Where have all the good games gone...

[Pietho]

What's the most unique game to come out in the last... oh... eight years?

I can't think of one off the top of my head and I blame gamers in general for that.

When video games were few and far between, in the late 1980's and 90's every release was something new and unique made by a bunch of people who just liked to make games. There was innovation and originality in those years when games like Ultima (destined to be one of the most ripped off games of all time, beginning with Diablo), Bards Tale, Kings Quest, Fantasy General, Crystal Caliburn, Dragon Lore, Blood and Fire, Eye of the Beholder and dozens and dozens of other games pushed the medium and turned it in new directions. Some of the directions were not so good, some were horrible even (play Dragon Lore now to see how painful that type of adventure game could be) but at least they were trying something new.

Now, we have Halo3 (a Wolfenstein clone) and, frankly, it's sad. I haven't seen a unique game in a long time, most of them are various combat simulators or puzzle games, and when someone comes out with something that's even a little different (like Psychonauts) it's ignored by most people in favor of Metal Gear Solid Whatever and .

It boils down to this, we all like a the thrill of a new gaming experience. When I played Doom for the first time I broke three mice and numerous keyboards due to the pacing, tension and just plain joy of the damned thing and while I would love to feel that way about a game again I don't think re-releasing it with top of the range graphics and calling it HALO is the way to do it.

Obviously I'm wrong, at least as far as the sales figures go, because people can't seem to get enough of the same game with different graphics. And this isn't even a "bad" thing because without remakes and re-imaginings we would never have Diablo, Fallout, Painkiller, Psychonauts or Sacred. These are all fun games that I have enjoyed tremendously, unfortunately for every unique vision that makes it to the shelves there's a hundred flashy, samey games that sell like hotcakes because their just like the one before it, and the one before it and the one before it... all the way back to the original game that started it all.

FANBOY WARNING: If I see a reply about how HALO has nothing to do with DOOM and is a unique game I want you to know that I know you haven't been playing video games long enough to know what it is I'm talking about.

By the way... I cut my teeth on Pong and Zork.

I really want to hear other opinions on this, because I think its interesting and a good topic for discussion.

 

[Space Spoons]

Maybe it's because I wasn't around for the Atari generation (hell, I barely made it into the 16-bit pool on time), but I tend to focus on whether or not a game is actually fun to play. Yes, I'll agree that Halo ripped a lot of things from a lot of other, arguably better games... But the bottom line is, I find it fun to play. That's enough for me, in this day and age when gaming, something that I do for fun, can actually become something like a chore.

On that note, what happened to just watching cutscenes? I beat that boss with my own two hands, and now I want to see the "kill/WHO ARE YOU WORKING FOR?" cinematic. I don't wanna help out by tapping A, X, Y and B in sequence to avoid being killed.

 

[Vladamir69]

ill keep it simple the well of gaming innovation it not infinently deep. you cant keep on coming up with new things to do. at least to the point when they decide to stick needles in the back of you neck and you go around bending spoons for quests.

 

[hypothetical fact]

ill keep it simple the well of gaming innovation it not infinently deep. you cant keep on coming up with new things to do. at least to the point when they decide to stick needles in the back of you neck and you go around bending spoons for quests.

That sounds interesting... I just hope that we are years away from Hollywood where every movie now is a rehash or sequel.

 

[geldonyetich]

A fellow "cut teeth on Pong and Zork" type, eh? Well, having put quite a lot of thought into this myself, I suppose the answer is all of the following:

1) Since computers have become a lot more multimedia intensive, there's been a general focus of game developer attention towards filling the void. Consequently, a great deal of games focus too much on looking and sounding good, and not enough focus on being good games. It's why you'll often find some surprisingly good gems on the handhelds with less multimedia capabilities.

2) The good games are technically out there, but considering how much the game industry boomed, there's a great deal of crap to shovel out of the way first. The toil is the bother, but perhaps the rare diamonds found are worth the effort. Don't be quick to discount consoles (where those fleeing piracy are going) or indies.

3) After 20-something years of playing games, you really have to realize that you're the exception to the norm when it comes to the average gaming public. The typical developer can get away with developing a game that caters to a more casual audience because their wallets outnumber the power gamers' wallets several-fold. Consequently, our best bet towards finding good games these days is either to delve into specialized niches (such as Indies) or start making games ourselves.

I've been sick of just about everything lately. I guess I need to go back to working on my own some more.

 

[Aiden Rebirth]

uh last gen = katamary damaci(2004) anyone. not to mention okami (2005), viewful joe(2004), shadow of the colloussus(2005). this gen = just about anything on the wii, portal, mirrors edge. the future = Mad world, uh um, I got nothing else.

point is DON'T LOSE HOPE GAMING NATION!!!

 

[Rizzen203]

If we look at mainstream games, sure they are rare, but the rarity make the game that much more special.

It comes down to economics, making games cost money, which I cannot blame them about. You need to sell X copies to make up the money you invested, so go the safe route. Sure, if you are stable enough, experiment, but going off the wall completely is a risk that can sink a company.

 

[timm123]

Well no, every game in the market can't be original and exciting, and besides if a person has fun playing a game then what's the problem with them buying a sequel or remake? If somebody enjoys the Mario formula or wants to play an excellent platformer, then I can't see any reason they shouldn't buy Mario Galaxy.

Besides, there are still plenty of new directions the industry is moving. Portal, God of War, and Puzzle Quest have all moved their respective genres in new directions with satisfying results.

 

[Fightgarr]

I don't really see how the fact that a company did something first makes it the best one. Doom may be one of the first FPS game but that doesn't make it the best one ever. There are plenty of ways to IMPROVE (that the key word here) on things that already exist. I'm all for gaming innovation but it seems ill-informed, naive and pretentious to just give a blanket statement that the first video games are the only good ones and new games are all just rip-offs.

You can say that Eye of the Beholder was a great RPG and it presented a better way to play an RPG, but to say that because it came first its better than, say, Planescape: Torment or Baldur's Gate then I'm going to have disagree and present you with all three of those to see which one you enjoy more.

I'm not saying that old games are bad, its just that there a LOT of good games out there and old by no means means better.

EDIT: I know that this is about gameplay INNOVATION, but again being old doesn't make it innovative, and the most innovative thing out there may not actually be that good.

 

[Souplex]

We had no more heroes if that helps

 

[Samurai Goomba]

There are dry spells in gaming. The last gen was chock-full of innovative PS2 goodness like God Hand, Katamari and Shadow of the Colossus. Here's hoping the next few years see some better releases as developers start getting a hang of programming for the new systems and begin exploring just what can actually be done on each system.

 

[Pietho]

HALO 3...
Metal Gear Solid 4...
Warcraft 3...
GTA 4...
Sacred 2...
Diablo 3 (coming)...
Devil May Cry 4...
Anything With Mario, Lara Croft, Spyro...
Metal of Honor...
Any Madden...

All the "big games" are sequels, there hasn't been a lot of new properties

 

[Pietho]

EDIT: I know that this is about gameplay INNOVATION, but again being old doesn't make it innovative, and the most innovative thing out there may not actually be that good.

You are completely correct! The old games aren't all great, they're just all old. The problem I run into is that I keep thinking about those old games when I start playing the new ones. FANTASY WARS reminds me of FANTASY GENERAL; actually it's the same game with a graphic upgrade. I played the HALO demo and all I could think about was DOOM2 (with the ability to look around and much, Much, MUCH better graphics).

It took playing PAINKILLER to realize this, because when I played it, I wasn't thinking about anything but the game (which is odd, since PAINKILLER has demons and fireballs and such).

For the record here are my list of games that were innovative when they came out and still stand out due to their game play or novelty

Might and Magic: The graphics suffer in the current generation but I haven't found an RPG yet that can match it in off the wall humor (A sign in the middle of a huge grassland that says "you are here, now go away"). Plus, no matter how powerful you were, the final battle at the end can't be done in a single go without superior luck.

Majesty: The Fantasy Kingdom Sim (and The Northern Expansion): Now here's a game that should have spawned a score of sequels. Clear graphics and solid game play that's so addictive I purchased the "Gold" edition off of Ebay so I could play it on my Vista machine.

Alien Logic: Based on the SkyRealms of Jorune tabletop RPG, this dialogue heavy game was charming and as true to the source material as was possible. Not great on the eyes, but fun in all the ways that count.

Dungeon Keeper 1 and 2: If you don't know what it is, look it up on Wikipedia. One of the most innovative Fantasy/Strategy games of all time. More addictive than chocolate.

Heroes of Might and Magic 2: The first two games in the series (Kings Bounty and Heroes of Might and Magic 1) were just like works in progress but this is the first one that got it all down. Turn based strategy, cartoony graphics that are clear and attractive.

Masters of Orion 2: Turn based 4x galactic strategy. The AI is efficient and downright brutal once the Antarians show up.

Civilization 2: Classic, pure and simple. Others have followed, but this is the one that kept me up though many weekends.

Doom 1&2: Pure fun, nothing beats the thrill of running through samey corridors, blowing away demons in search of ammo and keys. Sadly, not as fun as it used to be since I have the whole thing mapped in my head now. the only benefit to the slew of rip-offs and upgrades is the creation of random spawning points.

Heroes/Kings Quest Series: fun even today, though the earlier ones were buggy to the point of mouse shattering frustration. This is Sierra before they became dicks.

Archon: SSI's answer to Battle Chess. No standard Chess pieces and moves here, just move into another pieces square and begin an arcade style battle. the piece that wins controls the square, the other is destroyed.

The Adventures of LOLO: Sure, block puzzle games are a dime a dozen on the net, but this addictive NES game took me 38 hours to beat from beginning to end and there's wasn't a "save" option and the Passcode mechanic was buggy, I had to do it all in one sitting.

I have more, tons of them I've found on special release CDs and converted from old 3.5" disks. But these are the ones I keep going back to when DIABLO, SACRED, HEROES OF MIGHT AND MAGIC V and PAINKILLER get stale.

 

[Pietho]

I blame the fps for the decline of good original games now every game is a clone of the game before it because we lost the original ideas that made games great

I believe that the FPS isn't the cause of the problem, it's just the most obvious victim. the First Person Shooter is a popular style, but that's not to say that it can't be mixed and changed to make it interesting (See SYSTEM SHOCK 2 and PAINKILLER).

The problem here is that the FPS is obviously very easy to create since they make up the majority of any season of gaming releases (especially on the XBOX). I just wish that there were more WITCHHAVENS and PAINKILLERS than HALO's and CALL OF DUTY's.

 

[Sewblon]

Many developers are after audiences who did not start playing games untill the playstation or even the Xbox came out, as in, people who have no working knowledge of what they are copying. Producing mainstream games is now so costly that anything that might not sell 3 million copies makes publishers dive for their security blankets. Finally why would any one want to take a risk with orginial material in the first place when they can make more money copying and pasting the Source code for Halo and swaping some color pallets.

 

[Pietho]

Well said, Sweblon. My greatest fear is that, like anything else, now that Video Games are in the "millions of units sold" game, where are the true innovators coming from. I know everyone says "look at the Indie releases" but the problem there is the minute an indie developer gets recognized it seems like their swallowed by the industry and their next release is Captain Same-O's Cookie Cutter Adventure.

I understand the money angle, but like the movie and music industries, why can't it be about the artist and their vision rather than the money? It's pathetic and sad.

 

[coldfrog]

Honestly, this is what I love about the Xbox and Wii indie designers out there. If you look at some of the stuff that's come out (Lost Winds and World of Goo on wii, Geometry Wars and Braid for Xbox are my faves) you'll see a large amount of creativity that, had it been required for a big budget game, just couldn't have made it. Even Katamari was a pretty low budget game, it sold for 20 bucks on release for crying out loud (never mind that Namco was behind it, sh sh quiet). I've stopped looking at big name games for innovation and looking for the ones that bring me more of the things that I know I like.

 

[Portoparty]

EDIT: I know that this is about gameplay INNOVATION, but again being old doesn't make it innovative, and the most innovative thing out there may not actually be that good.

You are completely correct! The old games aren't all great, they're just all old. The problem I run into is that I keep thinking about those old games when I start playing the new ones. FANTASY WARS reminds me of FANTASY GENERAL; actually it's the same game with a graphic upgrade. I played the HALO demo and all I could think about was DOOM2 (with the ability to look around and much, Much, MUCH better graphics).

It took playing PAINKILLER to realize this, because when I played it, I wasn't thinking about anything but the game (which is odd, since PAINKILLER has demons and fireballs and such).

For the record here are my list of games that were innovative when they came out and still stand out due to their game play or novelty

Might and Magic: The graphics suffer in the current generation but I haven't found an RPG yet that can match it in off the wall humor (A sign in the middle of a huge grassland that says "you are here, now go away"). Plus, no matter how powerful you were, the final battle at the end can't be done in a single go without superior luck.

Majesty: The Fantasy Kingdom Sim (and The Northern Expansion): Now here's a game that should have spawned a score of sequels. Clear graphics and solid game play that's so addictive I purchased the "Gold" edition off of Ebay so I could play it on my Vista machine.

Alien Logic: Based on the SkyRealms of Jorune tabletop RPG, this dialogue heavy game was charming and as true to the source material as was possible. Not great on the eyes, but fun in all the ways that count.

Dungeon Keeper 1 and 2: If you don't know what it is, look it up on Wikipedia. One of the most innovative Fantasy/Strategy games of all time. More addictive than chocolate.

Heroes of Might and Magic 2: The first two games in the series (Kings Bounty and Heroes of Might and Magic 1) were just like works in progress but this is the first one that got it all down. Turn based strategy, cartoony graphics that are clear and attractive.

Masters of Orion 2: Turn based 4x galactic strategy. The AI is efficient and downright brutal once the Antarians show up.

Civilization 2: Classic, pure and simple. Others have followed, but this is the one that kept me up though many weekends.

Doom 1&2: Pure fun, nothing beats the thrill of running through samey corridors, blowing away demons in search of ammo and keys. Sadly, not as fun as it used to be since I have the whole thing mapped in my head now. the only benefit to the slew of rip-offs and upgrades is the creation of random spawning points.

Heroes/Kings Quest Series: fun even today, though the earlier ones were buggy to the point of mouse shattering frustration. This is Sierra before they became dicks.

Archon: SSI's answer to Battle Chess. No standard Chess pieces and moves here, just move into another pieces square and begin an arcade style battle. the piece that wins controls the square, the other is destroyed.

The Adventures of LOLO: Sure, block puzzle games are a dime a dozen on the net, but this addictive NES game took me 38 hours to beat from beginning to end and there's wasn't a "save" option and the Passcode mechanic was buggy, I had to do it all in one sitting.

I have more, tons of them I've found on special release CDs and converted from old 3.5" disks. But these are the ones I keep going back to when DIABLO, SACRED, HEROES OF MIGHT AND MAGIC V and PAINKILLER get stale.

and "Rainbow Six" is where?
(or atleast explain what a)wasn't innovative about it b) what came first in the tactical shooter genre.)

on that note:
At least most genres are getting rehashes, I can't think of a single real tactical shooter unless you're counting war-sims like OFP.

 

[Calamity]

This isn't anything new as far as entertainment mediums are concerned.
Books, movies, games, T.V, It's all an ocean of dung and remakes that every now and then coughs up a gem that's worth spending your time on.

As long as there are people who will watch/play/buy the same old junk, they're not going to stop making it.