Would you like the next Elder Scrolls game to focus on Elsewyr or Black Marsh?

[Oroboros]

I would like to revisit Morrowind, or vvardenfall specifically, but Bethesda nuked that setting completely for no reason between Oblivion and Skyrim.

Actually, they nuked it for a VERY specific reason.

Back in Morrowind there was a book series called the 36 lessons of Vivec. In the second to last sermon, Vivec described how the virility of the Dunmer's belief in the Psijic Endeavor, the path of the prophet Veloth, the man who led the Chimer, would would become the Dunmer, from The Summerset Isles, to Morrowind, was dead.

Vivec also goes onto describe that he knows, and is going to let happen, a series of catastrophes in order to renew the Dunmer's faith in the Psijjic Endeavor, those calamities being the invasion of Dagon, the eruption of Red Mountain, and the Argonian invasion, and books added in Skyrim's Dragonborn DLC say that after all these events, the Dunmer's belief was renewed, just as Vivec foresaw.

Bethesda nuked Morrowind because they said they would in Morrowind itself, and the entire plot of Morrowind was about setting up the situation to happen in the first place, by taking away Vivec's god powers, thus causing the giant rock he purposefully left floating above Vivec City, knowing that one day it would fall, destroy the city, and cause Red Mountain to explode, to crash down, destroy the city, and causing Red Mountain to explode.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:36_Lessons_of_Vivec,_Sermon_35
"'The formulas of proper Velothi magic continue in ancient tradition, but that virility is dead, by which I mean at least replaced.

Later, and by that I mean much, much later, my reign will be seen as an act of the highest love, which is a return from the astral destiny and the marriages between. By that I mean the catastrophes, which will come from all five corners. Subsequent are the revisions, differentiated between hope and the distraught, situations that are only required by the periodic death of the immutable. Cosmic time is repeated: I wrote of this in an earlier life. An imitation of submersion is love's premonition, its folly into the underworld, by which I mean the day you will read about outside of yourself in an age of gold. For on that day, which is a shadow of the sacrificial concept, all history is obliged to see me for what you are: in love with evil. "

The specifics of what was going to happen to the Dunmer were never explicitly mentioned in Morrowind. I don't think anyone believed that vivec was going to keep his powers after the heart of Lorkhan was destroyed, or that the Ministry of Truth was going to stay poised in the air forever. Bethesda went far and beyond just that however, with the ministry destroying the entire city and red mountain rendering the entire subcontinent uninhabitable, and argonians suddenly invading the mainland and wiping out most of what was left. (seriously, who saw that one coming?) Fact of the matter is, Bethesda purposefully destroyed the setting of Morrowind. Chances are, if there was anything you liked about the game Morrowind, it's one of the things that Bethesda axed. In light of the scope of the manner in which Bethesda cleaned house, it certainly looks like the setting was nuked for no good reason, something that a few scraps of lore don't begin to excuse.

 

[endtherapture]

I'm actually thinking that TES6 could take place in High Rock.

The Thalmor are trying to deactivate all of the towers right...and the last active tower is supposedly in High Rock, right?

 

[SajuukKhar]

-The specifics of what was going to happen to the Dunmer were never explicitly mentioned in Morrowind.
-I don't think anyone believed that vivec was going to keep his powers after the heart of Lorkhan was destroyed, or that the Ministry of Truth was going to stay poised in the air forever.
-Bethesda went far and beyond just that however, with the ministry destroying the entire city and red mountain rendering the entire subcontinent uninhabitable,
-and argonians suddenly invading the mainland and wiping out most of what was left.
-(seriously, who saw that one coming?)
-Fact of the matter is, Bethesda purposefully destroyed the setting of Morrowind. Chances are, if there was anything you liked about the game Morrowind, it's one of the things that Bethesda axed.
-In light of the scope of the manner in which Bethesda cleaned house, it certainly looks like the setting was nuked for no good reason, something that a few scraps of lore don't begin to excuse.

-The specific destruction was not mentioned no, but the destruction itself was.
-I dont know what people you are talking about, because pretty much everyone on the TES lore forums knows that Vivec had CHIM, and this his loss of the powers he gained from the heart meant nothing, since he had moved beyond them centuries ago.
-What game did you play? because Skyrim specifically stated that Balmora, along with several other cities on Vvardenfell, were being rebuilt, and people are moving back there, and have been for years.
-The Argonians didn't wipe out anything, they got to Mournhold, sacked it, then went back south. and in case you didnt know, Mournhold is a very southern city http://images.uesp.net/f/ff/Racemap05S-Morrowind.jpg
-Who saw a bunch of slaves turning on their oppressors the moment they got the change? A lot of people actually. A slave uprising was discussed a lot back in the day.
-Bethesda didn't axe anything, as Skyrim's Dragonborn DLC showed, everything from the plant life, to the animals, and even the cities, are still there, just as they were before, and are flourishing, not only in Morrowind, but even in Solstheim as well.
-They destroyed Vvardenfell, and did so in order to make the Dunmer's politics and weird culture more prevalent by making them undergo a spiritual rebirth. Also, it wasn't just a few scraps of lore, it was literally the ENTIRE point of Morrowind's main quest, and the Nerevarine Prophecies.

You seem very confused on what actually happened to Vverdenfell, and how much destruction it actually suffered.

I'm actually thinking that TES6 could take place in High Rock.

The Thalmor are trying to deactivate all of the towers right...and the last active tower is supposedly in High Rock, right?

The Thalmor are trying to kill Talos, so they can control the time dragon, not destroy the towers.

You are probably thinking of the Mythic Dawn, they sought to destroy the towers to allow Dagon to invade.

 

[endtherapture]

snip
The Thalmor are trying to kill Talos, so they can control the time dragon, not destroy the towers.

You are probably thinking of the Mythic Dawn, they sought to destroy the towers to allow Dagon to invade.

Well they're not going to go back to Morrowind again, I'm pretty sure of that, even though it is rebuilding.

Oh well...it seems like every Elder Scroll game since Morrowind has focused on a tower/the destruction of a tower, and isn't Adamantine Tower the only one left? I could imagine it being set around that tower since it is the only one left...but obviously not for. So the Thalmor aren't interested in the towers at all?

But the Green tower could also be the setting for a game too (ie. Valenwood, not sure if that tower is still active).

 

[TotalerKrieger]

I don't think Black Marsh or Elsewyr will ever be featured in a full-blown Elders Scrolls game as it would be rather difficult to market a game focused on the land and culture of reptilian and cat people. The unconventional setting of Morrowind was compelling to many gamers, but it turned off many others with less adventurous tastes.

The name Elsewyr itself suggests to me that Bethesda had little intention to actually render this region. It is a mysterious land that will always be elsewhere. Black March sounds like a hellish shit-hole unsuitable for any sort of enjoyable gaming experience. That said, I wouldn't mind some DLC forays into these regions.

I think the most likely setting for the next TES game will be High Rock and/or Hammerfell. Valenwood, like Black Marsh, seems like a fairly impractical setting. The Summerset Isles have purged all non-elves from the land so a full game seems unlikely, but some sort of invasion DLC is very possible.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Well they're not going to go back to Morrowind again, I'm pretty sure of that, even though it is rebuilding.

Oh well...it seems like every Elder Scroll game since Morrowind has focused on a tower/the destruction of a tower, and isn't Adamantine Tower the only one left? I could imagine it being set around that tower since it is the only one left...but obviously not for. So the Thalmor aren't interested in the towers at all?

But the Green tower could also be the setting for a game too (ie. Valenwood, not sure if that tower is still active)

Well yes, they wouldn't have gone back to Morrowind regardless of its state.

The whole tower saga is presumed by many to have been wrapped up with the "death" of Alduin. The world became unable to the point of destruction, Alduin was freed from his time-cage, and tired to fulfill his mythic destiny of eating the world, but the Dragonborn proved that mortals are still worthy of at least little more time, thus delaying the end that should have come until Akatosh grows tired of this Kalpa, and releases Alduin to continue his work.

As for The Thalmor, for all we know, they dont care about the towers.

Green-Sap, the tower which is presumed to be the Bosmer's moving tree city capitol Falinesti, is, as of Oblivion, dormant, and not moving. If it started moving again since Oblivion is unknown, but given that we haven't heard of it being burned down/destroyed by the Aldmeri Dominion, and they have had plenty of time to do it, we can assume they left it alone, active or not.

 

[endtherapture]

snip

Hmm I thought the towers were the main overarching plot of the game series.

Obviously Arena/Daggerfall/Morrowind lead up to Oblivion, and Oblivion/Morrowind seems to lead into Skyrim and they all revolve around towers so hmm.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Hmm I thought the towers were the main overarching plot of the game series.

Obviously Arena/Daggerfall/Morrowind lead up to Oblivion, and Oblivion/Morrowind seems to lead into Skyrim and they all revolve around towers so hmm.

The entire tower thing was something made up in Morrowind, and only made important in a out-of-game document for Oblivion. It largely exists to explain why Dagon couldn't invade during all the past times when the Dragonfires were out, a plot-hole not explained in Oblivion itself.

The "every game has a tower falling" thing is just a theme, one that Arena breaks, and one that was retroactively retconed into Daggerfall, as in Daggerfall, Numidium, the brass tower, was JUST a giant robot. That isn't to say its not important, it is, its just not something that HAS to happen every game.

 

[endtherapture]

snip

Yeah but Arena is sort of the dark horse anyway in an undeveloped franchise...and you can visit all of the towers in Arena if I'm not mistaken?

 

[SajuukKhar]

Yeah but Arena is sort of the dark horse anyway in an undeveloped franchise...and you can visit all of the towers in Arena if I'm not mistaken?

You cant see Numidium in Arena

 

[endtherapture]

Yeah but Arena is sort of the dark horse anyway in an undeveloped franchise...and you can visit all of the towers in Arena if I'm not mistaken?

You cant see Numidium in Arena

Oh yeah you can't. Arena does seem undeveloped in Lore though so I think we could possibly discount it, so in every other game there is a tower as a main plot point/visitable.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Oh yeah you can't. Arena does seem undeveloped in Lore though so I think we could possibly discount it, so in every other game there is a tower as a main plot point/visitable.

Daggerfall is just as bad as Arena. and even then it had no mention of towers until after Morrowind came out.

 

[endtherapture]

Oh yeah you can't. Arena does seem undeveloped in Lore though so I think we could possibly discount it, so in every other game there is a tower as a main plot point/visitable.

Daggerfall is just as bad as Arena. and even then it had no mention of towers until after Morrowind came out.

True, Elder Scrolls lore didn't seem to get genuinely unique and interesting until Morrowind.

 

[SajuukKhar]

Anyways, if they do contiue on with the "tower" theme, then the only places left are high rock/ Hammerfell, since the Adamantium tower sits on an island between them, and Valenwood.

But since we have already been to high Rock/Hammerfell, and the thalmor's capitol is in Valenwood, I suspect that will be the location of the nex game.

Black Marsh and elswyer have no real........... importance as far as a game setting.

 

[persephone]

Elsewyr and Valenwood would be a good set to pair together.

I agree completely. The existing lore for both provinces is fascinating, we'd see the aftermath of the reign of the Aldmeri Dominion (or maybe they're still ruling, yikes!), and the two provinces together cover about as much land mass as Cyrodiil or Skyrim. The geographical variation alone would be an explorer's wet dream. It'd also be nice to have a game with lots of elves and Khajiit in it after Skyrim and its racist, "fuck off if you're not a Nord, especially if you're not human" culture. I mean, there were hardly any Khajiit or Argonians at all.

 

[Kyber]

Argonia is almost completely inhabitable by all the other races except for the Argonians due to their large resistance to all diseases.
Elsweyr would be a great choice, due to the fact that a lot of structures and places in there predate Men and Mer, due to an ancient civilization living in there (that could be part of the main plot). It's landscape would also be more varid, when Black Marsh would mostly be a Jungle/Swamp (then again, Skyrim was supposed to be cold and unforgiving, more like Antarctica than Alaska). It would also be better from the lore point of view.

 

[SajuukKhar]

(then again, Skyrim was supposed to be cold and unforgiving, more like Antarctica than Alaska).

No it wasn't, your thinking of Atmora.

 

[Kyber]

(then again, Skyrim was supposed to be cold and unforgiving, more like Antarctica than Alaska).

No it wasn't, your thinking of Atmora.

I actually wasn't, I genuinely remember reading that, before Skyrim was even announced, when I was getting into the whole lore thing and was reading about all the parts of Tamriel and all the continents and what not, but I do believe your lore knowledge is greater than mine, so thanks for correcting me. Also, no offense, but in my opinion, Elsweyr has a pretty large lore importance, due to the whole ancient civilization, and hundreds of buried cities in the sand.

 

[Puzzlenaut]

Is any reason why the two choices are Black Marsh or Elsewyr? as to me those are the two least interesting of all the provinces; they are very homogenised in terms of population and the beast races just seem... goofy, to say the least. As all non-Altmer were purged from Alinor, it also suffers as a potential setting.

Valenwood would be my preference. The superiority complex of the Thalmor over even the Bosmer must surely lead to a troubled relationship? It seems as though Valenwood is sort of a the frontlines of this Empire v Thalmor battle, and don't forget the Thalmor's capital city is in Valenwood. It definitely seemed in Skyrim that they were setting up the Thalmor to be main baddies later on. Valenwood has varied environments and inhabitants as well as the potential for political intrigue. Also, the Wild Hunt (look it up).


If not Valenwood then Hammerfell, specifically as it is prophesied as the place with the Dwemer will return to, and the return of the Dwemer seems like perfect subject matter for the next game.

 

[Dragonbums]

(then again, Skyrim was supposed to be cold and unforgiving, more like Antarctica than Alaska).

No it wasn't, your thinking of Atmora.

I actually wasn't, I genuinely remember reading that, before Skyrim was even announced, when I was getting into the whole lore thing and was reading about all the parts of Tamriel and all the continents and what not, but I do believe your lore knowledge is greater than mine, so thanks for correcting me. Also, no offense, but in my opinion, Elsweyr has a pretty large lore importance, due to the whole ancient civilization, and hundreds of buried cities in the sand.

It does indeed. However a lot of people stated on this forum- Bethesda probably won't do it because of the amount of Khajiit models they have to create for Elsewyr that they stated in the lore.
Of course in my opinion if they were smart, they would utilize the various Khajiit mods that created those very Khajiit models and upgrade the past Khajiit models from previous games.