Zero Punctuation: Transistor - Like Bastion But...

TaboriHK

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Zachary Amaranth said:
TaboriHK said:
Sure they are. The difference being that Yahtzee's reviews are the point, and the joke was a throwaway. I could also get mad that he implied that he had sex with my father and my mother has a dry vagina, and that would make me look silly. It's silly to nitpick a joke.
Apparently not, as Yahtzee's jokes get nitpicked frequently. The actual rule is more along the lines of "it's silly to nitpick a joke, unless that joke impacts me or mocks something I like in which case burn the heretic!"

That's basically the way the Zero Punctuation comments sections (here and on YoutTube) work. People are fine with Yahtzee's jokes until something dear to them gets mocked, then it's war.
Yeah, that's annoying. I feel like it should be discouraged.

Now, I admit that the feelings of trans people aren't as important as something super serious like the layout of a video game aimed at children, but the pattern remains.
Even framing it in those words feels manipulative. Should be adjusted to "the feelings of people aren't as important" and just end the sentence there. Because feelings are nice, but not very important. The ability to express one's self and freedoms, mega-important. Your feelings, on the other hand are kind of like your garden. You get to tend to them because they only really feed you.
 

IrisNetwork

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Although the narration isn't as great as Bastion's, I thought the music more than made up for it.
Yahtzee could've mentioned how much neater it is though. That was his problem in Bastion and Transistor fixed it.
 

Ticklefist

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~30 mins seemed to be about my limit too. Between the boredom and how I don't enjoy playing pirated* games well... yeah.

*I had to. They actually said the Steam version was "DRM free." I HAD TO.
 

Ikaruga33

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Karavision said:
Please stop fucking referencing transpeople. I am trans, you are not offending me in the slightest and I do not believe that you have anything against us.

But, it is clear that you have a very 1995 understanding of who we are and all this does is start that goddamn tumblr wardrum that will make it a pain in the ass to browse /v/ for the next month just like last time with the Papers Please shit.

And before you guys jump on me and scream censorship; I am against anyone forcing him to change anything that he wishes to say. I am just asking him to consider that 4 people have been killed over their identities and gender expression in the last 30 days. It is not his fault or his problem or his responsibility to make us feel "ok" but I would be eternally grateful if he simply forgot that we exist, at this point..
Someone's mad.
Getting ad at Yahtzee is like getting mad at SouthPark.
 

PinkiePyro

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this game wasnt even on my radar and I am glad it wasnt

on the note of telling Yahtzee how to do his job do a review of among the sleep !!!!
(pretty please Yahtzee I bought both your books)
 

Ipsen

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1337mokro said:
How is it hard to grasp the starting concept of "Someone close to you was murdered, fucked up the city and stole your voice. Find out who."
I don't understand either; sometimes most of the time now, reading the trend of thread comments on this site, I just don't see much intelligence or discernment anymore. Maybe I'm reading them wrong. :p

I love Transistor, but not just for it's story; I find it to be one of the most solidly designed games in recent memory (say, since Bastion) for what it is. I do feel that since it's combat system was gradually upgraded through levels, you didn't solidly learn how all of the distinct slot types worked together until later in the game(Particularly the passive slot).

But that's about the only valid complaint I can see with the game. I struggle to see the game as significantly 'confusing' or 'vague'. It takes effort, but every game requires this, so I can't think people are divided on this notion. The story isn't vague, it just decidedly doesn't explicitly tell you preceding details. I thought we liked 'show, don't tell' conception in games? (and yes, this game is an example of it; by progressing 'in media res', you learn the context/preceding events/cause of conflict by progressing through its effects).

Also considering the focus on the city itself and the lack of flesh-and-blood people around, I got the message that you can never fully acknowledge the full details of a story; there are too many facets to imagine/consider when you follow a typical story arc, so the game doesn't even bother trying. Instead, it chooses to tell what the gameplay leads you through; the Process and two people struggling through danger and catastrophic change to figure out why.
 

Grabehn

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Back in the day I was all about the "small but special" games, like Bastion was, or like Audiosurf when it came out (literally no one knew about it here).

But unlike Bastion, which I played 5 minutes and I knew I HAD to buy it, I played Transistor for about half am hour at a friend's house and just stopped. For some strange reason there's just nothing in the game that caught my attention, and there's such a "I should like this game" vibe that I get from it but I just couldn't.
 

Dalisclock

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I actually just started playing Transistor today. I loved Bastion, but so far I'm about 30 minutes into transistor and I'm not sure how I feel. I like it so far for the atmosphere, sound and visuals, but the complexity of the combat is definitely off-putting and I'd like a little more plot then "People/machines are trying to kill you and keep murdering people you know."

Then again, I've liked games with less plot(Earthbound didn't have much plot to speak of for most of the game, with spikes at the beginning and end). Hell, Kentucky Route Zero doesn't even have a plot(just a goal) and I love it despite that.
 

Duncan Belfast

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Zombie Badger said:
It's more that his idea of them is very outdated. He seems to think that they are literally switching genders (boy-->girl or girl-->boy) whereas it's actually that their gender (which is their male/femaleness as far as them as a person goes) doesn't match their physical sex; the old 'woman trapped in a man's body' term is basically literal. So the sister in the joke would always have been a sister, she just used to look like a guy.
I think there are a couple of things that more trans people (and people in general) need to realize:

1) What is obvious to you might not be obvious to others.

2) When people hear hooves, they assume horses, not zebras (at least outside of Africa).
Which means people are more likely to assume the default rather than the exception.

3) Sometimes a misunderstanding is just a misunderstanding, or a lack of knowledge is just a lack of knowledge, and isn't the product of ignorance and/or hate.

It is entirely possible that the joke is written from the perspective of the sibling, rather than as a reflection of Yahtzee's understanding. So, objectively, the sister might have always been female. However, the sibling in question might not have been aware of this. If it wasn't explained, from their perspective, it's a man becoming a woman.
 

RoonMian

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Qizx said:
RoonMian said:
Qizx said:
Dude... Unless you're trans yourself you don't get to decide what is offensive to trans people. Are you trans? I doubt it.
Nope. But I do get to decide if I find it ridiculous and react as such.

To quote a man: Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.

EDIT: I'm a VERY open person and I am all for gay/trans etc. rights, however when you start getting angry about things like this it DOESN'T help your cause, at all. It just makes it seem as if you want to scream persecution or get angry about any little thing, I'm certain there are quite a few trans people who wouldn't mind that pun at all.

EDIT 2: Just to stay on topic, I actually think it's a really cool idea to be able to use different abilities differently and stuff. It also reminds me of your Marvel super hero MMO (No idea what it was actually called or even if it was marvel?) how you can have gadget based scare powers or scare based gadget powers or W/E.
Oh, all right then. You decide someone you can hardly empathise with because their every-day reality is very different from yours is behaving ridiculously when they get offended by a joke where their sole existence is the punchline. And you qualify that by a statement that can be boiled down to "I'm not anti-trans BUT... I think they're ridiculous when they don't behave like I think they should behave."

I'm not trans either. I didn't even notice the joke before someone actually identifying as trans said that it wasn't okay. I wouldn't even think of putting myself in front of that person in this thread and say "Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right" when I have no idea how it feels to live their life and be offended by such a joke.

You seem to see that differently. Now that that is obvious to me I don't really want to discuss this with you any more. Go on and find other people ridiculous if that makes you happy.
 

Drejer43

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I did enjoy transistor but yeah the fact that i cant remenber anything about the plot tells how much i understood of it to begin with.
 

Darth Sea Bass

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'Like Bastion' Nuff said i fucking hated Bastion. So that goes safely in my never purchase list or only purchase when it's stupidly cheap in a Steam sale.
 

Miral

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Yep, this is pretty much exactly the problem I have with Transistor as well. It started out interesting, but my interest just sort of quietly tailed off after the first boss fight. It's just hard to relate to what little story there is.
 

1337mokro

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Ipsen said:
I do feel that since it's combat system was gradually upgraded through levels, you didn't solidly learn how all of the distinct slot types worked together until later in the game(Particularly the passive slot).
Ha, you quoted me before I actually corrected my poor sentence structure.

However I agree about the combat, to some people it would be very confusing and a bit to slow on the burner before it's fully utilized. However I picked it up fairly quickly and didn't have much trouble utilizing it. I did quickly fall back on the dominant strategy of maximum mobility because that's simply how I enjoyed playing. Maybe because of that the combat system seemed much easier to grasp to me because maximum mobility can be achieved with the first 5 powers you learn.

The critique about how the story was told just confused me. This in essence is the perfect story that most critics on this site have been screaming about for the past few years. Story and gameplay mixing together. Show Don't Tell. You learn more about the story by playing the game, interacting with objects and by unlocking powers you also gain more backstory about the city.

You are literally told nothing at the start except 3 things. "City under attack. Guy possibly close to you is now a sword and your voice is gone. Someone is behind this." and only by playing the game do you figure things out. This is perfect In Medias Res. You are given a clear goal at the start but almost no information and you are left to puzzle things back together.

Maybe the critics on this site are just a bunch of pretentious wannabees that when presented with the thing they always clamour for because it sounds smart are unable to grasp it because it flies way over their heads.
 

C14N

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Scrumpmonkey said:
C14N said:
Oh no, not another joke about trans-gendered people.
Why is that? I don't tend to follow these threads, has there been another outbreak where people lose their sense of humor again in previous threads?

I mean Yhatzee insinuating he fucked your dad and making a joke about holocaust denial open mike night is all peachy but a tranny pun? No thank you, he must be as bad as seven mega-hitlers.

Edit: Oh look. People's sense of humor has fallen off. Maybe we can get them some "Humor reassignment surgery" or at least remove their heads from their rectal cavity, that has to be uncomfortable...
There was a joke in Paper's Please where he said something like "I'm not gay, I just suck off pre-op transvestites" or something like that and it caused a shitstorm. It was the only time I've ever seen Yahtzee actually apologise and edit out a joke.
 

Mydnyght

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I wonder if "like Bastion but" was an intentional reference to the "like God of War but" stamp?

EDIT:
Also, that impburger has got to be the absolute worst goddamn motherfucking burger in existence...

...well, except for maybe the Trekking Burger.
 

Blithering_div

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1337mokro said:
The critique about how the story was told just confused me. This in essence is the perfect story that most critics on this site have been screaming about for the past few years.
Stories have characterization in them. Something this game severely lacks in the first hour of the game.
 

1337mokro

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Blithering_div said:
1337mokro said:
The critique about how the story was told just confused me. This in essence is the perfect story that most critics on this site have been screaming about for the past few years.
Stories have characterization in them. Something this game severely lacks in the first hour of the game.
NOPE!

The mouse said to the fox. "Would you like some cheese?" The fox said no and ate the mouse.

The only characterization going on is that the mouse might be mentally unhinged by not fearing the fox and that the fox is a fox. Yet it is a story.

The characterization is done throughout the entire game. The little terminal messages where you type a mass panic message, then back pedal and write something less panic inducing. Little bits of characterization wherever you look.