253: Pardon My French

[habslove]

Same thing for me...along with films and books. I remember when I started reading the Harry Potter books in English and my mother went out and bought me the French version. I read the first page and put it down. I think everything is better in it's original language.

 

[Snor]

oooh yes the localised games horror (fuck you ubisoft! every single damn game i have bought from you in the pasts years has been localised!)
being dutch myself translating anything from english to dutch sounds much muuuuch more childish. mainly because they tend to use excessive amounts of diminutives.

Games are what thaught me english (movies and tv a little to. this has/will open up new opportunities for me. but localisation is a very bad thing that has been gaining ground here (cartoons are mostly dutch now instead of subtitled)

 

[lomylithruldor]

And have you ever heard Minsc (from Baldur's Gate for you young whippersnappers) yell out his battle cry in French? I'm still trying to erase that from my memory.

Les yeux Boo, IL FAUT VISER LES YEUX! YARRRRRRG!

Minsc is such a cool character that i could forgive him.

 

[Bobipine]

Interesting, almost the same story for me, except it was with Banjo-Kazooie (the real one) and not FF, since I never understood what I was supposed to do in any RPGs, even believed someone who told me he entered a cheat code to get to the last boss of Super Mario RPG, and then seeing Bowser. I did had a few English classes before playing Banjo-Kazooie, and I needed them, that quiz at the end of the game? yeah, especially those where you needed to talk to Grunty's sister along the game. Anyhow, video games pretty much taught me English, though I still have a rather strong accent compared to what I'd like, and every game translated in French feels...odd, so when it comes to gaming, I usually set everything in English just as a matter of precaution toward unwanted translations. (I'm a French Canadian also, but not from Québec)

 

[Monogamie]

'no francophone could ever publicly admit to hating French'

I would disagree. I come from the same region as the author (jonquière) and french has set me back tremendously. the anecdote of the author translating final fantasy word-for-word is cute, but all it illustrates is typical 'english envy', which the author probably still suffers from today. it's certainly bleeding all over this article, which I disliked (too naive).

though the issue the author brings up is legit (translated games are awful! 'duh'), but then again so are movies, cartoons, etc, translated in french. 'l'enfant sacré du tibet' (golden child, with eddie murphy) is, in fact, I find, much better translated in french then the original version. the loose, so-terrible-it's-good dub adds a touch of ghetto to the experience that makes it quite different, more fun.

so yes, games translated in french = evil. halo 3 in french is spectacularly bad, which is even more hilarious/paradoxical/puzzling considering the presentation tries to suck you in with massive epic music and dramatic moments and such, but then the translation just vomits all over that. the point is: it's very, very hard to make anything sound decent in french.

I am for games being available in whatever language you feel like playing them in. as far as quebec goes, I am not so much against 'bad' translations as I am against games being available primarily in french, forcing you to make the 'extra step' if you want the original, 'real' english version. but I have the same issue with movies, and I could also go on a big rant about literature.

I remember my sister purchasing 'surf's up', the game based on the movie, for X360. it boots directly in french, and she plays the game with her kids. there's nothing wrong with that. I think that makes perfect sense.

 

[Chaya]

I know exactly what you mean. Okay, maybe not exactly but almost. I acquired my English skills mainly from videogames and the TV. Thankfully even now there hasn't been a single localization of a game. Maybe the cover and manual but the game itself remains unchanged and I'm thankful. It's just a matter of comparing any show or cartoon that was dubbed into my language. It completely and utterly sucked, it just didn't seem right. Everything sounded silly and over the top, but the same thing in English was completely normal. I even watched some shows in German and they sounded normal even though they were also dubbed. But when those already dubbed shows made it here and got translated it sounded strange.

There's just something different when you're watching or playing something and it is not in your language. This however may be difficult to understand by the native English speakers. But, we'll never know how the other side sees it. Not fully.

 

[GrandmaFunk]

I have to agree with dubbed kids shows NOW, but they used to be good. I remember watching Les Mystérieuses Cités d'Or, back in the day, and boy, was it ever good.

to be fair, Les Mystérieuses Cités d'Or was a French/Japanese collaboration and was actually written first in french and then translated to japanese. =)

 

[PPB]

I hear you! I leart English from playing Warcraft 2 and watching Transformers =) I'm from Montreal though and live in an anglophone neighbourhood so it was easier for me.

And have you ever heard Minsc (from Baldur's Gate for you young whippersnappers) yell out his battle cry in French? I'm still trying to erase that from my memory.

Les yeux Boo, IL FAUT VISER LES YEUX! YARRRRRRG!

Minsc is such a cool character that i could forgive him.

I can also forgive Minsc, but I can't forgive Aerie. Everyone on forums were saying that she was whiny and annoying, and I agreed with them. Then one day I finally found an English copy of BG2 (I still can't believe I bought it in french the first time) and I was stunned to hear her "real" voice. The French VO is a hundred times worse than the English one. So if you thought she sounded annoying in the English version, tell yourself that others had it much worse.

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

...there would be more Anglos or at least bilingual people in Quebec if many francophones were not so overtly hostile to visiting Anglophones....

Sadly, the opposite is just as true. Walk around Calgary talking french and see what kind of welcome it gets you.

Depends on the Calgarian you run into, we aren't ALL backwards hicks who despise our eastern brethren. Political Divisions should never extend to interpersonal relationships beyond the occasional heated discussion.

 

[ShadowKirby]

Oh, and French localizations in Québec are so bad. I started playing Assassin's Creed 2 yesterday, and I slapped my head by how bad the French is, even if the game was done in Québec. Same with NHL 2010, as said in the article, Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2, etc. I guess that's the price to pay since France has more French speakers than Canada :/

And the worst is, there is less and less way to get around it. There is more and more unilangual French version of the games on the shelves of Québec. Back when I bought Mass Effect, I could only find the French only version (the good thing is, Wrex voice in french is better than in english imo). Same thing when I rented Halo 3 or MW2. Hell, I searched high and low through Gamestops and Futureshops between University of Montreal and my hometown of Lavaltrie in Lanaudière only to find and english version of Pokémon Soul Silver. I ended up finding it in a Wal-Mart in Joliette and felt dirty for buying a game there.

I wish they would give us the choice.

 

[Pontus Hashis]

I cant stand localization... I even hink i english nowdays....

 

[CharlesA]

There's something else that had to be said: whenever a game is translated, it mostly shows just how incredibly juvenile the actual writing is. I remember playing mostly in english through my youth (Oh, Chrono Trigger!) and always getting this feeling of seriousness, the simple fact that it was in another language meant that I did not have the same level of sensitivity to bad writing. It's only when I got to the age of about fifteen that I understood how incredibly dumb some games were (jrpgs), and this does not only apply to games, but to most mediums: Tv, novels, comics, music.

I remember listening a while ago to all the shit I used to listen to growing in the late nineties: Korn, Limp Bizkit, Green Day (pre-emo) and such, what actually hit me was how profoundly stupid the lyrics were, and I wondered why I did not realize that sooner. Only, I think as a child the fact that I experienced games, music and novels that were not only epic or energizing, but also mysteriously foreign gave them an additional value that I now can't have back, it probably is one of the things that got me in litterary studies. I remember trying very hard in my youth to listen to local french bands and absolutelly hating it. Why? Because even if said bands had about the same lyrical talent as any english bands, I could hear every single tiny weakness, immaturity or plain errors in the voice of the signer, whereas I could listen to Blink 182 for hours without actually understanding what the signer sang.

However it actually bit me in the ass when I went through Mass Effect 2, which is supposed to have «stellar» writing: in one scene in particular, the courtship with that Asnari daughter whose name I can't remember, I perfectly understood everything that was said, and I understood just how adolescent (the thirteen years-old boy who draws naked barbarian chicks type of adolescent) it all was. Not that writing for a target audience is necessarly a bad thing, it's just that I finally understood what most old-ish game critics have been saying for a few years now: it is time for the medium to grow up.

Bref, these days I try to get every game I can in english to keep this volontary dellusion that the game is actually more intelligent than it pretends to be, only it is not working so well anymore.

 

[lomylithruldor]

Oh, and French localizations in Québec are so bad. I started playing Assassin's Creed 2 yesterday, and I slapped my head by how bad the French is, even if the game was done in Québec. Same with NHL 2010, as said in the article, Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2, etc. I guess that's the price to pay since France has more French speakers than Canada :/

And the worst is, there is less and less way to get around it. There is more and more unilangual French version of the games on the shelves of Québec. Back when I bought Mass Effect, I could only find the French only version (the good thing is, Wrex voice in french is better than in english imo). Same thing when I rented Halo 3 or MW2. Hell, I searched high and low through Gamestops and Futureshops between University of Montreal and my hometown of Lavaltrie in Lanaudière only to find and english version of Pokémon Soul Silver. I ended up finding it in a Wal-Mart in Joliette and felt dirty for buying a game there.

I wish they would give us the choice.

Well, nobody I know wants the french version of games, except those who can't understand english. We're all used to play in english. The worst is buying the french version of WoW because you end up on the euro servers (more lag and nobody's on at the same time as you). At least there's french-canadian guilds on all MMO I tried.

 

[ramox]

This reads a lot like my own story.
When i was about 12 satelite and cable TV became popular and i got my first Commodore 64. Back then no games at all were localized and all the flashy tv programs i could watch (early 90s MTV for example, when it still was about music) were in english. Living in a german speaking country meant (and still means) you get anything localised. To a massive extent. Much later i learned that what i was used to (getting anything not only translated, but even dubbed) is by far not common in other languages.
However, since all this stuff was new and there was no real market for it yet, for a while the only way to enjoy videogames was learning english. Which i did.
Now, much later, you'll have a hard time finding media which is not at the very least subbed (if not dubbed), be it games, movies, anime, manga, you name it.
And just like the author i am deeply disapointed by those localisations. Even anime shows i watch in japanese with english subtitles even when i have the option to watch it dubbed in my own language. It is like Remi said, it just sounds and feels wrong.

 

[Landslide]

Dubbed movies are pretty bad too. My wife and I watch French movies every now at then. A couple years ago we watched Banlieu-13, and I translated (generally) for her during the movie. It was fun, silly and action packed. We recently watched B-13: Ultimatum (sequel) and it was dubbed in English. It was almost painful to watch. We also watched Angel-A (dubbed and undubbed) and had the same experience.

 

[HellBrendy]

All my english has been learned from watching Transformers and other cartoons/shows/movies as a kid, then picking up videogames mid-90's.
My native tongue is norwegian.

 

[Pierre-Luc Savard]

Hey bro see what you've done?

Yeah yeah i know... You'll all say (hey look who's there!) Well yeah i'm Rémi's bro... The weak minded Quebecois who can't even play NHL 10 in english! The complete issue was true though... He teach me almost everything in english, How to speack and read but writting was on my own as you see. Yeah i still play video game in french but i prefer to listen in english cause when i read the french version bellow it sucks. So thank you Rémi de m'avoir teaché l'english sti!

Le gars dans l'fon du fjord P-L

 

[leifa]

Very interesting article indeed.

And I think I may have the answer to the dilemma.

Not that it came from myself, but from my son.

His theory, and what I?ve come to realize, is that French is just not ?cool?.
What I mean by that is that it is impossible to make any character, or situation, feel cool in French. The language simply does not lend itself to it.

French is a great language for ?emotions?, which is why it is so wonderful in the hands of Victor Hugo and his ?Les Misérables?.
No matter how many tried translating the depth of the human condition of the wretched in English ? and Charles Dickens did a pretty wonderful job of it ?, the feeling, when you read both works in their original tongue, is just not the same. One makes you sad, and the other grips you inside and ?almost? makes you cry.

The English language, however, totally owns the ?cool? factor.
?Silent, dog! Your only purpose is to die by my hand!? ? Irenicus, BG2, SoA
I mean, no matter how you try to turn that phrase in French, you?ll just end up either crying or laughing your head off. It can?t be done. Period.

So trying to translate an entire game ? or movie, for that matter ? in French is madness. At best, you?ll never accomplish anything else than to make French people understand what it is that they are doing, and permit them to follow the story.
But the cool factor, (the magic which grabs us and pushes us to move ever forward) is destroyed in translation.

That?s just the way the cookie crumbles?

Which is why, IMHO, it is imperative for French Canadian speaking parents to learn, if need be, and teach their children the English language from birth. To not do so is to deprive their offspring of such richness that it should be made mandatory by law.

In fact, were I to continue, I?d say that they should all be adored, well fed, given a good computer, all the games they want, and time to know just what they want to do with their lives, but I digress? My apologies, just being a bit of a Chaotic/Good mumzie here, can?t help it? 

 

[Amsus]

A very representative story to be sure. Learning English through playing video games is actually a pretty common story it seems to me. To me personally video games served as a provider of ambition. They pushed me from cold comfort with my adequate English to expand my vocabulary. I remember Bastila from KOTOR telling me something about the force and then franticly looking through my parents books to find a learners dictionary because she used some fancy word. And a couple years later after getting my hands on Torment looking up what the devil entropy could be.

But i know from other people as well as this story that gaming might have an even more profound influence on your abilities in English. Back here in my native Denmark I have witnessed several of my friends who didn't give rat's ass about school being A students in English because three hours a day on Diablo 2 battle.net had taught them what a pole-arm was. The medium of gaming had motivated them to learn the language because they needed to convince some Australian dude to give up an el rune.

This leads me to my point that gaming, just like it is portrayed in this article, can be a powerful motivational tool to get kids involved in their education. I think this article beautifully displays how powerful a tool this can be. Getting a small child to translate endless text boxes from final fantasy is no small feat. I think this is a grossly under utilized opportunity. It need not even be English video games can teach, a game like Deus Ex (go on, reinstall it already) might teach kids about the need for free speech and the dangers of totalitarian government, RTS games can teach kids about world war 2 if done correctly and a game like Torment can teach children about literature, philosophy and tools for characterization within literature. the possibilities are endless one only needs the right games and a teacher willing to use them in the teaching process. Of course they can't replaced normal teaching, but like films video games can be a powerful and relevant tool in teaching almost any subject.

 

[Orbert]

Uh, I haven't read past the first few paragraphs of the article yet, but... North America's only fjord? Is BC not in North America? Because basically the whole coast of BC is nothing but fjords. I think those fjords also continue down into Washington and up into Alaska. So yeah, don't be too proud of the fact that Saguenay is North America's only fjord Maybe eastern North America.

I read the rest of the article and I have to say, I was in French immersion and I always found it better to watch actual French movies in French (which hardly ever happened) rather than watching an English movie with French dubs. God, I must have seen Home Alone dubbed in French like three times just in school.