Why do people say Crysis 1 is a "generic shooter" ?

[Treblaine]

le snip

I just want to add, I played Crysis 1 just now and the max-speed sprint speed is not super fast, it is almost exactly the same as the sprint in Crysis 2, only the suit energy is consumed faster and you have a neato "vvvVVVVVRRRRRT!" noise.

"In Crysis 2, you slowly run out of energy if you're holding someone"
then
"And so Crysis 1 was far more strategic because of the lesser amount of suit energy and slower recharge"

So when Crysis 1 has negative things it's "more strategic" but when Crysis 2 has other equivalent limitations it is "more constrained".

Crysis 2 looks fantastic with the latest patch that brings out a whole load of the best features of graphics rendering on PC. It really gives the game depth and life, moreso than stereoscopic 3d could though that is also an option.

PS: I hope Crysis 3 doesn't go back to its bad old habits of those crap divisions of modes, but it would only have to be slightly more open than Crysis 2 to be as open as Crysis 1.

 

[Breadline]

le snip

I'd like to focus in on this quote that seem to underpin the centre of your argument:

"My point is that mixing the powers into each other or automating them defeats the whole idea."

Well that's YOUR idea of the way the game should be.

...Exactly. I'm glad we're making progress. Though many things I've sad have been factually correct, I've so far left it up to you to understand that when I do make a statement on a subjective matter, I'm doing so based on my own opinion.

But did you stop to consider people liked the abilities themselves not the fact that they were LIMITED by being subdivided into discrete modes - that it didn't help how it wasn't as quick and intuitive to switch between them as they could be.

I assume you used the word limited to try and turn it around on me in a cliched attempt to undermine my argument by using the same one for your side, very clever there. But I've specified time and time again that this is an issue I have with the player's control over the suit being limited. The number of ways and reasons that you the player can consciously and often effectively use it is reduced in Crysis 2.

And I'm guessing you haven't stopped to consider the other perspective either? You know, my perspective, which is similar to the perspective of all those people who thought Crysis 2 was a step back. You say I haven't considered the other side when I have actually agreed with things you've said multiple times, like how the controls are easier. I'm only continuing because you have the arrogance to claim to have "proven" me wrong using flawed, often completely incorrect pseudo-logic, as well as straight up deciding that you have refuted everything I say no matter how much you get factually wrong nor how much you actually failed to correctly and objectively refute anything.

I actually had a chance to fire up Crysis 1 recently and discovered I accepted quite a lot of nonsense you claimed on bad faith:
-In Crysis 1 you cannot jump AT ALL while sprinting, in any mode! Using suit-shortcuts Double tapping jump while sprinting not only do you not jump, but you don't change modes at all.
-Entering radial menu instantly breaks sprint momentum.
-Combining forward velocity of Max-sprint and vertical thrust of Max-strength jump is impossible the way you claim.
-double tapping jump any other time may activate a super-jump but then you are left in strength mode!
-Speed mode has absolutely no effect on reload speed of any of the weapons
-half the trees I found in the jungle in Crysis 1 were indestructible and in fact only a few select trees were in any way destructible
-I also discovered the pistol has a really low fire-cap (about 300rpm)

Just to make sure I wasn't crazy and accidentally devaluing my argument due to not having played in a while, I tried Crysis 1 out a bit also:

-You absolutely can jump while sprinting in any mode. I am literally sprinting back and forth in an out of speed mood and jumping without letting go of sprint. You also continue sprinting if it's still held down when you land. I don't know if you said this because you thought I wouldn't check or because you legitimately have a technical issue. Could be your keyboard is ghosting.

-Entering the radial menu absolutely does not break sprint momentum. Again, not sure what you're thinking. Not only can you continue sprinting with the radial menu open but you can even stop and start sprinting while it's open. Including in speed mode.

-And what exactly did I claim about combining strength jump with maximum speed? I only remember responding to you to say that you can double tap space while sprinting in speed. Though regardless, I'm testing it now and you do go further, even though for a long jump you'd want to just jump once. The distance you get from speed sprinting and strength jumping is slightly less than the center point between regular sprint with strength jump and a long jump using max speed.

Try it, choose a spot and strength jump while sprinting with and without max speed. Check your footprints or go into devmode to make sure you jumped from the same spot each time. Also, interesting tidbit, normal running (not sprinting) in speed mode is slightly faster than sprinting in the other modes.

-Yes you're left in strength mode when you double tap jump, good job. Is that part of my "nonsense I claimed that you accepted in bad faith"?

-Speed mode absolutely increases reload speed, as well as makes you move faster in every stance, switch weapons faster, throw grenades faster, etc, but the reload speed is negligible for some of the earlier weapons. I'm guessing by "Speed mode has absolutely no effect on reload speed of any of the weapons" you meant the Crysis 1 starting weapons. Increasing the reload speed when in speed mode is even a mod-able value you can see in weapon mods.

-All the tall palm trees are destructible. They can be broken into multiple pieces and picked up/thrown. I'm not sure what your point was though.

-Um... how is the pistol's rate of fire "nonsense that I claimed"?

I have no mods installed, non-Steam version. I don't think it's fully patched, but I'm not sure.

So were you just making things up or is this more of the "proving" me wrong using a vague "it's close enough to me to not really matter" line of reasoning? I noticed you made no effort to respond to pretty much most of my last post except to make the "yeah well that's just your opinion, man" statement.

 

[Don Savik]

Wow this thread turned into a nitpicking of why the first game is better than the second. Or vice versa.

Wasn't it about people calling it a generic shooter?

Strange how these things unfold.

 

[Treblaine]

But did you stop to consider people liked the abilities themselves not the fact that they were LIMITED by being subdivided into discrete modes - that it didn't help how it wasn't as quick and intuitive to switch between them as they could be.

I assume you used the word limited to try and turn it around on me in a cliched

Might want to look up the term "Cliched" or what a Cliché actually is.

The number of ways and reasons that you the player can consciously and often effectively use it (control over the suit) is reduced in Crysis 2.

For example? It would be nice to get one.

I actually had a chance to fire up Crysis 1 recently and discovered I accepted quite a lot of nonsense you claimed on bad faith:
-In Crysis 1 you cannot jump AT ALL while sprinting, in any mode! Using suit-shortcuts Double tapping jump while sprinting not only do you not jump, but you don't change modes at all.
-Entering radial menu instantly breaks sprint momentum.
-Combining forward velocity of Max-sprint and vertical thrust of Max-strength jump is impossible the way you claim.
-double tapping jump any other time may activate a super-jump but then you are left in strength mode!
-Speed mode has absolutely no effect on reload speed of any of the weapons
-half the trees I found in the jungle in Crysis 1 were indestructible and in fact only a few select trees were in any way destructible
-I also discovered the pistol has a really low fire-cap (about 300rpm)

Just to make sure I wasn't crazy and accidentally devaluing my argument due to not having played in a while, I tried Crysis 1 out a bit also:

-You absolutely can jump while sprinting in any mode. I am literally sprinting back and forth in an out of speed mode and jumping without letting go of sprint. You also continue sprinting if it's still held down when you land. I don't know if you said this because you thought I wouldn't check or because you legitimately have a technical issue. Could be your keyboard is ghosting.

-Entering the radial menu absolutely does not break sprint momentum. Again, not sure what you're thinking. Not only can you continue sprinting with the radial menu open but you can even stop and start sprinting while it's open. Including in speed mode.

-And what exactly did I claim about combining strength jump with maximum speed? I only remember responding to you to say that you can double tap space while sprinting in speed. Though regardless, I'm testing it now and you do go further, even though for a long jump you'd want to just jump once. The distance you get from speed sprinting and strength jumping is slightly less than the center point between regular sprint with strength jump and a long jump using max speed.

Try it, choose a spot and strength jump while sprinting with and without max speed. Check your footprints or go into devmode to make sure you jumped from the same spot each time. Also, interesting tidbit, normal running (not sprinting) in speed mode is slightly faster than sprinting in the other modes.

-Yes you're left in strength mode when you double tap jump, good job. Is that part of my "nonsense I claimed that you accepted in bad faith"?

-Speed mode absolutely increases reload speed, as well as makes you move faster in every stance, switch weapons faster, throw grenades faster, etc, but the reload speed is negligible for some of the earlier weapons. I'm guessing by "Speed mode has absolutely no effect on reload speed of any of the weapons" you meant the Crysis 1 starting weapons. Increasing the reload speed when in speed mode is even a mod-able value you can see in weapon mods.

-All the tall palm trees are destructible. They can be broken into multiple pieces and picked up/thrown. I'm not sure what your point was though.

-Um... how is the pistol's rate of fire "nonsense that I claimed"?

I have no mods installed, non-Steam version. I don't think it's fully patched, but I'm not sure.

So were you just making things up or is this more of the "proving" me wrong using a vague "it's close enough to me to not really matter" line of reasoning? I noticed you made no effort to respond to pretty much most of my last post except to make the "yeah well that's just your opinion, man" statement.

OK, Pistol was exactly not any of your claims though I did notice it at the time and is illustrative of how Crysis 1 is quite suckier than Crysis 2 in terms of controls, with such a low firecap and (I might add) huge visual recoil, it makes the pistol worthless which you might realise makes it worthless carrying pistol plus two assault weapons. This all added to my impression that Crysis felt very lame compared to Crysis 2.

-Well I AM holding sprint down and I tap space (jump key), double and triple tap it, hold it down and I cannot jump at all, no suit mode changes either. I try to let go of sprint and jump I have lost forward velocity by the time I jump. Are you using the Special Edition? I hear that has many unique control features that are jealously held back from everyone else. EA ARE dicks in that kind of way.

-Using the Radial menu does break my sprint. I practised for half an hour and I could not switch fast enough.

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

"And what exactly did I claim about combining strength jump with maximum speed? I only remember responding to you to say that you can double tap space while sprinting in speed."

Earlier: "Double tap sprint to go into max speed, then double tap jump to max jump. Bam. No it isn't as elegant as it could be, but it's no more inelegant than having to hold the jump button down. You also can use the radial menu (which is normally what I do) because you do retain momentum from maximum speed for a short time."

-It's a bad thing to be left in strength mode when you just want to perform one strength mode but want to either not be in Max0Strength mode or in some other discrete mode.

-"Speed mode absolutely increases reload speed"
Sure, in no noticeable way. You're going to need sources to back up your claim. I'll work on filming myself sprinting and tapping jump key to no effect but I don't have a video camera.

-while it's true all the tall thin trees are destructible in Crysis, not all the trees in Crysis 1 are tall palm trees. I have found all the tall thin trees in Crysis 2 are destructible and similar between Crysis 1 and Crysis 2 heavily branching trees are indestructible as well as other complex objects that you might think would be fragile, like fences and benches and crates.

So to bring this a bit more back on topic: I remember being hugely underwhelmed by Crysis 1. I loved all the abilities but it was just plain frustrating to try to actually use them so without those it really did feel very generic, it wasn't very special. But Crysis 2, I found exceptional even though being essentially the exact same game as Crysis 1 but with improved controls.

 

[endtherapture]

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

Max-speed-sprint to max strength jump in Crysis 2 is like toddling forward like a scared duck for 10 feet before your energy runs out, then stopping and bouncing into the air for 3 seconds. It is pointless

You run at like...running speed, as opposed to running faster than a car.

In Crysis 1 you can do a dolphin dive out of the water by doing maximum speed underwater heading for the surface and catapult yourself onto boats. It's awesome.

 

[Treblaine]

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

Max-speed-sprint to max strength jump in Crysis 2 is like toddling forward like a scared duck for 10 feet before your energy runs out, then stopping and bouncing into the air for 3 seconds. It is pointless

You run at like...running speed, as opposed to running faster than a car.

In Crysis 1 you can do a dolphin dive out of the water by doing maximum speed underwater heading for the surface and catapult yourself onto boats. It's awesome.

Whereas Max-speed to Max-jump is all but impossible in Crysis 1. In Crysis 2 you sprint at over 25 miles per hour, for those who claim sprint speed is significantly slower than Crysis 1, I'd like to see some evidence of this and that it isn't just subjective impression from the "VVRRRROOT" noise.

"before your energy runs out"

Seriously? Crysis 2 gives you way more energy for both sprint, cloak and Max-armour as well as recharging quicker.

Crysis 2 is is so intuitive and flexible not to mention POSSIBLE to super-sprint + Super jump for those huge leaps of maximum horizontal and vertical velocity.

Captcha: jump higher

 

[endtherapture]

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

Max-speed-sprint to max strength jump in Crysis 2 is like toddling forward like a scared duck for 10 feet before your energy runs out, then stopping and bouncing into the air for 3 seconds. It is pointless

You run at like...running speed, as opposed to running faster than a car.

In Crysis 1 you can do a dolphin dive out of the water by doing maximum speed underwater heading for the surface and catapult yourself onto boats. It's awesome.

Whereas Max-speed to Max-jump is all but impossible in Crysis 1. In Crysis 2 you sprint at over 25 miles per hour, for those who claim sprint speed is significantly slower than Crysis 1, I'd like to see some evidence of this and that it isn't just subjective impression from the "VVRRRROOT" noise.

"before your energy runs out"

Seriously? Crysis 2 gives you way more energy for both sprint, cloak and Max-armour as well as recharging quicker.

Crysis 2 is is so intuitive and flexible not to mention POSSIBLE to super-sprint + Super jump for those huge leaps of maximum horizontal and vertical velocity.

Captcha: jump higher

Jump in Strength mode in Crysis 1 makes you jump higher. Jump in Strength mode in Crysis 2 also makes you jump higher but it takes longer to activate.

In Speed Mode in Crysis 1 you can run along at like 70 miles per hour for about 5 seconds then tap jump and you go flying another 20 meters or something and it's great, but in Crysis 2 sprint is just a normal FPS slightly faster than running sprint which sucks.

 

[Treblaine]

Jump in Strength mode in Crysis 1 makes you jump higher. Jump in Strength mode in Crysis 2 also makes you jump higher but it takes longer to activate.

In Speed Mode in Crysis 1 you can run along at like 70 miles per hour for about 5 seconds then tap jump and you go flying another 20 meters or something and it's great, but in Crysis 2 sprint is just a normal FPS slightly faster than running sprint which sucks.

Jump height is the same in Crysis 1 and Crysis 2 while Crysis 2 has the added feature of ability to scramble up ledges so you can actually get to greater heights. It also doesn't take any significantly longer time to acticate.

Again, what version of Crysis are you playing?!? I sprint and hammer and hold down the jump-key, I cannot jump at all. I try to lift off on sprint key and tap jump quick enough I COULD NOT do it lifting off enough to retain forward velocity.

In Crysis 2 when sprinting I can jump IMMEDIATELY by tapping jump key, I can super jump while sprinting by just holding down jump key for 0.2 sec.

HUGE exaggeration to say you can Max-Speed sprint for 5 seconds in Crysis 1.


At 1:05, about 2 seconds.


10 seconds of continuous sprint, about 2x further. Way further and while it is a bit slower, it's actually at a manageable speed. And the upgrades increase Crysis 2's sprint speed even more. Also see the demonstration of the Cloak mode, how it actually gives you enough cloak time to do ANYTHING and sprint in cloak without ruining it.

And people say the controls in Crysis 2 are worse. ARE THEY EVEN PLAYING THE SAME GAME!?!?

 

[Breadline]

For example? It would be nice to get one.

Um, are you serious? Half this thread has been me giving examples. FOR EXAMPLE, everything in speed mode is now automated. Do you remember me saying that?

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

...

Earlier: "Double tap sprint to go into max speed, then double tap jump to max jump. Bam. No it isn't as elegant as it could be, but it's no more inelegant than having to hold the jump button down. You also can use the radial menu (which is normally what I do) because you do retain momentum from maximum speed for a short time."

Again, are you serious? I admit, using the radial menu to switch to strength mode and jump during a speed sprint is way harder than I thought, I must have been remembering that wrong. But literally two sentences above the part you bolded, in the same quote, I mention double tapping jump. You're just picking and choosing.

Even though I meticulously laid out how even you could see for yourself, you still claim that you can't strength jump while speed sprinting. It is absolutely, objectively, 100% factually true that you can strength jump while speed sprinting, and you get more distance. And again you demonstrate that you either refuse to acknowledge or just don't understand that I keep saying my point is the player's control is limited.

I never buy collectors/special editions, so no I'm not using that.

I said the player's control over the suit is limited, you said blatantly there there are "no limitations, no compromises". You said you proved me wrong when you only tried to do so by relating points that don't inherently relate. Saying that a different feature or aspect being improved makes up for whatever complaint I have is you compromising. You also said I claimed nonsense when all that "nonsense" was either you being plain incorrect or spouting off unrelated grievances you have with the game.

 

[Treblaine]

For example? It would be nice to get one.

Um, are you serious? Half this thread has been me giving examples. FOR EXAMPLE, everything in speed mode is now automated. Do you remember me saying that?

That was in question of:
"The number of ways and reasons that you the player can consciously and often effectively use it (control over the suit) is reduced in Crysis 2."

So, you allege Reduced:
-conscious use of suit powers, and
-effective use of suit powers

Of which you have yet to give a TRUE example of.

No conscious control is not lost. Nothing will ever happen unless you command it to. You will only sprint if you command it to. And it is far more effective to have one button to activate sprint and to combine with other active modes.

"everything in speed mode is now automated"


Automated:
1.
a. Acting or operating in a manner essentially independent of external influence or control: an automatic light switch; a budget deficit that triggered automatic spending cuts.
b. Self-regulating: an automatic washing machine.
2.
a. Acting or done without volition or conscious control; involuntary: automatic shrinking of the pupils of the eyes in strong light. See Synonyms at spontaneous.
b. Acting or done as if by machine; mechanical: an automatic reply to a familiar question.

The only function of Max-Speed Suit mode is the increased movement and sprint speed where that functionality exists in Crysis 2 as a sprint, that can only be activated by conscious and willing control. No functionality lost. Not automatic, by definition. Of and in both Crysis 1 and 2 reload speed for all the weapons are constant between suit-modes. It's never stated in any official sources (I can find) that that is a variable in Crysis 1, the burden of proof in on your to prove that.

Please explain how it is less effective to have one button activation that doesn't interrupt and is able to combine suit powers? And to be able to move for longer in super sprint and with Cloak-Engaged?

Also, explain how being able to intuitively deliver a super punch/jump by pressing the semantically same button but holding down (for a very short time) rather than just tapping be less efficient? For the overwhelming majority of gamers it will be too distracting and take so long to switch to strength mode it isn't worth it.

-You claimed that Controls over the suit were limited in Crysis 2. Yet if you can combine Max-Speed-Sprint AND max-strength jump in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 then that is a huge limitation on Crysis 1.

...

Earlier: "Double tap sprint to go into max speed, then double tap jump to max jump. Bam. No it isn't as elegant as it could be, but it's no more inelegant than having to hold the jump button down. You also can use the radial menu (which is normally what I do) because you do retain momentum from maximum speed for a short time."

Again, are you serious? I admit, using the radial menu to switch to strength mode and jump during a speed sprint is way harder than I thought, I must have been remembering that wrong. But literally two sentences above the part you bolded, in the same quote, I mention double tapping jump. You're just picking and choosing.

Even though I meticulously laid out how even you could see for yourself, you still claim that you can't strength jump while speed sprinting. It is absolutely, objectively, 100% factually true that you can strength jump while speed sprinting, and you get more distance. And again you demonstrate that you either refuse to acknowledge or just don't understand that I keep saying my point is the player's control is limited.

I never buy collectors/special editions, so no I'm not using that.

I said the player's control over the suit is limited, you said blatantly there there are "no limitations, no compromises". You said you proved me wrong when you only tried to do so by relating points that don't inherently relate. Saying that a different feature or aspect being improved makes up for whatever complaint I have is you compromising. You also said I claimed nonsense when all that "nonsense" was either you being plain incorrect or spouting off unrelated grievances you have with the game.

What part of this don't you get: When I play Crysis on PC, I CANNOT jump while in sprint! Jump key does nothing!

Have you ACTUALLY tested this or are you just making assumptions? I have sprinted in every mode (including max speed) and tapping or holding the jump key does NOTHING. Explain that. Are you ABSOLUTELY POSITIVE that you can jump while holding down the sprint key? Because I showed this to several of my friends who also play Crysis who noticed the same thing. You've already admitted to misremembering the ability to use the radial menu that you so vociferously objected to my claim of inability to super sprint and super jump in crysis 1:

"You also can use the radial menu (which is normally what I do) because you do retain momentum from maximum speed for a short time."

So when you say this:

"It is absolutely, objectively, 100% factually true that you can strength jump while speed sprinting"

Very well then: Prove it.

You make the claim, you provide the evidence. I have looked for the evidence myself and no where in any speed runs of Crysis 1 can find Max-speed-sprint simultaneously combined with max-strength-jump. I see a lot of either, but apparently none of them combined! And of course my contrary evidence of actually testing it myself in my copy of the game on Steam.

As it stands I CANNOT jump at all while sprinting in Crysis 1, while in Crysis 2 while sprinting I can easily and accurately perform the super jump (the hold-time is no where near as long as you are implying, it is WAY faster than you could use radial menu or double tap space) and even better I can grab onto ledges and pull myself up giving even more vertical movement.

This is not limited.

If I can easily do that in Crysis 2 but not in Crysis 1 that makes the controls of the former far inferior due to their limitations.

"you proved me wrong when you only tried to do so by relating points that don't inherently relate."

It is entirely related to talk about suit controls when the subject in the games suit controls. I have stayed entirely related to Crysis in comparison to its sequel and how lame it is compared to Crysis 2.

There is no compromise in the sense you mean it. I have to be careful with you, as you are so pejorative with neutral terms like compromise. Like how a console port is compromised.

I have shown how all the objections over Crysis 2's controls do not stand up to scrutiny, so what is the reason for the displeasure? I think there was backlash against Crysis 2 not being a PC exclusive that it got panned in ways it never would if the PS3+360 versions never saw the light of day, even if Crysis 2 was EXACTLY the same on PC as it was on release. It would be hailed for it's improvements rather than derided by insinuation as a sellout to console mediocrity. Nope. It excelled over Crysis 1 only it's been pissed on as if these changes in any way dumbed down the game.

All this nonsense about Automation in Crysis 2, all these false claims about the practicality of Crysis 1's controls. Where does it come from?

 

[Breadline]

No conscious control is not lost. Nothing will ever happen unless you command it to. You will only sprint if you command it to. And it is far more effective to have one button to activate sprint and to combine with other active modes.

"everything in speed mode is now automated"

Automated:
1.
a. Acting or operating in a manner essentially independent of external influence or control: an automatic light switch; a budget deficit that triggered automatic spending cuts.
b. Self-regulating: an automatic washing machine.
2.
a. Acting or done without volition or conscious control; involuntary: automatic shrinking of the pupils of the eyes in strong light. See Synonyms at spontaneous.
b. Acting or done as if by machine; mechanical: an automatic reply to a familiar question.

The only function of Max-Speed Suit mode is the increased movement and sprint speed where that functionality exists in Crysis 2 as a sprint, that can only be activated by conscious and willing control. No functionality lost. Not automatic, by definition. Of and in both Crysis 1 and 2 reload speed for all the weapons are constant between suit-modes. It's never stated in any official sources (I can find) that that is a variable in Crysis 1, the burden of proof in on your to prove that.

Let's use an example from the definition you posted. "Self-regulating: an automatic washing machine." The washing machine works on its own, but you have to put the clothes in there and start it. Similarly, you consciously decide to reload, but maximum speed works automatically. You cannot decide between reloading normally and reloading with maximum speed, only reload. Maximum speed (which probably doesn't even occur except in sprints in Crysis 2 because there's no indication it's been activated - I'm assuming this for your benefit) only operates automatically, there's no instance where you can just choose it.

In the same way, you can decide to sprint but not whether or not to use maximum speed with that sprint. The game decides for you. Do you get this? The action of sprinting, reloading, whatever is consciously made, but the suit power activates automatically in conjunction with those actions. You make no conscious effort to go into speed mode, you hit sprint and the game puts you in speed mode automatically.

Back to my ultimate attack analogy, would you think one button to automatically kill everyone in your line of sight doesn't limit the player's control? None of it is automatic, right, because the player consciously decides to press the ultimate attack button and it all performs the same function and pointing your mouse and them and clicking. This is using the same reasoning you are when you say max speed isn't automatic when you press sprint.

And increasing movement and sprint speed is not the only function of max speed, at least not in Crysis 1 (increased movement in standing, crouch, prone, faster reload, faster weapon switch, faster punches, faster throws for objects and grenades). But even then, in Crysis 2 it only increases sprint speed (and only during sprint at that), not general movement speed. Look at the video I posted a couple pages back, that guy goes into speed mode a lot and he rarely actually sprints in it. He also jumps while sprinting. Also, the wiki you seem to love says this: "The increased dexterity of Speed Mode also allows the user to prepare heavy weapons and (Depending on the firearm) reload at an increased speed. ...The user can also switch to Strength Mode while sprinting and immediately jump for an even longer distance, since there is a very short period of time in which the two modes can be combined."

Also, explain how being able to intuitively deliver a super punch/jump by pressing the semantically same button but holding down (for a very short time) rather than just tapping be less efficient? For the overwhelming majority of gamers it will be too distracting and take so long to switch to strength mode it isn't worth it.

So are you trying to argue another vague general statement? Is this a majority wins sort of thing where you've just made up the majority? Double tapping for strength jump or melee happens instantly. If you actually tried it, you'd see that when you tap jump you immediately jump, and tap it again quickly after makes you go higher. You're already jumping by the time you decide to strength jump. It just adds on to your regular jump. You understand that immediate is objectively less amount of time than whatever "very short time" it takes in Crysis 2, right?

Have you ACTUALLY tested this or are you just making assumptions? I have sprinted in every mode (including max speed) and tapping or holding the jump key does NOTHING. Explain that. Are you ABSOLUTELY POSITIVE that you can jump while holding down the sprint key? Because I showed this to several of my friends who also play Crysis who noticed the same thing. You've already admitted to misremembering the ability to use the radial menu that you so vociferously objected to my claim of inability to super sprint and super jump in crysis 1:

"You also can use the radial menu (which is normally what I do) because you do retain momentum from maximum speed for a short time."

So when you say this:

"It is absolutely, objectively, 100% factually true that you can strength jump while speed sprinting"

Very well then: Prove it.

You make the claim, you provide the evidence. I have looked for the evidence myself and no where in any speed runs of Crysis 1 can find Max-speed-sprint simultaneously combined with max-strength-jump. I see a lot of either, but apparently none of them combined! And of course my contrary evidence of actually testing it myself in my copy of the game on Steam.

It's amazing that in all these speed runs of Crysis you haven't seen anyone jump while sprinting. Or you have and ignored it. Here's a video. There's also jumping while sprinting in there to show you it's definitely a thing. Notice how Nomad's hands are held up in the screen whenever you jump while sprinting.

I have shown how all the objections over Crysis 2's controls do not stand up to scrutiny, so what is the reason for the displeasure? I think there was backlash against Crysis 2 not being a PC exclusive that it got panned in ways it never would if the PS3+360 versions never saw the light of day, even if Crysis 2 was EXACTLY the same on PC as it was on release. It would be hailed for it's improvements rather than derided by insinuation as a sellout to console mediocrity. Nope. It excelled over Crysis 1 only it's been pissed on as if these changes in any way dumbed down the game.

I have not once brought this up, but you have multiple times for some reason. I've said I don't mind the Crysis series being on consoles. I think Crytek definitely deserves the money and the series deserves exposure.

 

[Treblaine]

Let's use an example from the definition you posted. "Self-regulating: an automatic washing machine." The washing machine works on its own, but you have to put the clothes in there and start it. Similarly, you consciously decide to reload, but maximum speed works automatically. You cannot decide between reloading normally and reloading with maximum speed, only reload. Maximum speed (which probably doesn't even occur except in sprints in Crysis 2 because there's no indication it's been activated - I'm assuming this for your benefit) only operates automatically, there's no instance where you can just choose it.

In the same way, you can decide to sprint but not whether or not to use maximum speed with that sprint. The game decides for you. Do you get this? The action of sprinting, reloading, whatever is consciously made, but the suit power activates automatically in conjunction with those actions. You make no conscious effort to go into speed mode, you hit sprint and the game puts you in speed mode automatically.

Back to my ultimate attack analogy, would you think one button to automatically kill everyone in your line of sight doesn't limit the player's control? None of it is automatic, right, because the player consciously decides to press the ultimate attack button and it all performs the same function and pointing your mouse and them and clicking. This is using the same reasoning you are when you say max speed isn't automatic when you press sprint.

And increasing movement and sprint speed is not the only function of max speed, at least not in Crysis 1 (increased movement in standing, crouch, prone, faster reload, faster weapon switch, faster punches, faster throws for objects and grenades). But even then, in Crysis 2 it only increases sprint speed (and only during sprint at that), not general movement speed. Look at the video I posted a couple pages back, that guy goes into speed mode a lot and he rarely actually sprints in it. He also jumps while sprinting. Also, the wiki you seem to love says this: "The increased dexterity of Speed Mode also allows the user to prepare heavy weapons and (Depending on the firearm) reload at an increased speed. ...The user can also switch to Strength Mode while sprinting and immediately jump for an even longer distance, since there is a very short period of time in which the two modes can be combined."

"And increasing movement and sprint speed is not the only function of max speed"

Bold claim. Contradicts everything I find in my game. So, can you prove this? Please show which weapons reload quicker in Maximum-Speed mode of Crysis 1? Or any other speed increased in Max-speed mode?

(doesn't matter if you have a version with completely different functionality from mine)

"would you think one button to automatically kill everyone in your line of sight doesn't limit the player's control?"

Nope. That's not what I am arguing for. That is ridiculous overkill going beyond any of the abilities in Crysis 1 or Crysis 2. That is a straw-man argument. This is none of the same reasoning as you have inserted outrageous new idea of an ability that insta kills everyone. Sprint is actually slower in Crysis 2 but takes you further. My argument has been for the same abilities being slightly more or less powerful but ultimately the same being EASIER to actually use, so not all of them divided into 4 discrete modes. That would make for better controls without any automation.

You are setting a fallacious baseline by saying "speed mode reload is automatically applied in Crysis 2" when it could be that reload speed IS the reload speed and it's a fallacy to associate it with any particular suit-mode. It is neither limited nor automated.

Please, I explain what is going on as I am running the Steam version of Crysis, do you have the Non Steam version?!?!?

Also, explain how being able to intuitively deliver a super punch/jump by pressing the semantically same button but holding down (for a very short time) rather than just tapping be less efficient? For the overwhelming majority of gamers it will be too distracting and take so long to switch to strength mode it isn't worth it.

So are you trying to argue another vague general statement? Is this a majority wins sort of thing where you've just made up the majority? Double tapping for strength jump or melee happens instantly. If you actually tried it, you'd see that when you tap jump you immediately jump, and tap it again quickly after makes you go higher. You're already jumping by the time you decide to strength jump. It just adds on to your regular jump. You understand that immediate is objectively less amount of time than whatever "very short time" it takes in Crysis 2, right?

So are you claiming the majority of gamers found Crysis 1 controls easy to use and utilise all the abilities of each mode? Everyone I ask other than you found Crysis 1 controls a right pain and you yourself admit that Max-speed-Sprint + Max-strength-jump is hard when it should be easy. PS: they all ran the steam version.

It takes about 0.2 seconds to super-punch someone in Crysis 2. But in Crysis 1 you have to double tap jump to jump then super jump up in the air (disabling your armour mode that you need to not get killed by a single burst of fire) then aim and close to melee on them. Or use the radial menu temporarily disabling your ability to aim and use of one of your fingers and easily ending up in the wrong mode your your mouse shifting so far off centre you have to inconveniently re-centre it and further delay.

It's amazing that in all these speed runs of Crysis you haven't seen anyone jump while sprinting. Or you have and ignored it. Here's a video. There's also jumping while sprinting in there to show you it's definitely a thing. Notice how Nomad's hands are held up in the screen whenever you jump while sprinting.

I take it that is Your video on Your account? As it would be quite improbable finding precisely the video you need within a few hours of it being posted. So you can clarify that when jumping-while-sprinting at no point did you lift your finger off the sprint key?

If that is the case then we have nothing more to argue, as we are clearly playing COMPLETELY DIFFERENT VERSIONS of the same game!

While I sprint in MY version of Crysis 1 the jump key DOES NOTHING:
-I cannot jump
-I cannot switch to Max-strength
-I cannot use any of suit shortcuts while sprinting yet can as soon as I let off sprint key (I double and triple checked I had suit-shortcuts activated)
-This is same for all suit modes

I'm not lying to you and I'm not angry at you, I am angry at EA for releasing a game that are apparently identical but clearly some versions are (edit) UTTERLY SIGNIFICANTLY HOBBLED in their controls capability.

Not that I'd prefer that layout to Crysis 2, IMO: it's easier to hold jump key than to double-tap it to perform super jump and that not negating nay other active modes like Cloak or Armour. Holding a key is easier than double-tapping.

I have shown how all the objections over Crysis 2's controls do not stand up to scrutiny, so what is the reason for the displeasure? I think there was backlash against Crysis 2 not being a PC exclusive that it got panned in ways it never would if the PS3+360 versions never saw the light of day, even if Crysis 2 was EXACTLY the same on PC as it was on release. It would be hailed for it's improvements rather than derided by insinuation as a sellout to console mediocrity. Nope. It excelled over Crysis 1 only it's been pissed on as if these changes in any way dumbed down the game.

I have not once brought this up, but you have multiple times for some reason. I've said I don't mind the Crysis series being on consoles. I think Crytek definitely deserves the money and the series deserves exposure.

Well otherwise, I don't get your objections to the controls. I've heard others say "they're only like that for console gamepad" (not you) and it's a common theme to associate consolization with games being more limited and more automated. It's just a common theme.

I suppose it purely is a matter of preference whether its easier to double-tap or hold jump to perform super jump. But you seem to be taking your preference as indicative of terrible compromise. And I'm sorry, your arguments don't get over how more enjoyable it is to intuitively and dynamically use all these abilities. I rarely used sprint in Crysis 1 because the time needed to enter that mode would be better spent dodging or fighting back. When You or I move around none of us have to use that amount of mental distraction to start moving at our top speed to avoid danger.

 

[Breadline]

"And increasing movement and sprint speed is not the only function of max speed"

Bold claim. Contradicts everything I find in my game. So, can you prove this? Please show which weapons reload quicker in Maximum-Speed mode of Crysis 1? Or any other speed increased in Max-speed mode?

(doesn't matter if you have a version with completely different functionality from mine)

Even though you crossed it out, you conveniently don't acknowledge any of the other functions I mentioned. I doubt your game is so broken that you're unable to test switching weapons in speed mode, or throwing grenades, or moving while standing, crouching, and prone. I don't care if you think every unofficial source is unanimously lying about faster reload speeds (especially since your version apparently can't be trusted) because it still has other functions you can easily see right now.

You are setting a fallacious baseline by saying "speed mode reload is automatically applied in Crysis 2" when it could be that reload speed IS the reload speed and it's a fallacy to associate it with any particular suit-mode. It is neither limited nor automated.

As I specifically said, I was assuming that for your benefit only. For all I can tell, speed mode only activates (automatically) when you hit sprint in Crysis 2. I agree that the reload speed is only that, which only strengthens my argument because in Crysis 1 you had the option to augment that situation, as well as many others. This was my original point before you suggested that the nanosuit automatically increased reload speed. As such, speed mode is stripped and limited compared to it's Crysis 1 version, I have less options to work with, less reasons to be in speed mode. Hell, I can't even be in speed mode without sprinting.

Please, I explain what is going on as I am running the Steam version of Crysis, do you have the Non Steam version?!?!?

Yes I have the non Steam version, as I've said before.

So are you claiming the majority of gamers found Crysis 1 controls easy to use and utilise all the abilities of each mode? Everyone I ask other than you found Crysis 1 controls a right pain and you yourself admit that Max-speed-Sprint + Max-strength-jump is hard when it should be easy. PS: they all ran the steam version.

You said "For the overwhelming majority of gamers", I made no attempt to generalize an entire group as falling under my own perspective. You realize this right? I also only said speed sprinting and strength jumping was hard with the radial menu, it's easy with shortcuts as demonstrated. I don't care how many people found the controls easy or hard to use, this is my issue with the player's control of the nanosuit being limited. I don't care that "everyone" you talked to agrees. Especially when your friend incorrectly believes something like "you can only strength jump while speed sprinting with a macro". And besides, "everyone" I talk to agrees with me, good objective argument, right?

This is also what I meant by compromise. I prove to you that speed sprint and strength jump is possible (literally all you do is double tap space while speed sprinting, you don't even have to take your hand off shift), and your response is "yeah ok but it's too hard!" You're compromising, saying though my point may be technically valid, you think it isn't worth the difficulty.

It takes about 0.2 seconds to super-punch someone in Crysis 2. But in Crysis 1 you have to double tap jump to jump then super jump up in the air (disabling your armour mode that you need to not get killed by a single burst of fire) then aim and close to melee on them. Or use the radial menu temporarily disabling your ability to aim and use of one of your fingers and easily ending up in the wrong mode your your mouse shifting so far off centre you have to inconveniently re-centre it and further delay.

What the hell? Are you just trying to complicate the situation to get around the fact that strength jump happens immediately in Crysis 1? Fine that it's complicated for you, but it isn't for me. Also, on that first jump in the video I used the radial menu to switch back to armor, and you barely even see it it's done so fast (I'd say about 0.1 seconds if I'm also allowed to make up exaggerated estimations). And that's after not playing Crysis 1 for years and not having my own more comfortable keybindings set.

I don't even get why you seem to compare super punching in Crysis 2 to super jumping in Crysis 1. What that paragraph should have said is: "It takes about 0.2 seconds to super-punch someone in Crysis 2. But in Crysis 1 it happens instantly."

I take it that is Your video on Your account? As it would be quite improbable finding precisely the video you need within a few hours of it being posted. So you can clarify that when jumping-while-sprinting at no point did you lift your finger off the sprint key?

That's why I specifically mentioned how the character holds his hands up, because that's an animation that only plays if you jump while sprinting. Hence why normal jumping and jumping while sprinting are compared in the video, to show the animation that proves I was sprinting in the process. He also goes further.

If that is the case then we have nothing more to argue, as we are clearly playing COMPLETELY DIFFERENT VERSIONS of the same game!

While I sprint in MY version of Crysis 1 the jump key DOES NOTHING:
-I cannot jump
-I cannot switch to Max-strength
-I cannot use any of suit shortcuts while sprinting yet can as soon as I let off sprint key (I double and triple checked I had suit-shortcuts activated)
-This is same for all suit modes

I'm not lying to you and I'm not angry at you, I am angry at EA for releasing a game that are apparently identical but clearly some versions are (edit) UTTERLY SIGNIFICANTLY HOBBLED in their controls capability.

Then this whole thing is ridiculous. You clearly have a very broken game or ghosting keyboard or something. As such, all your "proving" me wrong, all the "nonsense" I claimed, all the "objections that don't hold up to scrutiny", are invalidated. Hell for all you know, even the pistol fires faster in the real game. You can certainly still say you liked Crysis 2 better because the controls were easier, and I'll respect that, but you cannot honestly expect to have any validity whatsoever when "proving" your previous points.

And no, it isn't just a different version. Crysis 1 has worked this way since the pre-release demo (download it if you don't believe me) and no amount of searching has led me to anyone claiming similar problems, even unofficially. If the fully updated Steam version truly removed basic and vital movement controls from the game, you'd think someone else might have noticed. I guess the burden is on you now to provide some sort of patch notes, workaround, or basic acknowledgement that the Steam version blatantly removed something so important.

I may as well claim that my Crysis 2 version doesn't work either and add that it "doesn't matter if you have a version with completely different functionality from mine".

When You or I move around none of us have to use that amount of mental distraction to start moving at our top speed to avoid danger.

...Because you and I don't move around in a nanosuit that's designed to provide different tactical options for different circumstances that take our capabilities beyond their normal limits and add an extra layer of strategy to dangerous situations specifically due to that interactivity.

 

[Treblaine]

le snip

I really have yet to see any evidence that ANYTHING is quicker in Crysis 1's speed mode other than running and sprint speed. Which leaves faster movement speed which might as well just be a single-button for super sprint. There is no Speed 'mode' in crysis 2, the single ability of speed mode now is a stand alone ability to use on demand.


I don't see the point obsessing over a speed mode but rather that the speed ability is there, though at a slower speed it takes you further.

Double tapping space while Max-Speed-sprinting to super-jump would be a pretty good way to work but:
-that doesn't actually work for me
-Even if it did, it's quicker to hold down space key than I can double-tap the jump-key
-even if I could double tap as quick as the hold time, it still disables any active mode like Max-Armour or Cloak that takes mental load to remember to switch back.

Super jump makes way more sense as a discrete ability than as a component of a discrete mode.

You can super punch instantly in Crysis 1 but not at any time in any mode, only in Strength Mode, which takes time to switch to and to switch back from. At ANY TIME you can super punch in Crysis 2 with minimum mental load or occupation of fingers/time. Mental load is a major issue in ergonomics, it says nothing of the individual's intellect as attention of other important factors (special awareness, forward thinking) must be Compromised to focus on something else like perform multi stage controls that interrupt aiming and use of multiple fingers in sequence.

This Crysis 1 super jump (assuming pressing forward):
activate Radial menu -> Mouse gesture to Max-speed -> release radial menu -> hold sprint -> activate Radial menu just at apex for jump -> Mouse gesture to strength mode -> release radial menu -> tap jump QUICK ENOUGH BEFORE MOMENTUM IS LOST -> (in mid air) activate radial menu -> gesture back to armour/cloak mode -> release radial menu -> release sprint

That is a 12 stage combo that needs absolutely perfect timing with EXTREMELY fast speed and not loosing mouse centring too much or being slightly off where you'd accidentally flip your perspective 90 degrees. There is a huge likelihood you will get it slightly wrong and go ploughing right into the minefield you were trying to jump over or fleeing over a cliff.

Or the Crysis 1 way with suit shortcuts to perform super jump while moving forward:
-double tap sprint
-hold sprint
-double tap jump at apex
-double tap S (default) for armour mode
-Release sprint

5 stages, 8 discrete inputs. Why is such a simple move like a fighting game finishing-move combo?

Compared to Crysis 2:
-tap sprint key to initiate sprint
-Hold jump key at apex to mega-jump

That's all you need to do to perform the super jump while retaining the mode you were in before, cloak or armour. Doesn't that seem more fitting for what should be such a simple move?

"I may as well claim that my Crysis 2 version doesn't work either."

Is that the actual case for you?

I am not making a false claim to support my argument, and I don't see how I can be mistaken. My friends (who also have the steam version) corroborate what I found but didn't particularly test it.

Can't you see this is a huge problem for Crysis 1 if apparently all the Steam versions are unreasonably hard to perform moves. I will be documenting this and investigating it further. But note, I still would prefer Crysis 2 controls to the controls of Crysis 1 even if the suit shortcuts worked properly

 

[repeating integers]

I wonder when people will realise that "Generic" just means "Of the genre"?

Completely useless criticism, never take any notice of anyone who calls anything "generic" as an attempted insult.

 

[endtherapture]

le snip

I really have yet to see any evidence that ANYTHING is quicker in Crysis 1's speed mode other than running and sprint speed. Which leaves faster movement speed which might as well just be a single-button for super sprint. There is no Speed 'mode' in crysis 2, the single ability of speed mode now is a stand alone ability to use on demand.


I don't see the point obsessing over a speed mode but rather that the speed ability is there, though at a slower speed it takes you further.

Double tapping space while Max-Speed-sprinting to super-jump would be a pretty good way to work but:
-that doesn't actually work for me
-Even if it did, it's quicker to hold down space key than I can double-tap the jump-key
-even if I could double tap as quick as the hold time, it still disables any active mode like Max-Armour or Cloak that takes mental load to remember to switch back.

Super jump makes way more sense as a discrete ability than as a component of a discrete mode.

You can super punch instantly in Crysis 1 but not at any time in any mode, only in Strength Mode, which takes time to switch to and to switch back from. At ANY TIME you can super punch in Crysis 2 with minimum mental load or occupation of fingers/time. Mental load is a major issue in ergonomics, it says nothing of the individual's intellect as attention of other important factors (special awareness, forward thinking) must be Compromised to focus on something else like perform multi stage controls that interrupt aiming and use of multiple fingers in sequence.

This Crysis 1 super jump (assuming pressing forward):
activate Radial menu -> Mouse gesture to Max-speed -> release radial menu -> hold sprint -> activate Radial menu just at apex for jump -> Mouse gesture to strength mode -> release radial menu -> tap jump QUICK ENOUGH BEFORE MOMENTUM IS LOST -> (in mid air) activate radial menu -> gesture back to armour/cloak mode -> release radial menu -> release sprint

That is a 12 stage combo that needs absolutely perfect timing with EXTREMELY fast speed and not loosing mouse centring too much or being slightly off where you'd accidentally flip your perspective 90 degrees. There is a huge likelihood you will get it slightly wrong and go ploughing right into the minefield you were trying to jump over or fleeing over a cliff.

Or the Crysis 1 way with suit shortcuts to perform super jump while moving forward:
-double tap sprint
-hold sprint
-double tap jump at apex
-double tap S (default) for armour mode
-Release sprint

5 stages, 8 discrete inputs. Why is such a simple move like a fighting game finishing-move combo?

Compared to Crysis 2:
-tap sprint key to initiate sprint
-Hold jump key at apex to mega-jump

That's all you need to do to perform the super jump while retaining the mode you were in before, cloak or armour. Doesn't that seem more fitting for what should be such a simple move?

"I may as well claim that my Crysis 2 version doesn't work either."

Is that the actual case for you?

I am not making a false claim to support my argument, and I don't see how I can be mistaken. My friends (who also have the steam version) corroborate what I found but didn't particularly test it.

Can't you see this is a huge problem for Crysis 1 if apparently all the Steam versions are unreasonably hard to perform moves. I will be documenting this and investigating it further. But note, I still would prefer Crysis 2 controls to the controls of Crysis 1 even if the suit shortcuts worked properly

Man, I think you're just bad at the game, everyone else can do it fine

 

[Treblaine]

Man, I think you're just bad at the game, everyone else can do it fine

You really think I am incapable of holding shift, pressing space and determining if my character has jumped or not? There is nothing to screw up, in MY install of Crysis it just does, not, work.

I'm not saying I'll never be able to perform the 12-step combo for the super jump, I'm just doing a COMPARATIVE examination to show in Relative terms how much better Crysis 2's controls are vs Crysis 1.

Can you seriously perform that jump? Consistently? Without any macros? What sort of keyboard layout do you have? Can you do that while distracted by dodging incoming fire and navigating a complex environment?

 

[Breadline]

snip

I've said so many times that the controls for Crysis could be better and in fact that the controls for Crysis 2 are easier, but that in no way opposes my argument. You keep using "the controls are easier" as a way of combating "the player's control of the suit has been limited" and it's clear you aren't gonna get that such an argument doesn't work.

I think I'm just gonna have to agree with endtherapture here. If you honestly see something simple like speed sprinting and strength jumping as a ridiculous twelve step process (in which you again desperately use the longest sounding method instead of just the shortcuts) with a significant "mental load" then I suppose that's the end of it.

A couple more 100% true facts:
-You can strength melee and strength jump instantly from any mode, just double tap their respective buttons.
-I possess the apparently EXTREME mental dexterity necessary to double tap a button faster than it's required to be held in Crysis 2.
-Speed mode in Crysis 1 does everything I already mentioned, in Crysis 2 it is only a glorified sprint.

It's also funny that you refuse to believe something I say without solid proof (and even after proof is given) when any search will provide multiple sources backing me up, yet when your game is shown to be incredibly incomplete suddenly "all the Steam versions" are like that despite neither of us being able to find any documentation of such a glaring mistake.

 

[Treblaine]

snip

I've said so many times that the controls for Crysis could be better and in fact that the controls for Crysis 2 are easier, but that in no way opposes my argument. You keep using "the controls are easier" as a way of combating "the player's control of the suit has been limited" and it's clear you aren't gonna get that such an argument doesn't work.

I think I'm just gonna have to agree with endtherapture here. If you honestly see something simple like speed sprinting and strength jumping as a ridiculous twelve step process (in which you again desperately use the longest sounding method instead of just the shortcuts) with a significant "mental load" then I suppose that's the end of it.

A couple more 100% true facts:
-You can strength melee and strength jump instantly from any mode, just double tap their respective buttons.
-I possess the apparently EXTREME mental dexterity necessary to double tap a button faster than it's required to be held in Crysis 2.
-Speed mode in Crysis 1 does everything I already mentioned, in Crysis 2 it is only a glorified sprint.

It's also funny that you refuse to believe something I say without solid proof (and even after proof is given) when any search will provide multiple sources backing me up, yet when your game is shown to be incredibly incomplete suddenly "all the Steam versions" are like that despite neither of us being able to find any documentation of such a glaring mistake.

Yeah, but I don't buy your argument that the suit has even been limited.

What I've been trying to say is things like your claim that super-jump and super-punch are always instantaneous glosses over how that is only instantaneous within a discrete suit mode, the time it takes to switch to Max-Strength is slower or on par with holding respective melee or jump keys for 0.2 sec.

The only tangible limitation is slower sprint speed though it does take you much further. Whether this is an actual limitation or a practical tweak for how Crysis 1's speed-sprint was just too fast and over too soon.

"a ridiculous twelve step process (in which you again desperately use the longest sounding method instead of just the shortcuts)"

I told you already, in MY GAME the shortcuts (like double-tapping jump) do not work while I am sprinting. Even considering them working, Crysis 2's shortcuts are more straightforward. And you are right, it is ridiculous that it is a 12 step process to perform what should be a simple combination of abilities. It's not the longest sounding method, I put it as brief as possible to list every critical move.

Nothing desperate about it, to spite your hollow insinuation. It is emphatic.

It doesn't seem I have emphasised this enough, there are serious problems with a radial wheel, for how to get a positive direction you need a fairly large magnitude input, this take your mouse off centre and either means continuing along mouse mat in awkward position or cost time re-centring. And of course, you need perfect timing or TAKE YOUR TIME, to not make the gesture till the radial wheel is activated or else your view flies off to the right or left or staring up at the sky. It's disorienting and time wasting. The radial menu is a woeful ergonomic design design and bullshit I hear on forums of "Suck it up and deal with it, too much of a noob to handle the radial menu" is an excuse I shouldn't have to hear for a game I spent VAST sums of money upgrading my rig in order to play it with good performance.

And the suit-shortcuts clearly don't work the same for everyone in consistently the same way.

As to your 100% assertions:
-double tap is not instant and of course switches off another active mode leaving you having to switch back.
-Considering how short the hold time is on Crysis 2, you'd struggle to double tap as quick and of course is more complex.
-please provide proof that anything over than movement/sprint is faster in Speed mode.

OK, I googled it, so here are the the results are in any way relevant to "crysis 1 speed mode reload-speed".

http://crysis.wikia.com/wiki/CryNet_Nanosuit = no mention of speed mode increasing stance-change speed or reload speed. Only movement speed.

http://www.incrysis.com/wiki/index.php/Nanosuit = again, nothing

http://cdn.steampowered.com/Manuals/17330/manual_english.pdf?t=1297293398 = nothing about this in the game manual either

Other than that, all I can find are a few unsubstantiated claims made by anonymous people on forums where no one admits to any active testing, it seems they are just making subjective assumptions. If you have actual sources, please provide. I've never seen this demonstrated anywhere! It is entirely possible people are switching to speed mode and imagining it's going 20% faster. How much faster are you claiming? Like CoD's slight-of-hand half the reload time?

 

[endtherapture]

snip

snip

Have you got the game fully patched? I'm playing the Special Edition of the game, on my laptop and everything works fine.

But anyway you can't argue maximum speed is pathetic in Crysis 2 compared to Crysis 1.