Biden v. Trump Election Mega Thread

Who will win the election?

  • SleepyJoe

    Votes: 15 30.0%
  • Donald Trump

    Votes: 9 18.0%
  • It doesn't matter who wins, because we will all lose in some way.

    Votes: 26 52.0%

  • Total voters
    50
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Hades

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I think our ruling elite have an agenda that includes using the FBI to come up with results they like. I don't buy the right is more dangerous to this Jew than the Left.
ANTIFA may not be an "organization" but it is a para militaristic anti-west violent movement. Biden should have condemned them by name.
If that was the case Comey would never have helped Trump out in 2016. If the FBI served ''the elites'' they wouldn't have announced at the last possible second that Clinton was no good after all.

Also fascism greatly weakened the west and even destroyed many western nations completely. Its also deeply hostile to aspects almost synonymous with western culture such as democracy. Opposition to that hardly strikes me as anti western.
 
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Thaluikhain

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Also fascism greatly weakened the west and even destroyed many western nations completely. Its also deeply hostile to aspects almost synonymous with western culture such as democracy. Opposition to that hardly strikes me as anti western.
Germany, Italy and Spain are Western nations, and anti-fascists got right stroppy with those a generation or two ago. They even drove the democratically elected ruler of one of those to kill himself, and then set fire to the body.
 

Elijin

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Define "lost". He's playing by different rules than he should be, and they've worked fine for him until now.
Defined as there was a formal debate, and I consider him to have lost based on the way he composed himself and treated the process.

I fully acknowledge that he was playing to his base, and they almost definitely see it as a win.

I will still say he lost the debate though. It was like watching an 80's movie come to life, as the bully disrespected the whole process. All he needed were some other bullies cheering and jeering from the crowd.



Tstorm:
He said 'sure' to being WILLING to condemn them, then failed (or refused) to actually condemn them when asked to do so.
 

Agema

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I think our ruling elite have an agenda that includes using the FBI to come up with results they like.
Like Hillary Clinton regarding her email servers? Apparently, the establishment elite failed to protect the non plus ultra of establishment elite candidates from the FBI, including right in the middle of an electoral campaign.

I don't buy the right is more dangerous to this Jew than the Left.
Those swastika tattoos and chants of "Jews will not replace us" aren't much found in Antifa protests.

ANTIFA may not be an "organization" but it is a para militaristic anti-west violent movement.
Where are their guns, their military training and tactics, their military-like structure / hierarchy? They aren't military at all.

But what is the Proud Boys organized movement? I've linked their web page. Again: they are multi-racial.
It's multiracial, Jim, but not as we know it.

Wallace: Are you willing to condemn white supremecy.
Trump: Sure, I'm willing to do that.
Internet: Trump refuses to condemn white supremacy!
"Proud boys, stand back and stand by!"

So Trump in fact assumed the role of their commander-in-chief and gave them orders, including asking them to prepare for future action (which I'm assuming is November). That's just about the biggest possible endorsement.
 

happyninja42

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Calm down. The only thing that will happen out of the outcome are just regular riots and skirmishes. The average Donald voter aren't smart enough to mobilize or instigate an actual civil war. No matter how much I fantasize about a 2nd Civil War, the only thing that's going to happen is just another wave of dumb white guys opening fire randomly.
They don't have to be smart, they just have to be armed, and highly motivated to go shoot people. And his demographic definitely are. A lot of them are chomping at the bit for a situation like this. They stroke themselves to gratification at night, dreaming of the second civil war, and them at the lead of some redneck army, with delusions of Red Dawn in their head, but instead, it's a Brown Democrat Dawn. This is why they've been stockpiling guns and ammo for decades.

It could get very ugly in my opinion.
 

tstorm823

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He didn't actually condemn white supremacists at all, did he? What he said was '[White supremacists] stand back and stand by'. Holy hell, the condemnation!
Tstorm:
He said 'sure' to being WILLING to condemn them, then failed (or refused) to actually condemn them when asked to do so.
"Proud boys, stand back and stand by!"

So Trump in fact assumed the role of their commander-in-chief and gave them orders, including asking them to prepare for future action (which I'm assuming is November). That's just about the biggest possible endorsement.
You know how many times Trump has explicitly condemned white supremacists? A lot. Like, a lot. The continued presumption in the questions that Trump treats white supremacy the same as the left treats antifa is intellectually offensive. When he says "yes, he's willing to do that" after having a history of doing that, that's plenty:
Trump Quotes said:
Trump, Aug. 14, 2017: Racism is evil. And those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including the KKK, neo-Nazis, white supremacists, and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans.

Trump, Aug. 15, 2017: I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally.

Trump, Aug. 11, 2018: The riots in Charlottesville a year ago resulted in senseless death and division. We must come together as a nation. I condemn all types of racism and acts of violence.

Trump, Aug. 3 2019: The shooter in El Paso posted a manifesto online consumed by racist hate. In one voice, our nation must condemn racism, bigotry, and white supremacy. These sinister ideologies must be defeated.
There is no number of times Trump can condemn White Supremacists that will make that lie die. They're going to keep saying that of him no matter what he does. And like, he names the Proud Boys and tells them to stand down, like it's actually pretty clever. The Proud Boys aren't white supremacists. They're violent political extremists who participate in riots, and overall morons in general, but they aren't a white supremacist group. But Trump picked them to tell to stand down. Cause if he told actual white supremacists to stand down, he'd be taking up position as the leader of racism in America. He's smart not to tie himself to like the KKK.

Everyone who cares to know the truth knows that Trump has condemned white supremacy multiple times in no uncertain terms. He's not being asked that question because he hasn't, he's being asked that question because they want to tie him to white supremacists, and the question succeeds at that no matter how he answers, so the only answer is damage control.

And like, think about this for a second: they demand Trump condemn white supremacists, that something needs to be done about them, and then when it's turned to antifa, Biden repeats that stupid crap about it being an idea rather than an organization, which is both untrue and doesn't matter. There are plenty of groups organized under the antifa name that can be condemned as groups just fine, but even if there aren't you can condemn the ideas in exactly the same way as you condemn white supremacy. Are we incapable of opposing white supremacy because it's an idea and not an incorporated entity? I don't think so.
 
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Thaluikhain

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They don't have to be smart, they just have to be armed, and highly motivated to go shoot people. And his demographic definitely are. A lot of them are chomping at the bit for a situation like this. They stroke themselves to gratification at night, dreaming of the second civil war, and them at the lead of some redneck army, with delusions of Red Dawn in their head, but instead, it's a Brown Democrat Dawn. This is why they've been stockpiling guns and ammo for decades.

It could get very ugly in my opinion.
Second that. You don't need an organised disciplined force to have lots of lynch mobs. It helps a lot, but it's hardly necessary.
 
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Hades

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So here's a fun scenario. What if Trump loses the election but still arranges a second term through subterfuge. What if he declares the election result void and has the supreme court declare him the victor, or what if faithless electors grant him another term even if he loses both the popular and college vote.

What can Democrats do then? Would it be possible for all Democrat states to just stop paying taxes to the central government and not funnel money to the impoverished south until the legitimate president takes office? Could they disregard anything Trump says and regard Biden as the legitimate president? Can they make the US completely ungovernable until the legitimate government is allowed to take office?

The democrat states are where the people and the money are so if they desire it they could theoretically cause a lot of havoc.
 

tstorm823

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So here's a fun scenario. What if Trump loses the election but still arranges a second term through subterfuge. What if he declares the election result void and has the supreme court declare him the victor, or what if faithless electors grant him another term even if he loses both the popular and college vote.

What can Democrats do then? Would it be possible for all Democrat states to just stop paying taxes to the central government and not funnel money to the impoverished south until the legitimate president takes office? Could they disregard anything Trump says and regard Biden as the legitimate president? Can they make the US completely ungovernable until the legitimate government is allowed to take office?

The democrat states are where the people and the money are so if they desire it they could theoretically cause a lot of havoc.
Stop entertaining insane fantasies.
 

Thaluikhain

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So here's a fun scenario. What if Trump loses the election but still arranges a second term through subterfuge. What if he declares the election result void and has the supreme court declare him the victor, or what if faithless electors grant him another term even if he loses both the popular and college vote.
The Dems say that that's bad, but don't push it too hard.

Mind you, pushing it that hard has a not insubstantial chance of a fascist crackdown, so can't entirely blame them. But it's a coup anyway.
 

Baffle

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You know how many times Trump has explicitly condemned white supremacists? A lot. Like, a lot. The continued presumption in the questions that Trump treats white supremacy the same as the left treats antifa is intellectually offensive. When he says "yes, he's willing to do that" after having a history of doing that, that's plenty:
So ... he didn't condemn them is what you're saying. I mean, unless you've got a different transcript to the rest of us?
 

happyninja42

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So here's a fun scenario. What if Trump loses the election but still arranges a second term through subterfuge. What if he declares the election result void and has the supreme court declare him the victor, or what if faithless electors grant him another term even if he loses both the popular and college vote.

What can Democrats do then? Would it be possible for all Democrat states to just stop paying taxes to the central government and not funnel money to the impoverished south until the legitimate president takes office? Could they disregard anything Trump says and regard Biden as the legitimate president? Can they make the US completely ungovernable until the legitimate government is allowed to take office?

The democrat states are where the people and the money are so if they desire it they could theoretically cause a lot of havoc.
It's possible I guess? I mean it depends on how much personal motivation the other side has if that scenario you described happens. It also assumes that noone in the rest of the government doesn't object and work against it as well. I would assume that our allies would also apply political/economic pressure if things with that batshit crazy, which would influence businesses to react, and the various representatives to also act, to put pressure on.

So....*shrugs* fuck if I know really.
 

Elijin

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Call me old fashioned, but if I were a public figure battling serious allegations of racism like that, I would answer questions about it explicitly denying it and condemning those beliefs at each opportunity. Not just a few scripted sound bites. Given how often it comes up, the fact you could only supply 4 times he did speak against it... 🤷‍♂️
 
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tstorm823

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if I were a public figure battling serious allegations of racism like that
Here's the trick: half of everyone laughs at those allegations. They aren't serious allegations to us. They are desperate political lies.

Edit: The same lies Democrats have been firing at Republicans for the last half century.
 

Exley97

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There is no number of times Trump can condemn White Supremacists that will make that lie die. They're going to keep saying that of him no matter what he does. And like, he names the Proud Boys and tells them to stand down, like it's actually pretty clever. The Proud Boys aren't white supremacists. They're violent political extremists who participate in riots, and overall morons in general, but they aren't a white supremacist group. But Trump picked them to tell to stand down. Cause if he told actual white supremacists to stand down, he'd be taking up position as the leader of racism in America. He's smart not to tie himself to like the KKK.
Clever? Shouldn't the Proud Boys be, I dunno, upset that the president thinks they're white supremacists? The fact that the Proud Boys (who participated in rallies where members scream "Jews will not replace us!" among other white nationalist/supremacist events) are reportedly ecstatic with Trump mentioning them in the debate last night *IN RESPONSE TO A QUESTION ABOUT WHITE SUPREMACIST GROUPS* is pretty revealing, and not exactly supporting the claims that the group is non-racist.
 

gorfias

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I... how? What? The first shooting death was in August? The current confrontational protests between Proud Boys and Antifa started happening around the same time, over a month after Trump was forced out of town? So not only are things not getting “better” (in terms of the risk to private property it’s neutral, in terms of the risk to human life the current phase is the most dangerous yet), but Trump had fuckall to do with it. Just, what? Who told you this?

Things aren’t getting better, things were just never honestly that bad (in terms of the “threat” protesters presented). If anything, the escalation that confrontational protests are bringing in is making things worse.
Briefly, the narrative is that Trump kept offering aid which was declined by Democrats. The Democrats have been failing to press charges again the rioters, bailing them out, etc. Then Trump started making Federal cases that are sticking so the riots are dying down. Not true?
If that was the case Comey would never have helped Trump out in 2016. If the FBI served ''the elites'' they wouldn't have announced at the last possible second that Clinton was no good after all.

Also fascism greatly weakened the west and even destroyed many western nations completely. Its also deeply hostile to aspects almost synonymous with western culture such as democracy. Opposition to that hardly strikes me as anti western.
The Comey thing was odd. There is a ton of history of him handling HRC with kid gloves, including the calling of the investigation a "matter" and that he called her non legal term "extremely careless" rather than legal, "criminally negligent." And that's just for starters.
Great. Fascim stinks. It's also irrelevant in most of the west. If you are engaged in violence screaming that we have to do something about all of these people worshiping Odin in the USA, which to my knowledge is not a problem? There's really something else going on.
 

Elijin

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I dont care if you think they're lies. The US president should be working towards unifying America. Under trump, division is at its worst in my lifetime, and he actively encourages it.

The man can't even commit to abiding by the election results, or a peaceful transation of power, win or lose.

ANY US president who will not commit to doing their utmost to meet those two things deserves immediate removal from office.
 

lil devils x

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The difference between a financial arrangement and a loving relationship:
No wonder Trump said his wife wouldn't cry if he were shot...
 
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