why is Origin= Bad...Steam =Good?

[Comic Sans]

I personally don't have a huge issue with it. I don't care if companies look at my system specs, I don't buy things often off of it (I've bought 3 games, and those because I got them on deals), I don't see EA as the devil and rather like many games they've released. If you don't like Origin that's cool. However, I find people saying things like "I won't buy ME3 because of Origin and the like" rather silly. What does Origin have to do with it? The interface, prices and the like won't affect you, you just play the game and don't do anything else with Origin. I also see a lot of misconceptions about Origin. Yes, it has an offline mode. Yes, it has deals (they email discount codes from time to time). Yes, they force you to use it, but so does Valve. I also saw someone say that you won't be able to transfer ME save files on this thread, which is blatantly untrue. I had ME2 on Steam but not ME1 and got my save transfer just fine, I am 100% positive it will be the same.

Yes, there are legit gripes with Origin. However, at the end of the day I have Origin and my computer hasn't exploded yet. Most of it is just the witch hunt mentality and hate for EA in general. Hating on EA is the big trend, and Origin is part of that.

 

[Bradeck]

I'll ask it again, because it got missed. Is there any truth to the claim that Origin has a finite number of downloads you are allowed per game?

 

[Woodsey]

Because people don't like or trust EA (with good reason), the service began with a pretty questionable ToS, and the service doesn't work as well.

Plus, they're not really offering anything in return for us having to use it.

 

[The Abhorrent]

As many have noted already, one of the biggest reasons to be against Origin is due to the publisher in charge of it -- EA. Their whole approach to the game industry has earned them quite a bit of distaste: the prevalence of day-one DLC, pulling their games off Steam, the high amount of information gathering from Origin, unnecessary (and/or rushed) sequels, and let's not forget the obnoxious marketing.

Quite simply, they've placed themselves in a position where people are going through them only if they absolutely have to. Yes, they got a huge chunk of the market... but most people have a good reason to avoid them, and it's only a matter of time before they get their act together.

---

As for myself, I'm not exactly a fan of digital distribution in general; I just prefer to have a physical copy of the game myself. And since I generally don't play games online, it's a good thing when I don't have to bother with the whole online-verification thing every time I boot up the game. That doesn't put Steam very high on my priority list for acquiring games, but there's a few circumstances which go against Origin:

1. Steam is already on my computer, mostly for Valve's first-party titles (mostly Portal and it's sequel) and Skyrim.

2. EA has given me plenty of reason to dislike them, while Valve has not. I don't have a lot reason to particularly like Valve either (beyond the high quality products they have) due to them requiring Steam for their games, but it's still better than my stance on EA.

3. Steam sells plenty of games from many developpers, and some offers do seem interesting....while I'm hearing Origin simply does not have the same selection.

4. I do not want another digital distribution program on my system. As I said, I'm not a huge fan of it; slowly starting to warm up to it now that I've heard some good reasons for it (easier access to older titles which are no longer available via retail is a big one), but I'm still pre-disposed to having a physical copy. Anyhow, I'm more or less stuck with Steam already; not something I'm overly fond of, but I can deal with that. Nevertheless, that means anyone else who's trying to force their digital distribution service on me is not going to get my business; or rather, I'll get another version of the game instead (one which doesn't require said service).

---

With more and more PC games requiring online connectivity (for access to something like Steam or Origin) to play, even if it's a strictly single-player game... well, it's probably not helping PC gaming in general. Even if there are plenty of people who gleefully adopt digital distribution, there are many of hold-outs like myself who prefer the surety of a physical copy; that and I prefer to deal with cash rather than my credit card, remarkable how easy it is to stay out of debt when you do that.

Anyhow, that actually give consoles a bit of a one-up over PCs right now; the physical copy is still a viable method for acquiring the game, while PC games more or less require online connectivity. If (or perhaps, when) consoles move entirely towards digital distribution themselves, we hold-outs will (begrudgingly) accept them out of necessity. Even then, there's a pretty good chance we're going to stick with the ones we're already stuck with.

Taken a bit further, if every (major) company adopts their own digital distribution service? At that point, people might be a bit more proactive about which services they'll bother using; a corporation's reputation will play a surprisingly large role in determining if it's worth it at all.

In other words, good-bye EA.

 

[Bradeck]

http://www.overclock.net/t/1042812/think-origin-is-a-good-idea

This is what I was referring to. Apparently it's true. If you download a game too many times, EA can restrict your purchase, and make you re-purchase it again.

 

[Atmos Duality]

Because Steam's EULA identifies its terms very clearly, and in the 3 years I've used it, it has stuck to precisely those parameters.
Even as a company, Valve has pretty much stuck to their guns since their inception; they don't step on their customer's toes or change the rules of engagement to suit their whims. It's a simple relationship that works.

And this isn't coming from some scrub who just put their first rig together: I've known about or otherwise dealt with Valve since the days of Action Quake 2 (what would later be overhauled in a newer, modified Quake 2 engine and become the basis for Counterstrike).

Origin has vaguely defined terms (they claim to only want to search for "software" on your computer...legally meaning anything on your hard drive, since they didn't bother to establish any containing/limiting clauses), and it's run by EA, who have proven to me how ruthless and exploitative they can be for well over a decade now.

Technical and legal issues aside: I don't trust EA, and not without good reason.
Over that last decade, they've been shown to badly mistreat their customers, their clients (developers), and their employees all for their bottom line.

Knowing that, signing up for Origin is simply asking to be exploited.

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

Sure, people will talk about "privacy invasion" this and "evil corporation" that, but they're really just arguments that arrived after the conclusion: people don't trust EA as much as Valve, so they're afraid of investing in the new service. People already loved valve when steam came out. People hated EA when Origin came out. I don't know if there really is any other reason that people actually care about.

Is it objective? No, but it is a result of the state of EA's public relations, which are very much the result of some bad decisions on EA's part.

It's a little bit more than that. See, Steam technically has the same "we can monitor what you do" clause that Origin does. The difference is that Steam's is more restricted. They can ONLY monitor your gameplay stats, and maybe a couple other things restricted specifically to your gaming. Meanwhile Origin's clause is that they can just monitor your computer. Anything. If I had Origin installed right now, EA could tell you that I'm using Firefox for my web browsing.

Yeah... see the difference? It isn't just a matter of "we trust Valve more than EA", it's a matter of "Origin wants access to more information than Steam". Now... is EA going to use this access for the kinds of things that have people paranoid? Maybe... maybe not. But why give them the opportunity?

 

[AnotherAvatar]

here I thourght I had

Origin...everyone hates it, more or less,its become a symbol of how awful EA are

and then there steam..EVERYONE loves steam..steam are an example of how awsome Valve are

now I acutally like valve..espeically compared to EA

but WHY is this? I mean is it really a good thing for one digital distribution service to have a "monopoly" on the market? Steam has screwed me over a number of times (losing my game data, forcing my to use it and download a whole load of data before I can play my game...on a game I got retail..no less)

I know origin is aparently not perfect as a platfrom/service but some people seem to hate it for the fact that it exists, and that it isnt steam

so tell me...why is steam so great when origin is so awful?

Have you not used Origin?

Origin's biggest sin in my opinion is spying on user data and program use and sending the info back to the company, and I'm not just talking about what games you play. That is disgusting, how fucking dare they.

Next up is the fact that all of their games are outrageously over-priced, most of them are the same price you would pay to get a copy in store... By contrast steam has so many absurd deals I nearly have 100 games from them after only having my gaming pc for a little over a year now. All of GTA for $13, fuck me how I can say no to that?!

Finally is the worst part about Origin: They're trying to control the market by making their games exclusive, pulling already existing games from Steam (Crysis 2 anyone?) and preventing future releases. The fact is the data mining alone makes me want to not have Origin installed on my PC, but if I want to play Battlefield 3 and get the best exclusives for TOR, I have to. No fucking options about it. And while I haven't used it much every aspect of Origin seems behind Steam by like 5 years, poor user interface, little to no social structure, no achievements, poorly laid out store. It's a slow, gawdy train wreck of a program


It is bad to let one company control the market, but that clearly isn't what Steam wants to do, they're not pulling the same shit EA is forcing people to have their program just to play their games. Everyone just loves Steam because it's absurdly good at it's service, while constantly throwing great deals at us.

There is nothing wrong with a lot of people loving a great company so long as that company keeps up the good work and doesn't grow corrupted.


However there IS something wrong with the thought process that people should like a shitty service just so one service doesn't have a monopoly. Competition is great, and leads to benefits for both society and the consumers, but Origin doesn't deserve to consider it's self even in the same league with Steam. EA's Orwellian bullshit mixed with their lazily made program can't hold a candle to Valves carefully evolved program, and until it or someone else can it is perfectly reasonable for Steam to have the lock on this part of the industry it so well deserves.


Edit: Valve does require Steam for some of their games. However, this doesn't matter to me as much because they don't search through my files.

Final word: EA, I hate you for buying Bioware, I'm glad the company is still around, but I blame you for the negative direction it's taking. If I had it my way I'd never touch another EA game, but between Bioware and Battlefield I don't really get a choice.

Seriously though: Eat a dick and die, EA.

 

[BaronIveagh]

Basically, this: If I write a thread critical of something valve has done, in a polite and professional manner, and Valve reads it, they respond in a polite and professional manner. EA, on the other hand, bans you from every game you've bought, online or not. Supposedly they're trying to fix this, but frankly, I'll believe that when pigs fly.

 

[Waffle_Man]

It's a little bit more than that. See, Steam technically has the same "we can monitor what you do" clause that Origin does. The difference is that Steam's is more restricted. They can ONLY monitor your gameplay stats, and maybe a couple other things restricted specifically to your gaming. Meanwhile Origin's clause is that they can just monitor your computer. Anything. If I had Origin installed right now, EA could tell you that I'm using Firefox for my web browsing.

Yeah... see the difference? It isn't just a matter of "we trust Valve more than EA", it's a matter of "Origin wants access to more information than Steam". Now... is EA going to use this access for the kinds of things that have people paranoid? Maybe... maybe not. But why give them the opportunity?

I wasn't saying that there were no objective differences. Rather, I was trying to make the point that the actual effect of most of the differences aren't intuitively understandable to the common individual. How often do people actually read the terms and conditions of something if they aren't already suspicious about something? It certainly wasn't someone simply doing a routine reading through of the terms and conditions before deciding to use the service, considering that the controversy came about before Origin was actually available to the public. No, it was someone who disliked what EA was doing and actively searched for dirt on them.

I'm not trying to convince people that EA should be trusted or not trusted and that Origin should be used. Rather, the point was more along the lines of "public relations has real consequences in business."

 

[Rheinmetall]

I don't know, for me all drm services are equally evil and awful. Whenever I buy a pc game I look carefully the cover so that it is not a Steam, or GFWL game. Origins is also out of question because I avoid as hell EA games.

 

[Reggie Rock]

One thing that always gets me is how so many people are saying
"I don't mind a monopoly, as long as its valve's monopoly"
That is fanboyism of the highest goddamn caliber.

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

I wasn't saying that there were no objective differences. Rather, I was trying to make the point that the actual effect of most of the differences aren't intuitively understandable to the common individual. How often do people actually read the terms and conditions of something if they aren't already suspicious about something? It certainly wasn't someone simply doing a routine reading through of the terms and conditions before deciding to use the service, considering that the controversy came about before Origin was actually available to the public. No, it was someone who disliked what EA was doing and actively searched for dirt on them.

And you think that no one has combed the Steam ToS with the same grudge? Just because Valve is more popular over-all doesn't mean that everyone loves them. In fact, plenty of people hate Valve and/or Steam. As for the other question in there, not everyone the ToS is pre-suspicious (if you can call that a legitimate term), some people are just legal nuts. Throw them a bunch of "small print" and they'll read the whole thing, word for word.

I'm not trying to convince people that EA should be trusted or not trusted and that Origin should be used. Rather, the point was more along the lines of "public relations has real consequences in business."

Well yes, I would definitely agree to that. Simply saying that Steam just as vulnerable to people picking apart its ToS as was Origin. I think the key difference with them isn't so much if people are looking for flaws, but more the fact that people are more willing to jump on the bandwagon when said flaws are found in something from EA than from Valve.

 

[Calcium]

I like how the Escapist staff compared them in a podcast. It was along the lines of...

"Steam is abiguous about what it collects about you, but precise about what they do with it.
Origin is precise about what it collects about you, but ambiguous about what they do with it."

Though people's hate for Origin seems to stem mainly from it being EA who operates it. Also Steam as the established platform is already a service many people use. There's no point in me using Origin when I'm happy with the service of my current digital distributor.

 

[mirasiel]

When Steam first came into being I did not like it, nor did I trust it.

I heard it was buggy and flawed and I didn't trust the concept of DRM they had.

One day I decided that I kinda fancied the Orange box but couldn't get it anywhere so I bit the bullet and got it via Steam.

Over time and a few sales that purged my wallet of funds Valve/Steam have earned my trust and proven themselves to be a decent and customer-centric company with a vast array of varied titles from countless studios.


Origin/EA entered this realm about 7 years too late, made their entrance by *lying* about why they pulled titles from Steam (remember it wasnt because they were going to compete but because Steam was t3h evils to them), have a history of *awful* customer treatment (at best you are their serf, at worst their enemy to crushed into obedience) and made a terrible PR misstep of trying to lay claim to data on your PC, which they recanted but with some nice legalease that makes it look like they intend to undo that change asap. Oh and they seem to only carry their own products no one elses....making them pretty fucking redundant and over priced.

I already have 2 Digital distribution sources that fulfill my needs (Steam and GOG.com), trying to ply me with a 3rd is acceptable...trying to *force* me to use a 3rd...go fuck yourself assholes, I already have an xbox and a game rental sub.

 

[GonzoGamer]

As people were saying it was crap before it launched, I assumed it was because everyone hates EA... I know I do.
I'd much rather patronize Valve than EA. Especially when it comes to my PC.

 

[SpartanBlackman]

Valve is Chaotic good. They might force DRM, but they give massive sales and release quality games that are loved.
EA is Lawful Evil. They force DRM, and they do not give as many sales as steam, as well as destroying any developer they touch.

 

[Furtled]

Also EA's own staff admit Origin is flawed [http://kotaku.com/5885077/pc-gamer-vitriol-subsiding-ea-promises-origin-will-be-excellent-within-two-years], but hey, we have to use it anyway!

EA don't have the excuses (or the customer goodwill) Valve had when they started out, saying it's better than Steam was at launch is a straw man argument, Steam didn't have any major competitors and they weren't a massive corporation with billions in turnover. EA have no excuse for pushing a sub-standard service on their customers at this point, and that's ignoring their predatory data harvesting or the fact games are actually more expensive via Origin than they are on Steam or even Amazon.

Also those millions of users? I notice they never break that down into accounts ported across automatically from EA accounts or people that had no choice but to install Origin for FIFA12 or BF3.

I'd love to see Origin succeed as a valid competitor to Steam, but if EA keep going the way they currently are I just can't see it happening.

 

[GonzoGamer]

I agree that Steam needs competition or else those great prices wont last. But they need competition from someone other than EA. There's a chance that a Steam monopoly might not be a disaster but there's no doubt in my mind that if EA had a monopoly, it would lead to so much wallet-rape that they would be making horror movies about it.

 

[IKSA]

Because Origin is a piece of shit. Its just plain awful I once contacted customer service because I had problems with BF3 I waited 30mins and response was asdasdasdasdasd while I had problems with TF2 customer service was very patiece and solved the problem.