Why won't the big video game publishers leave our niche games alone?

[Aircross]

I consider Mass Effect 1 a niche game. It was made for a specific demographic of video gamers. When Mass Effect 2 came out, a lot of the complexity that I liked from Mass Effect 1 got either streamlined to the point it was very simple (Paragon/Renegade actions) or completely removed (weapon and armor modification). Now Mass Effect 3 is getting tweaked for an even wider demographic. Guess what that means?

If the publishing companies want to make a Space Opera RPG with shooting mechanics that appeals to a large audience, why don't they come up with their own IP instead of "dumbing down" niche games?

 

[ZeroMachine]

Mass Effect 1 was never meant to be a niche game. It was, specifically, BioWare trying to get into the TPS market.

Besides, Mass Effect 2 was better.

 

[Puzzlenaut]

Explain to me why EA is to blame for the fact Bioware is now totally incapable of creating anything more than a sub-standard 3rd person action game with very limited RPG elements, cardboard cut-out characters and dull plots?

 

[4173]

Because they think they can make a profit.

 

[Cat of Doom]

EA + Bioware = Match made in heaven. Seriously

 

[mjc0961]

Mass Effect 1 was never meant to be a niche game. It was, specifically, BioWare trying to get into the TPS market.

Besides, Mass Effect 2 was better.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts. I laughed when I opened this thread that claimed to be talking about niche games and saw that the games in question are Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2. Neither are niche games.

But hey, sorry that the shooting was fluid instead of clunky and that it didn't require you to dick around on the pause screen for 5 minutes between missions or every time you picked up some new gun, armor, or weapon mod that might be useful, TC. How dare they improve upon Mass Effect's flaws in Mass Effect 2?! The sequel is supposed to be worse or the same, not better.

 

[Rawne1980]

Mass Effect 1 a niche game .... now i've seen it all.

If by niche you mean played by every bugger that likes RPG's or space or both.

Bioware, quite well known for making the old RPG and have quite a large fan base.

About as far away from niche as you can get.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

It's happening with Battlefield, too. Say what you want about its quality, but the series fills a different niche in the shooter market than CoD does. The EA property that should be in direct competition with CoD is Medal of Honor, but because the last MoH game didn't sell well and Battlefield has such big brand recognition, EA and Dice are retooling BF3 to be more like CoD and less like Battlefield. It sucks, but that has been EA's mode of operation for quite a while now. They haven't been a good niche publisher since the 80's, and they have been a pretty darned evil empire of a corporation since the late 90's. I'm still upset that they named their DD platform "Origin." It's just a reminder that they bought out Origin Systems in 1992, and completely dismantled it in 2004.

 

[Corven]

I came in here expecting more Xcom or Syndicate rage, now I'm left slightly bemused and scared.

 

[Ordinaryundone]

I consider Mass Effect 1 a niche game. It was made for a specific demographic of video gamers. When Mass Effect 2 came out, a lot of the complexity that I liked from Mass Effect 1 got either streamlined to the point it was very simple (Paragon/Renegade actions) or completely removed (weapon and armor modification). Now Mass Effect 3 is getting tweaked for an even wider demographic. Guess what that means?

If the publishing companies want to make a Space Opera RPG with shooting mechanics that appeals to a large audience, why don't they come up with their own IP instead of "dumbing down" niche games?

Mass Effect? Niche? BWAHAHAHAHA. Mass Effect was Bioware's attempt to become LESS Niche and expand into a larger market. You want a niche Bioware game, go play Jade Empire. That'll satisfy your hipster cred.

 

[Aircross]

Mass Effect? Niche? BWAHAHAHAHA. Mass Effect was Bioware's attempt to become LESS Niche and expand into a larger market.

Really?

Well then, thanks for opening my eyes for me...

...I guess this is what I get for making an ignorant statement.

 

[MisterDyslexo]

Mass Effect? Niche? BWAHAHAHAHA. Mass Effect was Bioware's attempt to become LESS Niche and expand into a larger market. You want a niche Bioware game, go play Jade Empire. That'll satisfy your hipster cred.

On an unrelated note, Bioware recently said that they wanted to do more with the Jade Empire IP, wouldn't rule out making another game. So yay.

 

[Stall]

Mass Effect 1 wasn't niche. "Niche" is genres like grand strategy and simulation. A TPS/RPG isn't niche.

Explain to me why EA is to blame for the fact Bioware is now totally incapable of creating anything more than a sub-standard 3rd person action game with very limited RPG elements, cardboard cut-out characters and dull plots?

Because it's easier to blame the big, scary EA instead of admitting Bioware might not be a flawless gift from the heavens.

 

[Legion IV]

Mass Effect 1 was never meant to be a niche game. It was, specifically, BioWare trying to get into the TPS market.

Besides, Mass Effect 2 was better.

Can somone please explain why the second one is better? Please!!! lets ignore the dumbed down game play lets just look at story.

Mass effect one had a huge overarching story party members were added as the story progressed and loyalty missions were only there if you actually took the time to talk to other characters. Again i must stress that the characters were intelligently added into the main story. You find out that the reavers can totally wreck the worlds shit and they destroyed a civilization and this is a huge cycle of death.

Mass effect 2 has a story, Shepard must stop the collectors. to do so you must assemble a squad. Most of this squad missions can be done at anytime and in any order therefore there all completely independent from everyone else's and the main storyline in general. Once you get these characters BAM loality quest go. Also they make the loyalty quest more a mandatory then i care for this character" Its more of a If you dont they'll die. Then after all that all you learn is that the collectors are a result of what the reapers can do and that reapers are attacking.

PLEASE!!!! tell me how mass effect 2 is better?

 

[Joccaren]

Eh, in kinda the same boat, but ME1 is not niche. ME1 was good with complexity, maybe it was clunky with the menus, but I didn't care too much. The shooting was fine, although I can only speak for PC, and I far preferred being able to alpha strike with all of my abilities to having to wait for a cooldown on everything, not to mention I don't have that many abilities anyway. Yeah, ME1 was a bit over the top, but it let me Spec my character how I wanted them to be. ME2, Shepard is a guy who fires guns and that's mostly it. Even in my non-Vanguard playthrough attempt (Couldn't get past the boring, repetitive combat. It was just too boring to even try)when I tried engineer, sentinel and adept, I found myself using my gun more than my abilities as it had a quicker reload time. Some of the streamlining was ok, though I wouldn't call it good. The complete removal of the inventory bugged me, I like having limited resources to work with and having to put things in the best combo for success, now I have infinite everything, all I have to do is select the most recently acquired/DLC weapon and let my squad go.

I'm not going to touch the story, that has been done so many times. But ME2 IMO was not better than 1.

Still, ME3 looks somewhat interesting. The tampering they are doing with it for a wider audience is speech recognition on Kinect, so what? Things like weapon upgrades are coming back, I can carry and use any gun, but only certain combinations of them, I get weapon and skill stat bars back, so I can actually see which gun is better, or if they are better in different situations, we get to run around during combat rather than sitting behind a wall. It is looking somewhat good in some aspects, I just hope that I get to use my abilities with seperate cooldowns (though I'm pretty much sure I won't D

 

[Sheamus]

maybe the op considers anything that is not a Military FPS to be a niche game? But really, while some of the changes might not have been to my liking (ammo, gear stats) the majority of the changes from 1-2 were, as many have already pointed out, for the better. I'm intentionally not paying attention to ME3, so I don't know what changes will be made, but again Bioware hasn't failed me yet.

captcha: scesime scarce

 

[cookyy2k]

I hated ME2, so glad I bought second hand so no one from EA got their hands on my money for it. ME1 is, in my opinion, one of the best games ever. ME2 just took away everything I liked and became... that. The story was good, that is all. Stats "streamlining" and taking away my weapons/upgrades/armour etc. ruined it. ME3 will be on my wait til less than £10 second hand and play for the story nothing else if it's anything like 2.

OT ME1 wasn't really niche, but I get what you mean. I have no idea why everything has to become the same bland pap they keep serving up. Then I suppose people buy it and EA never sees any repercussions because bland pap is a decent experience for a lot instead of a great experience for the few...

 

[ZeroMachine]

Mass Effect 1 was never meant to be a niche game. It was, specifically, BioWare trying to get into the TPS market.

Besides, Mass Effect 2 was better.

Can somone please explain why the second one is better? Please!!! lets ignore the dumbed down game play lets just look at story.

Mass effect one had a huge overarching story party members were added as the story progressed and loyalty missions were only there if you actually took the time to talk to other characters. Again i must stress that the characters were intelligently added into the main story. You find out that the reavers can totally wreck the worlds shit and they destroyed a civilization and this is a huge cycle of death.

Mass effect 2 has a story, Shepard must stop the collectors. to do so you must assemble a squad. Most of this squad missions can be done at anytime and in any order therefore there all completely independent from everyone else's and the main storyline in general. Once you get these characters BAM loality quest go. Also they make the loyalty quest more a mandatory then i care for this character" Its more of a If you dont they'll die. Then after all that all you learn is that the collectors are a result of what the reapers can do and that reapers are attacking.

PLEASE!!!! tell me how mass effect 2 is better?

We'll ignore story. That's purely subjective. I enjoyed both equally story-wise, and I know many people that enjoy 1 more and 2 more.

Looking at gameplay:

Yes, the EXTREMELY lacking RPG elements sucked, as did the EXTREME lack of weapons. But, it was more responsive, more intense, controlled far better (especially with Techs and Biotics), and was far easier to manage than the first games sub par leveling system and ATROCIOUS inventory system.(Side note: Mass Effect 3 looks like the supreme happy medium for both of these issues.) Mass Effect 2 didn't improve on anything, but it improved on more things than not. It did NOT, repeat, NOT dumb it down. It streamlined it. It streamlined it a little too much, admittedly, but it was so much smoother that it was just better from a strictly game design standpoint.

And I don't feel like I need to explain how the graphics are better. That's just obvious.

And hey, if you prefer the first one, cool. I did for a while. But from an unbiased standpoint, Mass Effect 2 is just better designed.

 

[x-machina]

If the publishing companies want to make a Space Opera RPG with shooting mechanics that appeals to a large audience, why don't they come up with their own IP instead of "dumbing down" niche games?

First of all I completely agree with you about Mass Effect 1 being better. But, the reality is that Mass Effect 2 was more successful. Sequels simply make more money than Original Properties, and sequels that appeal to wider audiences make even more money.

 

[NeutralDrow]

Aww...I was gonna come in here and exclaim "I wish big developers would do something with our niche games!"

Of course, then I realized I don't trust most big developers to make a good visual novel, so I was screwed either way.