Your video game hot take(s) thread

[Old_Hunter_77]

The powerful graphics and hi fidelity of modern AAA video games have made cheesecake female fighter characters too silly.

Unrealistically proportioned scantily clad physics defying women fighters have been a staple of comic books, anime and video games forever, I know. We make fun of it, we enjoy it even. Boob armor and all that. It's one of the defining tropes of nerd culture.

But now video games look too good where it's not funny any more, it's just silly in an annoying distracting way.

This came to mind during GamesFest when FF73make was officially revealed and Tifa was added to Street Fighter. This is maybe THE defining cheesecake video game characters, with her short skirt, humungous honkers, jump kicks and power punches, and being a core part of a beloved game franchise. And I'm gonna play the new FF7 and Tifa is just gonna bother me- this is going to be the highest fidelity Tifa we're gonna get and it's not cure any more like it was back when she was pixel boobies, it's just immersion breaking. Especially in a game with a dramatic story where the narrative is important.

I already ranted my mockery of Stellar Blade.

It's similar to how I laughed the first time I saw Yoda fight with a lightsaber in the Star Wars prequel. It looked so silly! But it was supposed to be a big serious moment.

How can I take a dramatic fight seriously when I'm confused at how the tiny bra is somehow holding on. This was less of a problem in old cartoons because the simpler lower tech allows for an abstraction. With modern graphics, that's gone.

That's why even in Hollyood movies with cheesecake action girlies, they resort to skin tight outfits instead near naked ones because at least it's plausible.

 

[BrawlMan]

his came to mind during GamesFest when FF73make was officially revealed and Tifa was added to Street Fighter. This is maybe THE defining cheesecake video game characters, with her short skirt, humungous honkers, jump kicks and power punches, and being a core part of a beloved game franchise. And I'm gonna play the new FF7 and Tifa is just gonna bother me- this is going to be the highest fidelity Tifa we're gonna get and it's not cure any more like it was back when she was pixel boobies, it's just immersion breaking. Especially in a game with a dramatic story where the narrative is important.

Honestly, Capcom got Juri, Chun-Li, Elena, and Mai great in realistic, but over-the-top fashion. Mai is still considered queen cheesecake when comapred to Tifa. She will look fine in the RE Engine. Fine if you're not into the character, but you're basing this off of nothing really. I get it with Stellarblade, but I choose to ignore and not make a big deal about it. I am here for the gameplay or over-the-top characters/world. Bayonetta still does it the best above all else.

​

 

[Gergar12]

Buy some mirrors.

I just want sexy woman, and good game-play in some of my AAA games.

 

[BrawlMan]

I just want sexy woman, and good game-play in some of my AAA games.

You already have an abundance of that. They exist in AA and indie too, so you have lost nothing. Cry me a fucking river.

 

[thebobmaster]

Also, Tifa has a fairly more realistic body proportion in the FFVII Remake compared to the original, not that that's hard. She still definitely has a bit of a bust, but it doesn't seem outrageous to me that she'd have that figure and be a brawler.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

With fighting games it's less of an issue because those are supposed to be silly and over the top. And nothing will ever be sillier in that regards than Ivy from Soul Caliber, the first time I openly laughed at a sexualized character design (I actually played Soul Caliber 2 with friends back in the day when one of them had a Dreamcast. I remember really wanting to main her but I never played enough to get comfortable with her sword/whip thing).

I'm thinking more about story-heavy games. Story, emotion, themes, etc. It's hard enough for games to do that effectively and things like silly character designs make it unnecessarily harder. My favorite games are the ones that deliver effective stories via gameplay. That is a big reason why FF7 resonates with so many.

To be clear I'm not saying Tifa's look will interfere with my enjoyment of that game- it's just her appearance twice in the GamesFest that made me think about this.
(And also, I think the main reason she looks silly isn't just her large honkers but more so the outfit. Going into battle with loose long hair, a tiny skirt, and no protection other than wrist guards seems irresponsible. Cloud at least has a shoulder pad. I promise I'm not just nitpicking FF7- my wife was watching some show where skinny Asian ladies were kung-fu-ing some baddies and I was like "why don't they at least tie their hair back?").

And the Tomb Raider remake, which I am looking forward to. Lara Croft is THE defining cheesecake design, but it was kind of funny with the triangle pixel boobs. When they rebooted the franchise for modern tech, they gave her a more modest, realistic look, and I thought that was a reasonable smart concession to updating the franchise. Now with the remake, they have to use the "classic" outfit. How is it gonna work with the newer games which try to add some seriousness to the story?

The good news is it's not gonna be a problem with the games I'm most anticipating. I trust Laufey and Ciri won't be cheesecaked.

 

[BrawlMan]

why don't they at least tie their hair back?").

Pai Chan did that back in the older games, and she technically did in the newest trailer for VF. Evie has short hair in the new Stellar Blade. There's nothing to tie it back. Yuffie has short length hair as well.So she can't really tie anything either.

 

[Ezekiel]

Any character designer who puts jeans and a tank top on their female protagonist should be embarrassed. As should the studio heads and executives who mandate that. Like we don't have enough of those. Sometimes the tank tops are under jackets.

Chloe Frazer - She wore slim cargo pants in Uncharted 2. In The Lost Legacy, she wore jeans. Her shirt at least had cap sleeves. It wasn't another tank top.

Elena Fisher - She wore capri pants in the first Uncharted. Since then, she has worn jeans. Uncharted 4 has her wearing jeans and a tank top.

Nilin from Remember Me - Not as recent as my other examples. I replayed it over the last week.

Claire Redfield from the Resident Evil 2 remake - Her clothes aren't even accurate to typical 1990s fashion.

Jill Valentine from the Resident Evil 3 remake - There was actually nothing wrong with her wearing a skirt in the original. Like Claire in RE2, she wasn't expecting to be in a zombie apocalypse. She was attacked in her apartment or hotel.

Jesse Faden from Control

Joanna Dark from the new Perfect Dark - We can see that she wears jeans in the teaser. I bet she wears a tank top under the jacket.

Lara Laura Croft from Tomb Raider

There are so many other practical choices, if you're aiming for realism/grit (Like we don't have enough of that.) and the protagonist is able to prepare for the situation. It's pretty obvious why they do it. The tank top and slim jeans allow them to show just enough of the body to please the horny male gamers but not so much that a certain other group of people will get angry. It's the most inoffensive, bland, safe combination there is.

People are saying the Claire model in the Code Veronica remake looks different from the one in RE2 because the woman is seven years older. Then it's another example of how counterproductive modern model scans are. The events are only three months after RE2, not seven years. In the past when devs weren't obsessed with photorealism they at least tried to stylize their models more.

It's dumb that Claire has been wearing a tank top with slim jeans for three months. I know that she wore the generic outfit in the original Code Veronica, but her outfit in the original RE2 was different. First her in RE2 remake, then Jill in RE3 remake, now her again, all wearing the generic slim jeans and tank top, because devs have made so many dumb limitations for themselves that this is the only way they can show off the female form anymore, which they all secretly want to do. She'll lose her jacket at some point so that we can look at her bare shoulders again.

Edit: No, she wore a T-shirt in the original Code Veronica. Lame. Way too many slim jeans and tank tops for action women in modern media. Not representative of the 1990s when these games are supposed to be set. You look at videos of New York City at the time and find there was much more variety.

 

[BrawlMan]

No one cares; I got a better take:

Veronica Remake is and will be better than the original.

​

 

[NerfedFalcon]

The original Code Veronica sucks because of the Bandersnatch, which besides just not being as cool as the Lickers or Hunters, is also an enemy that you can't really reasonably fight without being able to sidestep, in a game where you can't sidestep. Compared to that, and based on my impressions of the previous RE Engine games, there really isn't a way Capcom could make it worse without completely shitting the bed somehow.

 

[Ezekiel]

This is lame. I don't want these quick time events all over my action game. Nor do I want to dodge through attacks anymore. Devs have abused the fuck out of dodging in 3D action games.


The best move he did in 300 hours was a quick time event. I'm glad Platinum Games is washed up, so that I no longer have to hear so often that they are the best. If they were the best, then what does that say about gaming?

 

[Chimpzy]

Don't take the bait, lads

 

[Zykon TheLich]

The original Code Veronica sucks because of the Bandersnatch, which besides just not being as cool as the Lickers or Hunters, is also an enemy that you can't really reasonably fight without being able to sidestep, in a game where you can't sidestep. Compared to that, and based on my impressions of the previous RE Engine games, there really isn't a way Capcom could make it worse without completely shitting the bed somehow.

For me, it was the freaky twins. It went from cheesy B movie into outright farce at that point. Then the final boss. WTF was that thing? A giant moth woman? That's your ultimate form? I think if I had actually been Claire at that point I'd have just laughed and walked away.

 

[Ezekiel]

A normal response:

"To be fair, the impressive thing is actually luring 5 enemies to within licking distance so they all get caught up in the QTE. And that is rather difficult.

"I wish games were more about manipulating positioning for stuff like that, rather than doing QTE spam so frequently the game plays like DDR."

Spoiler

To which I responded, "Yes. Yes, that is actually one of the reasons I want the dodge fad to die out and why I would not put a dodge in my linear action-adventure. Positioning doesn't matter so much when you can just dodge in any direction through attacks and dangers."

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/is-metal-gear-rising-revengeance-the-best-game-ever-made.94850/page-10#post-9868773

You:

Don't take the bait, lads

 

[NerfedFalcon]

For me, it was the freaky twins. It went from cheesy B movie into outright farce at that point. Then the final boss. WTF was that thing? A giant moth woman? That's your ultimate form? I think if I had actually been Claire at that point I'd have just laughed and walked away.

Okay so RE:CV has a lot of issues, that (the Bandersnatch enemy type) was just the one that got me to quit playing it, and it'll probably be better in the remake. I can't make a guess as to how they'll handle the story.

 

[Chimpzy]

A normal response:

"To be fair, the impressive thing is actually luring 5 enemies to within licking distance so they all get caught up in the QTE. And that is rather difficult.

"I wish games were more about manipulating positioning for stuff like that, rather than doing QTE spam so frequently the game plays like DDR."

Spoiler

To which I responded, "Yes. Yes, that is actually one of the reasons I want the dodge fad to die out and why I would not put a dodge in my linear action-adventure. Positioning doesn't matter so much when you can just dodge in any direction through attacks and dangers."

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/is-metal-gear-rising-revengeance-the-best-game-ever-made.94850/page-10#post-9868773

You:

K, fine, I'll play. Revengeance does not have a dodge with I-frames in your standard kit. It's a move you have to buy. Without it, your defensive option for most attacks is to parry, which is the intended way. And for attacks you can't parry, your defensive option is to just not be in their path. So you can leave the dodge, and now positioning does matter.

 

[Ezekiel]

K, fine, I'll play. Revengeance does not have a dodge with I-frames in your standard kit. It's a move you have to buy. Without it, your defensive option for most attacks is to parry, which is the intended way. And for attacks you can't parry, your defensive option is to just not be in their path. So you can leave the dodge, and now positioning does matter.

Positioning would be more satisfying if you mostly could not parry either, if the fighting was mainly about the dance with the enemy, about footwork, about motion. Dodging through attacks and abusing parries are the same thing in essence, because they both make your position unimportant or substantially less important. I haven't played Metal Gear Rising for a long time, but I remember that in Hi-Fi Rush it was often easier to stand still and wait for the parries. I want an action or action-adventure game in which there are no i-frames and there is no dodge or parry (or minimal parrying), and the devs, conscious of that, have to design the enemy postures and attacks with greater care.

Spoiler

Technically, my game would have a dodge, but, since I want Z-targeting and jumping anyway, it would the one from Devil May Cry and Zelda activated by jumping backwards or sideways while locked on an enemy, not a dedicated button. For the regular movement to be the intended primary method of evading, like it is in the classic 2D action games without dodging, there would need to be some kind of drawback to this strafe jump. Maybe the wide space or seeing you withdraw so far gives the enemy time and confidence to recover.

 

[Chimpzy]

Ok, so a new Xenoblade got announced and the new character design artists are Mai Yoneyama and PALOW, which is giving me more of a shoujo vibe compared to previous entries.

Spoiler

And like, maybe more of that please. I'm kinda sick of games with anime art styles pretty much universally using shounen/seinen styles. Outside of visual novels, that is.

Get me some Revolutionary Girl Utena up in this *****!

Hold the CLAMP noodle people tho.

 

[Ezekiel]

Spoiler

Technically, my game would have a dodge, but, since I want Z-targeting and jumping anyway, it would the one from Devil May Cry and Zelda activated by jumping backwards or sideways while locked on an enemy, not a dedicated button. For the regular movement to be the intended primary method of evading, like it is in the classic 2D action games without dodging, there would need to be some kind of drawback to this strafe jump. Maybe the wide space or seeing you withdraw so far gives the enemy time and confidence to recover.

I've got it! Make the backwards and sideways jump the same speed as backwards and sideways running, so that it's still only used for dodging low attacks. So no dodging needed at all in one of my dream games, except for jumping over low attacks and ducking (crouching) under high attacks. The game can stay all about the movement (stick) and positioning. I really thought my desire for Z-targeting and jumping compromised the design, but it was only because it was hard to imagine old systems used slightly differently.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

I'm pretty certain Doom Eternal also doesn't have I-frame dodges. You do get them during Glory Kills and chainsaw kills, but you're usually not going to be using those to avoid attacks as opposed to simply not getting hit by them at all. And since the dash both doesn't have I-frames and does have a cooldown, most of the time, not getting hit is related to positioning and anticipation rather than pure reaction.

And Doom Eternal, when you get in the zone and you're dodging and blasting everything, is gaming Nirvana.