Why Bronies (and Pretty Much Everyone) Should Hate the Brony Documentary

[Hyenatempest]

I wouldn't expect a Pokemon documentary to comment on the pornography either. Indeed, people should look down on viewing sexual expression as a negative thing if they're not into it, because this sexually repressive and dumb attitude that marginalizes other is...dumb. and stupid.

Same thing with death threats and dumb fandom drama. Everyone knows it exists, because it exists everywhere. A documentary is not a debate with a set topic to discuss and provide arguments for and against, it's supposed to tell you about something, to inform you. It's supposed to be as impartial as you can make it. You can talk about the more questionable sides by talking about just how varied the amount of fan content is in regards to media and tone without being "OH MY GOD LOOK AT ALL THIS SMUT IT'S SO BAAAAD," which isn't a healthy attitude to have in your head or a tone in your documentary. That's not to say you can't say negative shit, you just have to prioritize and find...shit that's actually bad and not just weird.

Talk about Hasbro and our love-hate relationship with them, or how EQD has been pandering to them nowadays. Talk about the mixed reception to different seasons by fans. We're a very reactionary community. Not without reason (TWICORN*COUGH*SHITTY THIRD SEASON*COUGH* TERRIBLE CHARACTERIZATION IN SEASON 2*COUGH*), but we can be mixed in reception and vitriol.

It shouldn't be a hour long fandom handjob, and it should exist for a reason, but if you're going to bring up negative shit, don't do it for its own sake.

So what you're saying is that if they had a documentary on bioware fans they should neglect to mention the death threats because other fandoms make them too? Isn't the point of a documentary to inform? While we're at it lets make a documentary on Stalin and ignore the killings since Hitler did them too.

"So why should any documentary give any air time to such subjective horse shit? Or even take it seriously? All that would do is send the message that "this argument may have legs" when in reality it doesn't"

From the sounds of it all it was was subjective bullshit in favor of the show, so why not have a few dissenting opinions, see the point about documentaries existing to inform, not reassert. If they are making a documentary with only one sided arguments, they aren't making a documentary, they are making propaganda. That being said, a documentary on the brony fandom does seem like it would be incredibly shallow as there isn't really anything to it. It's just a cartoon some people like.

 

[Zeldias]

Documentaries ought to comment on controversy. Otherwise, it's just X amount of minutes spent masturbating the material. Whether Rule 34 and all that should come up, I don't know, but if there have been beefs and bad shit bubbling in the fandom, it ought to be mentioned. Same way I'd expect someone plotting to craft a Tali sex doll to come up in a documentary about Mass Effect fans.

 

[Headdrivehardscrew]

Thanks to you (Thank you!), I just watched it.

My stance is still pretty much the same. MLP started out as cartoons to promote sales of plasticky toys for girls. I can accept that. When I was into Barbie, I watched Barbie crap. Down at the toy store, I also got exposed to He-Man animations, so I also got He-Man and some of his buddies. I got the pink whatever from Barbie, and the Skull castle from He-Man. The different proportions didn't matter much to me back then. I liked the fact that the males were fascinatingly muscular and about half the size of most of my female plastic puppet muppets.

Do I think it's smart for young, impressionable males to watch MLP? I am still conflicted about this one. I've met grown males that watched Sex in the City and were still exceptionally good, shallow fucks. Dedicated, but ADD-ish with anything emotional. Power consumers, power drillers. Nice fucks, that's it. Nothing that I wanted to enjoy for more than one night, one week or a month, though. Disposable heroes, so to speak.

I liked the guy keeping the old Benz alive.

I liked the Israeli sound artist.

I liked the inspiration and seemingly positivistic approach to isolated and otherwise straineous lives that obviously is present in the MLP/Brony community. If it allows these or any young men to survive, it's perfectly fine in my books; if it turns them all into feminist zombies, or otherwise easily impressionable adults and voters, it's no better than any other vehicle, intended to be such or not.

What I don't think I should keep from you is this one, single emotion: even after more than an hour of having watched it, I cannot shake feeling genuinely sad for everyone involved. There's just an overload of detachment, mute rebellion and the feeling of not belonging in whatever family, village, city or place they were born into. That shit never gets easy. We might find ways of making it feel better, but it's just so darn easy to get all twisted and confused in the process.

You might not like that. I am no Brony or Brony lover or MLP lover. If I met an adult male and found out he loved MLP, I'm not sure about how I'd respond.

If the love and everything is there, I think I'd rather let a male wear my clothes and get high on kinky shit than watch MLP. From where I stand, it really looks like a confusing and confused army of outcasts and freaks that get herded into yet another exploitative scheme. If my fictional, Pony-loving male mate would still fuck me like an animal and function as my very real significant other, why should I bother? I don't know. I don't know of any Pony-lover in my vicinity that's also a cool dude. Fact is, I don't know any Brony IRL. All the Bronies I know of are ethereal and online-only. And I don't feel like going to a Brony-con.

If it just empowers the individual, cool. If it ever gets abused by anyone, not so cool.

 

[Bashfluff]

I wouldn't expect a Pokemon documentary to comment on the pornography either. Indeed, people should look down on viewing sexual expression as a negative thing if they're not into it, because this sexually repressive and dumb attitude that marginalizes other is...dumb. and stupid.

Same thing with death threats and dumb fandom drama. Everyone knows it exists, because it exists everywhere. A documentary is not a debate with a set topic to discuss and provide arguments for and against, it's supposed to tell you about something, to inform you. It's supposed to be as impartial as you can make it. You can talk about the more questionable sides by talking about just how varied the amount of fan content is in regards to media and tone without being "OH MY GOD LOOK AT ALL THIS SMUT IT'S SO BAAAAD," which isn't a healthy attitude to have in your head or a tone in your documentary. That's not to say you can't say negative shit, you just have to prioritize and find...shit that's actually bad and not just weird.

Talk about Hasbro and our love-hate relationship with them, or how EQD has been pandering to them nowadays. Talk about the mixed reception to different seasons by fans. We're a very reactionary community. Not without reason (TWICORN*COUGH*SHITTY THIRD SEASON*COUGH* TERRIBLE CHARACTERIZATION IN SEASON 2*COUGH*), but we can be mixed in reception and vitriol.

It shouldn't be a hour long fandom handjob, and it should exist for a reason, but if you're going to bring up negative shit, don't do it for its own sake.

So what you're saying is that if they had a documentary on bioware fans they should neglect to mention the death threats because other fandoms make them too? Isn't the point of a documentary to inform? While we're at it lets make a documentary on Stalin and ignore the killings since Hitler did them too.

"So why should any documentary give any air time to such subjective horse shit? Or even take it seriously? All that would do is send the message that "this argument may have legs" when in reality it doesn't"

From the sounds of it all it was was subjective bullshit in favor of the show, so why not have a few dissenting opinions, see the point about documentaries existing to inform, not reassert. If they are making a documentary with only one sided arguments, they aren't making a documentary, they are making propaganda. That being said, a documentary on the brony fandom does seem like it would be incredibly shallow as there isn't really anything to it. It's just a cartoon some people like.

Yes! That's exactly what I'm saying. Every fandom has death threats. Every fandom has porn. Not every leader kills millions of people, which is why your comparison is dumb. Documentaries, again, aren't arguments. There shouldn't be negative shit about the show for its own sake. We don't talk about the rare purple chested troll fucker in nature documentaries and say, "Hey, but some people don't like this animal!"

No. A documentary is not an argument or a discussion. It's purpose is to tell you about the subject. This is the fandom. This is how it came to be, and this is why. This is how the internet reacted, this is the relationship to the different providers of the content, here's some notable stuff the fandom has done, and here is where the future of the fandom seems to be headed. It's not hard to make one of these, folks...

 

[Broderick]

The problem with the "Dark side" of the brony fandom is pinpointing what the "dark side" actually is as you said. Rule 34? Every fandom has that, and sexuality is not an inherently bad thing. You may say that is bad when applied to a children's tv show, but I think that is up for debate, and really depends on the characters in question (would pinkie or twilight be more "acceptable" to sexualize than say one of the children of the show?). I think the over reactions of fans and much of the drama is closer to a "dark side" than cartoon pony genitalia. I mean hell, the derpygate fiasco and the much more recent

Spoiler

Twilicorn

controversy speaks much more about the community. Also the various in fights with musicians and other "prominent" members of the mlp fandom would have been better to address. Like say... Yelling At Cats' song about derpy, where he specifically names and verbally berates a member of the fandom, which many believe to be part of the reason why derpy's voice was changed in later versions of a specific episode.

I have not seen the documentary, even though I myself was a backer of it. Many of the musicians and artists of the mlp fandom see the documentary as a huge circle jerk, and was disappointed in it. As for me? I will watch it when the time comes and pass judgement then.

That would be why I said I do not know if rule 34 should be applicable in this case. However, there still should've been some sort of negative aspect of it. Go talk to some people who find the love (or as the people who dislike bronies would say, "obsession") with the show to be unusual, bizarre, etc.

The point of documentaries is to educate people. In the type of documentary this brony one sounds to be, it sounds like it's the type of documentary intended to turn someone with a negative opinion of the culture so they can see it's just as normal and human as any other type of entertainment. But the way the OP made it out to be, it sounds as if all they're doing is putting out the positive elements. Putting in negative ones, no matter how minor, will allow the people against MLP fandom to see their opinion, stay drawn in to the documentary, and to watch the rest of it so they get a better understanding of bronies/pegasisters/etc.

The "dark side" of it is up to debate on what it should've been, but the OP's point on including some negative things still stands. However, as I've said, I haven't seen this documentary, so I'm just speculating based off of the OP's initial post.

Indeed, which is why I included some examples of negative aspects of the fandom in my post. I agree with you that it needs to show the good with the bad, I just think there are much better examples than rule 34, some of which you mentioned. I am agreeing with you mind you.

 

[secretkeeper12]

Yes! That's exactly what I'm saying. Every fandom has death threats. Every fandom has porn. Not every leader kills millions of people, which is why your comparison is dumb. Documentaries, again, aren't arguments. There shouldn't be negative shit about the show for its own sake. We don't talk about the rare purple chested troll fucker in nature documentaries and say, "Hey, but some people don't like this animal!"

No. A documentary is not an argument or a discussion. It's purpose is to tell you about the subject. This is the fandom. This is how it came to be, and this is why. This is how the internet reacted, this is the relationship to the different providers of the content, here's some notable stuff the fandom has done, and here is where the future of the fandom seems to be headed. It's not hard to make one of these, folks...

What about militant bronies who constantly insert ponies into every discussion? What about the controversy that occurred over the banning of a certain rule 34 artist (I believe the escapist had a thread on that very thing, even)? What about all sorts of other negative things that happen in the brony community? Dismissing them all by saying "they happen everywhere" is painfully weak.

 

[Reeve]

Don't you think you might be taking this too seriously? If I'm a fan of something, I'm a fan because it's fun.

 

[Section Crow]

I don't know about this mannn...

Documentaries are always going to be slim picking of the things they are trying to represent, its supposed to inform you to the best of the persons ability via the evidence provided and to be fair, this isn't a documentary about the war its about a large fanbase and i think the director person thing is just straining for some level of understanding of what a is a 'brony'.

I don't know what i'm writing but hell maybe someone can find some sense in it, i guess what i'm trying to say is that the people who watch this don't want to know about the arguments inside the fandom they just want to understand what a 'brony' is and why they have that word attached to their person or some shit about the director foraging his own definition of a brony.

gobbledygook above.

 

[Dangit2019]

Don't you think you might be taking this too seriously? If I'm a fan of something, I'm a fan because it's fun.

Wait, the show, or the documentary?

Because I don't usually put the show under any sort of microscope above a basic standard of a cartoon, but when someone makes a documentary with the pure intent of reassurance instead of information, than I just have a problem with that, and wish to discuss it. You know, on a discussion website.

 

[Bashfluff]

Yes! That's exactly what I'm saying. Every fandom has death threats. Every fandom has porn. Not every leader kills millions of people, which is why your comparison is dumb. Documentaries, again, aren't arguments. There shouldn't be negative shit about the show for its own sake. We don't talk about the rare purple chested troll fucker in nature documentaries and say, "Hey, but some people don't like this animal!"

No. A documentary is not an argument or a discussion. It's purpose is to tell you about the subject. This is the fandom. This is how it came to be, and this is why. This is how the internet reacted, this is the relationship to the different providers of the content, here's some notable stuff the fandom has done, and here is where the future of the fandom seems to be headed. It's not hard to make one of these, folks...

What about militant bronies who constantly insert ponies into every discussion? What about the controversy that occurred over the banning of a certain rule 34 artist (I believe the escapist had a thread on that very thing, even)? What about all sorts of other negative things that happen in the brony community? Dismissing them all by saying "they happen everywhere" is painfully weak.

I've already stated things that are not positive you could talk about in my op. People who are fanatical about their hobbies exist everywhere. I don't know what controversy you're talking about, but...how is that relevant? What negative things are you talked about? Be more specific. I'm not dismissing anything that's negative by saying they happen everywhere. I offered a few of my own.

 

[Reeve]

Don't you think you might be taking this too seriously? If I'm a fan of something, I'm a fan because it's fun.

Wait, the show, or the documentary?

Because I don't usually put the show under any sort of microscope above a basic standard of a cartoon, but when someone makes a documentary with the pure intent of reassurance instead of information, than I just have a problem with that, and wish to discuss it. You know, on a discussion website.

I think you are over-thinking this. Some people have made a "documentary" about things about a fan base that they enjoy. Why is this a problem? Do the makers of the video make the claim that they are giving a balanced, informative viewpoint on all possible aspects of the fandom, at any point?

 

[Dangit2019]

I think you are over-thinking this. Some people have made a "documentary" about things about a fan base that they enjoy. Why is this a problem?

Because it pretty much misrepresented the fan base that it said it wanted to represent.

Do the makers of the video make the claim that they are giving a balanced, informative viewpoint on all possible aspects of the fandom, at any point?

That's pretty much the point of any documentary: to inform the viewer of something. How good the documentary is is based on how well it informs people and the way that it does it.

This documentary, on the other hand, didn't want to inform people of a bigger picture, it wanted to spread deliberately information to further its cause (ie the textbook definition of propaganda).

Spoiler: also, if you're wondering why people would ***** so much about a stupid movie

 

[runic knight]

hmmm, not really my subject here, though I keep hearing people complain they didn't show the dark side of fandom. My first question was: For the star trek or star wars documentaries, did they mention the themed pornos that had been released? Pretty sure not. Why does this one have to?

Death threats... well, depends if we are talking mailed-in letter stalker-dome here or anonymous internet asshole territory. Sad, but it does make a difference.

 

[IamLEAM1983]

This is a bit strange. Isn't it par for the course for any given fandom to want to portray itself in the best possible light? I'm not condoning it, but it feels like something I'd do if I were part of a fairly rabid fandom. Take the Bronies who claim they'll "love and tolerate the shit out of me" because I dare to bring up a conflicting point of view? Isn't that passive-aggressive? You're not buying back the aggression quotient of "beating the shit out of me" by replacing "beating" with "loving and tolerating".

Considering, I'm pretty happy to report I'm the most casual Brony ever. I watch the show for the cameos and the animation styles, and I think I'm mature enough to admit this thing exists to push plastic shit and asinine grade-school morals. Even then, those morals are there because of E/I regulations; as you can bet your ass that Hasbro would want to get away with a female take on "Ren and Stimpy" if they could, in terms of cohesion and actual intent. Instead of getting cute little morals about friendship and teamwork and whatnot, we'd get an nth diatribe about shopping. Or something.

"My Little Pony: Getting My Parents' Visa Invoice to Spike into the Red Zone is Magic"

As for John De Lancie "spearheading" the documentary project, I'm cynical about that. It's already been mentioned that he's only ever participated in Trekkie conventions for the cash. On the whole, he seems like an excessively detached actor. As much as I enjoy Discord, he's nothing more and nothing less than a Q send-off, reworked into another occasion to showcase the power of Friendship with a capital F - because that's always decent filler when the old brain cells run dry.

As for the fun references I tune in for? They're mostly there to placate the potential young parents in our midst who might be stuck watching this with their progeny. Not necessarily because Lauren Faust's a geek and M.A. Larson's a geek and because there's a kind of Pop Culture Cred they need to prove they have and constantly have to invoke. The show's not proceeding ahead *for* the Bronies - it's proceeding ahead *in spite* of the Bronies. That's what the most rabid fans out there keep forgetting.

A poster above me mentioned feeling potentially uncomfortable around a guy who might've found validation or support throughout MLP. I'm tempted to agree, but I'm also reminded of Trekkie couples and Star Wars flings. I figure being a Brony and being "man" enough at the same time is more than possible. It just depends on your ability to understand that there's a time and a place for that Rainbow Dash hoodie of yours; a time and a place for show quotes or for showcasing your love of the series to others.

Take me. I used to watch a girls-oriented piece of fluff back in the early nineties, called "Sky Dancers". There was some world-building involved, which "Dragon Flyz" lacked. That was enough to draw me to the pastel colours and eternal mullets of the Wingdom. "Dragon Flyz" basically involved Winged Space Marines and the requisite Butch Girl who spent their time flying around, shooting at their demonic counterparts. Truly riveting stuff. The female-oriented series had its mythology, lore, background and character-developing moments, in comparison.

Does that mean I came to consider myself as the definitive authority on all things Sky Dancers? Of course not. I knew it was a shameless attempt at getting girls to buy fancy doll-shaped string-pulled propellers that were rumoured to have sliced open a few pre-teen eyes and faces. I knew it was utterly vapid and without any ounce of intellectual value.

You'd think people would still be able to do that with MLP. Because it parrots the word "friendship" a couple times, though, wouldn't ya know, it's all swell and dandy. Grade-A worthwhile entertainment, even for guys who aren't only of the wrong gender, but out of the target demographic by more than two decades, in some cases!

Like I said - it's more than a little bit strange, when you think about it. My guess is if "adult" cartoons weren't so exclusively gore-filled or focused on furthering a comically cynical view of the world, we wouldn't be forced to fall back onto MLP, Foster's or Adventure Time. If anything, this proves some persons are still looking for some nicely humble and cheery cartoons, well into their thirties.

 

[Limecake]

I might watch it, I am not a fan of the show at all but if the documentary is fair and offers something other than "some men watch cartoons" it might be worth watching. But if it's just a movie praising the culture of bronies than I'll pass. watching MLP doesn't make you lame but it's not fair to assume all fans of MLP are Casanova's

for example this cringe worthy video:

Spoiler

 

[Dangit2019]

But if it's just a movie praising the culture of bronies than I'll pass. watching MLP doesn't make you lame but it's not fair to assume all fans of MLP are Casanova's

Oh, it is absolutely that for an hour and half. When it gets to a point where I and other bronies start calling bullshit on how saccharine it is, it's safe to assume that it's that bad.

 

[Extra-Ordinary]

Don't you think you might be taking this too seriously? If I'm a fan of something, I'm a fan because it's fun.

Same here.
"Hey, look at this thing. Do I enjoy this thing? Yes. I want more of this thing."
Anyway.
That's a shame, while having a positive attitude is nice, you need to take the bad with the good to balance it out, you know?

Captcha: easy as cake
If only, Captcha, if only...

 

[Hyenatempest]

So BashFluff...

So it's meant to tell you about a subject...but only the good parts. Because documentaries on the Nazis and the Belgian Congo Company seem to miss that. And I don't see Vietnam documentaries talking about the nice weather and friendly locals playing tag in the street with American soldiers. I guess if somebody made a documentary about you they would have to neglect the eating lead paint chips.

 

[Hyenatempest]

hmmm, not really my subject here, though I keep hearing people complain they didn't show the dark side of fandom. My first question was: For the star trek or star wars documentaries, did they mention the themed pornos that had been released? Pretty sure not. Why does this one have to?

Death threats... well, depends if we are talking mailed-in letter stalker-dome here or anonymous internet asshole territory. Sad, but it does make a difference.

Were these documentaries about the show itself or about the fans? Because if it's about the show, then themed porn would likely be out of it's scope. If it's about the fans however, then you I would think it deserves a mention, even if brief.

And yes, the death threats should probably be mentioned.

 

[MrHide-Patten]

MLP is one of those funny phenomenas that I like sticking me head into see what kindof crazy crap they'll be up to now, but have never been interested in the show (sisters watched thesis out of it when they were kids, stopping me from watching Dinosaur Riders, and it was too cute for me to bear watching.)

But I'll throw in my two cents, as with a lot of comments I've seen the 'every fandom gets rule 34'd, so what makes MLPso special", well as about arts enthusiast. I can tell that if anything defined the phrase it would definitely be MLP. There's so much porn of it, they've often been given their own boards away from the others, and their own bloody sections. They're also the least sexiest things I've seen, how anybody thinks they're sexy escapes me.

Also the "we're not like Furries in any way", yeah like sports fans are nothing like nerds.