A DRM

[lacktheknack]

Without a save-game, the players will only be able to access the first three levels of War, and a multiplayer demo on one map. Players will also not be able to download or use patches, DLC or any other official content.

The easy-to-crack ***** in the armor. Once some smart-ass pirate fixes that little detail, the DRM just becomes an obsolete nuisance again.

And it would happen within a day. Games for Windows already works like this.

 

[siNwrath]

Obviously, some form of DRM has to be used - to suggest otherwise is insanity.

It has been asked before, but WHY? Why must we live in a world where people are considered guilty until proven innocent?

Companies like Valve or Blizzard should not be any where near or any kind of feasible let alone successful if piracy was just that rampant. Its not just big companies either, Frictional Games for example, is doing really well for its relatively niche games.

If you remember, Sins of a Solar Empire was a stunning success for what it was, and it had NO DRM, not even a CD-Key. I did not buy it because I wasn't interested in it. This is an article about piracy from one the guys from Stardock: http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/post.aspx?postid=303512

EDIT: Largely it seems DRM just attracts or encourages piracy, look at Spore (pirated in protest), and Ubisoft's bs, and its only ever a matter of time before any kind of DRM is cracked. Its not new either, people demanded nocd cracks for games so they didn't have to fumble with the CD as well as for piracy, and now people demand cracks for Ubi's DRM so they can play their game, that they OWN. Besides services like Steam and Battle.net 2.0 innately work as DRM. (and Steam offers an offline mode!)

 

[SimuLord]

Heres a solution: Move PC gaming to bluray, games at least 400gb.

Once CDs hit, the average game size greatly exceeded the average internet connection's ability to move it. The pirate's solution were 'rips.' Games with all the movies removed, the sound files reduced to absurdly low bitrates and/or compressed with retarded schemes that took hours upon hours to decompress. But were still fucking huge, compared to the average connection. In this period, piracy was dead. The only people who could even hope to pirate any game had to work in IT as the administrator.

So, yea, content, content, content. The longer it takes to download, the less people will want to expose themselves on public trackers. The more content you force the pirates to remove/compress/downsample/re-encode to make distribution viable, the better the retail version becomes.

And hell, putting bluray games on a platform capable of doing something of actual fucking worth with the format would be a huge step forward.

One problem. Computers wouldn't be able to fit that. So, no. Here's the perfect way: USE STEAM! In fact, there should be a law: All PC games must be sold through Steam. Fixed and done.

While I wouldn't go so far as saying "there oughtta be a law", I will echo the sentiment that "what do you need esoteric DRM for when Steamworks offers a customer-friendly platform with anti-piracy measures built right in?

Who's hiring these PC-gamer bashers? Are Ubisoft and EA employees getting Escapist accounts?

 

[Paragon Fury]

Since I've yet to see pirates cast out as phariahs and the general pulic attunted the attitude of their actions being unacceptable, yes, the stereotype fits. Silence implies and means condonement. The stereotype sticks because it works - just ask most developers that make PC games if PC gamers have shown themselves to be a truly trustworthy bunch. We know what Ubisoft's and EA's answers will be at least.

Of course, by remaining in PC gaming, they are also indirectly condoning the apparent behaviour of PC Gamers. If PC Gamers and developing/publishing PC games are such tribulations then why are they still trying? That's Enabling behaviour.

Quitting is admitting defeat. That pirates finally beat them, and that they give up on trying to establish any sort of orders. Its a Catch-22. Stopping doing business with a crowd that continues to snub you is the logical thing to do, but if they do they will give the very people they are fighting against a solid platform to stand on.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

And even they do crack it, it meant as a deterrent and stigma measure, not as a stop. For all that work, they could've just paid, enjoyed the game and gotten on with it.

Most of the crackers I've ever met crack games for the challenge and 'scene cred'. Hell, hardly any of them actually played games - cracking was their game, so to speak.

 

[lacktheknack]

It wouldn't be so much a "crack" as a "Have to construct the ability to save the game from scratch". Without the download, the game wouldn't even know what a save is, much less have anything to crack. Even if you bypassed the check for the levels, you'd still be unable to save the game or use the MP.

And even they do crack it, it meant as a deterrent and stigma measure, not as a stop. For all that work, they could've just paid, enjoyed the game and gotten on with it.

Could have, yes. But they didn't/wouldn't. Again, Games for Windows works a bit like this, and my friend (a pirate) cracked it himself.

Besides, you don't need an explicit save feature, all you need is a save state.

 

[lacktheknack]

Since I've yet to see pirates cast out as phariahs and the general pulic attunted the attitude of their actions being unacceptable, yes, the stereotype fits. Silence implies and means condonement. The stereotype sticks because it works - just ask most developers that make PC games if PC gamers have shown themselves to be a truly trustworthy bunch. We know what Ubisoft's and EA's answers will be at least.

Of course, by remaining in PC gaming, they are also indirectly condoning the apparent behaviour of PC Gamers. If PC Gamers and developing/publishing PC games are such tribulations then why are they still trying? That's Enabling behaviour.

Quitting is admitting defeat. That pirates finally beat them, and that they give up on trying to establish any sort of orders. Its a Catch-22. Stopping doing business with a crowd that continues to snub you is the logical thing to do, but if they do they will give the very people they are fighting against a solid platform to stand on.

A solid platform of having nothing more to pirate. Very solid indeed.

 

[Altorin]

It wouldn't be so much a "crack" as a "Have to construct the ability to save the game from scratch". Without the download, the game wouldn't even know what a save is, much less have anything to crack. Even if you bypassed the check for the levels, you'd still be unable to save the game or use the MP.

And even they do crack it, it meant as a deterrent and stigma measure, not as a stop. For all that work, they could've just paid, enjoyed the game and gotten on with it.

no you wouldn't. you download the ability to save from the company.

you wouldn't have to crack the game.. you'd have the infinitely easier task of cracking the save dongle..

and the regular pirate wouldn't have to worry about it at all.. they just go to a torrent site, download the cracked version (and trust me, cracking a small bit of code that enable the save function would easily be cracked) and that's that.

and the people who WOULD have to deal with it, the actual crackers, see uncracked games as puzzles. They get to solve the puzzle, provide a service to their community, and be seen as something of a god for cracking the uncrackable DRM. It's Win-Win for them.

The ONLY people obtrusive DRM (and I do mean ONLY, as in NO ONE ELSE) harms, are the people who pay money for the game. Pirates get a game with the DRM castrated out of it, doesn't bother them no matter how obtrusive the DRM was before it was castrated.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

And besides, some times games deserve to be pirated to punish the devs for one reason or another.

Nah, to punish you just don't buy it and publicly ridicule the developer. You pirate it and any criticisms you have can simply be written off as a coating of bullshit wrapped around self-entitlement.

 

[CNKFan]

I have an idea. How about a code that is like 30 characters long and is one use only as a whole. The game can be installed and uninstalled on a ulimited amount of machines after that but you need the last four characters of the code in order to activate it. What do all of you PC users think of my idea?

 

[lacktheknack]

I have an idea. How about a code that is like 30 characters long and is one use only as a whole. The game can be installed and uninstalled on a ulimited amount of machines after that but you need the last four characters of the code in order to activate it. What do all of you PC users think of my idea?

Key generators. They already use this system in some games (for example, all of Spiderweb Software's games), and it's already cracked.

DRM is just useless, at the end of it. I like games like Sins of a Solar Empire who just bypass it entirely, leaving me no headaches when I BUY them.

 

[Paragon Fury]

Heres a solution: Move PC gaming to bluray, games at least 400gb.

Once CDs hit, the average game size greatly exceeded the average internet connection's ability to move it. The pirate's solution were 'rips.' Games with all the movies removed, the sound files reduced to absurdly low bitrates and/or compressed with retarded schemes that took hours upon hours to decompress. But were still fucking huge, compared to the average connection. In this period, piracy was dead. The only people who could even hope to pirate any game had to work in IT as the administrator.

So, yea, content, content, content. The longer it takes to download, the less people will want to expose themselves on public trackers. The more content you force the pirates to remove/compress/downsample/re-encode to make distribution viable, the better the retail version becomes.

And hell, putting bluray games on a platform capable of doing something of actual fucking worth with the format would be a huge step forward.

One problem. Computers wouldn't be able to fit that. So, no. Here's the perfect way: USE STEAM! In fact, there should be a law: All PC games must be sold through Steam. Fixed and done.

While I wouldn't go so far as saying "there oughtta be a law", I will echo the sentiment that "what do you need esoteric DRM for when Steamworks offers a customer-friendly platform with anti-piracy measures built right in?

Who's hiring these PC-gamer bashers? Are Ubisoft and EA employees getting Escapist accounts?

No one. Maybe we're just tired of the "WAAAAAAAHHHHH UBISOFT/EA/ACTIVISION/GOD IS MEAN BECAUSE THEY WANT TO PROTECT THEIR WORK WAAAAAAAHHHHHH!" *NerdRAGE* crap that not only do we have to listen to, but have to deal with the affects of later. Most of us don't actually hate PC gamers - its just that this issue keeps recurring, and its stupid and annoying and is rather irksome, which leads us to be angry at the instigators, the rest of PC gaming community.

The only reason Sins remotely worked is because you needed to register your legitmate copy of the game to get updates, patches and expansions to work. If it hadn't need that, Ironclad and Stardock probably wouldn't have even made a 1/4th of their money back.

 

[Altorin]

one time online activations, and online multiplayer communities are the best DRM.. I wonder what the piracy levels on Starcraft 2 will be when you need a battle.net account with a legit starcraft 2 tied to it to play multiplayer.. no IPX, no TCP/IP.. just Battlenet.

Blizzard's new Battle.net is the way to go (although some people don't like it, but ehh, you can't please everyone), but again, it only works with a firmly established developer/publisher.. Valve could do it (and basically does with their games), Blizzard does it... because if blizzard were to go belly up, the games would be useless

I just hope that battle.net has annual ladders and removes anyone who hacks up their score

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

that they give up on trying to establish any sort of orders.

Who the bloody hell asked them to establish order?

If their attitude is that PC gamers are nothing but anarchic scum then they either;

- stop doing business with them
- accept it as the way shit is
- keep playing The Adventures of Don Quixote in Holland

So far they've taken the last option and it doesn't seem to have had much effect except for virtual shitsmearing.

 

[Snotnarok]

All the DRM shit out there is bullshit. Most of it isn't about targeting pirates, it's about getting MORE money from people who've paid. You think 5 install limits hinders a person pirating a game? No it harms the customer, because it's not JUST installs it's hardware changes, a new CD drive, a new vid card, more ram, ALL COUNTS as an install. How do I know? Farcry 2, I played 3 hours of it and I lost it because I was trying to get my hardware working right. What does this DRM do to pirates? Nothing they just remove it and play the game without a problem.

I understand protecting your game but FUCK you if you're going to take it out on the people who CHOSE to support your game. Because it IS a choice, I can pirate your game easily but I CHOSE to buy it to support your game, because I want you to make more games. I dislike pirating, I like paying for the game because I want them to know that people enjoy it and we want more. Pirating just isn't fun to me, plus I don't get that nice case on my shelf.

[/rant]

 

[SniperWolf427]

Honestly, due to my past experience with pirating, I feel as if we're coasting in the same spot we've always been in. Pirates pirate games, game studios sell games, they hate each other forever and ever and ever [sub]and ever and ever....[/sub]

I originally discovered several game series' through piracy, all of which I now purchase upon a new release in the franchise. I'm not saying that I can atone for downloading software, I'm simply saying that for many people like me (i.e. broke highschool students), piracy has shown me what is worth my money, and what isn't.

The point I'm getting at is... It's a stalemate. An unwinnable argument. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation for devs. Nothing will ever change this. Let's just accept that piracy exists and that it will always exist. Free shit is free shit.

The closest thing to a solution is making your game fucking massive so people don't feel like wasting the bandwidth.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

The only reason Sins remotely worked is because you needed to register your legitmate copy of the game to get updates, patches and expansions to work. If it hadn't need that, Ironclad and Stardock probably wouldn't have even made a 1/4th of their money back.

Updates, patches and expansions for Sins have all been cracked.

Stardock remain viable because they get big love from the anti-DRM-as-a-principle crowd.

 

[Paragon Fury]

No one. Maybe we're just tired of the "WAAAAAAAHHHHH UBISOFT/EA/ACTIVISION/GOD IS MEAN BECAUSE THEY WANT TO PROTECT THEIR WORK WAAAAAAAHHHHHH!" *NerdRAGE* crap that not only do we have to listen to, but have to deal with the affects of later. Most of us don't actually hate PC gamers - its just that this issue keeps recurring, and its stupid and annoying and is rather irksome, which leads us to be angry at the instigators, the rest of PC gaming community.

The only reason Sins remotely worked is because you needed to register your legitmate copy of the game to get updates, patches and expansions to work. If it hadn't need that, Ironclad and Stardock probably wouldn't have even made a 1/4th of their money back.

And you base that on... what? Oh right, absolutely nothing. You're spewing nothing but idle conjecture based in a near complete lack of understanding of the ideas you're attempting to discuss.

Punishing your customers is bad business. Further rewarding (as according to publisher logic, they're paid the retail price for downloading it) people who don't buy your product is worse business.

Base what on what? DRM is a reaction, not a pre-emption (grammar?). How far do you think DRM wouldn've gotten if the PC community had had a little more integrity early on and said "No, piracy is wrong. We might not agree with your DRM idea, but we're not going to steal, or support or harbor those who do just because we feel slighted."?

DRM does not "punish" anyone. Anyone with a basic understanding of copyrights, IPs and law knows this. A game is the developer's/publisher's product to the end - regardless if you give them $40 or $60 or $100 or $1000. You are getting the privilege to use the item until you break the rules or abuse it, or until it is no longer functional. Your sense of entitlement means nothing in the face of the rules.

Ubisoft's "Always On" DRM does not punish anyone. They have decided that they want to be able to watch those using their products as best as possible, and thus have implemented a way to do so, as is their legal right. No legitimate customer is hurt in the process. If you do not agree, have the moral forititude to do without, rather than playing victum or stealing.

 

[SimuLord]

Heres a solution: Move PC gaming to bluray, games at least 400gb.

Once CDs hit, the average game size greatly exceeded the average internet connection's ability to move it. The pirate's solution were 'rips.' Games with all the movies removed, the sound files reduced to absurdly low bitrates and/or compressed with retarded schemes that took hours upon hours to decompress. But were still fucking huge, compared to the average connection. In this period, piracy was dead. The only people who could even hope to pirate any game had to work in IT as the administrator.

So, yea, content, content, content. The longer it takes to download, the less people will want to expose themselves on public trackers. The more content you force the pirates to remove/compress/downsample/re-encode to make distribution viable, the better the retail version becomes.

And hell, putting bluray games on a platform capable of doing something of actual fucking worth with the format would be a huge step forward.

One problem. Computers wouldn't be able to fit that. So, no. Here's the perfect way: USE STEAM! In fact, there should be a law: All PC games must be sold through Steam. Fixed and done.

While I wouldn't go so far as saying "there oughtta be a law", I will echo the sentiment that "what do you need esoteric DRM for when Steamworks offers a customer-friendly platform with anti-piracy measures built right in?

Who's hiring these PC-gamer bashers? Are Ubisoft and EA employees getting Escapist accounts?

No one. Maybe we're just tired of the "WAAAAAAAHHHHH UBISOFT/EA/ACTIVISION/GOD IS MEAN BECAUSE THEY WANT TO PROTECT THEIR WORK WAAAAAAAHHHHHH!" *NerdRAGE* crap that not only do we have to listen to, but have to deal with the affects of later. Most of us don't actually hate PC gamers - its just that this issue keeps recurring, and its stupid and annoying and is rather irksome, which leads us to be angry at the instigators, the rest of PC gaming community.

The only reason Sins remotely worked is because you needed to register your legitmate copy of the game to get updates, patches and expansions to work. If it hadn't need that, Ironclad and Stardock probably wouldn't have even made a 1/4th of their money back.

NerdRAGE? That's the best you've got for a system wherein pirates are rewarded for cracking and distributing games while legitimate customers pay for the privilege of being fucked up the ass with a broomstick?

As for Sins, registering the game got you access to Stardock's dev forums, which meant first dibs on the patches and other content, but that stuff wasn't DRM-protected. It was more along the lines of "want access to the people who made this game? Want your input to be heard and your good ideas implemented in future products? Then buy the game for real and register it."

Paradox does the same thing. There's a damn good reason both companies have sales figures far in excess of what you'd expect from companies their size.

Since nobody's posted it in a while, I suggest you read this, because it comes from someone who, unlike you, actually knows what he's talking about:
http://draginol.joeuser.com/article/303512/Piracy_PC_Gaming

And, because so many people "tl;dr" anything longer than a Twitter post, the relevant portion:

"The reason why we don't put CD copy protection on our games isn't because we're nice guys. We do it because the people who actually buy games don't like to mess with it. Our customers make the rules, not the pirates. Pirates don't count. We know our customers could pirate our games if they want but choose to support our efforts. So we return the favor - we make the games they want and deliver them how they want it. This is also known as operating like every other industry outside the PC game industry."

 

[joshthor]

drm is NOT necessary. drm only serves to punish a actual customer for buying it. what companies should do is give extras to people who actually choose to pay. (posters, t-shirts, art books, trinkets) all drm gets cracked, however, if a free extra is brought in it is great incentive to buy. now, one important thing is DLC doesnt count as an extra. it has to be something you cant just download.