Xbox One No Longer Requires Kinect to Function

[TK421]

http://kotaku.com/xbox-one-wont-actually-need-kinect-plugged-in-microso-1113142909

Sorry, no Kinect free bundle for anyone. Still won't buy this console until it goes down in price. F U C K K I N E C T.

Also with the previous 180 and this 180, is the new system going to be called the Xbox 360 2?

I would have brought a kinectless Xbox, but nooooo stupid motion gimmick cost 100 dollars more.....I rather have another 100-200 gb for memory for a hundred bucks.

I guess I will have to roll with just a ps4, and use the Xbox money for saving up to a gaming pc.

Might I suggest that you forgo the PS4 as well, and just save all your money for a PC? I'm not trying to hate on consoles, but as an owner of a PS3, 360, and a gaming PC, the PC is by far my favorite. Also, on PC multiplayer is free, unlike both of the new consoles.
[small](not to mention upgradeable hardware, customizable UI, cheaper games, etc.)[/small]

OT: I'm not surprised. They already bailed on all of their other schemes, so it makes sense to wait until the next-next gen to screw their customers completely, after everyone has stopped caring about their rights as consumers, not just some people.

Yeah, to be honest I'm a little disappointed MS didn't stick to their guns and go down with the ship. I kind of feel like it would be better for the industry if Microsoft bowed out. At least, from a creative standpoint.

And if it were down to just the PS4 and WiiU, I could see the WiiU gaining a foothold on its lower price alone.

I completely agree.

 

[dreadedcandiru99]

http://kotaku.com/xbox-one-wont-actually-need-kinect-plugged-in-microso-1113142909

Sorry, no Kinect free bundle for anyone.

Until there is one, I'm not getting it. As long as the Kinect comes in the box, there's the possibility that they'll eventually put out a mandatory software update to make you use it again. I wouldn't trust them not to try that.

 

[Jadak]

It won't necessarily stop games themselves having mandatory Kinect functionality, just like MS switching off the online requirement won't stop games having the exact same requirements.

True, but that's true of more than the new consoles, that applies to current gen and PC games as well. If game designers want to require specific shit to play their games, they can, doesn't really have anything to do with the XB1 specifically.

 

[Klagermeister]

So when the Xbox has features you don't like you guys get pissed and say they should be removed, and then when they're removed you guys get pissed about them backpedaling?
Is it just me or is all the Xbone hate one big cynical clusterfuck?

 

[NiPah]

That's good news...
But as many have said why the hell say it was required in the first place?
Either they're lying bastards or the system has been crippled to serve the greater good, and while as it stands the Xbox one is actually a system I wouldn't mind buying, Microsoft has proven they are not a company I want to buy from.
I mean FFS we're how close to launch and they're still picking out what is mandatory and what was just put in for shits? No wonder Mattrick left, he was an amazingly incompetent leader as it stands and Microsoft is still trying to clean the mess he made.

So when the Xbox has features you don't like you guys get pissed and say they should be removed, and then when they're removed you guys get pissed about them backpedaling?
Is it just me or is all the Xbone hate one big cynical clusterfuck?

People aren't pissed at features and policies being reversed, the more pertinent question is why were those policies enacted in the first place, why were we lied to about them being required for functionality, and what sort of bullshit will Microsoft come up with next when they have our money.

 

[loc978]

This almost got interesting. Inferior hardware for the same price would make for a much closer race than inferior hardware for more money. Maybe Microsoft is just biding their time with all of these Xbone about-faces. Perhaps each was planned as a fallback point from the beginning...

Or maybe they've planned to make a package that drops the Kinect and $150 off the price, that might actually make it competitive.

As someone who is essentially sitting this generation out, I'm interested to see if one side screwing up and slowly correcting themselves garners more praise than the other side having a reasonable(ish) plan from the beginning and sticking to it.

 

[Master_Fubar23]

I do not trust them. They could, at any moment after release, announce," Hey, you know all that crap we back-pedaled on? Yeah, we're gonna send out an update that re-establishes all that because we have you're money." They could do it with Kinect, and I see them doing it with the used-games policy. Are there things that could happen to the camera? Yes. But remember, this is Microsoft. They have been know to pull underhanded tactics.

For the record, I don't trust PS4 either.

While I can't comment on the US laws, over in EU, Australia etc there are laws that would allow said consoles to be returned, especially for those that don't have the internet/reliable net as it would kill their console. So Microsoft would find themselves with alot of returned consoles. Also even in the US where said laws may not apply M$ would quickly find sales of new consoles dropping off and sales of games droping too

That?s the problem. In the US, MS can change its policies and there's nothing anyone can do about it. Heck, it was already done with the PS3 removing the ability to play games with any OS installed on it. The PS3 shipped with that ability, Sony later removed it, customer's sued Sony over removing "the reason they bought the PS3", and courts ruled in favor of Sony case closed. So if Sony can and did do it, you can bet your ass MS will too. I?m never buying a XB1.

 

[Goro]

Well it seems like we're *almost* there with customising the feature set with what we as consumers want, now if we can steer some that vitriol towards price we could get it down to $199 if we tried hard enough...

 

[AuronFtw]

That's great!

Still not buying your PoS console Microsoft, ya fucking blew it.
You've already shown us your vision of the future, and I don't want it.

This. Anyone buying the console at this point is supporting microsoft; and while sensible outrage made them backpedal on various bullshit moneygrubbing DRM schemes, the fact that they even announced them shows their mindset. They don't give any fucks about the consumer, and if the outrage had been any less voracious they probably would have just kept all that shit in cos it makes them money. They're still going to be looking for every way to make a buck at their customer's expense, and anyone buying their proprietary console is giving them a leash already tied around the consumer's neck because you can't do ANYTHING ABOUT IT once you own the console, especially if they change something years down the road and warranties have all run out.

Probably the best thing for the industry at this point is supporting the smaller projects; even though the ouya is a pretty terrible piece of equipment, it's not a dead end. More money and more support will make open source/non-proprietary consoles completely viable. Look at how much android phones are dominating the smartphone market; apple had that shit cornered with the iPhone, but their policies and hardware are strict and consumer-unfriendly (just like our current consoles, some more than others) so they lost ground to the much more open androids. If the ouya was a quality piece of equipment, cost $400 or $500 and had the hardware to boot, and came without all the stupid bullshit that Sony and Microsoft and Nintendo force into their systems, it could very well be a competitor. It just needs support, funding and time.

 

[SeventhSigil]

This almost got interesting. Inferior hardware for the same price would make for a much closer race than inferior hardware for more money. Maybe Microsoft is just biding their time with all of these Xbone about-faces. Perhaps each was planned as a fallback point from the beginning...

Or maybe they've planned to make a package that drops the Kinect and $150 off the price, that might actually make it competitive.

As someone who is essentially sitting this generation out, I'm interested to see if one side screwing up and slowly correcting themselves garners more praise than the other side having a reasonable(ish) plan from the beginning and sticking to it.

To be honest, and I'm speaking as someone who is pretty pleased with the change, if only for peace of mind, the string of policy changes seem less some preplanned series of fallback points, And more a gradual toeing of the line. Rather than simply make all of the changes at once, they're seeing how many changes it would actually take to get sales up to whatever projections they have or, possibly, to reach a parity with the PS4. When the DRM and used game reversal were made, There was a responding surge in preorders, but the Xbox One looked to be behind the PS4. So they loosened indie restrictions by allowing self-publishing, which, at least on Amazon, made absolutely no difference. When that wasn't enough, they included a headset, same lack of difference. When that wasn't enough, they made the Kinect no longer quite as critical to the system's operation.

I base this mostly off the fact that the loosening of indie policies, and the inclusion of a headset both have likely cost Microsoft a fair bit of income and control. With self-publishing, presumably they cannot seek terms of timed exclusivity on indie games like they could with the Xbox 360's indie publishing policies, Meaning that any indie exclusives are likely ones they would have to fund outright, or purchase, instead of making it a requirement to publish through Microsoft Studios. Combine that with the fact that they previously released statements insisting they would not be changing their minds on either policy, and the suggestion is that something has motivated them to do it after all.

What really leaves me curious is what might happen if this newest announcement doesn't tip the numbers in their favor either. Will they give up and just let things rest as they are? Or are more changes on the horizon?

 

[Lieju]

They need to either embrace the stupid thing fully or they need to cut the loss and abandon it.

Why? How is it any different from any other gaming peripheral? Making it so that the x-bone can function without it will only put more consoles in more people's houses, and that opens up more possibilities for people to buy the Kinect. It's rather hard for the Kinect to be successful when people are so turned off by the thing they're avoiding the console altogether. But if they can get more Kinects in more homes, and if they offer competitive pricing for the x-bone/Kinect combo pack (make it only like $20 more than a PS4 rather than $100 more), then they'll only win over more.

Honestly, I think the price is the bigger obstacle. People like to complain about spying and whatnot but in the end most will decide based on what exclusives they have, and how much they'll have to pay for it.
Most hardcore gamers don't care about the Kinect so they don't want to pay 100 dollars extra for it, and more casual gamers (ones who don't hang out on forums and just like playing video-games) will be drawn to the cheaper option.

If I had to choose I'd get PS4 solely for the cheaper prize. Of course, I won't. I looked at my options and bought a 3DS instead.

 

[CrystalShadow]

I'm relatively certain I'm going to be the only one thinking this but here it goes...

I like this. HOWEVER, shipping out a Kinect-free version would be a terrible mistake.

At this point, Microsoft has a lot of eggs in the Kinect basket. They need to either embrace the stupid thing fully or they need to cut the loss and abandon it. If they release a version of the system without the Kinect, they're going to end up with the original Kinect's problem; No one designing anything for it because it's an optional piece of equipment that no one bought.

Personally, I'd prefer them to just abandon it but I doubt that's going to happen.

By making it non mandatory, it is now an optional piece of equipment.

Not quite. The Wii U tablet, believe it or not is an optional piece of equipment by that definition.
But, from the perspective of a dev thinking about making games for a device, this is actually a good thing.

Even though you don't need to have it connected, you know that everyone that has an Xbox One also has a kinect unit.

That means you can safely use the kinect for a core gameplay feature that won't work at all without it, without worrying about how many people will actually own the thing. (Because that's still pretty much anyone that owns the console you're developing for.)

That's a much more important point than anyone gives credit for.

It's why the Wii's default controller was a motion controller, and the more traditional controller was optional. - It's the only way to make sure that developers will even attempt non-gimmicky uses of the technology.

(Doesn't mean they'll succeed of course, but if the hardware required is optional, it discourages any attempt to make anything other than trivial gimmicky use of it.)

 

[CrystalShadow]

I'm relatively certain I'm going to be the only one thinking this but here it goes...

I like this. HOWEVER, shipping out a Kinect-free version would be a terrible mistake.

At this point, Microsoft has a lot of eggs in the Kinect basket. They need to either embrace the stupid thing fully or they need to cut the loss and abandon it. If they release a version of the system without the Kinect, they're going to end up with the original Kinect's problem; No one designing anything for it because it's an optional piece of equipment that no one bought.

Personally, I'd prefer them to just abandon it but I doubt that's going to happen.

Just how many of these stupid thing do they to have sold before people think its worth developing for? There are 24 million kinect 1 sold. Thats a pretty substantial install base when you consider 3 million copies of a game sold its pretty successful.

You're miscalculating things though. There may have been 24 million kinects sold, but there were 77 million 360's sold.

Assuming you want to sell 3 million copies of a game, but don't know whether the people that would buy your game would have a kinect or not, here's the situation you're looking at:

Sell your game without kinect support. 77 million potential buyers. - roughly 1 in 25 people that own a 360 would need to buy a copy.
Sell your game requiring kinect support. 24 million potential buyers - roughly 1 in 8 people that own a kinect would need to buy a copy.

All else being equal therefore, to sell a game that requires kinect, you'd have to sell about 3 times as well to reach the same goals.
That's simplistic, sure. But that's the reason it matters.

 

[spartandude]

You know, this could be a trick to get you to buy the console and then they will make most of the games require the Kinnect after. Don't be fooled.

i was thinking that but im going to be doing the very sensible practice of waiting atleast 1 year after launch to buy so i can see what games it has

So when the Xbox has features you don't like you guys get pissed and say they should be removed, and then when they're removed you guys get pissed about them backpedaling?
Is it just me or is all the Xbone hate one big cynical clusterfuck?

Yh, as one of many people who hated the Xbox One at first i have warmed up to it (still may not be getting it due to things like money and such) but the people who just refuse to forgive it after theyve reversed policies are being ridiculous

 

[w9496]

Yay?

I never understood the gripe about the Kinect(other than the spying stuff. I do understand that). Do people fear standing up when they play games?

10 bucks says that 90% of games with Kinect are just going to use it for voice commands mid-combat. I don't think you'll be forced to dodge incoming attacks with tactical rolls or anything.

It's not a matter of fear, it's a matter of wanting to relax when playing games, as opposed to acting like a monkey to get the console to register your movements, and even then it's usually sketchy.

I suppose I can understand that, but from what I understand many games with Kinect just use it as a voice recognizer like Mass Effect 3 did with squadmate powers and things of that nature.

People are always saying that Kinect-only games hardly work, but I've played one of the Dance Central games at a friends house and it worked fine.

 

[Terminate421]

I do not trust them. They could, at any moment after release, announce," Hey, you know all that crap we back-pedaled on? Yeah, we're gonna send out an update that re-establishes all that because we have you're money." They could do it with Kinect,.

Here is the problem with that:

As soon as that update would happen the people that don't have kinect would ALL be fucked. And would ALL have to buy it.

Microsoft, with one update, just shut out a large portion of their market. With ONE update.

They "couldn't" do it.

 

[captainballsack]

They really aren't showing a lot of confidence in their own product, but it's not like people won't buy it.

I mean, there will be XB1 exclusives that will make people buy the console, there will be PS4 exclusives that will make people buy a PS4. Both will sell because both will have games that people want to play.

WOW, WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THAT GAMES SELL GAMING CONSOLES JIOUDSBOIUTRBSDOIGNB9O

 

[TomWiley]

It'll be interesting to see if the people of Escapist will find something negative to say about this as well

EDIT. Nvm. People totally did.

 

[Maximum Bert]

I do not trust them. They could, at any moment after release, announce," Hey, you know all that crap we back-pedaled on? Yeah, we're gonna send out an update that re-establishes all that because we have you're money." They could do it with Kinect,.

Here is the problem with that:

As soon as that update would happen the people that don't have kinect would ALL be fucked. And would ALL have to buy it.

Microsoft, with one update, just shut out a large portion of their market. With ONE update.

They "couldn't" do it.

Except if you bought the thing you will have a kinnect its just now it does not have to be on all the time so if they did reverse it odds are they would shut out very few people its not like the thing will have much resale value if everyone who has the machine gets one.As far as I know there is still no Kinnect free Xbone.

Secondly I wouldnt bother speculating on what Microsoft will or will not do personally I think they will seek to creep back in their removed features and see how far they can go with it. Now just turning everything back on would be a stupid move and I wouldnt expect them to do that but they could do it hell who knows they may be stupid enough to going on recent performances.

Anyway I am waiting for a price drop seriously that price tag is way way to high PS4 is at the limits of what I am prepared to pay and as for kinnect I wouldnt mind it being gone totally because I wont use it I dont want to talk to my games console or wave my arms about or have my blood pressure read.

 

[Olas]

I do not trust them. They could, at any moment after release, announce," Hey, you know all that crap we back-pedaled on? Yeah, we're gonna send out an update that re-establishes all that because we have you're money." They could do it with Kinect,.

Here is the problem with that:

As soon as that update would happen the people that don't have kinect would ALL be fucked. And would ALL have to buy it.

Microsoft, with one update, just shut out a large portion of their market. With ONE update.

They "couldn't" do it.

Now probably isn't the best time to place faith in Microsoft to "do what's right". They're only removing this stuff now due to enourmous backlash from the public, and it's obvious they aren't happy about it.

Not saying it's gonna happen or it ain't, just that it seems wrong to dismiss the possibility completely. If I did plan on buyin one, I'd at least wait a little while first to see how everything pans out. There's no harm in waiting.