Why save Sanctuary? (Diablo III)

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

I think it's a Blizzard thing, I got the same feeling with WOW. With Outland I was like 'The place is a dump let's just evacuate everyone and let the demons have it...' I mean the only reason it has an atmosphere is because of A'dal...

Don't even get me started on dragons...they cause more trouble than they fix. -.-

In D3 I would have known that a certain person was a traitor straight away yet my wizard with all her intelligence can't even see that....

sigh. It's like the Sarevok Koveras thing all over again.

I think Diablo 3 was kind of a fail on Blizzards part even though I enjoyed playing it through with friends it has a very limited lifespan. I have donated to the Path of Exile kickstarter and already pre ordered Torchlight 2 tbh.

The plot isn't a big part of Diablo for sure but one can't help but get the feeling the entire gameplay and loot system is built around the real money auction house.

I have actually spent money on virtual items in the Sims 3 but that's not just for me. I build houses for other people to enjoy too. One decent item in Diablo 3 can be £50-£200. A download pack from Sims 3 can be £2.50 for numerous items.

It's just a stupid system that normal players will never want to use and so they get stuck on act 1 inferno as the loot system as is won't let them progress further.

 

[Jhooud]

Beyond all this, I'd like to know why in every bloody game of this sort I've played, I've gone off and put myself at horrible risk to save said town/village/hamlet/base/etc. ad nauseum for no other reason than I apparently respond well to people with exclamation points over their heads only to have said town/village/hamlet/base/etc. hit me with predatory prices for the supplies I need to save their sorry butts.

Really, you want to charge me ten freakin' gold for that potion? How much for the pointy stick that will keep undead hordes from noshing on your skull? Ugh!

Forget 'em, I say. Enough with you, you virtual profiteers. I'm not saving your cozy little Sanctuary you decided to build next to Hell's front door! Good riddance!

 

[Zenn3k]

The real question is, who cares, Diablo 3 is one of the worst gaming experiences I've had in years, and every "patch" they release has made the game worse. I haven't logged-in in a week now, and thats likely not going to change.

You must not game very much then.

Oh, I do, I just avoid bad titles on purpose.

However I expected Diablo 3 to actually be GOOD...cause ya know, Blizzard? Boy was I fooled. Won't be purchasing anymore Blizzard titles however, they seem to be doing everything possible to make me NOT like Diablo 3, a game I paid cash money to play...so to hell with them.

Well I'm enjoying it. Yes, the latency/lag issues are a pain and I wish I wasn't forced to be online to play single player, also I liked the skill tree system in Diablo II better even if most of the skills available went unused, at least it gave me choice. However overall I'm still having a good time with it. So far I've just reached Act III and the plot up to that point has me intrigued. I guess you and I just have different standards (yours being unreasonably high).

You haven't even beat the game yet? Yeah, the first play through, fairly okay...minus the bad and boring story. Lets talk again once you reach Inferno.

Very well. Although I don't anticipate that my position is going to change much.

Oh it will, I haven't met a person yet who enjoys Diablo 3's end-game which consists of running Act 3 Hell hundreds of times until you save up enough gold to buy 1 item for 1-3 million gold from the AH, until you are finally able to survive a bit in Act 1 Inferno so they don't have to pay those oh so fun 10,000 gold repair costs PER DEATH

The first time you get 1-shot, and realize that using the AH is basically a requirement if you want to gear properly (since there is only 1 correct gear path for every class), and that you MUST use the 1 and only viable end-game build...you'll find it gets really stale, really fast.

Right now, you're allowed to experiment, use any skills you want to use, mess around with almost no fear of death at all. That ALL changes at 60 friend.

You don't FIND upgrades in Diablo 3 (like you would in Diablo 1 and 2), you BUY them, because late game, 99.98% of the loot that drops is completely useless...not just for you, but for EVERYONE. 0.01% is useful for you, and the remaining 0.01% is useful for someone else, to sell on the AH...to buy from someone else on the AH.

Enjoy it while it last.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

The real question is, who cares, Diablo 3 is one of the worst gaming experiences I've had in years, and every "patch" they release has made the game worse. I haven't logged-in in a week now, and thats likely not going to change.

You must not game very much then.

Oh, I do, I just avoid bad titles on purpose.

However I expected Diablo 3 to actually be GOOD...cause ya know, Blizzard? Boy was I fooled. Won't be purchasing anymore Blizzard titles however, they seem to be doing everything possible to make me NOT like Diablo 3, a game I paid cash money to play...so to hell with them.

Well I'm enjoying it. Yes, the latency/lag issues are a pain and I wish I wasn't forced to be online to play single player, also I liked the skill tree system in Diablo II better even if most of the skills available went unused, at least it gave me choice. However overall I'm still having a good time with it. So far I've just reached Act III and the plot up to that point has me intrigued. I guess you and I just have different standards (yours being unreasonably high).

You haven't even beat the game yet? Yeah, the first play through, fairly okay...minus the bad and boring story. Lets talk again once you reach Inferno.

Very well. Although I don't anticipate that my position is going to change much.

Oh it will, I haven't met a person yet who enjoys Diablo 3's end-game which consists of running Act 3 Hell hundreds of times until you save up enough gold to buy 1 item for 1-3 million gold from the AH, until you are finally able to survive a bit in Act 1 Inferno so they don't have to pay those oh so fun 10,000 gold repair costs PER DEATH

The first time you get 1-shot, and realize that using the AH is basically a requirement if you want to gear properly (since there is only 1 correct gear path for every class), and that you MUST use the 1 and only viable end-game build...you'll find it gets really stale, really fast.

Right now, you're allowed to experiment, use any skills you want to use, mess around with almost no fear of death at all. That ALL changes at 60 friend.

You don't FIND upgrades in Diablo 3 (like you would in Diablo 1 and 2), you BUY them, because late game, 99.98% of the loot that drops is completely useless...not just for you, but for EVERYONE. 0.01% is useful for you, and the remaining 0.01% is useful for someone else, to sell on the AH...to buy from someone else on the AH.

Enjoy it while it last.

Except for the presence of the AH, how is that any different from previous Diablo games? The thing about the item drop rate I mean. As for the rest, well we'll see.

 

[Aeshi]

Oh it will, I haven't met a person yet who enjoys Diablo 3's end-game which consists of running Act 3 Hell hundreds of times until you save up enough gold to buy 1 item for 1-3 million gold from the AH, until you are finally able to survive a bit in Act 1 Inferno so they don't have to pay those oh so fun 10,000 gold repair costs PER DEATH

The first time you get 1-shot, and realize that using the AH is basically a requirement if you want to gear properly (since there is only 1 correct gear path for every class), and that you MUST use the 1 and only viable end-game build...you'll find it gets really stale, really fast.

Right now, you're allowed to experiment, use any skills you want to use, mess around with almost no fear of death at all. That ALL changes at 60 friend.

You don't FIND upgrades in Diablo 3 (like you would in Diablo 1 and 2), you BUY them, because late game, 99.98% of the loot that drops is completely useless...not just for you, but for EVERYONE. 0.01% is useful for you, and the remaining 0.01% is useful for someone else, to sell on the AH...to buy from someone else on the AH.

Enjoy it while it last.

Replace 'grind 1-3 million gold to buy an item off the AH' with 'grind for half a dozen high-end runes/SOJs to trade for an item from a trade server' and 'Grind Act 3 Hell' with 'Grind Nightmare/Hell Mephisto/Baal/whoever' and you essentially have Diablo II's endgame...

 

[Zenn3k]

Snip

Except for the presence of the AH, how is that any different from previous Diablo games? The thing about the item drop rate I mean. As for the rest, well we'll see.

In Diablo 2, you could beat the game on Hell, with just what you found in the game by yourself. The game was designed to fulfill your loot desires purely on the in game drop rates, it showered you with loot, and MOST of it was useful.

Diablo 3 is clearly NOT designed this way. The game just isn't reasonably beat-able using just in game drops, you WILL hit a wall where the game will then expect you to repeat content for a LONG time with the HOPE of an upgrade that never seems to come.

The entire game design seems to want to push you into using the AH to feel your gear holes. From the number of slots you need to fill, to the insane resist requirements of Inferno. The more comfortable you make the user with using the AH, the more likely they'll be to use the Real Money AH, and Blizzard takes their cut.

The game just reeks of design choices specifically to encourage the player to get frustrated and spend more money to win. Just read over those patch notes. Every time a good farming spot is found, Blizzard nerfs it. Why? How does a working farm spot in a GAME ABOUT FARMING GEAR hurt the players? It doesn't, it hurts Blizzard and their RMAH, because gear becomes too easy to obtain, so they have to make it harder to get...to frustrate the player and make them pay2win.

They removed magic items dropping from destructible things in the game FFS...thats a Diablo STAPLE, now gone, because it hurt the RMAH and Blizzard pocket book.

 

[Zenn3k]

Oh it will, I haven't met a person yet who enjoys Diablo 3's end-game which consists of running Act 3 Hell hundreds of times until you save up enough gold to buy 1 item for 1-3 million gold from the AH, until you are finally able to survive a bit in Act 1 Inferno so they don't have to pay those oh so fun 10,000 gold repair costs PER DEATH

The first time you get 1-shot, and realize that using the AH is basically a requirement if you want to gear properly (since there is only 1 correct gear path for every class), and that you MUST use the 1 and only viable end-game build...you'll find it gets really stale, really fast.

Right now, you're allowed to experiment, use any skills you want to use, mess around with almost no fear of death at all. That ALL changes at 60 friend.

You don't FIND upgrades in Diablo 3 (like you would in Diablo 1 and 2), you BUY them, because late game, 99.98% of the loot that drops is completely useless...not just for you, but for EVERYONE. 0.01% is useful for you, and the remaining 0.01% is useful for someone else, to sell on the AH...to buy from someone else on the AH.

Enjoy it while it last.

Replace 'grind 1-3 million gold to buy an item off the AH' with 'grind for half a dozen high-end runes/SOJs to trade for an item from a trade server' and 'Grind Act 3 Hell' with 'Grind Nightmare/Hell Mephisto/Baal/whoever' and you essentially have Diablo II's endgame...

Major difference, you didn't NEED SOJ's and high-end runes to beat the highest difficulty of the game. You could do it on your own, without trading with others and without the BEST gear.

Diablo 3, even attempting Inferno Act 1 without about 400 Resist All and you basically just die instantly all game long. You MUST have that 3m gold gear to progress, its a REQUIREMENT.

People who farmed Baal and all that, they just wanted to be the best of the best of the best of the best, wanted to full MAX their character. Thats totally different than being required to buy AH gear to even progress at all.

 

[teebeeohh]

What I don't get is what the deal is with Zoltun Kulle. Maybe I missed something along the way, but I was under the impression that his end goal was to liberate humanity from the influences of both Heaven and Hell. Throughout Act II Zoltun Kulle makes good on all of his promises to you, and he frequently warns you not to trust 'the angel' (Heaven) and 'the witch' (Hell). If you'd listened to Kulle you could have potentially put an end to Adria's plans -and- elevated humanity to a position of legitimate power.

But instead, after Kulle makes good on his promise, offers you a job, and even attempts to warn you that the black soul stone had been tampered with (by Adria)... you randomly decide to stab him in the back because of... what? His evil-sounding voice and laugh? What?

this
i would have been so cool if at that moment the PC decides to side with Kulle and you spend the rest of the game fighting off both heaven and hell. because at the end the humans are basically at heavens mercy, even being led by human tyrael, i wouldn't put it past the angels(who are either extremely wimpy or huge dicks) to destroy sanctuary because they don't need the humans help to defeat hell anymore.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Snip

Except for the presence of the AH, how is that any different from previous Diablo games? The thing about the item drop rate I mean. As for the rest, well we'll see.

In Diablo 2, you could beat the game on Hell, with just what you found in the game by yourself. The game was designed to fulfill your loot desires purely on the in game drop rates, it showered you with loot, and MOST of it was useful.

Diablo 3 is clearly NOT designed this way. The game just isn't reasonably beat-able using just in game drops, you WILL hit a wall where the game will then expect you to repeat content for a LONG time with the HOPE of an upgrade that never seems to come.

The entire game design seems to want to push you into using the AH to feel your gear holes. From the number of slots you need to fill, to the insane resist requirements of Inferno. The more comfortable you make the user with using the AH, the more likely they'll be to use the Real Money AH, and Blizzard takes their cut.

The game just reeks of design choices specifically to encourage the player to get frustrated and spend more money to win. Just read over those patch notes. Every time a good farming spot is found, Blizzard nerfs it. Why? How does a working farm spot in a GAME ABOUT FARMING GEAR hurt the players? It doesn't, it hurts Blizzard and their RMAH, because gear becomes too easy to obtain, so they have to make it harder to get...to frustrate the player and make them pay2win.

They removed magic items dropping from destructible things in the game FFS...thats a Diablo STAPLE, now gone, because it hurt the RMAH and Blizzard pocket book.

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember hawking or just abandoning most of the crap I found in Diablo II. Besides no one is forcing you to use the RMAH, you could just use the other one wouldn't be any different than buying from any other merchant in the game.

 

[Tiamattt]

What I don't get is what the deal is with Zoltun Kulle. Maybe I missed something along the way, but I was under the impression that his end goal was to liberate humanity from the influences of both Heaven and Hell. Throughout Act II Zoltun Kulle makes good on all of his promises to you, and he frequently warns you not to trust 'the angel' (Heaven) and 'the witch' (Hell). If you'd listened to Kulle you could have potentially put an end to Adria's plans -and- elevated humanity to a position of legitimate power.

But instead, after Kulle makes good on his promise, offers you a job, and even attempts to warn you that the black soul stone had been tampered with (by Adria)... you randomly decide to stab him in the back because of... what? His evil-sounding voice and laugh? What?

this
i would have been so cool if at that moment the PC decides to side with Kulle and you spend the rest of the game fighting off both heaven and hell. because at the end the humans are basically at heavens mercy, even being led by human tyrael, i wouldn't put it past the angels(who are either extremely wimpy or huge dicks) to destroy sanctuary because they don't need the humans help to defeat hell anymore.

The option would've been nice, if the jerk didn't try to kills us the second he got brought back to life. Among some of the other questionable ideas in the game why have him constantly try to do the whole warning/offering to join forces thing and then make him attack us the first chance he gets? Not like we can just leave him alone and not get killed.

 

[Cyfu]

Diablo's essentially a fantasy version of Warhammer 40k (or an alternate version of Regular Warhammer I guess) in that the setting only really exists to provide hordes of bad guys to mow down for loot.

And besides Reincarnation's not a Demon-only thing, as I don't think the Archangels can be perma-killed either. Plus I think some of the novels mention that other worlds besides Sanctuary do exist (and since said worlds have deities, that would imply they have life on them as well...)


EDIT:

You know what I would like to see? A Diablo game in which the world has already been overtaken by Diablo and been under his control for 300 odd years. And you try to take it back and banish him. Now that would be kickass.

It might actually feel like you did something when you finished a quest or whatever, you could see the world change around you and shit.

Probably never gonna happen though.

Wouldn't mind this either, but that'd probably end up coming too close to Demon's Souls.

There are other worlds/world, the lore states that one female demon-lord and one male angel-lord fell in love and escaped to another world. (I think)
I don't remember much else of the lore though. Check out ForceSC2Strategy's channel on youtube. He made a couple of videos explaining the pre-diablo lore.

 

[Zenn3k]

Snip

Except for the presence of the AH, how is that any different from previous Diablo games? The thing about the item drop rate I mean. As for the rest, well we'll see.

In Diablo 2, you could beat the game on Hell, with just what you found in the game by yourself. The game was designed to fulfill your loot desires purely on the in game drop rates, it showered you with loot, and MOST of it was useful.

Diablo 3 is clearly NOT designed this way. The game just isn't reasonably beat-able using just in game drops, you WILL hit a wall where the game will then expect you to repeat content for a LONG time with the HOPE of an upgrade that never seems to come.

The entire game design seems to want to push you into using the AH to feel your gear holes. From the number of slots you need to fill, to the insane resist requirements of Inferno. The more comfortable you make the user with using the AH, the more likely they'll be to use the Real Money AH, and Blizzard takes their cut.

The game just reeks of design choices specifically to encourage the player to get frustrated and spend more money to win. Just read over those patch notes. Every time a good farming spot is found, Blizzard nerfs it. Why? How does a working farm spot in a GAME ABOUT FARMING GEAR hurt the players? It doesn't, it hurts Blizzard and their RMAH, because gear becomes too easy to obtain, so they have to make it harder to get...to frustrate the player and make them pay2win.

They removed magic items dropping from destructible things in the game FFS...thats a Diablo STAPLE, now gone, because it hurt the RMAH and Blizzard pocket book.

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember hawking or just abandoning most of the crap I found in Diablo II. Besides no one is forcing you to use the RMAH, you could just use the other one wouldn't be any different than buying from any other merchant in the game.

Well, what you remember and what I still experience are kinda different things (yes, I'm still playing Diablo 2).

Was there some junky gear in Diablo 2? Sure there was, but it wasn't 99.98% of all the loot you find. I could go load up Diablo 3 tonight, run the best thing I can run without fear of death (since now death is too costly to bother attempting something that CAN kill you) for 7 hours and not find a single thing that was worthwhile, not 1 single thing. I MIGHT, if I was really lucky, find something I could sell for a few hundred thousand on the AH...but thats if, for an entire evening of play time. Nobody is going to want that Barbarian Only Belt with Intelligence on it. Nobody wants that helm with +5 to Health Globe and Gold Pickup radius.

Items in D3 need to have 3 things on them to make them worthwhile. A primary (STR, DEX, INT), Vit, and Resist All. Thats it. If it doesn't have those 3 things on it, its completely useless to EVERYONE. Besides those 3 things, its nice to have it have something else as well, like increased attack speed (nerfed to hell, but still helpful), +Crit %, or +Crit Damage or Life on Hit, but those 3 primary stats are required for every piece of gear you equip.

 

[kannibus]

You need to save Sanctuary so that in the far future, the Illusive Man can set up a secret research facility that will brutally slaughter millions of refugees in mad experiments designed to figure out how to control the Reapers.

See what I did there?

 

[Aeshi]

There are other worlds/world, the lore states that one female demon-lord and one male angel-lord fell in love and escaped to another world. (I think)
I don't remember much else of the lore though. Check out ForceSC2Strategy's channel on youtube. He made a couple of videos explaining the pre-diablo lore.

The Demon and Angel in question are Lilith and Inarius, the world they fled to was actually Sanctuary itself (Humans are descended from their children.)

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Snip

Except for the presence of the AH, how is that any different from previous Diablo games? The thing about the item drop rate I mean. As for the rest, well we'll see.

In Diablo 2, you could beat the game on Hell, with just what you found in the game by yourself. The game was designed to fulfill your loot desires purely on the in game drop rates, it showered you with loot, and MOST of it was useful.

Diablo 3 is clearly NOT designed this way. The game just isn't reasonably beat-able using just in game drops, you WILL hit a wall where the game will then expect you to repeat content for a LONG time with the HOPE of an upgrade that never seems to come.

The entire game design seems to want to push you into using the AH to feel your gear holes. From the number of slots you need to fill, to the insane resist requirements of Inferno. The more comfortable you make the user with using the AH, the more likely they'll be to use the Real Money AH, and Blizzard takes their cut.

The game just reeks of design choices specifically to encourage the player to get frustrated and spend more money to win. Just read over those patch notes. Every time a good farming spot is found, Blizzard nerfs it. Why? How does a working farm spot in a GAME ABOUT FARMING GEAR hurt the players? It doesn't, it hurts Blizzard and their RMAH, because gear becomes too easy to obtain, so they have to make it harder to get...to frustrate the player and make them pay2win.

They removed magic items dropping from destructible things in the game FFS...thats a Diablo STAPLE, now gone, because it hurt the RMAH and Blizzard pocket book.

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember hawking or just abandoning most of the crap I found in Diablo II. Besides no one is forcing you to use the RMAH, you could just use the other one wouldn't be any different than buying from any other merchant in the game.

Well, what you remember and what I still experience are kinda different things (yes, I'm still playing Diablo 2).

Was there some junky gear in Diablo 2? Sure there was, but it wasn't 99.98% of all the loot you find. I could go load up Diablo 3 tonight, run the best thing I can run without fear of death (since now death is too costly to bother attempting something that CAN kill you) for 7 hours and not find a single thing that was worthwhile, not 1 single thing. I MIGHT, if I was really lucky, find something I could sell for a few hundred thousand on the AH...but thats if, for an entire evening of play time. Nobody is going to want that Barbarian Only Belt with Intelligence on it. Nobody wants that helm with +5 to Health Globe and Gold Pickup radius.

Items in D3 need to have 3 things on them to make them worthwhile. A primary (STR, DEX, INT), Vit, and Resist All. Thats it. If it doesn't have those 3 things on it, its completely useless to EVERYONE. Besides those 3 things, its nice to have it have something else as well, like increased attack speed (nerfed to hell, but still helpful), +Crit %, or +Crit Damage or Life on Hit, but those 3 primary stats are required for every piece of gear you equip.

Whatever you say. ¬__¬ This discussion is going nowhere and I'm bored.