Zero Punctuation: Tomb Raider: Underworld

[jemborg]

Let's not forget that this is from a man who, as a young Internet gutter-snipe, told us Why It Would Kick Arse To Be Lara Croft [http://www.fullyramblomatic.com/essays/lara.htm].

Oh, bang on, very good. Oh, the irony, haha.

Being an Aussie I've seen Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw being interviewed on an arts show on telly. And I can tell you that he falls definitely in the camp of "..video games are an art form.." and that he sees himself as a serious critic of the medium not necessarily (or as opposed to) a reviewer. Yes he does.

How he goes about it is his business. Wicked sense of humour or not, I often find critics are kind of over-reactionary in their assessment of whatever anyway- they're either besotted with a work or disgusted utterly, with the occasional "meh" thrown in. But hey, that's their job to be uncompromising, some are better than others.

I could quote from some of the great comments made in this thread, but just to mention a couple in passing will do-

Perhaps Yahtzee could clarify why the evil protag in Saints Row 2 is ok whilst it's not in TRU. I'd be interested in knowing his personal perspective on this, but I suspect it's something to do with the excellent "square peg in a round hole" argument offered earlier. In TRU it just doesn't work, whereas in SR2 it does. It's that elusive "mes en scene" (sorry about the spelling) effect. This time around he found her/it to be neither endearing or likeable maybe.

I was very interested in the comment from one of the game's testers about how he felt about the critique. I believed overall he condoned it.

Yahzee's comedy is NOT an attempt to say "hey don't take me seriously" - he means what he says in his fashion. He can be funny... ergo so he is; it's his way. Hypocrisy aside... he's a natural born wit- like Mark Twain, Jeremy Clarkson or like many of you- I'm sure. Also, he's never suggested you shouldn't make up your own mind, quite the opposite. (I don't necessarily 100% agree with the bastard's assessments either).

Yeah, I reckon one reason some might be complaining, is simply the novelty is wearing off. Coz to me he's pretty consistent taking that factor into account. Can't help feeling "Yahtzee is popular now- let's get on the dissing bandwagon first" is a factor too.

Oh yeah, and women really don't have such large gazongas in real life...

...except for my wife.

 

[Ormick]

The Michael Atkinson bit at the end got a good laugh out of me.

Oh yeah, and women really don't have such large gazongas in real life...

...except for my wife.

And pics or enjoy your hand.

 

[Taranaich]

Lara Croft is supposed to be a good guy.
Protagonist from Saints Row is not.

Again, why? Lara is an anti-hero, it was established from the first FMV from the first game.

after playing this i just have one thing to add:

how the hell is she a "tomb raider" when she breaks every-fucking-thing in sight? isn't the point to being a treasure hunter to NOT BREAK ANYTHING in the ancient, ruins unentered for thousands of years until her happy ass showed up?

... That describes the term "tomb raider" perfectly, IMO. An archaeologist, treasure hunter, adventurer or anything else would show these places a great deal of respect and care. Lara blunders in guns blazing with little care for any priceless artifacts she destroys save for a few pretty shiny ones. In other words, she RAIDS them.

That's what happened to most of the treasures in Egypt & Mesopotamia before the modern era of archaeology: anything made of a precious substance like gold was taken and either sold off to private collectors or melted down, with things regarded as precious now like pottery, plaques, scrolls or stone sculptures being damaged or even destroyed in the process.

 

[SirSchmoopy]

Wait.... you people watch ZP to decide which games to buy and which games to skip? Man, I just come here for the jokes.

 

[chickenlord]

Wait.... you people watch ZP to decide which games to buy and which games to skip? Man, I just come here for the jokes.

tell me about it man, if i watched this for game advice i wouldnt own any games, lol

 

[ElTigreNegro]

Yahzee's comedy is NOT an attempt to say "hey don't take me seriously" - he means what he says in his fashion. He can be funny... ergo so he is; it's his way. Hypocrisy aside... he's a natural born wit- like Mark Twain, Jeremy Clarkson or like many of you- I'm sure. Also, he's never suggested you shouldn't make up your own mind, quite the opposite. (I don't necessarily 100% agree with the bastard's assessments either).

Yeah, I reckon one reason some might be complaining, is simply the novelty is wearing off. Coz to me he's pretty consistent taking that factor into account. Can't help feeling "Yahtzee is popular now- let's get on the dissing bandwagon first" is a factor too.

I second all that, it's also quite obvious that some people just read/listen only what they want because Yahtzee has actually praised games and does mention the good side of a game (if there happens to be one) in the review, along with the flaws. I guess some truly can't help to get all visceral when there's a franchise they love being criticized. In these days where every single media out there gives GTAIV nothing but blind adoration is refreshing to see someone who actually is trying to reason the pros and cons of a game.

Now that, if you're a visceral fan with no criteria of it's own then yeah, you will get angry with Yathzee no matter what he says. Some people might want to make up their minds, they want an actual review/commentaru on a game or just a rant of how "cool" and "awesome" is playing said game? Reviews should always be taken with a grain of salt anyway, i love RPGs from Japan and i won't stop playing them just because some guy i agree from time to time on the internet says he hates them.

 

[Metalrocks]

after playing this i just have one thing to add:

how the hell is she a "tomb raider" when she breaks every-fucking-thing in sight? isn't the point to being a treasure hunter to NOT BREAK ANYTHING in the ancient, ruins unentered for thousands of years until her happy ass showed up?

these things she is afther are more worth then this stuff she breaks but otherwise you are right.

 

[Firia]

Yahzee's comedy is NOT an attempt to say "hey don't take me seriously" - he means what he says in his fashion. He can be funny... ergo so he is; it's his way. Hypocrisy aside... he's a natural born wit- like Mark Twain, Jeremy Clarkson or like many of you- I'm sure. Also, he's never suggested you shouldn't make up your own mind, quite the opposite. (I don't necessarily 100% agree with the bastard's assessments either).

Yeah, I reckon one reason some might be complaining, is simply the novelty is wearing off. Coz to me he's pretty consistent taking that factor into account. Can't help feeling "Yahtzee is popular now- let's get on the dissing bandwagon first" is a factor too.

I second all that, it's also quite obvious that some people just read/listen only what they want because Yahtzee has actually praised games and does mention the good side of a game (if there happens to be one) in the review, along with the flaws. I guess some truly can't help to get all visceral when there's a franchise they love being criticized. In these days where every single media out there gives GTAIV nothing but blind adoration is refreshing to see someone who actually is trying to reason the pros and cons of a game.

Now that, if you're a visceral fan with no criteria of it's own then yeah, you will get angry with Yathzee no matter what he says. Some people might want to make up their minds, they want an actual review/commentaru on a game or just a rant of how "cool" and "awesome" is playing said game? Reviews should always be taken with a grain of salt anyway, i love RPGs from Japan and i won't stop playing them just because some guy i agree from time to time on the internet says he hates them.

I'll buy this line of thinking. Yatz trashed a few games I loved; most recently Mirrors Edge. I've rarely, if ever, hinged my game buying desision on reviews. I've delayed my purchases at most (price drop, used copy, etc). Yahtzee has made several good points about some games from time to time, and has displayed good judgment when pointing it out in his reviews. His delivery isn't always as solid as we all might want, but that's life.

It's rare that we get a reviewer as honest as Yahtzee, and even rarer to have one with a decent sence of humor. To anyone that says that Yahtzee is losing his touch; it could be that you're getting used to his humor. I've gone back and checked out his original vids only to discover minor changes in style. The unique music selection is gone, and we all miss it. But it's gone for a reason (copywrite reasons, I belive).

Yatz is ok in my books. We differ in some opinions, but hey, that's allowed.

 

[invitationofchaos]

after playing this i just have one thing to add:

how the hell is she a "tomb raider" when she breaks every-fucking-thing in sight? isn't the point to being a treasure hunter to NOT BREAK ANYTHING in the ancient, ruins unentered for thousands of years until her happy ass showed up?

these things she is after are more worth then this stuff she breaks but otherwise you are right.

yeah but still the shit she destroys probably leaves her with a few grand instead of millions due to her rampant acts of destruction.

fuck "tomb raider"
she should be called "porn star looks for shiny things to hide in her clevage"

 

[Metalrocks]

these things she is after are more worth then this stuff she breaks but otherwise you are right.

yeah but still the shit she destroys probably leaves her with a few grand instead of millions due to her rampant acts of destruction.
[/quote]

the same thing then with indiana jones. lol. the destruction he is causing will come up to the same.
lol. i am sure indi and lara will get along just fine

 

[jemborg]

Wait.... you people watch ZP to decide which games to buy and which games to skip? Man, I just come here for the jokes.

What? Ok, let's play "miss-the-point". You shitstirrer, classic man. Lolol

Heh, I just had this picture of Lara trashing the Rossetta Stone- "coz it's in the way and besides it's not shiny".

 

[jemborg]

The Michael Atkinson bit at the end got a good laugh out of me.

Oh yeah, and women really don't have such large gazongas in real life...

...except for my wife.

And pics or enjoy your hand.

Sorry bro, I value my nads too much.

And Michael Atkinson is a foolish reactionary git- I'm ashamed to say he is the Attorney General in my home state.

 

[Ormick]

Sorry bro, I value my nads too much.

And Michael Atkinson is a foolish reactionary git- I'm ashamed to say he is the Attorney General in my home state.

And everyone thought Dubya was a jackass.

 

[Eric the Orange]

I find it funny that he says he dosen't like her cause shes evil, but in other games praises that, and in pretty much any game that gives you the choice he goes the evil path.

 

[Soulx]

You know she really is evil.

 

[Muffaraggin]

Loved the review. I only ever played the original Tomb Raider once and just could not get on with the controls. The bit where Lara decides she doesn't want to grab onto a ledge choosing to fall to her doom brought my whole Tomb Raider gameplay experience memories flooding back.

It doesn't look like these issues have been fixed in the intervening years despite a plethora of new titles so I say "balls to Tomb Raider".

 

[merkaba48]

I hope some people here still consider going out and buying the game.

If people never bought games because Yahtzee said they suck monkey nuts, then there wouldn't BE a games industry. People will have only bought Psychonauts, The Orange box, Braid, Prince of Persia, Magic Island f'ing Dizzy, and a few choice others.

I know a lot of watchers of ZP mostly just enjoy the humour, me included (that's why I still bought Mirrors Edge and enjoyed it despite its flaws). Just don't let that over the top humour stop you from getting something you would otherwise have bought. In fact, consider buying the games Yahtzee reviews just to see just how much he is right or not.

In related news, Eidos has laid off 30 staff from Crystal Dynamics, the team behind the Lara Croft series. I think this is a result of a general lack of interest in Lara Croft games nowadays, but bizarrely their excuse is that they want the studio to focus on the next incarnation of Lara Croft, relating their goal to that of the reimagining of Batman in Dark Knight. Personally I think that sounds like a bullshit interest-inducing statement to cover up the fact that 30 of their staff are now out of a job.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/eidos-cut-30-jobs-at-crystal-dynamics

 

[ElTigreNegro]

I still don't understand how a review can make somebody buy or not buy something. Why not just rent the game and check for yourself how is the game?

 

[m_jim]

@NewClassic's Post
In any case, I really do hope you look at your bullshit and realize that bitching on the internet like that is fucking asinine and needless.

I agree wholeheartedly. Bitching on the internet is asinine and needless. Now, do you want to be the pot, or the kettle?

 

[ranearia]

Never cared for Tomb Raider, but cudos to the new Video Player on the Escapist