The Counterpoint
- Thread starter The Wooster
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Actually, it's an excellent counterpoint. The entire implied premise of the original assertion (Women are depicted badly in media) is that a gender disparity exists. Pointing out that it also happens to male characters disproves the inequality along gender lines, at which point the only available argument is "well, it's bad that humans of both genders are depicted unrealistically" which is a banal and asinine assertion, because, well, fat ugly and stupid people of both genders don't entice audiences.
There's a reason the movie "Hackers" starred Angelina Jolie and Johnny Lee Miller, and not two eczema-riddled overweight basement dwellers. The reason why DOA girls are all jiggly, wasp-waisted waifs is the same reason why Kratos is 7 feet of steel-reinforced steroid.
There's a reason the movie "Hackers" starred Angelina Jolie and Johnny Lee Miller, and not two eczema-riddled overweight basement dwellers. The reason why DOA girls are all jiggly, wasp-waisted waifs is the same reason why Kratos is 7 feet of steel-reinforced steroid.
This is my stance as well. People don't do it to say that it's okay, they do it because the vast majority of the time people talk about how women are misrepresented in the media, they do so with the opinion that it is down to gender inequality, and that it is sexist.Gasbandit said:
If both genders are misrepresented then yes, it sucks, but it isn't down to sexism or discrimination, so the argument is invalid. If people want to complain about poor portrayals in the media, then they need to do so without trying to play some sort of "victim" card. That's what people take issue with, not the idea that there are poor portrayals.
Let's take South Park for instance. It was once used as an example of people being discriminated against (Jews for example), but it makes fun of everyone and everything. It doesn't choose one group to make fun of and leave others alone, so you can't complain that your particular group is being "picked on", because it isn't.
Not to mention that comparing a woman being physically hurt (objectively bad) to women not liking large breasted fictional characters (subjectively bad) is a poor example. Obviously it was done for comedic value, but it helps when it works with the message you are trying to make, rather than against it.
Let's not kid ourselves; the community would real the hell out of "Zombie Tintin", but I can imagine there would copyright issues.
No, actually, it really isn't.Gasbandit said:
The DOA chicks look like that because that's what guys (at least, the guys who play those games) want to look at.
Kratos is the way he is because that's what guys want to look like, and therefor play as.
Krantos said:Grey and Cory are baiting the forums again?
Anyone have popcorn?
Sure men may be objectified, but they're objectified for men. The main objection that feminists have isn't about objectification itself, but that it caters primarily to men.Fappy said:
I wonder who all those guys are that want to look like Kratos. His physique is utterly ridiculous. Then again, I can't stand God of War so perhaps I'm just not in the right demographic to judge such things...Zhukov said:
If they are catering to men, they are doing a poor job at it. I don't think a lot of people want to be Kratos, his life isn't exactly a happy one, and I don't think the majority of people in this world desire nothing more than to look like a living boulder (just to name GOW, as it was named in a few posts above).
I think this debate has been raised a lot of times, but maybe I missed a similar question and the answers to it, so I am going to put this one here:
What would be considered a good heroine? Let's say we put a woman in Kratos's situation, what should she do to be considered a good character (for the look, I think anything would be fine, let's say something not needlessly skimpy, and probably a fit body, but nothing too oversexualized)? If she did exactly the same things as Kratos, would that make everyone happy?
I think this debate has been raised a lot of times, but maybe I missed a similar question and the answers to it, so I am going to put this one here:
What would be considered a good heroine? Let's say we put a woman in Kratos's situation, what should she do to be considered a good character (for the look, I think anything would be fine, let's say something not needlessly skimpy, and probably a fit body, but nothing too oversexualized)? If she did exactly the same things as Kratos, would that make everyone happy?
Because Women have different interests and it's impossible for women and men to share a common opinion of "This guy looks good."Rainboq said:
Implying that anything is "Catered" towards any gender implies that the genders themselves want different things.
Which again implies divide. Which there isn't really.
Individual tastes notwithstanding, I'm sure there are more guys who want to be Kratos than there are girls who want to fuck Kratos.Scars Unseen said:
As I said in another gender inequalities thread, using the Kratos example has always puzzled me. The man is (especially by the end of God of War 3) an irredeemable, murdering bastard, who slaughters is own wife and child and then destroys the entire world in pursuit of his own personal revenge. Yeah, I'm sure those are the exact qualities a woman looks for in a man, and that's without even going into his physical appearance.
Now, characters that are more along the lines of 'lovable rogue'; cheeky, confident, and ever so slightly dangerous to know. The sort of person that's more than capable of doing harm, but it's ok because what they do is for a higher purpose and goddamn, they just look so sexy while they're doing it (Ezio Auditore springs to mind here, although I'm a guy so make of that what you will)... now they would probably be a better example of 'The Guy Version of the DOA Chicks'. Although, it's still not an accurate analogue, as people actually put enough thought into Ezio to actually give him a character, which is more than any of the DOA girls have, who are basically just sex dolls that we can't actually touch.
When women buy games in the same numbers as men do, then things will change. The issue will not be addressed until there is money in it for the industry to do so. Its about catering to the audience that spends more, right now, that's men. Sorry ladies.
Of course one can argue that its because of this misrepresentation that women don't buy games in the same numbers as men, and that the cycle is a vicious circular reference.
Of course one can argue that its because of this misrepresentation that women don't buy games in the same numbers as men, and that the cycle is a vicious circular reference.