Why Does Hollywood always have to F*** it up?

SilentPony

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???? How is the history of Sub-Zero and Scorpion not part of the plot and setting of MK? It's the backstory of characters participating in the MK story, it's why they're there, how is that not relevant or part of the story? Isn't the entire draw of fighting games the different characters and their interactions with the "main plot" being secondary to that? Fighting games show story from the perspective of the fighter you play as, how it's relevant to them and what their part in it is, I don't understand where you get your notion of fighting game stories.
The story of Sub Zero and Scorpion is that they're titles, not individual people, who always end up fighting each other in MK tournaments. Their story centrally and critically revolves around the tournament. Who each individual incarnation is kind of irrelevant because the titles are the arch-enemies. Except when SubZero and Scorpion are besties, but we don't talk about that.
Taking those two out of the tournament is like taking the crime fighting out of Batman. He's just a dude. Sub Zero and Scorpion without the mortal kombat tournament are just two dudes who don't know each other.
 
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Specter Von Baren

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The story of Sub Zero and Scorpion is that they're titles, not individual people, who always end up fighting each other in MK tournaments. Their story centrally and critically revolves around the tournament. Who each individual incarnation is kind of irrelevant because the titles are the arch-enemies. Except when SubZero and Scorpion are besties, but we don't talk about that.
Taking those two out of the tournament is like taking the crime fighting out of Batman. He's just a dude. Sub Zero and Scorpion without the mortal kombat tournament are just two dudes who don't know each other.
????????????????????????????????????????
 

SilentPony

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????????????????????????????????????????
Yeah there's like a main sub zero, then there's his brother sub zero, other members of their assassin clan sub zero, a cyborg sub zero, and then there's just a race of ice magic ninjas who always fight the hell ninjas.
I think its the same Scorpion each time, but he's like an undead/immortal who just has a permanent spot in the tournaments, and just fights the Sub Zero of the moment.
And then there's alternate timelines/alternate universe versions of them, and spinoff games where they're buddies and I don't know if those are considered canon, and if so to which timeline/universe.
Point being if you want to do a ninja movie, do a ninja movie. If you want to do mortal kombat, do a mortal kombat movie. Also don't do a mortal kombat movie because it can't be translated into movie form.
 

Specter Von Baren

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Yeah there's like a main sub zero, then there's his brother sub zero, other members of their assassin clan sub zero, a cyborg sub zero, and then there's just a race of ice magic ninjas who always fight the hell ninjas.
I think its the same Scorpion each time, but he's like an undead/immortal who just has a permanent spot in the tournaments, and just fights the Sub Zero of the moment.
And then there's alternate timelines/alternate universe versions of them, and spinoff games where they're buddies and I don't know if those are considered canon, and if so to which timeline/universe.
Point being if you want to do a ninja movie, do a ninja movie. If you want to do mortal kombat, do a mortal kombat movie. Also don't do a mortal kombat movie because it can't be translated into movie form.
Yes, I already knew about how Sub-Zero is just a title, it was referring to Scorpion as just a title that had me confused because he's the same guy every time. The reason Scorpion wants to kill Sub-Zero is because he believed Sub-Zero's clan killed his. Scorpion has his fire powers and a skull for a head because he literally came back from hell for revenge. He killed the first Sub-Zero from the original game and the second Sub-Zero is his brother. Scorpion later learns that he was deceived as to the real murderer of his clan and gets revenge on the real culprit.

And there you go! That's your Sub-Zero/Scorpion movie!
 
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SilentPony

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Yes, I already knew about how Sub-Zero is just a title, it was referring to Scorpion as just a title that had me confused because he's the same guy every time. The reason Scorpion wants to kill Sub-Zero is because he believed Sub-Zero's clan killed his. Scorpion has his fire powers and a skull for a head because he literally came back from hell for revenge. He killed the first Sub-Zero from the original game and the second Sub-Zero is his brother. Scorpion later learns that he was deceived as to the real murderer of his clan and gets revenge on the real culprit.

And there you go! That's your Sub-Zero/Scorpion movie!
I mean that sounds fun, but not good. We know there's no consequences because they're not fighting in Mortal Kombat yet. Its like Godzilla vs King Kong, we know both survive so why bother with the versus set up?
 

The Rogue Wolf

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Proof that a fighting-game movie could work: The plot of Enter the Dragon is basically a martial-arts expert going to a fighting tournament on a secluded island, and having to fight his way through several encounters in order to reach and defeat the "boss". The difference between it and most video-game based movies is that the people involved in making Enter the Dragon actually gave a shit.
 

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Proof that a fighting-game movie could work: The plot of Enter the Dragon is basically a martial-arts expert going to a fighting tournament on a secluded island, and having to fight his way through several encounters in order to reach and defeat the "boss". The difference between it and most video-game based movies is that the people involved in making Enter the Dragon actually gave a shit.
Exactly. MK is basically that, plus Bloodsport. It's why the 1995 version worked. People actually gave a shit about what they were making and performing in.
 

SilentPony

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Exactly. MK is basically that, plus Bloodsport. It's why the 1995 version worked. People actually gave a shit about what they were making and performing in.
Those aren't video game movies you guys are gushing over. They're scripts specifically written for movies, not adaptations. They don't have the baggage of non-movie friendly plot points and pacing that a video game has.
Saying Enter the Dragon or Bloodsport is proof a Mortal Kombat movie can work is like saying Raiders of the Lost Ark is proof an Uncharted movie can work. Yeah, they're similar stories sure, but one has to be an adaptation of a video game and thus limited to what it can do, the other is a free-floating movie script that has no limitations to story and structure.
This seems to be the fundamental thing you guys aren't getting. To make a video game story work in movie form you have to change so much there's no point in having it be related to the video game. Look at video game movies, they either suck, or take pits and pieces of a video game and make the rest up, or both.
 
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BrawlMan

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Those aren't video game movies you guys are gushing over. They're scripts specifically written for movies, not adaptations. They don't have the baggage of non-movie friendly plot points and pacing that a video game has.
Saying Enter the Dragon or Bloodsport is proof a Mortal Kombat movie can work is like saying Raiders of the Lost Ark is proof an Uncharted movie can work. Yeah, they're similar stories sure, but one has to be an adaptation of a video game and thus limited to what it can do, the other is a free-floating movie script that has no limitations to story and structure.
This seems to be the fundamental thing you guys aren't getting. To make a video game story work in movie form you have to change so much there's no point in having it be related to the video game. Look at video game movies, they either suck, or take pits and pieces of a video game and make the rest up, or both.
Put a cork in it, @SilentPony! I don't agree with you, don't care for the negative Nancy attitude, and you can stop with the fucking goal posting already!

P.S - Double Impact is the best Double Dragon movie ever made! Chao! Your argument is invalid!



 
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SilentPony

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Put a cork in it, @SilentPony! I don't agree with you, don't care for the negative Nancy attitude, and you can stop with the fucking goal posting already!
I'm not the one moving the goal post, you are. The entire thread, the entire discussion, has been about Hollywood adapting video games into movies. Suddenly you think the counter to my argument that they can't is to bring up non video game adapted movies, as if that has anything to do with adapting a video game.
I can bring up random movies too, watch! Santa Clause Conquers the Martians is proof you can never have a Fallout movie.

You wanna talk about movie adaptations of video games, stick to it. You wanna list random movies you like, make a new thread.
 
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BrawlMan

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I'm not the one moving the goal post, you are. The entire thread, the entire discussion, has been about Hollywood adapting video games into movies. Suddenly you think the counter to my argument that they can't is to bring up non video game adapted movies, as if that has anything to do with adapting a video game.
Nope. Nearly all of that has been you. Nearly all of your points are just plain cynicism and self-defeatism. Whenever someone brings up a good, sound, or reasonable point, you double down on the cynicism, full of "what if, buts, or maybes", or go through mental gymnastics on why it "can't" work. These adaptions can work with proper compromise and care (and they have regardless of what you believe or think). You will lose something and gain something no matter what medium is being adapted from a different medium. Hence why they are called adaptions. They have to adapt in some way or it does not work. I won't go any further, because all you do is go around in circles refusing to listen and too stuck in your cynicism. I'll be ignoring you in this particular topic (but I won't actually put you on ignore). So say anything to me on this topic unless you know it's important (to me).

For those interested, care, or need a reminder:

  • Double Impact is the best Double Dragon movie ever made.
  • Ninja Assassin is the best Ninja Gaiden movie ever made.
  • The Crank films are the best GTA movies ever made.
  • The Purge films are the best Manhunt movies ever made.
  • Event Horizon is the best Doom movie ever made.
  • Dog Soldiers is the best Resident Evil movie ever made. At least until the new live-action adaption does it properly.
All of this and more if you're interested:



Speaking of Resident Evil:
  • RE1 is Night of the Living Dead with elements of Jurassic Park (The Hunters are basically Raptors), Jaws, The Fly, and Little Shop of Horrors.
  • RE2 & 3 is Dawn of the Dead; especially 3. 3 is that combined with Terminator.
  • Code Veronica is RE1 near the end, but not as interesting combined Parasite Eve. Alexia Ashford is a copy of Eve.
  • RE4 is The Thing combined with The Wickerman.
  • RE5 is Black Hawk Down combined with the Constant Gardner added with parasitic zombies.
  • RE6 is Resident Evil: Michael Bay Edition! Featuring Explosions From Michael Bay!
  • RE7 is Texas Chainsaw combined with Condemned: Criminal Origins combined Clock Tower combined with F.E.A.R.
  • Not A Hero DLC is just RE5/6 Chris, but you're in first person instead of third person.
  • End of Zoe DLC is Punch Out meets Final Fight.
  • RE8 is Dracula/Carmilla combined with Resident Evil 4 and Bloodborne.
  • Revelations 1 and Dead Aim are Capcom's answer to Cold Fear. Ironic, because Cold Fear did not come until after RE4 and was a clone of the latter. Dead Aim came out in 2002. Dead Aim was also another proto-RE4 when you think about it. Rev 1 fits the Capcom take on Cold Fear. The only difference being you're on a cruise ship instead of Russian whaler.
  • Revelations 2 is Saw and Evil Within.
I bring these up, because nearly any of these can work in proper live-action film adaption or TV/Streaming series. Just be put in to the hands of people that care.
 

SilentPony

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Nope. Nearly all of that has been you. Nearly all of your points are just plain cynicism and self-defeatism. Whenever someone brings up a good, sound, or reasonable point, you double down on the cynicism, full of "what if, buts, or maybes", or go through mental gymnastics on why it "can't" work. These adaptions can work with proper compromise and care (and they have regardless of what you believe or think). You will lose something and gain something no matter what medium is being adapted from a different medium. Hence why they are called adaptions. They have to adapt in some way or it does not work. I won't go any further, because all you do is go around in circles refusing to listen and too stuck in your cynicism. I'll be ignoring you in this particular topic (but I won't actually put you on ignore). So say anything to me on this topic unless you know it's important (to me).

For those interested, care, or need a reminder:

  • Double Impact is the best Double Dragon movie ever made.
  • Ninja Assassin is the best Ninja Gaiden movie ever made.
  • The Crank films are the best GTA movies ever made.
  • The Purge films are the best Manhunt movies ever made.
  • Event Horizon is the best Doom movie ever made.
  • Dog Soldiers is the best Resident Evil movie ever made. At least until the new live-action adaption does it properly.
All of this and more if you're interested:



Speaking of Resident Evil:
  • RE1 is Night of the Living Dead with elements of Jurassic Park (The Hunters are basically Raptors), Jaws, The Fly, and Little Shop of Horrors.
  • RE2 & 3 is Dawn of the Dead; especially 3. 3 is that combined with Terminator.
  • Code Veronica is RE1 near the end, but not as interesting combined Parasite Eve. Alexia Ashford is a copy of Eve.
  • RE4 is The Thing combined with The Wickerman.
  • RE5 is Black Hawk Down combined with the Constant Gardner added with parasitic zombies.
  • RE6 is Resident Evil: Michael Bay Edition! Featuring Explosions From Michael Bay!
  • RE7 is Texas Chainsaw combined with Condemned: Criminal Origins combined Clock Tower combined with F.E.A.R.
  • Not A Hero DLC is just RE5/6 Chris, but you're in first person instead of third person.
  • End of Zoe DLC is Punch Out meets Final Fight.
  • RE8 is Dracula/Carmilla combined with Resident Evil 4 and Bloodborne.
  • Revelations 1 and Dead Aim are Capcom's answer to Cold Fear. Ironic, because Cold Fear did not come until after RE4 and was a clone of the latter. Dead Aim came out in 2002. Dead Aim was also another proto-RE4 when you think about it. Rev 1 fits the Capcom take on Cold Fear. The only difference being you're on a cruise ship instead of Russian whaler.
  • Revelations 2 is Saw and Evil Within.
I bring these up, because nearly any of these can work in proper live-action film adaption or TV/Streaming series. Just be put in to the hands of people that care.
So lemme get this straight. Your argument that video games can be adapted into movies is...a list of movies that are not adaptations of video games and just claiming they are?
At this point you're just taking the piss right? Like you don't honestly think Dog Soldiers is a Resident Evil movie do you? Or have you never played any of these games and don't really know what they're about?
Like I don't know why the fuck you bring up spiritual adaptations when the topic has been literal adaptations.

No one in this thread, at least that I saw, said you can't do a good fighting movie. What has been said is that a video game is a different medium to experience a story than a movie, and that the two may not be compatible. How you tell a story in video games, the pacing, dialogue beats, player interaction, 20+ hour narrative is different than how you tell a story, even the same story, in a movie.
Somehow, some people interpreted this to mean you can't do a martial arts movie, full stop. And its nonsense. Its gaslighting. Its trying to change the debate from why can't Hollywood adapt a video game to the big screen to punch movie is good!
My argument is that mortal kombat, and tournament fighters in general, probably can't be translated into a movie successfully while also being faithful to the source material and without changing major elements. The counter to that has been the mortal kombat movies that were not successes, the Street Fighter movies that basically have nothing to do with the Street Fighter games save the character names and glaring don't have tournaments, and Enter the Dragon and Bloodsport, both of which are not video game adaptations.
And now we're at Event Horizon is a Doom movie somehow. I mean ignoring the plot, setting, characters, tone, pacing, IP, and narrative sure. And Sister Act 2 is a Binding of Isaac movie if you change a few things around. And for shame, not even getting it right, Event Horizon is a Warhammer movie. And even then its not a Warhammer movie, its a totally different IP that has no connection to Warhammer.
Jeez forget adapting video games into movies, you should just play a video game to know what they're like.
 

BrawlMan

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So lemme get this straight. Your argument that video games can be adapted into movies is...a list of movies that are not adaptations of video games and just claiming they are? At this point you're just taking the piss right? Like you don't honestly think Dog Soldiers is a Resident Evil movie do you? Or have you never played any of these games and don't really know what they're about?
The point being with those examples could do adaptations albeit, unofficially or unintentionally, than the more direct and intentional adaptions can get it right. That's the point I'm making. Though many fans and people suspect that the person who directed Double Impact, was a closet Double Dragon fans. There's too much there to be a coincidence. Dog Soldiers is a better RE film, than all of the WS Anderson "adaptions". So a better RE movie by comparison. Besides, Dog Soldiers and RE1 (game) take from Romero. They're literally Night of the Living Dead, but insert X and Y. And no, I am not taking the piss. I've played most of the Resident Evil games, so I know what they are all about; thank you very much!

Like I don't know why the fuck you bring up spiritual adaptations when the topic has been literal adaptations.
To prove a point. See the first sentence I mentioned.

No one in this thread, at least that I saw, said you can't do a good fighting movie. What has been said is that a video game is a different medium to experience a story than a movie, and that the two may not be compatible.
In your overly high opinion and too strict standards. You lack faith and vision, SilentPony.

My argument is that mortal kombat, and tournament fighters in general, probably can't be translated into a movie successfully while also being faithful to the source material and without changing major elements.
Yes they can and most definitely have, you just don't listen or want everything to be in black and white. Some changes can and will be made, as long as they are done within reason or are necessary to work. Not everything has to be a 1-to-1 translation.

Enter the Dragon and Bloodsport, both of which are not video game adaptations.
No, but they inspired a lot of tournament fighters and beat'em ups! Everything comes full circle. Funny how life works like that.

And now we're at Event Horizon is a Doom movie somehow. I mean ignoring the plot, setting, characters, tone, pacing, IP, and narrative sure.
More specifically Doom 3. The bigger emphasis on horror and atomsphere. Either that or Hellraiser in space. Neither are inaccurate.
 

BrawlMan

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If George A Romero can capture the tone of the RE games perfectly in this commercial for RE2, he could have done the same for the movies.
The commercial is time stamped.


 
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McElroy

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I figure film adaptations of Dan Brown's books have to be better than his novels. I know it's a cheap shot, but Dan Brown is a truly awful writer. He's made a lot of millions though, so he can afford to suck up some punishment and still have the last laugh.
The Da Vinci Code, Angels and Demons, are alright but Inferno can go to... y'know. I've never read Inferno (Dante's or anyone's) but there is simply no way it's worse than the movie.
The movie version of Read Player One is 1000x better than the novel.
Too bad the way the last Easter Egg is done in the movie is 1001x worse.
 

BrawlMan

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Too bad the way the last Easter Egg is done in the movie is 1001x worse.
Even with that, the movie is still better. Keep in mind, I found the film itself to be average, despite being superior to the book.
 

Samtemdo8

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My biggest beef of all of this is Cole.

Because for some reason modern Mortal Kombat really doesn't want Liu Kang to the protagonist anymore. When he was pretty much the hero of the story of Early Mortal Kombat. He has a rivalry with Shang Tsung and such. He defeated the Emperor Shao Kahn and saved the world plenty of times.

But they keep putting him on the sidelines when he was always the leading guy.
 

BrawlMan

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My biggest beef of all of this is Cole.

Because for some reason modern Mortal Kombat really doesn't want Liu Kang to the protagonist anymore. When he was pretty much the hero of the story of Early Mortal Kombat. He has a rivalry with Shang Tsung and such. He defeated the Emperor Shao Kahn and saved the world plenty of times.

But they keep putting him on the sidelines when he was always the leading guy.
The reason why he keeps getting sideline, especially in the early 2000s, because Midway at the time, thought Liu Kang was too boring. Which is a load of shit. I was still pissed that they killed him off in Deadly Alliance. The character is not boring; it's just that they don't know what to do with them. It took them till Mortal Kombat 11 to finally do something with Liu kang.
 
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