What's Wrong with Xbox Live?

[Cynical skeptic]

In order to run a proper walled garden service, you can't have any sort of chinks, leaks, or holes in your walls. Allowing valve to distribute free content through live would undermine the entire service's completely self-reinforcing/circular pricing schemes.

Also, "fag" no longer has any meaning, much less any relation to homosexuals. It, and any sort of homosexual act, is simply the new breed of curse words that scares all the un-hip squares, daddy-O. Nothing to do with hating or fearing gay people. "Choke to death on your daddy's cock" has a little more bite than "stfu."

 

[Nikolaz72]

So ehm. *Cough Cough* The Dedicated servers are soooo popular because everyone likes being kicked and banned for killing hosts? Or because its free and the hosts are usually nice people. Take TF2 Counterstrike Hl2mods Battlefield all those nice games with Hosts not actually kicking people for doing anything but the wrong stuff. Like say Teamkilling or being afk.

Hmm?

No... I assume you're talking about PC.

I was talking about consoles.

Yeah there are some shitty PC servers but I realise that there are still a fair few that aren't.

Dedicated servers work more for PC than they would for Xbox.

Its like saying America would never function as a country with its citizens having an awfull lack of guns. Stuff like that would take some getting used to for some. And be abused by others. PC has always had dedicated servers and so will the consoles hopefully in the future.

 

[rembrandtqeinstein]

Allowing users to run servers would take control away from microsoft, they can't allow that.

 

[the_pleasure_is_mine]

Its like saying America would never function as a country with its citizens having an awfull lack of guns. Stuff like that would take some getting used to for some. And be abused by others. PC has always had dedicated servers and so will the consoles hopefully in the future.

I didn't really get that post... still I'll just go off the 'would take some getting used to' bit.

I don't think it would work as well because Microsoft use their service to guide people more.

They give them easy ways to access games and game content made by the developers that works (we hope) so things like dedicated servers and mods might not interest a large portion of XBL.

I know people who use gaming websites like this would be interested but for the other 90-odd percent they wouldn't be interested.

But that's just how I see it.

 

[Fists]

Microsoft no doubt worry that the average console player can't spell dedicated let alone handle playing multiplayer games through them.

Equally, it's hardly all roses & icecream with dedicated servers. The last game I played online regularly which used them, COD2, was a navigational nightmare full of servers that were empty, locked, playing a map I didn't like, or servers that seemed open but then after 10minutes of loading informed me that it was infact full. As a casual player who really doesn't care who I play with, dedicated servers are more of a hassle than they're worth when one can just select ones preferences & let the game do the rest*.

*Yes I hate Xbox American teens as much as the next person, but muting mics seems an easier option than dedicated servers to escape that nagging issue.

That was going to be my point, consoles are a different market to PCs because you can game casually, you pick up the controller and press about ten buttons and your in a match (if your in a country with good internet and lots of fellow players), you don't have to know which servers are good or know that shorthand that tells you this server is battle-rifles only. You just game, no you don't get exactly the environment that fits your ideal but its typically a happy medium for everyone.

To put it another way you don't have to find and fit with a clique you just get to be part of the community.

 

[Sjakie]

It's not gonna happen Shamus.
You know that Microsoft doesn't have any vision. The only vision that MS has, is the ones it bought out up until those employees leave right after that.

 

[civver]

Whoever implements this system on a console first gets my money. Possibly for a long time.

 

[Ossian]

Either you didn't read the article or you're completely oblivious of how player run dedicated servers work.

Well yes I did skim the article originally.

Then I read the article in depth.

Then you get an instance of a game where you have all the admin powers. You can set the maps and the game mode and boot or mute at will.

So yeah my original point still stands.

See, the thing is, what you're describing is called a "shitty server".
Wait, don't panic! It's okay.
Just put that server on your shitlist and play on another server.

The article mentioned this, by the way.
I wouldn't call that 'in depth' reading.

Yeah, I know servers like that, everyone hates them and goes to the good ones, unless they are trolls and than they flock to servers like that, which is great because it keeps them out of my play zone.

 

[instantbenz]

Good luck Shamus, prepare for the Valve hate.

Taken a complete anti-Xbox PC elitism stance now have we?

OT: Yeah they need to change the rules round a bit for sure. Don't deny that.

But also they shut down the old servers so they could update current Live. Not because it cost too much to maintain.

I like the idea of sponsored servers. But if they let gamers do their own moderating of servers it'll be like Gears of War 1 public games.

*Yeah I made a kill! Oh I've been booted because I killed the host...*

I agree with that, but there are ways around such bs happening constantly.

The person running the server verifies server capacity and ranked or unranked.

Then number of boots per day is set ... extra money for more boots ... but never infinite boots.

If boots are too high or consistently cap, put a symbol next to the server to warn people that the host is insecure about his/her noobishness.

It could be done but it wouldn't be easy.

 

[kibayasu]

Isn't Steamworks is getting integrated into Valve games on the Playstation? Something like that anyways. That could be the start of a much better multiplayer experience on the PS3.

 

[TsunamiWombat]

Imagine that we had two forums: An un-moderated one for vegetarians and a carefully moderated one for steak lovers. When the vegetarian forum becomes a boiling cauldron of rate, racism, pornography, and shock pictures, I don't think it's fair to blame vegetarians. I'm sure there are nice people that own Xboxes. (I do.) But they aren't going to say much if everyone else is filling chat with homophobic bile.

This would happen, if only because vegetarians are the evil spawn of the devil.

Good luck Shamus, prepare for the Valve hate.

Taken a complete anti-Xbox PC elitism stance now have we?

OT: Yeah they need to change the rules round a bit for sure. Don't deny that.

But also they shut down the old servers so they could update current Live. Not because it cost too much to maintain.

I like the idea of sponsored servers. But if they let gamers do their own moderating of servers it'll be like Gears of War 1 public games.

*Yeah I made a kill! Oh I've been booted because I killed the host...*

I agree with that, but there are ways around such bs happening constantly.

The person running the server verifies server capacity and ranked or unranked.

Then number of boots per day is set ... extra money for more boots ... but never infinite boots.

If boots are too high or consistently cap, put a symbol next to the server to warn people that the host is insecure about his/her noobishness.

It could be done but it wouldn't be easy.

OR, you could log onto another damn server, which is the point of private servers.

 

[Booze Zombie]

Hopefully the next Xbox will let Microsoft get their act together.

 

[kementari]

They really SHOULD let you run the servers, Shamus. Fund this man's ideas!

 

[bjj hero]

In all honesty, if they proposed a tier system where you can get services depending how much you are willing to pay, I'd opt for the online only and just play with my friends. Not interested in all the other services or whatever, I want to pay accordingly to the services I use. Not something general.

My feelings exactly, I've not touched the twitter and face book stuff. Not interested. It's the same with Zune and lastfm. Just let me play online and download content. Charge the other clowns who want it extra.

If you are a UK xbl user you will have seen those 2 arse holes (with their stupid hair cuts) who post the "sentuamessage" video, each week, answering questions. I've messaged them a few times asking why the valve content is free on PC but not on the 360. Strangely they have never answered. Instead they prefer to answer questions that anyone with access to google can answer...

"1337pwner69 asks; When is generic shooter X out and will their be frisbees in it"

I do miss that feeling of having a local server where I can play with the same people. Having said that I've not done it this decade. I've not played a PC shooter since Action Quake II.

 

[The Bandit]

Everything would be much better if Xbox would just let us run its servers.

Good luck Shamus, prepare for the Valve hate.

Not entirely sure what that's supposed to mean.

OT: I never realized that Xbox Live had so many problems. I'm actually kind of glad I haven't wasted money on buying it. I like my Left 4 Dead experience the way it is. Getting the xbox version would sorta kill that.

It doesn't. People are freaking out because it's Valve and everyone loves Valve.

 

[The Imp]

Equally, it's hardly all roses & icecream with dedicated servers. The last game I played online regularly which used them, COD2, was a navigational nightmare full of servers that were empty, locked, playing a map I didn't like, or servers that seemed open but then after 10minutes of loading informed me that it was infact full.

You know, PC games usually come with a filter system for their online part. Do you want to display full/empty/password protected/playing map ABC? |Yes|/|No| Just check/uncheck the right box and everything is all right. But if even that is too much to ask from a current generation console gamer...Then i'm at a loss for words. Really.

 

[mjc0961]

Citing Newell's bullshit (the Left 4 Dead series makes his statement sound like a bunch of crap, unless he'd like to speak up and offer some clarity as to why he can manage to keep those games updated, but not Team Fortress 2) doesn't really make any case against Xbox Live. I found that entire part of the article to be pretty worthless honestly.

As for the part about servers... If they wanted to do something like that as an extra for those who want to use it, fine. I'd rather not be assed though, just being able to go to the MP menu and picking Quick Play works fine for me. So maybe they can expand but keep the current system there as well for people who don't want to deal with it. Of course it would probably only work for Microsoft published games. I don't think any amount of money tossed at Microsoft is going to stop EA from pulling the plugs on game servers faster than Gabe Newell can make statements that make him look stupid (and not just the ones about Xbox Live, remember when he was hating on the PS3? How's that foot taste, Gabe?).

If you are a UK xbl user you will have seen those 2 arse holes (with their stupid hair cuts) who post the "sentuamessage" video, each week, answering questions.

Oh man, why would you ever remind anyone that those guys exist? Never remind anyone that those guys exist (sadly we get them in the US as well).

 

[Blazenwizard]

What Im trying to figure out is why Microsoft is increasing the price of Live Gold but I can't block people from msging me w/o signing off of live. Sometimes I want to slay online in silence and privacy. also I can't download a demo and play a game at the same time? what gives. But i can browse face book from my 360 whoppeee!!! (soo sarcastic)

 

[SageRuffin]

What Im trying to figure out is why Microsoft is increasing the price of Live Gold but I can't block people from msging me w/o signing off of live. Sometimes I want to slay online in silence and privacy. also I can't download a demo and play a game at the same time? what gives. But i can browse face book from my 360 whoppeee!!! (soo sarcastic)

That's not hard at all. Either turn your notifications off, or set your status to "appear offline".

Unless someone knows otherwise, you either won't get notified of any messages (you know - out of sight, out of mind), or you'll have virtually dropped off the face of the planet. Kaboom yo, now you can frag, kill, and maim in the privacy of your own room.

 

[Earthbound]

I find it disappointing that there exist people who believe moderation by Microsoft in any major form is positive. You do not need Microsoft's help or assistance if you had dedicated servers. Make games work using the same general system of Left 4 Dead 2 for the PC. You have a "Quick Game" button that just chooses a pseudo-random vanilla server, a "Custom Game" button that let's you specify conditions for the server, and a server browser for advanced users to find exactly what they want. Give people the option to search for servers with vanilla content instead of policing what servers can allow. Modded servers simply don't have a "vanilla" tag. Even better, give admins the ability to make their own tags to describe how the server works. "Casual," "DM_only," "XTREEM_MODZ," and "j3i9zM3," are all valid tags, and people will easily be able to judge the general feel of a server by reading them.

Will people make stupid servers where anyone who kills the host is kicked? Yes. Will they have servers that severely gimp non-admins? Yes. Will there be servers with ludicrously stupid gameplay changes? Yes. All players are free to go or not to go to these servers. They'll have the ability to favorite or blacklist any servers that they want. They can even choose to just use the "Quick Game" and ignore all the previously mentioned things. The important thing is that they, the gamers, would have the choice. They do not need Microsoft to guide them. They can guide themselves and be better off for doing it.

Now we just have to somehow convey this to Microsoft.