Why PC gaming might suck

[gmer412]

So I bought Thief II recently and after delving into it to be able to actually play it, I found that it was the glitchiest game I've ever played. You takes a step, the game freezes. You open the map, the game freezes. The problem might be with the fact that I'm playing it on mor recent computers, which lead me to conclude that PC games only have a short-term use. Once technology gets too advanced, they're unplayable unless something like steam picks them up and lets you download them. What do you think?

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

I had problems like that with KotOR 2. Buggiest game I've ever played yet I love it so.

 

[gmer412]

I think PC gaming is better or even the same as console. Consoles get technology advanced and you have to keep replacing the console to play new games. And you can download old games off online stores like the marketplace on the xbox or the virtual console.

But my Wii will play GCN games with no problem. PCs can't seem to play anything older than a few years.

 

[The Madman]

Copied from the 'other' whiny topic with a different name but same subject:

The old Thief games use the same engine as System Shock 2, another game notoriously hard to play on modern computers. Luckily there's actually a HUGE following for both the Thief and System Shock series which have figured out how to get the game running on most modern computers, something you'd know if you'd done more than just come here to complain about how glitchy? it is. (It isn't glitchy, glitches are built in malfunction or error. Thief is fairly glitch free, what it wasn't however was designed to run on computers from the future, go figure. I guess Looking Glass's time machine was broken.)

Here: http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75031

You're having the 'Multiprocessor/Hyperthreading Systems' problem because the game wasn't designed to run on multiple processors like modern gaming rigs have. The solution is here: http://www.thief-thecircle.com/guides/hyperthreading/

You can thank me later!

 

[The Madman]

But my Wii will play GCN games with no problem. PCs can't seem to play anything older than a few years.

Yes they do, you just need to know how to run them.

You don't obviously. Use Google, it's your friend!

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Spoiler: snip

Copied from the 'other' whiny topic with a different name but same subject:

The old Thief games use the same engine as System Shock 2, another game notoriously hard to play on modern computers. Luckily there's actually a HUGE following for both the Thief and System Shock series which have figured out how to get the game running on most modern computers, something you'd know if you'd done more than just come here to complain about how glitchy? it is. (It isn't glitchy, glitches are built in malfunction or error. Thief is fairly glitch free, what it wasn't however was designed to run on computers from the future, go figure. I guess Looking Glass's time machine was broken.)

Here: http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75031

You're having the 'Multiprocessor/Hyperthreading Systems' problem because the game wasn't designed to run on multiple processors like modern gaming rigs have. The solution is here: http://www.thief-thecircle.com/guides/hyperthreading/

You can thank me later!

Solutions always exist. I believe the OP's point is that there shouldn't be problems to begin with.

Of course the game wasn't meant to run on computers from the future, but there's no reason computers can't run programs from the past.

 

[Teh_Doomage]

While older PC games are really glitchy, if they programmed them for future computers....they wouldn't ever be released.

But that's not why PC gaming sucks, it DRM, well partially.

 

[The Madman]

Solutions always exist. I believe the OP's point is that there shouldn't be problems to begin with.

Of course the game wasn't meant to run on computers from the future, but there's no reason computers can't run programs from the past.

But it ->*CAN*<- run, they all can, that was the point of my post back when I thought he was genuinly asking for help in his other topic rather than just using it as a soapbox to complain about PC gaming, which is silly.

Just the other day I was playing some of my old Lucasarts adventure games on my computer via ScummVm, a neat program that lets you play them on new computers. That'd be the equivalent of playing NES games on your PS3, something which you simply can't do. And if you want to do it on the latest Nintendo consoles, it's only available for certain games and you have to PAY for it!

Bah Humbug!

 

[SinisterDeath]

Going from a single core CPU with multi-threading and all that jaz, to modern Quad Core CPUs, 64 bit opperating systems, and a bunch of other changes (like lack of hyperthreading/multithreading, which ever it is that modern cpus except the i7 line now re-includes) kinda tends to make older games a little harder to run.

Consoles are built with emulation of older games in mind. The Ps2 for example, basically had a PS1 in it.
The PS3 (orginally) had a ps2 in it, and has ps1 completely emulated by software. (its something like 10x the power to emulate one console on an other system. Running a PS2 game on a modern pc, is still extremely slow... At least it was for me...)

PC don't have BC hardware, its not hte same 'thing', pcs aren't just for gaming, they are for.. everything.
And adding in Old CPus, and Old ram, and old Operating systems, tend to make PCs less reliable, and other...t hings. (That and harder to atually BUILD and since we are all lazy/cheap S.O.B.s we'd rather have the easiest/cheapiest alternative, Specially when a few tweaks here and there by all our excellent coders out there for patching old games...

 

[gmer412]

Spoiler: snip

Copied from the 'other' whiny topic with a different name but same subject:

The old Thief games use the same engine as System Shock 2, another game notoriously hard to play on modern computers. Luckily there's actually a HUGE following for both the Thief and System Shock series which have figured out how to get the game running on most modern computers, something you'd know if you'd done more than just come here to complain about how glitchy? it is. (It isn't glitchy, glitches are built in malfunction or error. Thief is fairly glitch free, what it wasn't however was designed to run on computers from the future, go figure. I guess Looking Glass's time machine was broken.)

Here: http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75031

You're having the 'Multiprocessor/Hyperthreading Systems' problem because the game wasn't designed to run on multiple processors like modern gaming rigs have. The solution is here: http://www.thief-thecircle.com/guides/hyperthreading/

You can thank me later!

Solutions always exist. I believe the OP's point is that there shouldn't be problems to begin with.

Of course the game wasn't meant to run on computers from the future, but there's no reason computers can't run programs from the past.

This is my point. Games aren't programmed for use twenty years from when they're made, but computers then should be built on the computers that would be used to play these games in the past. Backwards compatibility is what I expect, without having to consult strategies for making games not buggy.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

That'd be the equivalent of playing NES games on your PS3, something which you simply can't do.

I beg to differ. [http://www.ps3news.com/PlayStation3/videos-using-snesgenesis-emulators-on-ps3-with-swap-magic/]

There's always solutions, on PC's they shouldn't be necessary. After all, they haven't released the PC2.

 

[The Madman]

This is my point. Games aren't programmed for use twenty years from when they're made, but computers then should be built on the computers that would be used to play these games in the past. Backwards compatibility is what I expect, without having to consult strategies for making games not buggy.

So we should all still be using archaic technology and running windows 95 because you're too lazy to look up how to get a game running on a modern computer?

That's stupid. And You're Welcome by the way, I already solved your problem. Thief isn't that hard to run on new computers and I gave you the links needed to solve your little problem. I've got the series installed right now in-fact, I might go play them later just to spite you. I'd be much less cynical if you'd atleast have the common courtesy to thank me rather than parade around my legitimately useful answer as some sort of banner for you're crusade against PC gaming.

 

[The Madman]

That'd be the equivalent of playing NES games on your PS3, something which you simply can't do.

I beg to differ. [http://www.ps3news.com/PlayStation3/videos-using-snesgenesis-emulators-on-ps3-with-swap-magic/]

There's always solutions, on PC's they shouldn't be necessary. After all, they haven't released the PC2.

I'd look at your link, but frankly it seems like too much effort. Isn't the entire point of this topic that the OP doesn't want to solve any problems and instead is determined that everything should always run flawlessly all the time?

Why should I hold the consoles to different standards? After all, Consoles are all built on pre-determined specifications unlike PC's which have a plethora of different possible configurations that have popped up over the years. No reason they couldn't make it all backwards compatible, right?

See what I'm doing here?

 

[gmer412]

This is my point. Games aren't programmed for use twenty years from when they're made, but computers then should be built on the computers that would be used to play these games in the past. Backwards compatibility is what I expect, without having to consult strategies for making games not buggy.

So we should all still be using archaic technology and running windows 95 because you're too lazy to look up how to get a game running on a modern computer?

That's stupid. And You're Welcome by the way, I already solved your problem. Thief isn't that hard to run on new computers and I gave you the links needed to solve your little problem. I've got the series installed right now in-fact, I might go play them later just to spite you. I'd be much less cynical if you'd atleast have the common courtesy to thank me rather than parade around my legitimately useful answer as some sort of banner for you're crusade against PC gaming.

You're right and I am grateful for the help. I actually prefer PC gaming, so I was a bit miffed when a game that looked promising wouldn't work on my computers(I tried it on two). My point is that I think PCs should be able to play old games without too much trouble: fair?

 

[thiosk]

While older PC games are really glitchy, if they programmed them for future computers....they wouldn't ever be released.

True.

Lets design our game to run on cheese, the computer of the future!

 

[The Madman]

You're right and I am grateful for the help. I actually prefer PC gaming, so I was a bit miffed when a game that looked promising wouldn't work on my computers(I tried it on two). My point is that I think PCs should be able to play old games without too much trouble: fair?

Fair enough. I'm not going to lie and say I haven't gotten frustrated in the past.

Remember: Compatibility mode should always be your first resort. If that doesn't work then look it up online, I've yet to have found a game that didn't have atleast a 'few' helpful people as a community (Hell, even Daikatana has fansites, and that game was crap!). Thief has a huge fanbase and so there's no shortage of help getting the game running. If you can't get the game running no matter what, post the problems on the TTLG forums and they'll help you out even. Great bunch!

Making a topic about how annoying PC gaming is on the other hand solves absolutely nothing unless a chump like me comes along to provide an answer only to get pissed later on. It doesn't help that the 'glitchy game' in question happens to be one of my all time favorites as well.

*grumble grumble*

 

[SquirrelPants]

This is my point. Games aren't programmed for use twenty years from when they're made, but computers then should be built on the computers that would be used to play these games in the past. Backwards compatibility is what I expect, without having to consult strategies for making games not buggy.

So we should all still be using archaic technology and running windows 95 because you're too lazy to look up how to get a game running on a modern computer?

That's stupid. And You're Welcome by the way, I already solved your problem. Thief isn't that hard to run on new computers and I gave you the links needed to solve your little problem. I've got the series installed right now in-fact, I might go play them later just to spite you. I'd be much less cynical if you'd atleast have the common courtesy to thank me rather than parade around my legitimately useful answer as some sort of banner for you're crusade against PC gaming.

You're right and I am grateful for the help. I actually prefer PC gaming, so I was a bit miffed when a game that looked promising wouldn't work on my computers(I tried it on two). My point is that I think PCs should be able to play old games without too much trouble: fair?

No. PC's are not designed for gaming specifically in mind. When they made Vista, they didn't exclusively think of running DOS games on them, which is why people are so angry about it. Companies don't make new PC's thinking about gamers who want to play old games, they're thinking about making a fast, functional computer so that people would buy it.
And there IS backwards compatibility, you've just gotta mess with some stuff, as said earlier in this thread.

 

[JMeganSnow]

No reason they couldn't make it all backwards compatible, right?

Actually, there are excellent reasons why the backwards-compatibility of PC's is severely limited--keeping everything backwards-compatible would result in a situation like refusing to build skyscrapers because they'd be taller than Gothic cathedrals. The old stone buildings had limitations that were imposed because stone is a crappy building material for tall buildings in comparison to to structural steel. It's the same with PC architecture--retaining perfect backwards-compatibility would mean severely nerfing your new equipment. There's a tradeoff involved.

The only games I've had trouble with were the smaller-budget games--I can still play Baldur's Gate and BGII on my new machine (built only a few months ago) if I turn off the SLI, but I can't play Planescape: Torment for some reason (heh, maybe I should go back and try playing it with SLI off to see if that fixes the problem I was having, I didn't think of that). Games like Drakan: Order of the Flame or Enclave wouldn't even work with my old PC (the one I'd had for 4 years) because they choked on the graphics card--they were made to utilize a very specific graphics architecture and couldn't handle anything else.

So, basically, the game needs to be fairly robust to have staying power, and a lot of PC games are NOT because many developers are more interested in making sure they use the graphics gimmick of the week rather than aiming for the mass audience.

 

[The Madman]

*SNIPPED to shorten*

So, basically, the game needs to be fairly robust to have staying power, and a lot of PC games are NOT because many developers are more interested in making sure they use the graphics gimmick of the week rather than aiming for the mass audience.

Methinks you missed the sarcasm in my post, because that's what I was implying. I agree with you! I was using the ol' double standards plot, thus the 'You see what I'm doing here?' at the end.

And for Planescape: Torment, go into the control panel - Display - Settings - Advanced - Troubleshooting, and turn the Hardware acceleration down by a couple notches. That's what I need to do when running Planescape: Torment, see if it'll work on your computer. Planescape has trouble dealing with 3D acceleration for some reason, which is odd because it uses the Infinity Engine, just like Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 do, and they both run excellently in most cases. And in the few cases people have trouble with the BG games it's always the first which can via an awesome mod actually be ported, the entire game, into the BG2 engine which solves that problem.

http://www.pocketplane.net/mambo/

Look up the BG1 tutu mod. It's amazing. All of the mods on that site are!

 

[Joeshie]

But my Wii will play GCN games with no problem. PCs can't seem to play anything older than a few years.

No offense, but you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. I can go back and play Doom and Duke Nukem 3D on my PC. Games that came out in the SNES and N64 eras respectively.

How do you think people are still playing Counter-Strike and Starcraft? Those games are 10+ years old.