Oh, Taro shitting on his games again? Yeah, he does that. Some kind of weird modesty thing.
Stellar Blade (formally Project Eve) - Korean Sci-Fi Bayonetta/Nier: Automata/Sekiro Edition
- Thread starter BrawlMan
- Start date
Yeah, that's fair. Good in the ideas and writing department, hopeless as game designer.
When did that become prevailing opinion? I seem to recall people singing Nier Automata’s praises at the time of its release. I can’t fucking keep up with you lot any more.
People like Nier Automata a lot and I'll never understand why. It's a game where I waited the entire time for it to get interesting, and then it didn't. I liked the basic setup about two types of artificial lifeforms waging a neverending proxy war for in the name of the long extinct races that created them but it doesn't resolve that situation in a compelling way or does anything interesting with it, instead, instead it just lets it stand and treats revelations like "both the humans who built the androids and the aliens who built the robots are actually dead" or "Despite one looking humanoid and the other one mechanical, androids and robots are practically the same" like those earth shaking revelations despite both being very obviously telegraphed from very early on in the game. And then it does cringe shit like naming all the characters after vaguely related European philosophers. Oh, the one who presents as a woman is named Simone, the religious one is named Kierkegaard, the two who look like construction machines are named Marx and Engels. I don't know, everything about it feels like a stupid persons idea of a smart game. Throws out ideas it doesn't really explore, throws out references to pop philosophy, plays a bunch of stock emotional beats with its main characters and layers some artsy visual design and post modernist gameplay gimmicks on top of it to convince people it's an art game.
I played the first one too when it came out on Steam and it was basically the same, only replace "pop philosophy references" with "fairy tale references" and about twice as much of that "do the same thing over and over again to unlock actual plot progression" structuring that Yoko Taro is weirdly attached to. And as I understand the real ending wasn't even in the original PS3 release of Nier and only added in the Rerelease?
Don't get me wrong, I guess what people like about those games is the whole existential tragedy angle, the doomed lovers thing between 2B and 9S in Automata, the "murdering thousands to save someone you love" from the first game but all the actual resonance this could have feels buried beneath tons of tryhard pretentious hackery by a guy who desperately wants to come off as an auteur.
I haven't played Drakengard, I know the Nier games are technically a spinoff and maybe understanding them in the context of that greater continuity adds something, but as standalone works I don't see their appeal. And from what I've heard, the Drakengard games are a classic example of "unenjoyable to play on purpose to make a point" which, unless it's something that looks really interesting to me, I'm not really willing to put up with just out of curiosity.
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I don't even thing so.
It is more that those idiots have convinced themselves that there is a powerful movement trying to make every women in games ugly just to annoy them. And they feel good about "fighting back" against this imaginary threat.
And every time some company blunders in the art department (like with the pokemon go example or with Andromeda or ...) they feel confirmed. And if they can't find ugly ones for a time, they make do with unflattering screenshots or unrealized concept art and so on. Everything is part of the conspiracy if you already believe in it.
Also everytime someone complains about too much sexualisation or too little diversity in games they see at as confirmation of the consprirancy.
I actually liked Nier Automata quite a lot. Strangely that does not translate at all into interest in Stellar Blade. Most of the game was whimsical surrealism. Didn't like much of the ending though. Didn't make sense from the characters or from what we had seen so far. Very unimmersive. But everything before was nice.
Strangely that does not translate at all into interest in Stellar Blade.
Yeah. No interest in those either. Watched a plot synopsis once and that should be enough.
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@The Rogue Wolf right. And while yes they have their own paranoia and conspiracy theories running around, a majority of them are racist and sexist assholes with little to no action going on in their lives and just trying to start crap because they're miserable shit heads. They do this all the time and you know it. They just did it recently with an RPG and hating on a character because they're actually black and not written as a negative racist or cultural stereotype. For bonus points, that character is black and female. I've already seen the Twitter post.
By the way, I'm glad you like automata. I did as well, once I got the true ending I never felt the need to play the game again.
Branches you pretty much has already be a fan of Toro's previous works, but it's not that hard to figure out why when the new people jumped on board, or wanted to watch or play as previous works. It's because taro likes playing with themes and severity gameplay design and story expectations. Obviously not everyone's going to agree on what works and what doesn't or if they like it or not, but it's a fact that he always does something different and weird to stand out. Trust me there's plenty of gameplay design decisions I disagree with on him. It's generally why I don't like the gameplay elements of his games. Which have almost always been janky aside from the two recent examples. Automata does have a great story and I'll stand by that, but I really have no need to play it again. His games aren't for me either but I'm glad he's got a large fan base and following that proven bigger with the game's success. As for stellar blade being better than his game, I'm indifferent. He like everyone else are entitled to their own opinion. Me personally, I think Automata is better because there was a clear purpose and not just aping it for the sake of it. That is SB'S major issue along with going for another soul-style combat that doesn't work. Automata at least knew what type of game it was. There was some minor Souls elements, but that only mattered if you died or somebody else died and you can grab their materials just for some extra bonus items. And that's assuming you left the online connectivity on or turn it off. The only thing SB has going for it that makes it "better" are the pretty visuals.
@CriticalGaming, Sphere Hunter loves the game, but does have issues with SB.
Short version of problems:
Positives:
Otherwise, she loves the games combat and feels it's one of the more accessible Souls style games. Sphere knows the game is not perfect nor does not much new, but is fun like back in the PS2 days.
Short version of problems:
- Skill Trees are boring and typical with upgrades that should have been default moves to begin with.
- Side quests suck and are boring. The main characters are mostly dull for 80% of the game.
- None of the side characters are interesting.
- Boring environments in many of the linear section.
- While environments are great looking, everything feels like a mishmash that is not cohesive. Character design is inconsistent to her.
- Scripted sequences that will be boring on your second or more run.
- The story ain't winning any awards. Around the 23-minute mark are some spoilers, but I recommend stopping there if you want nothing spoiled for you.
Positives:
- Excellent combat and dodge mechanics.
- Excellent and varied gear system.
- The game is the most accessible Souls style games.
- The game encourages the player to be aggressive. Dodging and parrying are on point 99% of the time.
- Soundtrack is wonderful. The same people who did the soundtrack for the Nier games worked on this. Talk about irony.
Otherwise, she loves the games combat and feels it's one of the more accessible Souls style games. Sphere knows the game is not perfect nor does not much new, but is fun like back in the PS2 days.
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As silly as it sounds I really stick by my stance that not having any change in her appearance ruins my immersion. No in a lot a of games it wouldn't bother me but her physical appearance is literally the center focus of this game. Lets be honest the view is constantly centered on her body.
She is near constantly immersed in filthy environments, guts and gore yet this is never actually acknowledged in game visually.
I personally think this is part and parcel of what makes this seem like a AA game. The lack of investment by the developers in making a polished game.
Even something as simple as having her shake or wipe off the gore as a part of her kill finishes would, I swear to you, be eye popping. Youd hear so much acclaim from critics saying it took immersion to the next level.
They could even take it to the next level and have her appearance become more filthy over the course of the game, but thats far less reasonable. Still thats what really parts good games versus award winning. That feeling of "fuck of Ive been through a lot" shared between the player and ingame character.
She is near constantly immersed in filthy environments, guts and gore yet this is never actually acknowledged in game visually.
I personally think this is part and parcel of what makes this seem like a AA game. The lack of investment by the developers in making a polished game.
Even something as simple as having her shake or wipe off the gore as a part of her kill finishes would, I swear to you, be eye popping. Youd hear so much acclaim from critics saying it took immersion to the next level.
They could even take it to the next level and have her appearance become more filthy over the course of the game, but thats far less reasonable. Still thats what really parts good games versus award winning. That feeling of "fuck of Ive been through a lot" shared between the player and ingame character.
That's what I love about the RE engine titles. RE2R-RE4R, RE8, and DMC5. Your characters get dirty, bloody, and filthy. Especially by end game. Even Bayonetta 3 and Nier: Automata got in on this to some extent. More so the latter. Another good example is Evil Within 2. Sebastian doesn't exactly stay clean appearance wise by end game. He goes get ruffed up a good amount.
This game is like a rollercoster. It feels fresh to have actual...levels! It's not just missions and traveling an open world. You go to a thing, do a story, play through a level, then do another story, and then you're somewhere else. Not gotten to the hub town yet since I only scraped by 2-3 hours away from Eiyuuden to play it, but it feels so nice man.
Gameplay is very weighty and responsive, I remember seeing concerns about the enemies not reacting to your hits but that's not at all true. Some do have super armor in some moves but once you get them vulnerable they react totally. Also kill hits have slowdowns and the combos feel a lot more involved than Sekiro. It does feel like a more tame DMC experience with Sekiro dodge/parry mechanics.
Oh also anyone having trouble dodging and parrying, make sure to upgrade those skills, it makes the window for a perfect timing wider when you do.
Finally, as for the slow movement when you enter combat, that's atually a myth. You have movement actions beyond walking and dodging, there's Rush which dashes instantly very far and does a big hit, kinda like Stinger from dmc, you have the L3 running which works the same as it does out of combat, and you have dashing as part of combos too, so when you see an enemy you're hitting back off you wanna do the ^ [] hold-[] ^ combo to chase em down as you hit them. There's tons of options!
Oh and Eve's ass is not even relevant in any of this, I'm just lost in the magic of the world and the ruins everywhere. People who pretended like only people who wanna be titillated would care for this game are eating craw. I spent more time looking at her hair fluttering about as she runs lol.
Gameplay is very weighty and responsive, I remember seeing concerns about the enemies not reacting to your hits but that's not at all true. Some do have super armor in some moves but once you get them vulnerable they react totally. Also kill hits have slowdowns and the combos feel a lot more involved than Sekiro. It does feel like a more tame DMC experience with Sekiro dodge/parry mechanics.
Oh also anyone having trouble dodging and parrying, make sure to upgrade those skills, it makes the window for a perfect timing wider when you do.
Finally, as for the slow movement when you enter combat, that's atually a myth. You have movement actions beyond walking and dodging, there's Rush which dashes instantly very far and does a big hit, kinda like Stinger from dmc, you have the L3 running which works the same as it does out of combat, and you have dashing as part of combos too, so when you see an enemy you're hitting back off you wanna do the ^ [] hold-[] ^ combo to chase em down as you hit them. There's tons of options!
Oh and Eve's ass is not even relevant in any of this, I'm just lost in the magic of the world and the ruins everywhere. People who pretended like only people who wanna be titillated would care for this game are eating craw. I spent more time looking at her hair fluttering about as she runs lol.
I have to talk about this in the morning. I am in love, but i wanna put in a few more hours to be sure.
Play up to the fight in the sunset bridge, then you will know for sure, it's maybe like 10-15 hours in depending on how much you walk around seeking for members.
But yeah, I am very proud my name is on the credits of this masterpiece, first thing I ever backed on KS.
wtf is happening with the discourse around this game lol...
Ok, Nier: Automata- loved that game! And y'all know I'm not one to bandwagon with prevailing critical opinion given how critical I am of pretty much all of the recent critical darlings but Nier was just so fun! Sometimes you're running around with action combat, and sometimes you're in a bullet hell, and a couple of times you're like a spaceship? 2D, 3D, 2.5D- the game is a trip, man. Cute singing robots and big sand robots and funny trash can robots. And, yeah, the multiple endings thing is a trip (that wouldn't work if the art and gameplay weren' engaging). Why do people like this game? 'Cause it's fun and weird and cool. Do y'all even like video games?
I was listening to Easy Allies talk about the game and they are all-in- freaking loving the combat and even the levels.
I am just more and more convinced it's about the timing of the release. If this game would have come out 6 months ago it would've been forgotten about.
And *sigh* I guess the chuds with their jiggle physics obsession because I just remember Rise of the Ronin also just came out and nobody cares any more hah-hah.
Ok, Nier: Automata- loved that game! And y'all know I'm not one to bandwagon with prevailing critical opinion given how critical I am of pretty much all of the recent critical darlings but Nier was just so fun! Sometimes you're running around with action combat, and sometimes you're in a bullet hell, and a couple of times you're like a spaceship? 2D, 3D, 2.5D- the game is a trip, man. Cute singing robots and big sand robots and funny trash can robots. And, yeah, the multiple endings thing is a trip (that wouldn't work if the art and gameplay weren' engaging). Why do people like this game? 'Cause it's fun and weird and cool. Do y'all even like video games?
I was listening to Easy Allies talk about the game and they are all-in- freaking loving the combat and even the levels.
I am just more and more convinced it's about the timing of the release. If this game would have come out 6 months ago it would've been forgotten about.
And *sigh* I guess the chuds with their jiggle physics obsession because I just remember Rise of the Ronin also just came out and nobody cares any more hah-hah.
The irony of this is that the jiggle physics are barely a thing. Eve's tits are not made of jello and don't jiggle the way Dead or Alive girls jiggle, and in fact she's fairly mundane in terms of titilation. Her outfits are certainly hot, but you kind of ignore that three minutes after changing outfits anyway because the combat requires you to pay significantly more attention to the hideous monsters in order to parry properly. You barely fucking look at Eve, it's so ironic!
You don't care anymore. The Ni-Oh fans care. The Wu-Long fans care. Pat, Woolie, and Reggie care and are having a blast. Funny thing, similar to Stellar Blade, Rise of the Ronin is the most accessible of the franchise. So both it and SB got something for people new to the genre, or if it's their first one.
They don't count for shit, and are only there for the shallowest of reasons.
Which makes all the "the horny/titillations is making the woke liberals mad" fuck heads all the more pathetic. They couldn't give a shit about the actual gameplay, mechanics, soundtrack, or level design. They just assume everyone not in their pathetic little echo chamber will be just as pathetic and miserable as their sorry biatch asses.