WW2 Games from a Nazi Perspective...

[chuckman1]

For one, as it was mentioned way up top was the Silent Hunter series in which it's not about how fast you win, but how slowly you lose.

Best case scenario for the fabled popular Nazi WWII shooter? Probably something along the lines of being a front line German trooper, pushed to go fight for his country by the harrowing depictions of German soldiers to fight for their country and the good of the world. As you progress you find war not as pretty as depicted but you still fight as best you can. Eventually you do something and become a German hero and are promoted into the SS. Your character quickly realizes that Hitler isn't this grand hero but a monster and everyone in Germany is being fooled. Knowing that slander against their great leader would be suicide, your character decides to flee to the Allied front and risk giving himself up to fight for the Allies. Along the way, you have a espionage-esque chase over several missions where you collect secrets and free rebels from the various freedom fighters and P.O.W.s (preferably not just Americans, if any) and gain support for not locking you away for the rest of your life and making it known that you're not a bad guy.

The one thing I know that wouldn't get by, but should, would be a No Russian style mission of your character's first day on the job with the SS. There should be a moment where your character is faced with a line of innocent Jewish people and you're forced to kill them, preferably through something extremely unnecessary like a flamethrower. You refuse? Your squad leader threatens immediate execution. Still refuse? Game over, because he just shot you. It would be his very poignant turning point and hopefully push that message of "not all German soldiers were terrible, they were told to do terrible things" deal, but also give insight as to how horrible some of the higher-ups in the Nazi army really were. As much as people want to gripe about something like this being a Jew-killing simulator and such, it needs to be said, lest we forget and history repeats itself.

The biggest problem? Gamers aren't mature enough for this game. Not yet. =(

This game sounds amazing.
I want to make this as an rpg (I'm in a "I want to make rpgs" phase)
This sounds like it could be game changing for videogames

 

[Prime_Hunter_H01]

The best way to incorporate a German and even Japanese campaign in a WWII shooter would be to go historical art house game. The campaign would jump between every, and I mean EVERY major battle from the war playing as the eventual winner. This would mean that in the early stages of the game Axis levels would include the Invasion of Poland and the first push into the Soviet Union for the Germans, some early Italian victories, and the Invasions of Manchuria and the Philippines for the Japanese campaign. The way to lessen controversy would be to explicitly sate that the game is a chronological tour through WWII, which would mean by the end You would take on the Classic roles such as the D-Day landing, Iwo Jima, and the Invasion of Berlin.

There may be hope for it since there wasn't a lot of notable flare up for Spec Ops The Line having American soldiers as enemies and that it treated each side as morally grey.

 

[WanderingFool]

If there ever is a WWII game with Nazi missions, then there needs to be this conversation appearing in a cutscene at least once.

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Anyways, I could imagine it's possible, I suppose if you play as a soldier in Rommel's Afrika Corps. They committed nearly no war crimes out of any of the Nazi soldiers, Rommel was an honorable man (and one HELL of a magnificent bastard), and the soldiers frequently kept up semi-courteous/gentlemanly relations with their "enemies".

You would frequently need to humanize your squad though. Get a few shots of Rommel every now and then, and maybe show the difference between him and the rest of the Nazi high-command by having an "evil" SS officer come to investigate all the war crimes Rommel hadn't been committing when ordered to.

The mission could end with Rommel speaking with you, his loyal and honorable soldier, and informing you of a little thing known as "operation Valkryie"...

I imagine afterwards there could be a DLC campaign where you successfully kill Hitler, Rommel gains enough of the Army's support to throw off the rest of the Nazi high command in a coup. He negotiates with all the allies (minus the Soviets, who continue to assault Germany) and convinces them to accept a peace treaty. The campaign would end with a badly battered and nearly broken Germany forcing back the Soviets in one huge "last stand" involving trench warfare and waves upon waves of soviet soldiers.

If you survive to the end, and manage to halt the Soviet advance, it could end with an alternate history epilogue in which the reds expansion stopped on the border of Poland. Rommel slowly began to rebuild a (badly fragmented) Germany, made what reparations he could to the Jews and other people targeted in the Holocaust, and so on...

Thats beautiful... If someone was to make a WWII game like that, I would buy it in a heartbeat.

Captcha:

Best Captcha yet...

 

[BathorysGraveland]

I'm interested in a similar thing actually, but for a less video game-covered war. Vietnam.

Playing a game like the first Vietcong (the best FPS I've ever played) from the perspective of a VC guerrilla or even an NVA regular would be fucking brilliant. But like the WWII-German thing, you have the moral problems with it. Shooting Americans and American-allies wouldn't go over well with most people, it probably wouldn't sell well and then unfortunately it wouldn't be made. You're also playing as what childish people consider "bad guys" and that's generally a no-no as well (though you can play as Soviet soldiers in WWII in some games - figure that one out). Which is too bad, because there is certainly some creative potential here as far as more personal FPS games go.

I think modifications is truly the only possibility for something like this to happen on a mature scale. Of course there are strategy games, but they lack the personality of taking control of an individual and fighting alongside other individuals with specific goals, missions and superior officers etc.

 

[Stepan_RUS']

I seem to have a very different opinion about the war to the people i meet on-line.

You're a neo-Nazi, right? You even have a swastika in your avatar (kolovrat?).

I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on the final solution and how would you deal with that and related topics in a video game. Do you think it was positive? Would it sell in your country compared to western Europe and the states where there would no doubt be a public outcry?

i do not belive 'final solution' as you say, occoured exactly as history tells it. Regardless, i do not know who would want to play a video-game that is just for killing people, they would have to have the sick head, no?
I think it is because most of the video-game is made in America, Etc. That they are mostly about the American soliders, of course.

I do not know America very well, but i have a feeling there would be less upset people here than in USA, because there are more of the communist sympathiser over there. (Irony, no?)
I know where i grew up in Lviv, and where i live now (Russia) all the people i know feel the same way i do.

The government likely make a fuss however, about this video-game like it is now about November 4. (Russian march) because it is under control from various left-wing groups.


Edited: it seems my avatar has changed to the portrait of some young man, why is this?

 

[mjcabooseblu]

if you took offense, don't.

This. I would make it my signature if such a thing existed on this site.

Anyway, it's an interesting thought. Though I predict outrage if such a thing were made.

Well of course, what do you expect? We still think we're the good guys for invading the wrong country after 9/11...

This is the country that still loses its shit over a terrorist attack over ten years ago with relatively minor casualties. I doubt we'll ever lose the butthurt over WW2. Not that WW2 was, like, a good thing, but come on guys. Let's at least ACKNOWLEDGE the enemy.

 

[Slayer_2]

Red Orchestra 2 has an Axis campaign, and all the previous games/mods have allowed players to play as the nazi's in MP.

 

[BathorysGraveland]

from the vietcong perspective is of course vietcong 2 which offered a campaign
also check out 7554 its one of the first games from vietnam and is entirely from the perspective of the vietnamese on the other side fighting the frenchthen the americans. from the reviews on gamersgate people apparently liked it alot

Well, let's be honest here. Vietcong 2 sucked, hard. The Vietnamese campaign was a total of 3 or 4 VERY short missions. It was no where near the depth of the original Vietcong campaign and felt completely tacked on.

As for that other game, it could be pretty decent. I'll check it out, thanks.

 

[Stepan_RUS']

I seem to have a very different opinion about the war to the people i meet on-line.

You're a neo-Nazi, right? You even have a swastika in your avatar (kolovrat?).

I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on the final solution and how would you deal with that and related topics in a video game. Do you think it was positive? Would it sell in your country compared to western Europe and the states where there would no doubt be a public outcry?

i do not belive 'final solution' as you say, occoured exactly as history tells it. Regardless, i do not know who would want to play a video-game that is just for killing people, they would have to have the sick head, no?
I think it is because most of the video-game is made in America, Etc. That they are mostly about the American soliders, of course.

I do not know America very well, but i have a feeling there would be less upset people here than in USA, because there are more of the communist sympathiser over there. (Irony, no?)
I know where i grew up in Lviv, and where i live now (Russia) all the people i know feel the same way i do.

The government likely make a fuss however, about this video-game like it is now about November 4. (Russian march) because it is under control from various left-wing groups.


Edited: it seems my avatar has changed to the portrait of some young man, why is this?

First off, if you're going to deny the holocaust, we're going to have a serious problem. Second, people kill enemies in video games all the time, that doesn't make them unwell. Video games are escapism after all. Thirdly, and this has been stated earlier, while the German army may have helped your people in WW2, you can't deny what they did. I know that there are no good guys in war, but do you? Finally, you're avatar is now Justin Beiber, a Canadian pop star. It changed because you pressed the red button, but it only lasts for a day.

You forign men sure are 'touchy' about this subject, i do not understand why.

I am not denying the 'holocaust' like you say, just questioning histories' version of it. "History is written by victor" as they say. this is why people think Nazi is evil, instead of just army of another country doing what they thought was right.
Of course many people are killed, many soliders and many civilans. in a state of total war, civilians will be targeted. Fact of such a large-scale conflict.
What is conveniently forgotten however, (because the opressors won the war) are the dreadful things the allies, both soviet and american did to 'enemy' civilians. Have you heard of the fire-bombing of Dresden, (The americans wanted to see if they could create a 'fire storm' in a city using bombs, and used the city of Dresden to test, killing over 100,000 civilians) or the Eisenhower death camps on the Rhine (where 1,7 million German prisioners were tortured, starved and killed at the end of the war)? There is evidence of a great many (deliberate, i might add) killings of Axis prisoners and axis civilians.

How do you justify this? Is it okay because you were "at war"? if this is okay to do, it brings up an interesting moral question: if the Nazis had "declared war" on the jew before killing, would that have made it alright?

I dont see any moral distinction between the Axis or Allies. both killed a great deal of soilders and civilians. such is the way of war.

 

[predatorpulse7]

While I am tired of WW2 games, I would buy a game that tells a Nazi perspective just for the freshness of it. I am no Nazi sympathizer(and it's funny to me when I see neonazis today even with the Nazi party having disappeared ages ago) but I get tired of Nazis being depicted not just as villains, but as the spawn of Satan. Nazies tried to put Europe under their boot. Guess what, so did Napoleon and countless others over the years. Had Hitler won, we would've heard tales about those evil allies that tried to bring down the third reich but failed due to their wicked ways. This s**t is all relative anyway, let's not forget the atrocities the Allies commited on the counter-offensive against the Axis and the fact that they allied themselves with a bigger monster than Hitler, Stalin, to bring the german to his knees. I'm sure Central and Eastern Europe really appreciated the gift of communism when the Allies put that whole area on Stalin's plate as thanks for helping them in WW2.

There is no black and white in war no matter how we cut it and a Nazi campaign wouldn't be bad. For those sensitive types, I have to re-iterate, it's a F**KING VIDEOGAME.

 

[TheIronRuler]

They're already out there. You might be addressing the problem that there aren't that many WW2 video-games recently.

 

[Stepan_RUS']

Yes, forgive me if I find the subjugation of 6 million people slightly upsetting.

I could certianly understand this if you were one of the jew, but i feel like you are not.

Uh... no. There are plenty of reasons as to why people find Naziism, and it's followers, to be reprehensible. For starters, it is a philosophy that is, at its very core, violent, hateful, and bigoted. Also, don't use the term "Nazi" to describe the ENTIRETY of the German people, or their army. It's a terrible generalization. And buddy, if you think the only reason people find the holocaust to be a disgusting war crime, is because the Allies won the war, you're quite delusional.

The natural man is violent, hateful, and bigoted. different people hate and fight with eachother. For example: you hate Nazis. i'm sure Nazis dont like you either. That's how it was when men began, and it is how it will be until the twilight of the gods. the weak are killed by the strong, that is evolution, no? why is that evil? You speak of evil as if it is an objective absolute. I did not realise you were the allfather of men and could decide what is good and evil

I can garuntee you that if the Nazis had won, people would be praising their heroic victory over the evil baby-killing allies, and the people claiming that the holocaust actually happened would be in the minority instead. It is called propaganda, and what we call history is an amalgamation of the propaganada from the victors throughout history.

I remember you saying that your country was occupied by the Bolsheviks at the time? Well, I don't defend them. It's not because I don't consider my self a socialist (a democratic socialist, to be accurate), but because I don't think Lenin, Trotsky, Stalin, and their ilk, are all that great. But, given Hitler's ambitions, you're country wouldn't have remained independent for long.

I guess that just comes down to personal preference. I would have prefered Nazi puppet state to Soviet puppet state

As I said earlier, there are no good guys in war. Did you read the entirety of my post? Because, you probably should, before you start responding.

Of course i have read your post. You may say that "there are no good guys in war" but you dont seem to truly belive that, because you still preach the evil of the Axis over the Allies.

Whoa whoa whoa, hold on a minute. I've heard of this, and there's a great deal of historians that say Eisenhower's death camp was nothing but the product of conspiracy theory. There's PLENTY of evidence to suggest it didn't exist.

I dont recall where, but there was an article on this topic i read somewhere.
it also had testamonies from american soliders who witnessed it and were disgusted by their treatment of German prisioners. i could look for it if you like.

No, it wouldn't have. Even if Germany had officially declared war on all the people that were killed in the holocaust, it still would have been an act of genocide. War was declared in Rwanda, but does that make how those people were slaughtered okay?

The point of that statment was to see how you justified allied atrocities, not that i belive the declaration of war removes guilt.

At the end of the day, there is no actual distinction between opposing forces in warfare. However, all I'm saying is, you are seemingly denying the mass degradation of approximately 6 million people, and that's not okay.

This is far too big of a topic to get into here. the "Bottom line": i know the jew was treated quite badly, but this isn't really relevant to me, and not really a factor in forming my opinion of the Nazis... because i'm a Rus' man. not the jew.

 

[Arfonious]

It's sad that you can't really touch this subject without getting shot down for being a nazi sympathiser.
I personaly would love to play a game depicting WWII from a German perspective

I was thinking about this the other day. The Germans had cooler uniforms and awesome sounding words for just about everything.

No wonder, all German uniforms during WWII were designed by Hugo Boss

 

[DrunkOnEstus]

Massive snip

I fought for a long time about jumping in here, but I had to make a distinction. One does not have to be Jewish to find the deplorable treatment of Jewish people to be a horrible thing. I'm an American, and I frequently become disgusted about the treatment of the native American (Indian) people that led to our founding. I don't have to be Indian to sympathize with what they as a people went though, and our school textbooks even struggle to try and spin this point into a positive thing.

Also, Judaism is a religion, not a country or the members specifically of it (not counting Israel). There are Jews all over the world, just as there are Muslims all over the world and the word "Muslim" does not immediately imply "Arab". I understand that from your viewpoint it may be hard to see the other side of the fence, but do realize that it's not at all hard for many people to sympathize and care very deeply about something that happened to people outside of their religion, cultural heritage, country, or family tree.

OT: If this game were to be made outside of the RTS/Simulation genre, where more of a plot and narrative drive is required, you'd have to be very careful and essentially walk on eggshells during its creation. I'd have to think that game designers aren't yet capable of handling this maturely, and that video games as a medium haven't reached the point where the subject would be tackled maturely and tastefully. I would love to be proven wrong and see this growth though, don't get me wrong.