Zero Punctuation: Overwatch vs Battleborn
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
Transdude1996 said:
Worgen said:
I feel like everyone wants to view this Tracer thing in purely black and white terms, either as another gamergate tantrum or another SJW overreach. I feel like it's possible to have complicated opinions about it that aren't so absolute.Piecewise said:
Was that pose objectifying? Yes, unequivocally. It was fairly standard video game/comic book 'girl who wears impractical armour that also happens to be sexy' trope.
Did it 'undermine so much of the good they had done'? I don't think so. At the risk of being accused of mansplaining, I think it wasn't necessary to imply that everything they had done was at risk because of one pose. I hate this internet mentality of tearing strips off people the moment they put a foot out of line. I prefer the softly softly approach at first.
Was it bad that Blizzard responded the way they did? Yes and no. I think it's both troubling that Blizzard can be so easily influenced by a single opinion, especially in a team-shooter like Overwatch where balance is king, but I also think it's good that they pay attention to their community.
I'm ambivalent, in other words. Really, I feel like the big problem with this is that the internet compulsively divides into camps to fling rocks at each other whenever something like this happens. As far as 'controversies' go, this is so minor it doesn't have its own passport.
Well all we know of Tracer's character is what we've gotten from the various trailers and shorts - all (or most) of which were released prior to the game itself since there's no narrative framework in the game to inform us of her traits. Plus since the complaint came from a closed beta tester they were basing their opinion on the in-game information as well.Johnny Novgorod said:
I'm with Yahtzee on this - to me it just shows what little faith Blizzard had on what they were doing.Gordon_4 said:
Exactly.Johnny Novgorod said:
At that point, Blizzard, with its team of dozens of profesional concept artists, animators, game designers, inbetweeners, etc... was the only one that could judge if someone was indeed "out of character"; and they thought there was more merit to that opinion (and those of their team) than the one of random Internet people.
Considering the beta and a couple of shorts containing Tracer were out by the time the comment was made, I'm pretty sure people had a good handle on her character.Johnny Novgorod said:
- Apr 1, 2009
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Ugh, dude. The part of the complaint they listened to was that it was out of character for her. Plus they apparently weren't happy with that pose anyway. Hell, its totally possible they were already working on the new pose before the poster had actually posted and it just coincided with the poster and the internet being what it was immediately realized this meant blizzard had bowed down to a single complaint of sexism and we should all vote for trump to save us from not being able to see breasts in a video game.Shamanic Rhythm said:
Yeah, Blizzard should handle betas like every other company handles betas, not as a way to show things to the public, tune things up and test it with a larger player base; instead it should be marketing material tied in to preorders, special editions and stores promotions once the game is so close to be released there is nothing of consequence they could change.Johnny Novgorod said:
I mean, how dare them show the public an unfinished product and change something that is in development. Everybody knows people don't make mistakes on works in progress, that is why lack of confidence and fear of political pressure are the only reasons one can change something before it is finished.
I wonder if Blizzard will bow to my single complaint that the game's too fucking expensive and random loot crates with microtransactions are a seriously insulting business practice in the way of illusory progression? As I am not paying for overpriced repetition. No? Oh well, maybe they aren't that soft on criticism as I hoped.
Having played Overwatch, there's very few characters with sit-down poses. Only Roadhog and maybe D-va and Torb if you want to count sitting on other things. There's quite a few over-the shoulder poses, though and there's a lot of kneeling poses.Worgen said:
Her sitting down pose is definitely the most out-of-character. I don't think I've ever seen her sit down outside of that pose. In most cases, you are often staring behind her as she dashes ahead of your team to get killed or dashes around you as she flanks you. Sitting down in a spot is extremely uncharacteristic of her (Widowmaker 1-shot bodyshot, previously). I don't see any of the other poses being any less playful than the sitting one.
I've been cruising the Overwatch forums since the game came out and I've never seen the developers apologise for McCree and Widowmaker being overpowered despite the numerous posts made prior to the recent nerf either. In fact, they kept real quiet about the potential changes until the last week. Aren't these players just as important?
OT: I believe Battleborn has more depth than Overwatch and potentially a higher skill ceiling. However, if you are in Australia just give up on Battleborn. In the time it takes to get into a Battleborn game, you've probably completed several rounds in Overwatch.
It's kind of funny that people complain about lottery boxes that are completely optional and also bring completely free and optional content to the game. Let the impatient children waste cash on these boxes and further development and play your game. It doesn't affect you in anyway, unless you're petty enough to care about other people having more tags/skins than you (how would you even notice?)Xsjadoblayde said:
It's not an MMO, so why do you need progress? The objective is to have fun in each of your games. What would -any- kind of progress even look like? Stronger characters? New skills? That's good for balance.
Also, it's onloy $39 on PC. Not that bad for a highly polished game. How do you decide if something is "too expensive" anyway? Obviously 10 million people disagree with this sentiment, or they shouldn't have bought it.
If you're on console then... well you should be used to the whole "pay more for less" deal by now.
No that would be The Sopranos and the Wire and anythign on HBO really.KissingSunlight said:
And the first 3 Star Trek shows.
And Seinfeld.
You can't prove to me that Zarya doesn't have a huge dick with which she makes sweet and tender love to Mercy! YOU CANT! But for real though, I had a great Mercy for my last match and ended up team killing on the point with Zarya. Ran in, dropped shields on Mercy and I, dumb enemies shot and charged my shields, Mercy switched to damage buff, and I unloaded. They melted, it was beautiful.erttheking said:
And a romance that will last a thousand years (or at least until a better single target support comes out) was born.
LOL yeah you just proved how you know absolutely nothing about the game. 7 million initial sales with 10 million active players at the last update. It's increased by 50% not decreased.Piecewise said:
Just like how League of Legends, Dota2, CSGO etc. are all multiplayer only and died 3 months after launch. Oh wait... don't let your incredible bias hit you on the way out.
He's got a point though.Entropy_kC said:
It's multiplayer only, which essentially means there's absolutely no guarantee that it'll last any kind of period.
If it had an offline (as in, proper offline, no internet required offline) singleplayer mode, then you could power it up any day, regardless of the status of any servers.
You took the words right outta my mouth, though reading through this argument (again) was somewhat amusing for the first few replies. Then it just got redundant.RedDeadFred said:
OT: Multiplayer things are definitely not my gig and since I actually like the first three Borderlands games, I naturally felt an inclination towards Battleborn, which works in my favour because it DOES have single player and a story.
Granted, I had to be dragged into playing the game by a buddy of mine which makes me think that neither of them are worth it. I'll just go back to my single player games. And nice try, people who try to explain away that Overwatch isn't all style and little substance. It is.
*Le Sigh* Blizzard doesn't need defending, random loot boxes are the poorest attempt at player rewards, and let's not pretend the addition of microtransactions are an act of kindness from this company to all those people who already played for the full game so they can pay even more money if they happen to be unfortunate enough to have a life outside of gaming. If it was really for the consumer and not a cheap attempt at fleecing the haves-and-have-nots psychology for unnecessary extra pocket lining, then they would be made available through other means that wouldnt cost the player more than they already have paid.ItsNotRudy said:
Now, maybe I just have a sense of the value of money, due to not being from a privileged background and having to watch where my money goes while watching out for people who are trying to fool you that their product is totes worth the value they're telling you (and these people are pretty much everywhere). If you have the disposable cash and don't care where it ends up, then that's your choice, but you cannot convince me that this product is pro-consumer and especially that it's worth my money and time. Compared to all the other full priced games that exist, this is barebones and repetative while it still hoping for the player to shell out more money. This is the profiteering intent that is on display.
Lastly, argumentum ad populum is a fallacious argument, 10 million people may buy this title, but it doesn't imply their opinion, and it doesn't make them right. More people tune in to the X-factor, does that mean that the programme is now something worth everybody's time?