Anti-DRM Group Sends Nintendo 200 Bricks

[mjc0961]

Once again, people fail to miss the point, just like with the whole Sony VS GeoHot lawsuit. It's not about piracy, it's about companies thinking they still own something they made even though we paid money for it and they can change or remove any features they want from it, even if the reason we bought it was for these removed features.

 

[killamanhunter]

If you're not going to pirate or do anything to your device why would you care? Oh right you are going to pirate all of your DS games and circumvent the software and hardware now I know why you're complaining about the ToS now it all makes sense!

 

[CM156_v1legacy]

I wish companies like Nintendo would stop wasting time trying to stop pirates and focus on the bigger problems like stores with trade ins like gamestop. They are losing more than 200X as much money from store like that compared to pirates.

Here's the problem though: they really can't do anything about Gamestop. At least in the USA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine

The doctrine allows the purchaser to transfer (i.e., sell, lend or give away) a particular lawfully made copy of the copyrighted work without permission once it has been obtained. This means that the copyright holder's rights to control the change of ownership of a particular copy ends once ownership of that copy has passed to someone else, as long as the copy itself is not an infringing copy. This doctrine is also referred to as the "right of first sale," "first sale rule," or "exhaustion rule."

In other words, at least in the United States, they can legaly do nothing, short of refuse to sell games to Gamestop unless they get a cut of resale. Which would be a huge loss, and Gamestop would just sell used ones anyway. In other words, no dice in that regard.

And "200X"? Where did you get that number?

OT: (Read this very sarcastically) Ohhh, nooooo, they sent fake bricks! Whatever will they dooooo? It's not as if they can just ignore them or pitch them!!!

 

[ph0b0s123]

Show me a case of an unfair bricking, and I'll consider that you might have a point.

Man give it two minutes the device has only just been released. But yeah lets just wait until that bad thing everyone can see coming happens before trying to stop it. Oh but wait, then it's too late....

Wow, from the responses here people really are happy to bend over backwards and take it in.... well you know the rest. People are happy to pay through the noses for devices they cannot use however they want and however they want does not equal piracy, that is just a cover by these companies to make sure you only do things the way they want and are locked into a wall garden.

It would not be so much of a problem if you were renting the device on contract like a mobile. But these companies expect you to take all the pain of paying for the hardware depreciation, etc so they have no risk and then still expect you be grateful.

And so many people are happy to do this. So yeah sure be sheep and just keep giving them your money without a complaint while they increase prices because they have complete control of the market and the device you have paid in full for. Nice work consumers....

And for those being negative about the sending in cardboard bricks. No it will not make Nintendo change, but at least it publicises the issue so that consumers who don't want to be screwed are warned and have the chance to abstain from purchasing. Man these forums are full of such negative nellys.

 

[Echo136]

Lol. Who would have thought Nintendo can decide to stop you from doing things which are in fact perfectly legal?

(Reverse engineering. Modification of hardware & software, have traditionally been legal as long as you aren't doing them for the sole purpose of doing something illegal with the result.
Homebrew software is legal, despite what companies claim. Pirated games are not. But with technical changes to the device involved being almost identical...)

You're kidding yourself if you think pirating games isnt the main purpose of modding systems. The reason the PSP was such a terrible failure was because it was so easy to pirate games on it.

The PSP was definitely not a failure. The PSP Go was, but definitely not the original.

That said, this is the main reason I'm not buying a 3DS. This is also going to be my deciding factor going into getting the NGP. I'm so sick of companies telling me what I can do with what I purchase. Extensive DRM on hardware is a gross violation of consumer rights.

I couldn't give a shit less if they think this will stop pirating, because it won't. They'll find a way like they always do. What it will do is prevent people from legally modifying the system, and placing homebrew and other applications on a device that has the potential to do so.

Video game consoles are one of the only hardware I see being sold with an extremely controlling automatic ToS. Software has it all the time, but not hardware. That's like selling me a damn radio and telling me I can only listen to bloody AM.

Being open source is key to having a happy audience. Why do you think everyone loves their Android phones so much? It's an open platform with endless amounts of customization. Take a lesson from Google, Nintendo. Don't be evil.

Seriously, theres no point debating this is there. You might as well not buy any gaming system, because they are all this way, and I for one understand why. You would have to be completely stupid to think people would stop at homebrewing, and allowing people to even attemt pirating is a major business risk. Anyone with any business sense would tell you that it would put any software developer at risk of having their game more easily stolen. What incentive do they have to make the game for your platform. NONE!

But clearly the only way you see it is that they are infringing on your consumer rights, so have fun with your Phone Apps.

 

[Timbydude]

Well, I think that will definitely get them to change their policies. "Oh no," they will solemnly proclaim, "how can we possibly keep our Terms of Service the way they are with all these cardboard bricks here? Guess they win..."

Seriously. Even symbolically, it just makes the pira--er, "Defective by Design" group--seem like a bunch of whiners. Nintendo isn't likely going to budge on this, because the average Nintendo customer is going to buy that 3DS regardless of the policy.

 

[Atmos Duality]

I have a major beef with Nintendo claiming copyright to all pictures/videos taken with the device.
Such a stipulation is demanding too much IMO; especially where there's no form of compensation (you already bought the device, you get nothing out of it), and when it serves no practical purpose other than that of nefarious or commercial intent.

Though this also creates the potential for a hilarious legal conundrum. Who owns the copyright of the image if I take a picture of an already copyrighted image? After all, Nintendo is implicitly claiming ownership of that picture!

Eventually, this System-Bricking-DRM is going to backfire on Nintendo HARD. The first person who discovers how to "unbrick" a 3DS (and disable the DRM in the process) will have a goldmine on their hands. And the more systems that get bricked (unintentionally even) the more of a demand there will be for it.

I understand that Nintendo was furious over their ultimate failure in combating the R4 and that this new system stems directly as a result from it, but going so far as to create a self-destruct mechanism for a device you paid for is quite extreme (and if genuine accidents happen, I doubt there will be any compensation because it sounds like they're going with the "Guilty until proven innocent" thinking here); especially when it isn't killing business.

 

[akibawall95]

I really like this method of protesting, it is a fun, even humorous way to protest without hurting anyone in the process. It can also be a good way to get your cause to be seen in the "good" light of the media and further your goals. But in all honesty probably no form of protest will make Nintendo change their mind, good try though.

 

[BrunDeign]

Why the hell is this even being posted? This is literally a waste of a news post.

You guys at the Escapist even bother to look at the subject matter? You posted about this more than TWO WEEKS AGO.

You don't have to post about every little thing. At the most just update your original post.

Sheesh.

Talk about stirring up arguments for the sake of stirring up arguments.

 

[Wharrgarble]

This isn't going to change anything. I don't understand why people think it will. Pirates will always, always be able to figure their way around blocks like this. Why? Because that's what they do. They enjoy the challenge, and while this may end up being a bigger one, at the end of the day someone will still crack it and we'll be back to square one.

I don't have a problem with companies trying to protect what's legally theirs. However, I find this creepy. Not to mention the fact that they place ownership over all photos and media is just silly. Nothing else I physically own is on this "rental" style agreement.

This practice is illegal in Europe for a reason, and all Nintendo is doing is punishing their customers for something they "might" do. I don't appreciate being treated like a criminal, even if it would never effect me. Even if I never mod my device, or use a pirated game... Even if my device will NEVER be bricked... I can't support this.

It's illegal in the European Union for a reason.

 

[Atheist.]

Lol. Who would have thought Nintendo can decide to stop you from doing things which are in fact perfectly legal?

(Reverse engineering. Modification of hardware & software, have traditionally been legal as long as you aren't doing them for the sole purpose of doing something illegal with the result.
Homebrew software is legal, despite what companies claim. Pirated games are not. But with technical changes to the device involved being almost identical...)

You're kidding yourself if you think pirating games isnt the main purpose of modding systems. The reason the PSP was such a terrible failure was because it was so easy to pirate games on it.

The PSP was definitely not a failure. The PSP Go was, but definitely not the original.

That said, this is the main reason I'm not buying a 3DS. This is also going to be my deciding factor going into getting the NGP. I'm so sick of companies telling me what I can do with what I purchase. Extensive DRM on hardware is a gross violation of consumer rights.

I couldn't give a shit less if they think this will stop pirating, because it won't. They'll find a way like they always do. What it will do is prevent people from legally modifying the system, and placing homebrew and other applications on a device that has the potential to do so.

Video game consoles are one of the only hardware I see being sold with an extremely controlling automatic ToS. Software has it all the time, but not hardware. That's like selling me a damn radio and telling me I can only listen to bloody AM.

Being open source is key to having a happy audience. Why do you think everyone loves their Android phones so much? It's an open platform with endless amounts of customization. Take a lesson from Google, Nintendo. Don't be evil.

Seriously, theres no point debating this is there. You might as well not buy any gaming system, because they are all this way, and I for one understand why. You would have to be completely stupid to think people would stop at homebrewing, and allowing people to even attemt pirating is a major business risk. Anyone with any business sense would tell you that it would put any software developer at risk of having their game more easily stolen. What incentive do they have to make the game for your platform. NONE!

But clearly the only way you see it is that they are infringing on your consumer rights, so have fun with your Phone Apps.

You're really bad at this. You've been rehashing the same single argument the entire thread. The majority of the people, we'll call them sheep, do not modify or toy with their property at all. These sheep just use their property as per the instruction labels, for their originally intended purposes. And you know what, we need sheep.

Now the other group of people, we'll call them wolves. Wolves think outside of the box. They innovate, and create amazing new things. They modify things they own, and make them better. They're also the companies putting things out. You see, the sheep feed the wolves all their money for these products. And the thing is, wolves are territorial. They have a hierarchy. They don't like other people having as much control as them. As such, they try to put people in their place.

They don't let people enjoy having nice things, and get mad when people can make them better. They're greedy bastards. The alpha male AKA game companies don't like the other wolves to enjoy themselves. They think we want to steal their sheep, but we don't. Us wolves just want to play. We want to play in different and new ways, and expand on topics.

So you see, you don't need to accuse everyone who wants to play around ever with loudly proclaiming them pirates. We just want to fuck around. We enjoy exploring code, and making things bend to our will by doing things they aren't intended to. We are wolves after all.

*Most people who mod don't pirate. The ones who do will find a way regardless. This is a completely pointless violation of the rights of consumers, who apparently can't even appreciate the people they're trying to protect.*

If you can't get my very juvenile metaphor, I'm afraid I can't help you my friend. My main point, which is surrounded by asterisk still stands. Pirates will always pirate, you're only slowing them down. I hate pirates, to be honest. They're the ones making me type this, and making people work around DRM. But the thing is, I hate ignorance more. As well as incorrectly labeling moders as pirates.

 

[Antari]

And here I thought the story would be about a nintendo employee going on disability after trying to lift a box of real bricks. Ohhh well. It doesn't shock me that some lawyer is making nintendo look like a bunch of idiots. Thats what lawyers do.

 

[Kecunk]

To all those people complaining about having something you paid for taken away from you nobody is going to come to your house and repossess your 3ds. You will still own the physical object you will just be denied access to the software and the software is nintendo's intellectual property weather you like it or not.

I tend to think of it like this if im watching a movie i don't own the rights to that movie even though i own the tv im watching it on, the movie studio still owns the rights to the movie.

Although i do agree that is kinda weird for them to own all your pictures but i guess thats just the messed up age that we live in.

 

[Dango]

Nintendo manufactured a handheld gaming device, if you decide to mod it so it performs a function is isn't intended to, then it's fine with me if your DS gets shut down, albeit after they give you a warning or two.

 

[YouShouldDeleteThisAccount]

Calling the DBD guys a bunch pirates is a load of crap.

It's a Free Software Foundation campaign, it has nothing to do with piracy. They believe in the Consumers right to use the devices and software they purchase for their needs. And as such, are against any design that limits the ability of a device or software artificially ( As in, there's no reason it couldn't do this accept an intentional lock ), including any DRM. Their beef is entirely philosophical. The FSF existed before DRM existed, and long before digital piracy was such an issue. DBD and anti-DRM aren't even their focus. They're far more focused on the developing of Free tools and Software so that anyone who wishes doesn't have to use Freedom-restricting software.

They aren't doing this out of desire to obtain free games, they're doing it out of desire to obtain freedom.

 

[sunpop]

One of many reasons I don't bother getting a 3ds and I don't even use and R4 or anything I haven't pirated a game in the longest time (valve has enjoyed that) but the fact they can brick it at any time is stupid.

 

[Defenestra]

I personally disagree with any company making what I consider to be unfair restrictions upon the products they sell.

If the hardware can do something, and I want it to do that something, and the software it comes with doesn't allow me to do so, I shoulb be able to correct that.

Like on a computer, if it doesn't come with voip software I like, I should be able to install some. Change the way I view the files it keeps. Stick an email client on it if it's lacking one.

Why should I not be able to do that? Because being able to do those things makes me theoretically able to play unapproved games?

Wouldn't be the first time I decided not to buy something because its use was too restricted.

 

[Katana314]

I'm often a proponent of used games being just as bad as piracy, and feeling that Project $10 is fine. However, hardware is different from software; it's a physical product. You're buying a piece of technology you can hold in your hand, experiment with, disassemble, etc. I really don't like the idea of Nintendo treating it as some kind of license, and protecting it in such ways.

It was brought up that other smartphones do this too. Yes, I don't like those smartphones either. I'm quite frankly amazed that seemingly the only form of gadgetry that's managed to avoid total ownership by some corporation is the IBM-based Micro-ATX Personal Computer (for those not versed in hardware, that's pretty much what every desktop in the world follows the standard for)

 

[JET1971]

Is there a demographic reason so many of the people who frequent this site don't care about their consumer rights or the future of technology? These threads are always filled with people saying Take that pirates! even when the subject will only hurt consumers without hindering pirates. It's getting almost embarrassing. I definitely won't be buying any Nintendo hardware until they stop trying to do such reprehensible things.

I would never mod my 3DS or use unauthorized devices (which im guessing is Action Replay), so how does this affect me at all? It doesnt, so my rights arent being infringed at all. Only those who want to cheat the system and pirate games. And dont kid yourself. The majority of the people who would mod their system would do so to pirate games.

Actualy your right is infringed upon. just because you choose not to excersise the right does not mean you shouldnt have the right.

Bricking it because of piracy is a shit excuse, Pirates will get past that without a second thought to it, the brick feature will be disabled in the pirates mod. what Nintendo does not want is some indie developer creating new aps and maybe even indie games that do not go through Nintendos totalitarian views on what can be allowed on the device. Imagine someone creating an app that allows you to view a game download site that has hundreds of free indie games. Has that happened before? why yes a free app store for the iphone that was not connected to Apple and none aproved by Apple. Nintendo does not want Apps they cannot charge you for, nothing other than that.

Think about it and you will know its not about piracy, thats an excuse and a shitty one at that.

 

[LaBarnes]

whoop-dee-doo, these self-entitled brats can cry me a fuckin' river. God my generation is worthless

In what way is it self entitled to want to have full use of a device you paid for? You clearly don't understand what Nintendo is actually doing, or you just hate the concept of property rights.
Unauthorized software is not just piracy, everything worthwhile done with the Kinect is "unauthorized" and the same may become true with the 3DS.
If you pay for a device, you ought to own it, and if you own it, you ought to be able to do as you please with it. If Toyota sold you a car on the condition that you weren't allowed to listen to certain music in it, you'd rightfully call them insane, but when someone does it to a software company, suddenly their "self-entitled"?
Demanding full use of a device you own isn't "self-entitled" its the way things ought to be.