Your video game hot take(s) thread

happyninja42

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Ok, maybe tanked was the wrong term. It did do quite well critically and there were people who liked it. But, I get the feeling that there are people out there who really don't like it and not just for the stupid reasons you mention. I think it was @happyninja42 who hated it because it was a joyless slog to play through. Either way, there don't seem to be as many defenders out there any more.
Sorry what game did I hate?
 

happyninja42

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The Last of Us 2.
I never played that game. I played TLoU 1, and thought the story was just fine. The mechanics annoyed the shit out of me. They were too clunky and frustrating in a lot of little ways. I heard that TLoU 2 was just more of the same mechanics, so I didn't feel like dealing with that.

So I think you're thinking of someone else.
 
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Catfood220

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I never played that game. I played TLoU 1, and thought the story was just fine. The mechanics annoyed the shit out of me. They were too clunky and frustrating in a lot of little ways. I heard that TLoU 2 was just more of the same mechanics, so I didn't feel like dealing with that.

So I think you're thinking of someone else.
Well, that failed miserably, last time I do that:).

Anyway, someone here on this site didn't like the game because they thought it was a joyless slog so my point still stands:).
 
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Inazuma1

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Ok, maybe tanked was the wrong term. It did do quite well critically and there were people who liked it.
It wasn't a blockbuster in terms of sales because LoU 1 came out when the zombie genre was really over-saturated and people got sick of it. 2 just came across as really mean spirited in its presentation and the director doubling-down only turned people off more.
 

Drathnoxis

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So much this. I played the 1st Nier because it was supposed to be the best video game story EVER (and TLOU was said to have ripped it off, no joke) and it's an average anime type story with decently entertaining characters. TLOU is just overall solid story/characters (maybe 8/10 at best), it's nothing too amazing. Bioshock gets all this praise for it's story, but it's probably the worst assassination plot I've ever seen, it all falls apart if you think half a second about anything, Infinite is a mess but that has a better overall story.
Bioshock may have fallen apart at the ending, but at least it made sense up until the end. A city dedicated to unrestrained genius falls to advances in technology that cause everybody to lose their minds while gaining super powers. Simple. Consistent. At least until Fontaine shows up.

Infinite, on the other hand, barely can keep itself straight after the opening act. What are vigors? Where did they come from? Why does nobody seem to use them except the player? Why are citizens murderous lunatics after the opening act? There really is no explanation given for their insane blood lust. Then we start dimension hopping and the plot falls to pieces. We're trying to gather weapons as part of a deal that we made in a different timeline that won't be honored to pursue an objective that's unnecessary. There is no logical reason for our protagonists to be doing the things they do, and the ending is pure nonsense.
 

Trunkage

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Bioshock may have fallen apart at the ending, but at least it made sense up until the end. A city dedicated to unrestrained genius falls to advances in technology that cause everybody to lose their minds while gaining super powers. Simple. Consistent. At least until Fontaine shows up.

Infinite, on the other hand, barely can keep itself straight after the opening act. What are vigors? Where did they come from? Why does nobody seem to use them except the player? Why are citizens murderous lunatics after the opening act? There really is no explanation given for their insane blood lust. Then we start dimension hopping and the plot falls to pieces. We're trying to gather weapons as part of a deal that we made in a different timeline that won't be honored to pursue an objective that's unnecessary. There is no logical reason for our protagonists to be doing the things they do, and the ending is pure nonsense.
I haven't played Infinite in a while. But I definitely remember enemies using vigors. And I thought they were stolen from the future like everything else in the game.

The timeline stuff sure doesn't hold up. It's the problem with every time story. It never makes sense in the end
 

Dalisclock

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I haven't played Infinite in a while. But I definitely remember enemies using vigors. And I thought they were stolen from the future like everything else in the game.

The timeline stuff sure doesn't hold up. It's the problem with every time story. It never makes sense in the end
Vigors were copied(or stolen/traded) from Rapture. The game implies they were just being introduced, though Columbia had a different type of society then Raputure, so this causes it's own problems.

As someone who kinda liked BS:I, I'm just gonna throw out that I think a big part of the problem was the game concept changing numerous times over the course of development. Just from watching the trailers in the years leading up to release alone, you can tell they were changing elements around between trailers and no doubt the script was getting rewritten over and over again. I have no doubt in the earlier incarnations a lot of these elements lined up a lot better then they ended up in the final product, but along the way things got added and discarded and the directors and writers just kind of lost track of it all. You can see this in written fiction as well sometimes, and written fiction is a bit easier to try to keep everything in line.

And we'll never know what the original plot was going to look like at this point, so the fact it all turns into a mess by the end isn't suprising at all.

Also, Time Travel compounds these issues. Even Chrono Trigger, a well regarded game about time travel. has issues like this(but not to nearly the same extent).
 
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Specter Von Baren

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Ok, I got one. I perfectly understand people being upset about Joystick drift on the Joycons but this isn't NEW. Joystick drift has been a thing for Nintendo since the N64! It was there for the N64, the Gamecube, the Wii, and I think the only reason no one talked about it for the WiiU is because not many people got one. The reason it's so much of a bigger issue now is because the Joycon is more expensive to replace.
 

BrawlMan

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Ok, I got one. I perfectly understand people being upset about Joystick drift on the Joycons but this isn't NEW. Joystick drift has been a thing for Nintendo since the N64! It was there for the N64, the Gamecube, the Wii, and I think the only reason no one talked about it for the WiiU is because not many people got one. The reason it's so much of a bigger issue now is because the Joycon is more expensive to replace.
Ironically enough, I never had the joystick drift issue with my Wii nor Wii U controllers (though I do not have a Wii U anymore). I rarely ever use my Joycon controllers, because I got three 3rd party controllers that work way better than the default controllers. Those Joycons are expensive as fuck, which why they charged and attached to my Switch.
 

Jarrito3002

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Ok, I got one. I perfectly understand people being upset about Joystick drift on the Joycons but this isn't NEW. Joystick drift has been a thing for Nintendo since the N64! It was there for the N64, the Gamecube, the Wii, and I think the only reason no one talked about it for the WiiU is because not many people got one. The reason it's so much of a bigger issue now is because the Joycon is more expensive to replace.
The Swtich was my first actual Nintendo console. I always associated Nintendo with handheld, in fact I will say 90% of Switch play is undocked even now. So the joycon drift had me thinking all my game were broken until I looked it up.

Also pretty damming that has been a issue for so long.
 

Specter Von Baren

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The Swtich was my first actual Nintendo console. I always associated Nintendo with handheld, in fact I will say 90% of Switch play is undocked even now. So the joycon drift had me thinking all my game were broken until I looked it up.

Also pretty damming that has been a issue for so long.
I mean... this kind of thing will happen to PS or XBOX controllers too, but the plastic Nintendo uses for their joysticks has always been softer than those so it happened more often (The N64 wasn't helped with all the games that had you rotate the joystick heavily either).

Playstation has also added this new rumble feature to their controllers I hear? I think as we continue to go forward this will become more and more of a problem for all the companies as controllers get more sophisticated and expensive. I think some kind of modular design of controllers should be made in the future where the joystick can be removed and replaced for much cheaper would be good PR move.
 

Jarrito3002

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I mean... this kind of thing will happen to PS or XBOX controllers too, but the plastic Nintendo uses for their joysticks has always been softer than those so it happened more often (The N64 wasn't helped with all the games that had you rotate the joystick heavily either).

Playstation has also added this new rumble feature to their controllers I hear? I think as we continue to go forward this will become more and more of a problem for all the companies as controllers get more sophisticated and expensive. I think some kind of modular design of controllers should be made in the future where the joystick can be removed and replaced for much cheaper would be good PR move.
I never had that issue with any PS or XBox controller. In fact I have had no first party controller issues until the Switch Drift I was experiencing. I do remember the rumble issue I had with my MadCatz PS2 controller way back when but that was it.

I am a hundred down with this universal option in fact more customizable controllers on the market that are not like 200 dollars would be nice to see in the future.
 

hanselthecaretaker

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Ok, I got one. I perfectly understand people being upset about Joystick drift on the Joycons but this isn't NEW. Joystick drift has been a thing for Nintendo since the N64! It was there for the N64, the Gamecube, the Wii, and I think the only reason no one talked about it for the WiiU is because not many people got one. The reason it's so much of a bigger issue now is because the Joycon is more expensive to replace.



They kinda deserve the lawsuit. Would it really have made a huge difference in cost if they put as much thought into stick tech as they did the rest of the damn thing.
 

Jarrito3002

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They kinda deserve the lawsuit. Would it really have made a huge difference in cost if they put as much thought into stick tech as they did the rest of the damn thing.
Damn.

This is why I am happy don't have the need to get the console at launch. The only explanation is either cost cutting for big profit thank capitalism I can kiss you or whoever makes that joystick hardware has dirt upon dirt that nobody wants to get out.
 

hanselthecaretaker

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Damn.

This is why I am happy don't have the need to get the console at launch. The only explanation is either cost cutting for big profit thank capitalism I can kiss you or whoever makes that joystick hardware has dirt upon dirt that nobody wants to get out.

I’ve only had one DS4 with drift issues, but it still sucks since the rest of the thing is still good. The culprit is definitely the stupid button clicks they put on sticks. I get why as they’re a couple convenient extra inputs, but reinforce the damn things because it puts some serious strain on them. It’s like how rotator cuffs get wrecked from behind the neck pull-ups or military presses, but should be more preventable since they should be able to use better parts.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Bioshock may have fallen apart at the ending, but at least it made sense up until the end. A city dedicated to unrestrained genius falls to advances in technology that cause everybody to lose their minds while gaining super powers. Simple. Consistent. At least until Fontaine shows up.

Infinite, on the other hand, barely can keep itself straight after the opening act. What are vigors? Where did they come from? Why does nobody seem to use them except the player? Why are citizens murderous lunatics after the opening act? There really is no explanation given for their insane blood lust. Then we start dimension hopping and the plot falls to pieces. We're trying to gather weapons as part of a deal that we made in a different timeline that won't be honored to pursue an objective that's unnecessary. There is no logical reason for our protagonists to be doing the things they do, and the ending is pure nonsense.
Bioshock doesn't make much sense at all. Fontaine's whole assassination plan is so stupid, which is basically the whole plot of the game.

Vigors were explained. They were selling them at the fair or whatever in the beginning so people were getting them. It's probably just that most enemies didn't have them just because that makes designing combat scenarios harder. I definitely agree that Infinite is a complete mess and you can tell there were development issues. The only way most of the plot actually works (somewhat) is if you assume Elizabeth is pulling things from other dimensions into her dimension vs going to other dimensions. But yeah, the 1st time Booker and Elizabeth jump, the whole deal with the one chick is null and void basically. I do heavily disagree on the ending being nonsense. The end to me is actually brilliant, every single line of dialogue of that ending is so purposeful and has a very specific meaning to it. This is kinda hard to explain in text so I hope you get the meaning. For the ending to work, you basically have to re-write the vast majority of the plot (basically everything between the beginning and end) in your head to what the plot should have been for the ending to make sense. The ending is basically a step-by-step tutorial of how to remove all branching dimensions that happen from a single decision point by going back and making that decision a constant instead of a variable (so Booker never ever decides to get baptized), it's makes perfect sense by the rules the game sets up. Both games have great concepts that could work if they were like 2 hours long but once they have to fill in the time of an actual game with more plot, it kinda goes to shit in each game. Infinite's plot is like an amazing piece of say yarn covered in shit whereas Bioshock's plot is a piece of shit speckled with some glitter that are some great ideas and concepts but really no core. Infinte would make for an amazing scifi movie with a director that basically replaced the huge middle portion of the game with something that merely connects the great beginning and ending together.
 
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Drathnoxis

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Bioshock doesn't make much sense at all. Fontaine's whole assassination plan is so stupid, which is basically the whole plot of the game.
Yeah, but up until that reveal the game was great. Maybe the plot was dumb, but the the world was much more consistent than Infinite. It did such a great job of building atmosphere that I can forgive the dumb ending. The world of infinite felt like a theme park ride, with all the people who aren't trying to kill you just standing around and cowering or whatever.

Vigors were explained. They were selling them at the fair or whatever in the beginning so people were getting them. It's probably just that most enemies didn't have them just because that makes designing combat scenarios harder.
Maybe they were explained (it's been a number of years, and I do vaguely remember something like that) but the bigger issue is that they don't seem to have a place in the world or the story, they are just there because it's a Bioshock game. How is this society affected by being able to get superpowers in a bottle? Why are they just casually giving away potions that let you take control of someone's body for free at a fair?! Rapture made sense, because of course once people start getting super powers without any regulation it's gonna be chaos, but Columbia doesn't even touch on the issue.


I definitely agree that Infinite is a complete mess and you can tell there were development issues. The only way most of the plot actually works (somewhat) is if you assume Elizabeth is pulling things from other dimensions into her dimension vs going to other dimensions. But yeah, the 1st time Booker and Elizabeth jump, the whole deal with the one chick is null and void basically. I do heavily disagree on the ending being nonsense. The end to me is actually brilliant, every single line of dialogue of that ending is so purposeful and has a very specific meaning to it. This is kinda hard to explain in text so I hope you get the meaning. For the ending to work, you basically have to re-write the vast majority of the plot (basically everything between the beginning and end) in your head to what the plot should have been for the ending to make sense. The ending is basically a step-by-step tutorial of how to remove all branching dimensions that happen from a single decision point by going back and making that decision a constant instead of a variable (so Booker never ever decides to get baptized), it's makes perfect sense by the rules the game sets up. Both games have great concepts that could work if they were like 2 hours long but once they have to fill in the time of an actual game with more plot, it kinda goes to shit in each game. Infinite's plot is like an amazing piece of say yarn covered in shit whereas Bioshock's plot is a piece of shit speckled with some glitter that are some great ideas and concepts but really no core. Infinte would make for an amazing scifi movie with a director that basically replaced the huge middle portion of the game with something that merely connects the great beginning and ending together.
I agree that the ending is impactful and is a fair bit better than a lot of the game. My main problem with the ending is that the idea of constants and variables doesn't really make sense with the many worlds theory. Ok, so you have infinite worlds where infinite choices cause infinite branching paths, but certain things always happen? How does that make sense? Also, why do we have to stop Comstock from existing in all realities? There are infinite dimensions, why can't those other Bookers and Elizabeths just look after their own worlds? Comstock is, after all, only one tyrant, there have been thousands throughout history, multiply that by infinity for every possible tyrant in the multiverse. What's next, a quest to stop every single person who has ever done a bad thing in any possible reality across all planets over the entire history of time? Because that's only slightly more unrealistic than deciding that it's your job to stop every instance of Comstock over an infinite number of realities. Like I don't see why we have to personally take responsibility to fight every evil there ever was. There's only so much one person can do.
 

laggyteabag

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The level The Library in Halo CE gets a lot of flak for being "the worst level in Halo" - as in, all of Halo. All of the games.

I kinda love it, though?

Don't get me wrong, its not perfect. The level is dark. The environment is bland. It can sometimes be a little confusing to navigate. The floors are repeated again, and again. The same doors. The same scenery. The same tunnels. It also exclusively features the Flood as enemies, which aren't everybody's favourite CE enemy faction.

But it is a relentless assault on the player. In other levels in the game, there is breathing room. Places for the you to stop and reload. Places to take cover, and let your shields regenerate. The Flood doesn't let that happen, and they are appearing from every direction. In front of you. Behind you. From the pipes to your left, and to your right. The one you just killed is back alive again. You are constantly shooting, moving, finding the next target, scavenging ammo, trying to buy yourself enough time to regenerate your shields, and load as many shells into your shotgun as you can, before the Flood come for you again. It is really stressful, particularly on the harder difficulties.

Sure, it may not be the most imaginative level, but its gameplay is matched only by the (equally hated) Cortana level from Halo 3, and I adore them both.

So yeah, The Library is pretty cool.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Yeah, but up until that reveal the game was great. Maybe the plot was dumb, but the the world was much more consistent than Infinite. It did such a great job of building atmosphere that I can forgive the dumb ending. The world of infinite felt like a theme park ride, with all the people who aren't trying to kill you just standing around and cowering or whatever.

Maybe they were explained (it's been a number of years, and I do vaguely remember something like that) but the bigger issue is that they don't seem to have a place in the world or the story, they are just there because it's a Bioshock game. How is this society affected by being able to get superpowers in a bottle? Why are they just casually giving away potions that let you take control of someone's body for free at a fair?! Rapture made sense, because of course once people start getting super powers without any regulation it's gonna be chaos, but Columbia doesn't even touch on the issue.


I agree that the ending is impactful and is a fair bit better than a lot of the game. My main problem with the ending is that the idea of constants and variables doesn't really make sense with the many worlds theory. Ok, so you have infinite worlds where infinite choices cause infinite branching paths, but certain things always happen? How does that make sense? Also, why do we have to stop Comstock from existing in all realities? There are infinite dimensions, why can't those other Bookers and Elizabeths just look after their own worlds? Comstock is, after all, only one tyrant, there have been thousands throughout history, multiply that by infinity for every possible tyrant in the multiverse. What's next, a quest to stop every single person who has ever done a bad thing in any possible reality across all planets over the entire history of time? Because that's only slightly more unrealistic than deciding that it's your job to stop every instance of Comstock over an infinite number of realities. Like I don't see why we have to personally take responsibility to fight every evil there ever was. There's only so much one person can do.
Yeah, Bioshock is engaging leading up to all the reveals but it's one of those "mystery box" plots and it falls apart once you know the mystery and it ripples backwards. Though a decent portion of the game feels like sidequests stretching the game out and it kinda gives up on its horror aspects (which are great) rather early on.

You can really throw out the vigors and it doesn't really affect the plot at all. They are mainly there for gameplay and not really much else. Infinite is juggling so many god damn things, it really doesn't need to be juggling people with super powers.

You kinda have to go by the rules the creator sets up in these type of stories and pretty much go with it as long as the plot sticks to those rules. The idea of constants doesn't really seem too out there, there's probably certain decisions I would make every time no matter what (with the information I had at the time). Forcing a story like Infinite or say Inception to line up with a specific theory 100% is asking too much. IIRC, stopping Comstock is so important because of the Elizabeth situation that is basically a unicorn situation. I forget what exactly was happening in that future where she was burning everything down. So, I don't think it was due to just Comstock being bad like say Hitler but the fact that that lead to Elizabeth.