Another Incident in Portland

lil devils x

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Actually, there's also a matter of the Police Departments not wanting people who live in certain communities. I had my pick of the boroughs when I was applying for the NYPD because I lived in a suburb of Manhattan.

But my friend who lived in the Bronx was told quite plainly that he was not going to be stationed in the Bronx. Due to 'not wanting fraternization'.
Yea, there is also issues of corruption, " drug dealing cops" to be precise, that departments have to deal with as well. * coughs* My OWN UNCLE, for example...
Letting people off because they are your friends and " roughing people up" because they were not.
 

Specter Von Baren

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Actually, there's also a matter of the Police Departments not wanting people who live in certain communities. I had my pick of the boroughs when I was applying for the NYPD because I lived in a suburb of Manhattan.

But my friend who lived in the Bronx was told quite plainly that he was not going to be stationed in the Bronx. Due to 'not wanting fraternization'.
Wait... you were in the police force Obsidion?! How are you so classic cool?! You've been a police officer AND you're a pilot?!
 

ObsidianJones

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Wait... you were in the police force Obsidion?! How are you so classic cool?! You've been a police officer AND you're a pilot?!
I was applying to be in the police force. I just completed my psych and they were going to schedule me for the academy.

But then my Teacher's father was killed by cops. And I couldn't do it.
 

Specter Von Baren

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I was applying to be in the police force. I just completed my psych and they were going to schedule me for the academy.

But then my Teacher's father was killed by cops. And I couldn't do it.
Welp. I'm just gonna go hang out in the corner for a while.

Oh also, are you going ok? Hurricane Sally blew over parts of Florida, were you at all effected?
 
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dreng3

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You don't expect the department to be parked outside their door while they sleep. If someone really wants to kill you or your family, they will. Criminals are opportunists, they wait until your guard is down to attack. The police can only do something about that which they are informed is going to happen. They can't do anything about something when they are not notified in time to get there.

If we all had a policeman in our pockets, I wouldn't have to worry about the guy who said he gets off on watching the lights go out of a woman's eyes while he is choking her or the man who stabbed my neighbor trying to break into my place to kill me either. Would be nice though wouldn't it?
I'm questioning the rationale of people being willing to commit premeditated murder against the people that would probably bring about one of the fiercest responses from the police but not being willing to drive to the next town over.

It reinforces the odd notion that police are living in a warzone where they must always be on guard because someone is always out to get them. That isn't a healthy mindset for someone who is supposed to be a public servant.
 
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lil devils x

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I'm questioning the rationale of people being willing to commit premeditated murder against the people that would probably bring about one of the fiercest responses from the police but not being willing to drive to the next town over.

It reinforces the odd notion that police are living in a warzone where they must always be on guard because someone is always out to get them. That isn't a healthy mindset for someone who is supposed to be a public servant.
Of course they would be willing to drive the next town over if they REALLY wanted to premeditated murder them. OTOH, the town drunk, who got angry because the cop hassled him is walking by his apartment and sees the cop who hassled him through his window or walking into his apartment spontaneously decided he is going to toss a cherry bomb though his window or grab his gun and unload it into his apartment, that is far more likely to happen if the cop lives next door to the guy. Some guy who is on drugs, drunk and pissed off just spontaneously saying "I'll show him" is far more likely and frequent than a serial killed hunting the cop down. Both actually do happen, but the probability and frequency it happens can be impacted by the location of the actual officer.

Of course that isn't a healthy mindset, yet, often it IS their mindset due to what they have actually had to deal with due to the nature of their job. We have some really nasty criminals here and being forced to interact with them puts these officers on the criminals radar for retaliation. When talking about criminals who literally still carry out hits on people outside while they are in prison, the cops have good reason for concern. Due to this " coming with the territory" of their job, that is why I say compensation in both paid time off and their pay itself as well as vacation benefits and ample psychological treatment. All of these things should be considered necessary compensation due to the nature of the job itself. If we are going to expect a person to do a job that necessarily involves traumatizing them and exposing them to extreme dangers, we very well better be providing them with what is needed to treat their PTSD and other psychological conditions that are a result of the job itself while also not reprimanding them for having to do so by not paying them while they have to take time off.

If we want our officers to not make mistakes or have PTSD episodes on the job due to the extreme environment and stress they are under, we have to reduce their hours, financially compensate them for doing so as well as provide them with the resources they need to be able to better adjust to the hazards of their jobs. Police often do feel like they are in a war zone because what they have to deal with often causes the same trauma that they would experience in a war zone. If we want to help change that, we have to address reducing the stress on the officers themselves.
 
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Silvanus

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There is a reason why there is a serious housing and homeless problem in LA. Across the US though, it is just getting worse.
Wait a second, that's not actually what the link says;

Renthop said:
To calculate what is and isn’t affordable, we used the 40x rule. This is the rule of thumb for most landlords in pretty much every major city. This guideline says that the household income must be at least 40 times the monthly rent. For example: we found that the median rent for a two-bedroom in Los Angeles is $2,480 per month, and will require $99,200 ($2,480 x 40) to secure.
I don't know whether it was my mistake or yours. It could have been mine; your original summary said an apartment "will require $99,200 to secure", and I interpreted that as meaning prospective tenants had to pay that to secure the place. But that's not the case.

A tenant's (annual) income needs to be that high in order for a landlord to agree to the tenancy, but they don't actually need to pay that.

This doesn't undermine your general point though: that average rent in L.A. is significantly higher than an LAPD officer's salary. That's true.
 

Revnak

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Wait a second, that's not actually what the link says;



I don't know whether it was my mistake or yours. It could have been mine; your original summary said an apartment "will require $99,200 to secure", and I interpreted that as meaning prospective tenants had to pay that to secure the place. But that's not the case.

A tenant's (annual) income needs to be that high in order for a landlord to agree to the tenancy, but they don't actually need to pay that.

This doesn't undermine your general point though: that average rent in L.A. is significantly higher than an LAPD officer's salary. That's true.
Wait... lol, nobody actually enforces that. People can rent with 30x or less all the time if they have solid credit or renter’s history.
 
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dreng3

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I am certainly in favour of better working conditions, including wages and vacation, for police, those who work in important professions should be treated well. If they reform of course, at present I don't feel that police have earned any kind of benefit from the taxpayers.

And I'd say that pretty much anyone that engages face to face with the general populace should have the same concerns in regards to safety as police, insurance workers, doctors, nurses, social worker, etc.
All of those are at risk of attracting anger from people with poor impulse control or anger issues, but I don't think I've ever heard the argument that they cannot live too close to work for fear of their families being victimized. It fosters an unhealthy mindset.
 

lil devils x

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Wait a second, that's not actually what the link says;



I don't know whether it was my mistake or yours. It could have been mine; your original summary said an apartment "will require $99,200 to secure", and I interpreted that as meaning prospective tenants had to pay that to secure the place. But that's not the case.

A tenant's (annual) income needs to be that high in order for a landlord to agree to the tenancy, but they don't actually need to pay that.

This doesn't undermine your general point though: that average rent in L.A. is significantly higher than an LAPD officer's salary. That's true.
Yes, that was what I was referencing. I quoted the "will require $99,200 to secure" directly from the link below it. People have to consider what is the required income for the landlords to even approve someone for a rental. It doesn't matter if the person earning 70k can barely make their rent if they ration food just right if the landlords will not even rent it to you due to their income requirements. That was what I was referring to with what people need to obtain leases to rentals here as well. They show that some families in the area earn less than that, but they are not pointing out that those same families have been living multiple generations in their home and no longer have rent or mortgage due to that, their house was paid off by their parents and they still live in the home is how people with lower incomes can sustain living in the area. That does not mean you can move here now with that same income, it does't work that way. Many people with lower incomes survive by not having to pay rent or mortgage at all due to existing circumstances, not that anyone can just walk in and obtain those same circumstances they did.
 

Silvanus

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Wait... lol, nobody actually enforces that. People can rent with 30x or less all the time if they have solid credit or renter’s history.
30x the average rent ($74400) would still put it out of the price-range of someone with the median income, and out of the price-range of an LAPD officer.
 
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Revnak

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Yes, that was what I was referencing. I quoted the "will require $99,200 to secure" directly from the link below it. People have to consider what is the required income for the landlords to even approve someone for a rental. It doesn't matter if the person earning 70k can barely make their rent if they ration food just right if the landlords will not even rent it to you due to their income requirements. That was what I was referring to with what people need to obtain leases to rentals here as well. They show that some families in the area earn less than that, but they are not pointing out that those same families have been living multiple generations in their home and no longer have rent or mortgage due to that, their house was paid off by their parents and they still live in the home is how people with lower incomes can sustain living in the area. That does not mean you can move here now with that same income, it does't work that way. Many people with lower incomes survive by not having to pay rent or mortgage at all due to existing circumstances, not that anyone can just walk in and obtain those same circumstances they did.
Landlords don’t actually enforce the “rent should only be 30% of your income.” They just use that as an excuse to demand a bigger deposit.
 

lil devils x

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Wait... lol, nobody actually enforces that. People can rent with 30x or less all the time if they have solid credit or renter’s history.
They DO enforce that here. That is why my friend is still forced to live with her mom. She makes over 60k a year in her job but she cannot get approved for an apartment in her daughter's school district due to having to the % rent to income ratio requirements. You have to factor in everything from your car payments, dependents, or any other obligations as well and then they do a percentage on top of it all. Usually slum lords don't care, but everyone else does. The apartment I am in now also checked my income percentage to rent as well. I abundantly do due to my field, but you wouldn't qualify earning 40k.
 

Revnak

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30x the average rent ($74400) would still put it out of the price-range of someone with the median income, and out of the price-range of an LAPD officer.
I said “or less” and that’s for an average two bedroom, not every two bedroom.
 

lil devils x

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Landlords don’t actually enforce the “rent should only be 30% of your income.” They just use that as an excuse to demand a bigger deposit.
They actually do depending on where you live. They do where I live. The nicer neighborhoods almost always do, especially if it is corporate owned. Mom and pop's will usually be willing to overlook it.

That is one of the reasons why I was happy to see Biden's credit to make utilities+ rent to only be 30% of your income, because that would affect so many people right now and is desperately needed. That credit would help you and everyone else in your income bracket tremendously.
 

Revnak

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They DO enforce that here. That is why my friend is still forced to live with her mom. She makes over 60k a year in her job but she cannot get approved for an apartment in her daughter's school district due to having to the % rent to income ratio requirements. You have to factor in everything from your car payments, dependents, or any other obligations as well and then they do a percentage on top of it all. Usually slum lords don't care, but everyone else does. The apartment I am in now also checked my income percentage to rent as well. I abundantly do due to my field, but you wouldn't qualify earning 40k.
You are the whitest non-white person I have ever talked to I swear. I’ve dealt with shitty apartments my whole life but I’m still doing solidly better than most people I know my age. How have you actually wound up interacting with a non-predatory landlord? Who are these mythical people? I genuinely cannot imagine living in your reality.
 
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lil devils x

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You are the whitest non-white person I have ever talked to I swear. I’ve dealt with shitty apartments my whole life but I’m still doing solidly better than most people I know my age. How have you actually wound up interacting with a non-predatory landlord? Who are these mythical people? I genuinely cannot imagine living in your reality.
WHat?! What on earth are you going on about? What mythical people? Corporate owned apartments will not budge on the 30% rule. Mom and pops I said usually would but those are a lot fewer these days due to corporations eating up all the real estate. Like I have said before, we have like 23 billionaires living in this area so yea, they are a good deal more stringent on people trying to move in. What the hell is "You are the whitest non-white person I have ever talked to I swear. " supposed to even mean?
 

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You have to factor in everything from your car payments, dependents, or any other obligations as well and then they do a percentage on top of it all.
Every source I find says that it's just based off your gross income, not your net after being subtracted by your car payments, dependents, etc.

Oh, but now I realize we're talking about 30% instead of x40. Still, your local landlord may have their own silly rules. I got turned down from renting a place because the guy didn't like that I work from home.
 

Revnak

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WHat?! What on earth are you going on about? What mythical people? Corporate owned apartments will not budge on the 30% rule. Mom and pops I said usually would but those are a lot fewer these days due to corporations eating up all the real estate. Like I have said before, we have like 23 billionaires living in this area so yea, they are a good deal more stringent on people trying to move in. What the hell is "You are the whitest non-white person I have ever talked to I swear. " supposed to even mean?
I honestly have never wound up in the scenario you’re describing, yeah. Like, most people spend over 30% of their income on housing/rent, so clearly most landlords don’t give a shit about that rule! It’s like a NYT article about a graduate with a can do attitude and rich parent who manages to live in their parents’ condo debt free on six figures lecturing the rest of the country on how they’re the one making themselves poor. I genuinely cannot understand the world you live in. It’s completely alien to me.
 
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