erttheking said:
Now I own the original Dues Ex, but I have not gotten around to playing it. Personally I found that HR did a lot of interesting exploring the idea of transhumanism, such as all the positive aspects (Amputees being able to live complete lives, saving people that otherwise couldn't be save, being able to go beyond what it means to be human) along with all of the negative aspects (Favors the rich, gives augs an unfair advantage over non-augs, some people just can't handle their bodies being transformed like that) and the arguments for why people take sades (My body my choice, wealth disparity, not natural, potentially can reach out to everyone some day) as well as the potential dangers. So did the original Dues Ex do something like that? Or are you talking about more philosophical concepts, and if so was that a heavy theme in the original Dues ex?
First off, I've never been able to finish the original - I came to it just a few years ago, and it's just too dated for me to really get into. Plus, one rather superb element of HR was [almost all of] its voice acting, and DE really is--- well, exactly like going back in time, to an era where production values were scant, and the 'talent' weren't very talented and generally also had bad dialogue and direction to work with.
Like I said, Invisible War is generally reviled by fans of the original, for being a filthy casual streamlined console game. Is it more linear? Sure, but I couldn't compare it to something I never played, so for me it was still pretty damn good at giving you options to explore and deal with situations in a variety of ways.
Anyhoo, as for HR: all the things you remarked are in it, sure, and it presents them just fine - better than average, in fact, given most mainstream media actively shies away from social commentary. However, for me it was just rote text - social commentary 101. It presented the situation finely, but I personally don't feel it had anything to
say about it.
My biggest complaint beyond its lack of actual insight was that compared to IW, HR was - to use a phrase first learnt from Fox Mulder... - small potatoes; IW was way out there on the extremes of what was potential with our previously only biological, 'natural' species. HR is just street level groundwork, and IW was the (excuse the figure of speech. no comparison's intended, btw) final solution of each of the main divergent paths; IW could explore that final step into something transcendentally new/different.
I have a feeling - given I've not played it for an entire gen or so - IW was hokey, and rather hamfisted with its bold brushstrokes. Key scenes/meetings or plot beats had Alex D (male or female - I'd like that option back in a DE) standing around with another character, simply talking and sometimes quoting philosophy [https://youtu.be/xBeoreJr4Yc?t=3m13s] (that's a spoiler heavy excerpt, but it gives a good indication of IW's tone and priorities), batting back and forth questions about just what was ethical or moral in a world where mankind could effectively choose and grasp its own destiny, along with all the 'who watches the watchmen' quandaries. IW's ends include a rather chilly utopia (effectively the annihilation of Self/the individual, sacrificed for clear-headed quasi-hive consensus), as well as an apocalyptic wasteland.
By comparison, HR mumbled a bit about welfare systems for people with polymer legs... whilst momentarily teasing a nanomachine future we'd already seen and dealt with. Like I said; small potatoes. Philosophy and ethics were hugely important to IW, but they seemed to be in hiding in HR bar a few cursory conversations. IW provoked long lasting thought as well as years worth of further reading. HR? It was like a quite stylish cop show or action thriller. And that's it. And when the 'secrets' you're working to uncover had been laid bare almost a decade ago, well, it was very hard to care (for me, DE's plot and lore is uninteresting, ergo seeing it all slot into place has no real appeal).
Each to their own, of course. If HR was your first DE, then I can easily see why it might be very impressive and/or satisfying. I still had a lot of fun playing it (including this year on XB1), but only after I'd more or less pretended it was an entirely new and less ambitious IP. Gorgeous art design, though; most of the actual open air zones are blocky and quite ugly, but even this year I was constantly stopping to be impressed by the lengths they'd gone to detail the world (did air vent grille #785 need that high res a workplace sign and attention to graphic design? nope, but it
gets it).
Don Incognito said:
It is very much the case. Adam being such an unlikable stereotype of every gruff dudebro videogame protagonist doesn't much help my enjoyment, though JC Denton was much the same in the original.
I don't feel any of the games have presented a particularly compelling or engaging protagonist - to me they're like Shepard's; a not entirely successful halfway house between player character and writer's avatar.
And I'm not sure I'd call Jensen a typical dudebro. I actually came to like his quirky Eastwood-possibly-with-a-respiratory-condition drawl; DE can deal with some genuinely interesting themes, but its lore is inherently goofy, seemingly with its feet still planted in the kinds of conspiracies The X-Files popularised then swiftly ran into the ground. MJ12, aliens, Area 51, shady global conspiracies, etc. If DE is now the aforementioned
Adam Jensen: Badass Simulator, then I feel he fits that rather goofy world just fine. An interesting or engaging character he ain't (he barely counts as a character), but he certainly strikes some fancy combat poses, and when upgraded comes across as a veritable god of destruction/ninja-ness who'd put most other action and stealth game protagonists to shame.
I'd like to see the next DE abandon him and feature a new, customisable character with no set gender.
Invisible War's greatest success was shaping a more likable and relatable protagonist. It was a decent enough game, it just fell flat in level design and plotting, especially compared to the original game.
If the original's level design was particularly good, I found it very hard to appreciate - for me it's like Baldur's Gate; probably would've loved it when it came out, but I just can't get into it anymore. The iffy dialogue and voice acting was a bit of a surprise, too.