed Nintendo's 3rd party support. that support has never receovered, and probably never will. The Wii was a further step in the wrong direction, and I'm not sold on the idea that the Wii-U is the system that will reverse that trend.
At the time, I was still riding the euphoria of the prior generation, which had maybe the best game lineup of any hardware generation to date. I held off on buying the PSX and saved instead for an N64. when the N64 was released, I played the crap out of Mario 64, but when I was finally done with that, it took 8 months for anything new and worth playing to come out, and to be honest, most of those few titles were kinda bad.
After this lesson, I went out and got a PSX. I still remember the N64 fondly thanks to great title like Goldeneye, Ocarina of Time, and Mario 64, but I also remember it as the system that killed Nintendo's 3rd party support. that support has never receovered, and probably never will. The Wii was a further step in the wrong direction, and I'm not sold on the idea that the Wii-U is the system that will reverse that trend.
I'll tell you what Nintendo don't do...they don't spend so much on making a video game that 4 million sales is viewed as a failure. :|
I take it you also don't like movies like Django which unflinchingly thrusts your face into the kind of abuse and violence that happened against the slaves in pre-civil war America? I'd like to see Pixar's family-friendly take on thatj-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
My point, I loved the Incredibles and Up but there's a reason I don't watch Disney Channel
that pretty much sums it up; people like to perpetuate this idea that making games for anyone other than the "hardcore" demographic is tantamount to suicide...which was proven wrong long, LONG ago. They can't stand that Nintendo does things their own way and as such decide to throw a near-decade-long hissy fit instead of getting the idea that there is more than one method of innovation and advancementj-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
Not hste, more like boredom. When was the last time they released something good that wasn't Mario,Zelda, etc? Sure you might know the answer but most people won't. The Wii U hasn't offered any games that make the console worth buying. Aside from the 3ds there really isn't much reason to care about Nintendo at the moment.
I wrote this on another thread, but on reflection it works better being posted here?
They screwed over European consumers for years, they alienated Gamecube owners with the wii, their business practices in the 80's and 90's were to the point of being malicious, and that spokesperson for Nintendo of America is just an arrogant git.
Perhaps the biggest criticism, however, is that they're capable of creating so many other fantastic, new IPs, but are content in just re-selling the same old crap. They make a dis-service to themselves, and a dis-service to the games industry as a whole because of it.
But, yeah, I haven't got a complete problem with Nintendo. It was only yesterday I booted up the Gamecube again, and it's got some quality titles. But I can't support them if all they're going to do is make rehashes which are just a shadow of games they've made previously.
There are other reasons why I have have 'resentment', but not 'hate', against Nintendo.
They screwed over European consumers for years, they alienated Gamecube owners with the wii, their business practices in the 80's and 90's were to the point of being malicious, and that spokesperson for Nintendo of America is just an arrogant git.
Perhaps the biggest criticism, however, is that they're capable of creating so many other fantastic, new IPs, but are content in just re-selling the same old crap. They make a dis-service to themselves, and a dis-service to the games industry as a whole because of it.
But, yeah, I haven't got a complete problem with Nintendo. It was only yesterday I booted up the Gamecube again, and it's got some quality titles. But I can't support them if all they're going to do is make rehashes which are just a shadow of games they've made previously.
Dude, those are their good games. The third party games are a myriad of nothing and the few (No More Heroes) that stand out are rarer than a hobo with a solid 401k and health insurance. Sure, they exist but are pretty hard to find and often fail to stand out against the others without enough reviews.Palmerama said:
The idea isn't being upset that they're making too many of them in recent memory. The idea is that they're not making new IPs and the only games they really put out are the same IP over and over again. They don't just make the heck out of Mario games, they make spin offs of spin offs of Mario games. Heck, Mario himself is a Donkey Kong spin off. Do I have favorable memories of Mario? Yeah, of course. But I and several others like me are tired of him. I've played Mario, Metroid, Zelda, Kirby, and everything else. I've been playing them for 30 years and it's about damn time for some new blood at Nintendo.
Nintendo lost the respect of a lot of gamers (myself included) since the Wii, but I don't see that many people who actually hate it (I personally don't). However, I do see many sensitive Nintendo fans who get angry every time someone hints at criticizing Nintendo. I was already called a Nintendo hater om this forum because I said that making Deus Ex: Human Revolution Director's Cut a WiiU exclusive is a dick move, and I didn't even accuse Nintendo of anything.
I really like nintendo,
I have heard people claiming that ITS THE END OF NINTENDO PRAISE SONY AND MICROSOFT
on other websites but not on this one
as for the problems I have with them...
First I got a Wii U when it first came out and still don't have a 3DS
I am considering getting a 3DS but I don't understand why there are so few games out for the wii U>???
Not only first party games are short (nintendo land and new super mario bros u are the only 2 out so far) but they aren't seeming to bother trying to help 3rd party companies make more games for them, the current games out are just ports and not even that good ports.
Why can't they port games on the 3DS over to the Wii U?
Heck I've even gone onto their new Wii Shop channel,
what is their? Lots of downloadable games that are the same ones as available on disc
and lots of 3DS titles that are "only available on 3DS"
as for retro Nes and Snes and N64 and gamecube game downloads we were promised?
I checked a week ago and there are a grand total of 2 Nes games available right now...
3DS is doing well but the Wii U is not...
mainly because their are almost 0 games made for it
Oh yeah also SOME NEW IP'S WOULD BE NICE!!!
Im getting tired of buying all these stupid remakes of older games Nintendo...
I have heard people claiming that ITS THE END OF NINTENDO PRAISE SONY AND MICROSOFT
on other websites but not on this one
as for the problems I have with them...
First I got a Wii U when it first came out and still don't have a 3DS
I am considering getting a 3DS but I don't understand why there are so few games out for the wii U>???
Not only first party games are short (nintendo land and new super mario bros u are the only 2 out so far) but they aren't seeming to bother trying to help 3rd party companies make more games for them, the current games out are just ports and not even that good ports.
Why can't they port games on the 3DS over to the Wii U?
Heck I've even gone onto their new Wii Shop channel,
what is their? Lots of downloadable games that are the same ones as available on disc
and lots of 3DS titles that are "only available on 3DS"
as for retro Nes and Snes and N64 and gamecube game downloads we were promised?
I checked a week ago and there are a grand total of 2 Nes games available right now...
3DS is doing well but the Wii U is not...
mainly because their are almost 0 games made for it
Oh yeah also SOME NEW IP'S WOULD BE NICE!!!
Im getting tired of buying all these stupid remakes of older games Nintendo...
I'm sorry, that's has no relations with one another. This is assuming that your personal opinion on the last two consoles are fact. It's not. I personally own a WiiU and Nintendo Land alone has made my purchase worthwhile. New Super Mario Bros Wii U and ZombiU also make it worth it during this incredibly dry period. It's because of those games I played with my friends that 5 of them bought their own consoles and they love it. And that includes the controller. To them, the controller was a wonderful idea. So don't just go "it's crap" like its fact.PoolCleaningRobot said:
So you're saying that only one gets to exist? That if Django Unchanged is what you like, then The Incredibles must be taken out of the picture? Guess what? There are different demographics in movies, just like in video games. You can enjoy both, but some might prefer others.PoolCleaningRobot said:
I still don't understand the hatred of Nintendo on the forums. The desire for it to fall like it's a dictator that murdered your family is just outragous. I have seem some great complaints about Nintendo and I personally find Nintendo to blame for its financial situation but the hatred is just overwhelming on these forums...
As much as I LOVE my GameCube, why does this site have such a nerd-crush on it? It sold horribly, especially when compared to the gold mine that the Wii has been, and by the end of the year, I fully expect the Wii-U to have nearly double it's first year sales with 7-8 million is my guess, once the games roll out.
There was a time when Nintendo pushed gaming forward. They were always on the cutting edge of new technology and ideas. They had a simple system: take tried and true gaming franchises and use the characters in new/interesting ways.
For example, transferring traditional 2D side-scrollers to 3D gave us the wondrous "Super Mario 64", "Metroid Prime", and "Ocarina of Time". They're the company that allows their major characters to go karting or to engage in continuity breaking brawls for no reason other than "its fun". They weren't afraid to throw their characters into strange, new situations ("Hey, let's take that character who started as a 2P pallet swap and lets base an entire game around how he became a ghost buster!" "Hey! Let's turn our major side-scrolling franchise into an RPG that looks like a pop-up story book!")
Even when retreading old ground, they never let their franchises turn stale. When an "Ocarina of Time" knock off was made for the Game Cube, they took a risk with a uniquely lighthearted art design that bordered on a western animation/anime crossover and packed the game with humor and personality hitherto unseen in the Zelda franchise. And of course, they added some water and sailing. The result was the absolutely amazing "The Wind Waker" (which is still one of my favorite games, 10 years after it was released. And no, this isn't nostalgia, I did a full play through for the first time just last summer.)
And lets not forget that they've been THE major player in the mobile market for the longest time. The Game Boy is a staple of many childhoods and the DS, while it seems dumb on paper, works surprisingly well for a system built around a couple of gimmicks (largely because the gimmicks add something that wasn't there before and they are entirely optional). Run into any public space and shout "I wanna be the very best!" and see what happens.
However, somewhere along the line they tripped. Their recent foray into technological innovation resulted in a system built entirely around horrible motion controls and rather obnoxious controllers (not to mention being severely behind the competition in system power). Now they have a system with the most obtusely conceived controller that only takes away from the gaming experience.
In fact, much of their recent work seems to be subtraction. They keep removing stuff from their franchises and systems, hoping to "return to basics" and find that sweet feeling that made Mario so wonderful in the first place. But they are forgetting that Nintendo has always been equal parts familiarity and freshness. Right now, they are spinning their wheels in familiar territory while their franchises rot and stagnate around them.
"Metroid: Other M" turned the cornerstone of strong female protagonists into a mewling baby. "LoZ: Skyward Sword" forgot to add anything unique to its game and the result was forgettable characters and an underwhelming adventure (which seems like the wrong word for "a hero completes needlessly complicated tasks to swat a guy back into his hole multiple times"). Mario's recent forays ("SM Galaxy 2" and whatever "New Super Mario Brothers" is on ) have fared better, but they both amounted to expansion packs more than actual games. That eclectic attitude that brought us "Wario Ware", "Luigi's Mansion", and "Paper Mario" seems to have reigned itself in.
Nintendo hasn't produced anything of substance in a long while. Now, I don't hate them and I don't want them to fail, but I do want them to get a little scared. They've been phoning it in for an entire console generation and it needs to stop.
For example, transferring traditional 2D side-scrollers to 3D gave us the wondrous "Super Mario 64", "Metroid Prime", and "Ocarina of Time". They're the company that allows their major characters to go karting or to engage in continuity breaking brawls for no reason other than "its fun". They weren't afraid to throw their characters into strange, new situations ("Hey, let's take that character who started as a 2P pallet swap and lets base an entire game around how he became a ghost buster!" "Hey! Let's turn our major side-scrolling franchise into an RPG that looks like a pop-up story book!")
Even when retreading old ground, they never let their franchises turn stale. When an "Ocarina of Time" knock off was made for the Game Cube, they took a risk with a uniquely lighthearted art design that bordered on a western animation/anime crossover and packed the game with humor and personality hitherto unseen in the Zelda franchise. And of course, they added some water and sailing. The result was the absolutely amazing "The Wind Waker" (which is still one of my favorite games, 10 years after it was released. And no, this isn't nostalgia, I did a full play through for the first time just last summer.)
And lets not forget that they've been THE major player in the mobile market for the longest time. The Game Boy is a staple of many childhoods and the DS, while it seems dumb on paper, works surprisingly well for a system built around a couple of gimmicks (largely because the gimmicks add something that wasn't there before and they are entirely optional). Run into any public space and shout "I wanna be the very best!" and see what happens.
However, somewhere along the line they tripped. Their recent foray into technological innovation resulted in a system built entirely around horrible motion controls and rather obnoxious controllers (not to mention being severely behind the competition in system power). Now they have a system with the most obtusely conceived controller that only takes away from the gaming experience.
In fact, much of their recent work seems to be subtraction. They keep removing stuff from their franchises and systems, hoping to "return to basics" and find that sweet feeling that made Mario so wonderful in the first place. But they are forgetting that Nintendo has always been equal parts familiarity and freshness. Right now, they are spinning their wheels in familiar territory while their franchises rot and stagnate around them.
"Metroid: Other M" turned the cornerstone of strong female protagonists into a mewling baby. "LoZ: Skyward Sword" forgot to add anything unique to its game and the result was forgettable characters and an underwhelming adventure (which seems like the wrong word for "a hero completes needlessly complicated tasks to swat a guy back into his hole multiple times"). Mario's recent forays ("SM Galaxy 2" and whatever "New Super Mario Brothers" is on ) have fared better, but they both amounted to expansion packs more than actual games. That eclectic attitude that brought us "Wario Ware", "Luigi's Mansion", and "Paper Mario" seems to have reigned itself in.
Nintendo hasn't produced anything of substance in a long while. Now, I don't hate them and I don't want them to fail, but I do want them to get a little scared. They've been phoning it in for an entire console generation and it needs to stop.
I can understand this position, some gamers may have nostalgia towards Nintendo and feel they they are being abandoned by Nintendo's direction. But looking at it from their perspective, you could also say that much of the 'core' gamer crowd has also abandoned Nintendo, what with the emergence of Sony and Microsoft into the console wars and a new generation of gamers being entirely devoted to either one. For much of this Nintendo is to blame, it started with the N64 where with their insistence on cartridges and I guess a greater degree of control they started losing 3rd party development to Sony (ex: Final Fantasy). By the time they came out with the Gamecube, there was full scale abandonment going on as most gamers were getting behind Sony or Microsoft. Which one can't forget are massive multi-purpose corporations able to sink a lot more money into the race to win it than Nintendo can.Treaos Serrare said:
That's the problem I have with your view on things. Had Nintendo gone the direction you would have wanted for the last gen they would have just continued to fade into obscurity. You can't get by on nostalgia alone, as we saw with Sega when they dropped out of the console race despite the Dreamcast being a damn good console. Nintendo had to do something different to remain relevant, and while the Wii-U remains to be seen with the Wii they were highly successful.
As for negativity on this site? Well I won't speak much about the forums as this is the internet and you'll find people to bash everything, and these are the people are always the most eager to speak up. But there is something to be said that every single new article posted about the Wii-U on the Escapists takes a shot at Nintendo in some manner, I don't think I've seen a single neutral-to-positive article in the last 6 months.
Sure its related. You said "at least we have something different in the market" as though that instantly makes anything different a good thing. It does not. I'm not sure what 2 consoles you're talking about, but my 'opinion' of the Wii is that it does not have games I want and the xbox, ps3, and pc do. And my 'opinion' of the WiiU is that I don't like touch screen based games that look as good the console I've owned for years. I won't lie. I own 2 DS's. My favorite game for it that I played with my sister was New Super Mario Bros because it only used the touch screen for items and a map. It also makes sense when the second screen is under the first so there isn't a lot of looking around. On the other hand, Star Fox Command used the touch screen for every single one of its controls rather than the buttons. Not even an option. I've seen Nintendo ruin too many good games with their focus on their damn peripherals. Thats why I bought a ps vita instead of 3DS. I'm still not sure of vita's success in the future, but I know I'll get to play (and I do play) games in a more traditional way while being enhanced by gimmicks, not ruined by themxaszatm said:
I'll let you in on a secret: that was my fucking point. Ps3, Xbox, and pc have plenty of (if we keep using this analogy) Pixar type vidyas. The difference between between them and Nintendo is that Nintendo doesn't seem to want the Quentin Tarantino Django style vidyas. That's why I don't like Nintendo right now. The gamecube had multiplatform games like the ps2 and the Xbox alongside their catalog of Nintendo games. I was too young to figure this out when I bought a Wii because I wasn't into adult games at the time. Nintendo made me choose between them and every other great 3rd party and adult Django-like games. I chose playstation and Metal Gear Solid 4 was easily better than any of the games I owned on the Wii despite the fact that I owned more Wii games than ps3 (and pc) games. The difference is my playstation games were funner and lasted me a lot longer so I bought less
ALL THAT SHIT SAID, I don't know whether or not the WiiU is, or will be, a failure or a bad console. I won't criticize you for liking the Wii or the WiiU. Its all about what games you like. I don't think the Wii U will be as far behind as the Wii was when it comes to Sony or Microsoft's next gen consoles so maybe these games I want will come out for the Wii U too. Maybe I'll someday be convinced to buy a Wii U. But as it stands right now, Nintendo wants tablet controllers and a console with games that look a lot like the one's I've been playing on ps3 for the last 4 years and I'm ready to move on
To be fair, Xenoblade is pretty much a Xenosaga successor so it technically really isn't a new IP but I agree with the rest. Also, good to see you back! Xenoblade also is awesome but I personally prefered The Last Story...if only because I love mocking it.j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
*takes deep breath* JEFFEEEEERRRRRRRRSSSSSSS!!!!!j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
Whenever someone mentions Nintendo must you always show up to fellate Nintendo's throbbing cock?
We've had this argument before (though you've probably had this same argument more). The adult games I want aren't on the Wii. I don't know if any new ones will come to the Wii U. And Sin and Punishment and Metroid Prime 3 are not seriously adult games in my eyes (they are not on the same level as Django in anyone's eyes). And, just because there are a lot of good family friendly movies doesn't mean every kid title that Nintendo releases is worth an adult's time. And saying "kiddy games are good" does not counter "there are not a lot adult games on the Wii"
Edit: forgot
You're description of Disney Channel sounds a lot like Nintendo's game catalog for the Wii.
Woops! did I just say that out loud?!
Mostly in name only though; there really aren't any themes or motifs that could connect it to Xenosaga (or the legendary Xenogears).xaszatm said:
I don't know, hipster logic? It's the same reason people gush about the Dreamcast despite it only having a handful of gems. I would most people trying to retroactively praise probably didn't buy one new.Sean951 said:
Yes, my bitterness has already been shown to be misplaced in the case of Bayonetta, but I cannot find anywhere the specifics of why Monster Hunter became exclusive. Maybe it's SEGA and Sony I should be angry at. But at the end of the day, the games are on the Wii U and that's what I don't like. I just find it hard to believe that reasonably late in the development Sony said "Look, I know you're making a game but if you don't put trophies in you can take it somewhere else".j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
Now that I can believe. At least the development costs keep the games worthwhile, to an extent.