245: Gunners and Gamers

[Sjakie]

Can't own guns in The Netherlands as a normal citizen. Well, we have a few shooting ranges but restrictions are so though and for hand-guns only, forget about rifles or automatic's.
The article read more as a pro-gunownership article then an objective one. It doesn't forego the possible objections to gunownership but for a 5 page story about guns and gamers i found it rather lacking a bit. And that is a shame really. Writing a story about personal experiences and statistics makes for a good informative read, but i do think there is still more subject there. Could just be me, since i dont have hardly any real life experience with guns.
The respect a firearm needs and the possibility to disregard that entirely for a virtual one was a really good point to make.

 

[secretsantaone]

I don't think comparing gun deaths and traffic accidents is fair, the clue being in the name.

Traffic ACCIDENTS.

Yes, there is always potential for accidental gun-related deaths as well, however the nature of a gun implies that for there to be a death, someone pulled the trigger with the intent to kill or injure. Noone wants to be in a traffic accident.

Another thing is that there are many more cars than guns per household, so after taking that into consideration the numbers would be considerably narrower.

On the topic of gamer and gun owners, the story about the Halo player does scare me but I'd like to think most gamers are responsible enough to both own a gun and play video games. As long as the person knows the difference between reality and fantasy then they should be fine.

Not that it matters in the UK anyway where guns are all banned. Guess I'll watch out for those fanatic MW2 knifers.

 

[atr_23]

Looking at statistics related to firearm-related deaths in the United States paints an even more interesting picture. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the number of people killed in the U.S. by firearms in the year 2005 was 31,000, but the number of people killed in traffic accidents was 43,150, making driving in the U.S. almost 40 percent more dangerous than guns - a fact you don't hear a lot of talk about on Capitol Hill.

This comparison is absurd. How many people take part in traffic (something that is nescessary for living) and how many people shoot with guns (something that is not nescessary for living)? 31,000 deaths through a tool that is not nescessary to a society is very scary. especially when comparing it to something like traffic victims because traffic is something everybody is part of.

 

[Doc Cannon]

Guns don't kill people, Fox News kills people.

But seriously, I think it's more of a cultural/social issue. The US are not the country with the most armed population, so I don't think guns are the problem. (Even though I do believe there has to be limits to what an ordinary person can buy).

 

[Susan Arendt]

Interesting and well-written article, Russ.

I agree, but doesn't the picture surrounding it make light of the situation? The words "Zip those puppies up" do spring to mind.

The pictures that often get spread with guns are very much akin to the ones that used to be used with cigarettes, or Flakes, or six inch long sandwiches...

And perhaps that's what leads to problems like Columbine? Sexualisation of something that's really not sexual.

From a UK perspective, our knife crime is reaching US's gun crime standards; before we look into the bomb problems, which we've had for decades, but are now creeping across into the US.

No. Putting pretty girls in adverts does not drive someone to shoot up a school. As someone pointed out, those boys wanted to do harm, plain and simple. They had access to guns, so they used guns. If all they'd had access to was pointed sticks, they'd have used them instead.

 

[BishopOfBattle]

"They used pipe bombs and other IED devices"

IED stand for Improvised Explosive Device... so they used improvised explosive device devices?

Unless they got their hands on a standard issue, manufactured, and trademarked pipe bomb from somewhere, the pipe bombs would have been homebuilt out of various components which classifies them as IEDs. So yes, they did.

Interesting and well-written article, Russ.

Indeed, thanks for writing a good, well thought out article regarding the topic. Most of the time you only hear from the extreme far left gun fearing liberals ("A gun by itself on a table will kill three babies and a kitten in less than twelve minutes!) and the extreme far right gun worshiping conservatives ("Molôn labe!"). Its good to hear from the rational middle ground, which is where many gun owners and gamers reside.

I think emphasis on proper approach to the hobby are important. Can you get hurt or hurt others if you don't know what you're doing, don't take safety classes, and go down to your local gun store to buy the biggest pistol you can get your hands on? Absolutely. You could also do the same if you threw yourself down the expert slope with no experience on a set of skis or snowboard or drove off in daddy's car without ever having learned how to drive.

I learned about firearms when I was young as a Boy Scout. Growing up, my dad owned (and still owns) over a dozen which I was exposed to, though they were always locked in a gun safe except when he pulled them out to show us in a controlled environment and taught us proper safety. I attended Basic Combat Training with the Army in 2007 where I learned even more about firearm safety and handeling of firearms (especially important as we were being trained to consistantly handle high power, loaded, automatic weapons). Even then, I still take safety / training courses as time and funds permit to keep up on my skills.

The individuals walking into a store to "get a sniper rifle" so they can "pwn noobs" are concerning. Though they also present an opportunity (if you know / meet that person) to get them into a firearm safety class (ideally one where they both learn safety skills and also get live fire time on a range) and change them from potentially worrisome overly enthusiastic hazards into responsible gun owners.

 

[Marine Mike]

"They used pipe bombs and other IED devices"

IED stand for Improvised Explosive Device... so they used improvised explosive device devices?

Unless they got their hands on a standard issue, manufactured, and trademarked pipe bomb from somewhere, the pipe bombs would have been homebuilt out of various components which classifies them as IEDs. So yes, they did.

I was pointing out that part of IED is Device, so saying "IED devices" is redundant... Part of my demolitions training was how to make IED's and let me tell you, having a part of your brain that says "I can make that into a bomb, here's how" for just about anything you look at can earn you more than a few awkward stares if you bring it up in social situations.

 

[JWAN]

Gunners and Gamers

Guns and games typically only come up in the same news story when it involves a horrific act of violence. But what about all the responsible enthusiasts out there who simply want to enjoy their favorite pastimes? Russ Pitts speaks with gamers and gun owners about their dual hobbies.

Read Full Article

^ that article should be submitted to a major news organization.
Ive played video games and shot guns since I was a kid and have caught crap for both.
Thank YOU Mr. Pitts

 

[JWAN]

I don't own any guns... yet.

I wouldn't mind keeping an M1911 (or similar .45 automatic), H&K 9mm and Garand for target practice, however. And just in case of zombies.

I help maintain 7 M1 Garands for military funerals.
If you have the chance pick one up. They are really great rifles.

 

[JWAN]

Ah these big groups that protest things in the US are mostly all are just looking for the next, big thing to attack. If you live in the US than you probably remember how much people attacked GTA4 when it first came out. I, personally, thought it was just silly. The specific features they picked out of the game to attack have been in games for YEARS. GTA4 was just the one they heard about on the news, or whatever.

I've practiced martial arts for most of my life and, needless to say, I have a pretty hefty arsenal of melee weapons and such. Now, I live in a very, VERY, christian, rural community and these people just seemed to be terrified of me and my family from day one. The police are up at our house almost daily, and it's almost comical. My family and I practice martial arts so that we can free ourselves from things like hate and anger, but all these people seem to think we're murderous lunatics or something. I don't know how many times I've found myself wanting to strangle one of my younger siblings and, instead, went did pushups or hit the cutting board for an hour or so. I think, that, when you deprive someone of a primal need, like, bashing things or you know, sex, it makes them want it even more. However, these protesting groups in America, would have you believe that taking those things away is the answer.

I still blame Elvis and that damn rock n' roll. but those groups exist in other places...like Europe. Much of it comes out of Europe, apparently Great Britain is still a little sore from that whole "Revolutionary War" thing (SARCASM)

I totally get what your coming from. Martial arts had been a part of my life just as long as games and firearms have. I get bitched at often for my beliefs but it hardly ever escalates to people showing up at my house... I wonder why? I think its because they lack the strength of their convictions, they are cowards and they want other people do do and believe what they do and believe. They don't understand that I believe in self preservation and my rights as a United States citizen.

 

[mrwar]

"Looking at statistics related to firearm-related deaths in the United States paints an even more interesting picture. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the number of people killed in the U.S. by firearms in the year 2005 was 31,000, but the number of people killed in traffic accidents was 43,150, making driving in the U.S. almost 40 percent more dangerous than guns - a fact you don't hear a lot of talk about on Capitol Hill."

Mr. Pitts, although I do not have a gun myself, I am not against a civilian´s right to own guns. In fact, I have been thinking in buying one for home protection for some years now.

Said that, I must say that the above comparison is not fair at all because you are comparing statistics using two largely different universes. It is quite clear that the number of people driving in 2005 is MUCH larger than the number of people shooting guns, don´t you think?

So you can´t compare those numbers like that...

 

[FURY_007]

Great article

I myself am a ''gunner and gamer.'' Thankfully, most people I know and surround myself with don't have a problem with guns or games, and even enjoy them. My 2 closest friends are as much into them as me, and when the weather permits often we can be found at the closest range having a blast (pun intended), then at night playing games haha. At first my mom was extremely opposed to guns, but when I turned 18 and bought my first rifle (A 1941 M91/30 Mosin Nagant) she got past her irrationality and was like "oh, it looks kind of beautiful." My mom now has regular conversations with her boss about my guns and stuff becasue it turns out he's into guns.

The media is to blame for why average americans are so weird about guns. People like the boys at Colombine use guns and the media blows them wayyy out of proportion, and they instilled an irrational fear of guns. My mom got over that when she saw that my rifle isn't going to jump up and start killing babys from 235 miles away. I think people just need to get exposed to them more, that's all.

I myself own the aforementioned M91/30 (Russian, Bolt-Action), a 1941 Lee-Enfield no.1 mk.III (British, bolt Action), a High Standard Sentinel 9-shot revolver in .22 (Extremely Rare), and a 1968 Charter Arms Undercover Special 5-shot revolver in .38 Special, and I am planning to get a new rifle this summer. I'm not a violent person, in fact people have commented about how calm I am, but I just love them becasue of their history, the mechanical aspects, and all around they are just really fun to shoot

 

[Nam Yensa]

Fantastic article Russ..

But you just gotta leave it to idiotic gamers to ruin firearms everywhere.

 

[KungFuMaster]

I don't how "universal" this is, as some states/provinces/what-have-you don't issue carry permits yet, but where I live in the Great Frozen North, you can get a permit to carry (often erroneously referred to as a "concealed carry" permit), but you have to go to a class first. The class costs 100 dollars, takes nine hours and you have to pass both a basic knowledge and a basic skills test, and that's just to get the paper that says you can apply for a permit. Applying for the permit also costs 100 dollars, you have to have a valid, and current, form of ID and pass a background check (i.e. if you beat your wife, you're not getting a gun) and it can still take up to a month for the thing to be issued. This might sound like a bit of hassle, and it is, but it's also a great motivator, because the permit supersedes the Brady law and all of the gun dealers I know around here won't sell to anyone who doesn't have the permit.

The moral of story being "no training, no weapon."

 

[zelda2fanboy]

I've only ever fired a BB gun, even though I technically own all of the real guns in our household (dad's FOID card expired, but mine's still good). Most of them are antiques that I wouldn't fire on a bet and I don't even know where the bullets for most of them are. In video games, the closest facsimile to real gun fire is ironically Fallout 3, a game criticized for the way it handles shooting. Going into VATS is a more realistic representation of picking a shot, considering probability, slowly taking aim, and squeezing the trigger. The BB gun section at the beginning of the game felt very familiar. The video arcade part of game is the appeal, but in reality the experience of firing a weapon is more like that of using a tool and there's very little "fun" to be had. Shoot a BB gun at some cans for ten minutes and you'll get pretty bored pretty fast.

 

[MGlBlaze]

Fantastic article Russ..

But you just gotta leave it to idiotic gamers to ruin firearms everywhere.

You mean like that moron who asked for a sniper rifle so he could "headshot some noobs... like in Halo"? I'm frightened people that dumb actually exist... and that's just if he was making a really tasteless and stupid joke! If he was being serious, I'd have to see if it's possible to get him sectioned!

Oh, and he asked for a Sub-Machinegun as well. Oh, sorry "Ess Em Gee". He clearly doesn't know anything about guns then, because I'm fairly certain that any form of automatic weapon is illegal for civilian possession. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.

 

[tur2n]

Weak article, especially the last part. Columbine would've happend with or without guns or games? I think so, too. But I doubt they would've killed as many people with just improvised explosives and a few knives.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the number of people killed in the U.S. by firearms in the year 2005 was 31,000, but the number of people killed in traffic accidents was 43,150, making driving in the U.S. almost 40 percent more dangerous than guns - a fact you don't hear a lot of talk about on Capitol Hill.

This doesn't make any sense at all. How many people own cars compared to how many people own guns? What would be price of outlawing cars compared to outlawing guns?
The whole populace would lose their means of transportation as opposed to gun enthusiasts would lose their favorite past time.

While it's true that starting in 2008, in response to fears of new gun legislation, firearms sales increased by an unprecedented 14 percent, the FBI's violent crime statistics show that in the same year, murder rates dropped five percent to the lowest they've been in 43 years. In the same year, videogame sales increased by 19 percent, and one of the top-sellers that year was also one of the most violent, Grand Theft Auto IV.

One year marks one hell of a trend.
And let's see which games and which console was responsible for that solid groth in videogame sales: (According to NPD

# Wii Play 5.28 million
# Mario Kart Wii 5.00 million
# Wii Fit 4.53 million
# Super Smash Bros. Brawl 4.17 million
# Grand Theft Auto IV 3.29 million*

Maybe murder rates dropped because all the potential murderers were busy playing Wii.

Seriously, don't make shit up just to prove a point.

 

[RabidusUnus]

I.. I think I love you, Russ.

I've fire many guns in my lifetime. I'm quite sure that to any of you who haven't met me, I fit the definition of "redneck" perfectly. Firearms =/= Toys. There is no situation I can think of, where it is even BARELY acceptable to treat a firearm like anything other than a deadly weapon.

Also, about what KungFuMaster said above, he's absolutely right. No matter how much any of the European or anti-gun members want to stick to their stereotypes, there is no gun shop in the U.S that lets you walk in with money, and walk out with a gun, hassle free. None. Zero.

 

[MurderousToaster]

I live in the UK, so guns are technically illegal here. An interesting article, nonetheless.


Also, spelling error on page two:

"I spend a fair amount of time playing causal games on my iPod Touch," says Steve.

 

[Steve the Pocket]

Looking at statistics related to firearm-related deaths in the United States paints an even more interesting picture. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the number of people killed in the U.S. by firearms in the year 2005 was 31,000, but the number of people killed in traffic accidents was 43,150, making driving in the U.S. almost 40 percent more dangerous than guns - a fact you don't hear a lot of talk about on Capitol Hill.

Well, are would-be gun owners in the U.S. required to go through as much training and testing as you have to go through to get a driver's license? Written tests, so many hours of training (including marksmanship, because even if you're shooting an intruder in self-defense, you don't want that bullet ending up in the wrong person!), etc.? Because it seems pretty obvious that they ought to be.

Also, spelling error on page two:

"I spend a fair amount of time playing causal games on my iPod Touch," says Steve.

Heh, Freudian slip?