Apparently Braveheart is Anglophobic?

[Brownie80]

First off, I know this sounds like the title of a video that MovieBob would've made. Point aside...

I was watching Braveheart last night. You know, the movie about William Wallace and freedom [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLCEUpIg8rE]. I wanted to know more about all those historical inaccuracies, so I looked it up on Wikipedia. And right below the historical inaccuracies column, was this:

Spoiler

Sections of the English media accused the film of harbouring Anglophobia. The Economist called it "xenophobic", and John Sutherland writing in The Guardian stated that: "Braveheart gave full rein to a toxic Anglophobia". In The Times, MacArthur said "the political effects are truly pernicious. It?s a xenophobic film." Ian Burrell of The Independent has noted, "The Braveheart phenomenon, a Hollywood-inspired rise in Scottish nationalism, has been linked to a rise in anti-English prejudice". Contemporary Scottish writer and commentator Douglas Murray has described the film as "strangely racist and anti-English".

Now I know the movie is incredibly black and white, but I wouldn't call it "Anglophobic." Would you?

 

[Thaluikhain]

Anglophobia isn't a great way of putting it, but all the English in that film were even rapists thugs, an evil villain who liked sending thugs to rape people, and his stereotypical effeminate gay son.

Sorta very clear anti-English vibe from that.

 

[Brownie80]

Anglophobia isn't a great way of putting it, but all the English in that film were even rapists thugs, an evil villain who liked sending thugs to rape people, and his stereotypical effeminate gay son.

Sorta very clear anti-English vibe from that.

Yes but from what I gathered some thought that they deliberately set out to portray English as the suck of the Earth. I personally think it's just an effect to add to the DRAMAS and have the token bad guys, so the audience knows who to root for.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Yes but from what I gathered some thought that they deliberately set out to portray English as the suck of the Earth. I personally think it's just an effect to add to the DRAMAS and have the token bad guys, so the audience knows who to root for.

Not seeing much distinction between the two there.

 

[Brownie80]

Yes but from what I gathered some thought that they deliberately set out to portray English as the suck of the Earth. I personally think it's just an effect to add to the DRAMAS and have the token bad guys, so the audience knows who to root for.

Not seeing much distinction between the two there.

I meant that they portrayed the as the bad guys for dramatic effect not because they have some hateful agenda against English people. At least that's what I thought.

 

[JoJo]

Yeah, I won't be losing any sleep over the film but I recall it being a bit over the top when it came to the English enemies. If I was to be cynical, I'd say that along with the 'Freedom!' angle the film makers were trying to hook American audiences by drawing parallels between the Scottish Wars of Independence and their own independence struggle against the English centuries later, historicity be damned.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Yes but from what I gathered some thought that they deliberately set out to portray English as the suck of the Earth. I personally think it's just an effect to add to the DRAMAS and have the token bad guys, so the audience knows who to root for.

Not seeing much distinction between the two there.

I meant that they portrayed the as the bad guys for dramatic effect not because they have some hateful agenda against English people. At least that's what I thought.

Well, yes, but how can someone tell? If there were a few dozen internal memos about hating the English, I guess, that'd be proof[footnote]That it was for dramatic effect, cause that's normal. Everyone says they hate the English.[/footnote], but otherwise, no way of telling what the motive was.

OTOH, they could have had a token not evil English person to show they aren't all bad, just most of them.

 

[Fox12]

I don't think so, because it didn't seek to villify Anglo's as a people. The brittish civilians were just civilians, the same as anyone else. The king and aristocracy was villainized because they needed someone evil for the movie. Was this lazy? Yes, but hardly anglophobic. Some of the "creative liberties" in that movie gave me a migraine though.

 

[Dalisclock]

Yeah, I won't be losing any sleep over the film but I recall it being a bit over the top when it came to the English enemies. If I was to be cynical, I'd say that along with the 'Freedom!' angle the film makers were trying to hook American audiences by drawing parallels between the Scottish Wars of Independence and their own independence struggle against the English centuries later, historicity be damned.

Especially considering the similarities between Brave heart and the later Patriot.

So on one hand the British/English had a long history of taking over countries that weren't theirs and taking over(I know there's still some bad blood about that in Northern Ireland) and they did commit atrocities during such wars, but OTOH, both films show the British/English incredibly one dimensionally.

 

[Ambient_Malice]

Whacking "phobe" on the ends of words tends to oversimplify complex things.

Braveheart, like Gallipoli, which Mel Gibson also acted in, is a film that depicts British people doing bad things they didn't actually do for the sake of DRAMA.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

I don't think so, because it didn't seek to villify Anglo's as a people. The brittish civilians were just civilians, the same as anyone else. The king and aristocracy was villainized because they needed someone evil for the movie. Was this lazy? Yes, but hardly anglophobic. Some of the "creative liberties" in that movie gave me a migraine though.

Like the Battle of Stirling Bridge having a distinct lack of a bridge; that one always got me - but I made the mistake of studying that period of history.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

Yeah, I won't be losing any sleep over the film but I recall it being a bit over the top when it came to the English enemies. If I was to be cynical, I'd say that along with the 'Freedom!' angle the film makers were trying to hook American audiences by drawing parallels between the Scottish Wars of Independence and their own independence struggle against the English centuries later, historicity be damned.

And then The Patriot came out, also starring Mel Gibson! You know, the one where the British are shown committing war crimes that were actually attributed to the fucking Nazis.

 

[Michel Henzel]

Yes, this movie gave me a terrible fear of English people, I don't know how I will ever overcome my anxiety disorder towards English people. /S

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Eh the English can take a little criticism, they're only the oldest, most colonially-prone international power in the world.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

Eh the English can take a little criticism, they're only the oldest, most colonially-prone international power in the world.

Accurate criticism would be nice. That said, Anglophobic is probably the wrong word since I'm pretty sure the Scots also count as Anglos.

It's still a great flick, and the score is beautiful but it's a highly inaccurate representation of pretty much everything. I mean Gladiator at least had the decency never to say it was based on a true story despite being even worse.

 

[Zykon TheLich_v1legacy]

I'm pretty sure the Scots also count as Anglos.

R.I.P Gordon_4

Died 07/03/15

Beaten to death with a can of Irn Bru in a (tartan) sock.

They're British, and Anglophone, but they're definitely celts, not angles.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

I'm pretty sure the Scots also count as Anglos.

R.I.P Gordon_4

Died 07/03/15

Beaten to death with a can of Irn Bru in a (tartan) sock.

They're British, and Anglophone, but they're definitely celts, not angles.

I accept my mistake and await my noble death by caber and haggis.

 

[Roboshi]

The relationship between the english and the scots is uneasy to say the least. The various wars in and around scotland are some of the most unusual and confusing. So to have a film portray it as the good natured scots gaining freedm from the evil british...Yeah it's a bit racist, but then it's not different to EVERY English villain in an american film. We just sort of shrug it off and deal with it.

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

Like any American made movie based on history, it will always be full of lies.