Are people too hard on smokers?

[Barblade]

FAFFAKSAKE Smoking is a terrible habit, but it's THEIR terrible habit. They're ruining their own lives, not mine. I like the laws against smoking indoors in certain places because in there it's actually affecting me, and they're there so that smokers don't annoy the feces out of everyone around them by polluting the indoors air, while smokers can still step outside and have their sigarette there.

I don't like people who listen to Justin Bieber. Should I BAN listening to Justin Bieber?
I don't like little kids who scream in public, should I BAN bringing little kids to public places? No. Just no.

Let smokers smoke, as long as they're not blowing the smoke in your face; Then you're allowed to smack them over the head and force them to smoke all their sigarettes at once and then burn them with the butts (I don't encourage actually doing this).

 

[Taekro]

What I do mind however, is what they force on me. Smoking within 10 meters (30 feet) of other people means that those people will also be affected by the smoke and risk lung cancer, cronically obstructed lungs (COL) and whatever problems absorbing the over 20.000 different substances which are in cigerettes.

I think people should be free to do with their body as they please and thus, I think that people should be free to smoke. However, setting the freedom to smoke of the smokers (30% in my country) over the freedom of the nonsmokers to not be affected by what is essentially forced on them is ludicris.

If that was not enough there is also a more intricate matter which comes with passive smoking. When a smoker smokes, the smoke is filtered, to a degree, by the filter in the cigeret. That does not apply to the people around the smoker which means that people will not primarily get the "cleaned" smoke which the smoker gets.


Furthermore, many people suffer from astma and allergies to the many substances in cigarettes. These people did not choose said ailements and I see no reason why a person should be able to actively make other peoples ailements even worse. I have allergic astma but no major problems with smoke - I do, however, know quite a few people who simply cant breathe if there is a person near them smoking and they have to use inhailers to be able to breathe at all after that.

There is no social reasoning at all for allowing smoking. It is not some ancient tradition like alcohol is, it is not something which is nessecary for society to function like cars is and the only thing smoking contributes to society is bad health, worsening of medical conditions, and an extremely unplesant odour - oh and ofc money to tobacco companies.

Damn, I would laugh at this post if the hypocrisy in it wasn't so sad.

There is not ONE person in this world that doesn't affect it's close surroundings and the people that are present there. In fact, 90% of the people are already contaminating the air just by using their deodorants and perfumes before exiting the house, and most make my nose react so bad I have to take 2 pills daily just so that I produce "only" a little amount of mucus... Did you know what makes my nose stop running for about an hour? A FREAKING CIGAR!

You complain about the smell of smoke? I complain when I get out of house in the morning the weekend and have to endure the disgusting stink of the vomit that the freaking drunks left there the night before. Sometimes it's so bad I add my own to the pile...

I, for one, smoke for 2 reasons. The first is for purely medical reasons. Nicotine apparently reduces temporarily the amount of mucus one produces, which help me a ton. One per day is enough except when I go out at night, where I smoke another.
The second one, though? I dare you to give me a better morning start than, after a half and hour jogging and a bath, having a coffee, a croissant (no I'm not french...) and a cigar while reading the newspaper. You finish feeling like a gentleman. Smoking feels damn good, and always has (except the first time that I didn't know how to do it right...). I'm not physically addicted, though I might be psychologically, as it's that good.

But I don't force my smoke on others: I only smoke in the open (even when raining, which actually feels nice, gives an awesome nostalgic feel to it), sort of distanced from the non smokers and if one stupidly (yes, some people actually pass-by close to us and complain even though they could easily avoid it) passes by, I actually hold my breath a little longer, hold my cigar behind me and resume only after they pass. And I'm not the only one doing it. I also wash my teeth after I smoke (yes, I carry a toothbrush with me, and believe some non-smokers really need to start doing the same) and I, for some reason, never get the smell of smoke on my hair or clothes.

Just to restate my point: people everywhere do shit. Just because you guys think your habits only affect yourselves doesn't make it so, and I'm a living proof of it. Should some smokers be a little more civil with the way they smoke? Yes. Should people diss us for smoking? No! Unless you ban alcohol and any airborne substance that people might us (for there is always someone feeling sick because of it), every single person has the right to smoke anywhere as long it is in an open, public space or their property.


Oh, and please, some people clearly haven't kissed a smoker before. Unless they are really frequent smokers, the "flavor" is quite tolerable, and hardly noticeable if they chew a gum before hand (or wash their teeth). In fact, I never kissed a smoker and felt bad, but boy do some non-smokers have bad breath...

 

[ajofflight]

I understand it's addictive, but I try to stay away from people who smoke, at least while they're smoking. I don't have any real issue with smokers per se, but I'm not sure if I would be completely comfortable having a romantic relationship with anyone who smokes. Plus, they make me smell like I smoke, and then I have to answer other people's questions.

 

[VanTesla]

I have no problem with smokers for I have friends and family that smoke. I do however think it's a terrible addiction that will only cause more problems down the road. Many well educated geniuses smoke, but that's because we all have flaws and no human is above those flaws, that I know of. I once knew a man that was 102 years old that smoked since he was 14 and never had one physical problem, that is because of good genetics, the majority of human population don't have that privilege. I hope for a day that all of humanity will stop smoking "not going to happen".

So you have no problems with them forcing potential health problems on you, feeding you with this many substances: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_additives_in_cigarettes (many of which are deadly) without your concent or even a chance for you to avoid it at all?

you ever heard of the great smog? it was a result of heavy industry, car exhausts and natural weather conditions in london, 4000 people died and smoking barely factored in, put it this way if you own a car (evien if its a hybrid) you are putting out as many carcinogens hell probably more than any smoker could if he was smoking like a chimney his whole life. but you don't hear me crying over people using cars. the world's a dangerous place live with it, second hand smoke is the least of your worrys.

First, in I lands at least cars produce less and less pollution and there is active legistration (sp?) which forces manifacturers to make that even smaller. On top of that, cars are a nessecary evil because without them the world as it is would just not function. Neither can be said about smoking so what you are comparing it to doesnt make sense.

I know all about the hazards... I am not around it long enough to give me such problems. I would more likely get radiation poisoning than lung cancer "I live by a nuclear plant".

 

[Remigus]

I used to smoke though

That just makes me want to smoke

yeah, me too! Definitly like to be high righ now, If I wasnt drunk already

 

[4reall]

What I do mind however, is what they force on me. Smoking within 10 meters (30 feet) of other people means that those people will also be affected by the smoke and risk lung cancer, cronically obstructed lungs (COL) and whatever problems absorbing the over 20.000 different substances which are in cigerettes.

I think people should be free to do with their body as they please and thus, I think that people should be free to smoke. However, setting the freedom to smoke of the smokers (30% in my country) over the freedom of the nonsmokers to not be affected by what is essentially forced on them is ludicris.

If that was not enough there is also a more intricate matter which comes with passive smoking. When a smoker smokes, the smoke is filtered, to a degree, by the filter in the cigeret. That does not apply to the people around the smoker which means that people will not primarily get the "cleaned" smoke which the smoker gets.


Furthermore, many people suffer from astma and allergies to the many substances in cigarettes. These people did not choose said ailements and I see no reason why a person should be able to actively make other peoples ailements even worse. I have allergic astma but no major problems with smoke - I do, however, know quite a few people who simply cant breathe if there is a person near them smoking and they have to use inhailers to be able to breathe at all after that.

There is no social reasoning at all for allowing smoking. It is not some ancient tradition like alcohol is, it is not something which is nessecary for society to function like cars is and the only thing smoking contributes to society is bad health, worsening of medical conditions, and an extremely unplesant odour - oh and ofc money to tobacco companies.

Damn, I would laugh at this post if the hypocrisy in it wasn't so sad.

There is not ONE person in this world that doesn't affect it's close surroundings and the people that are present there. In fact, 90% of the people are already contaminating the air just by using their deodorants and perfumes before exiting the house, and most make my nose react so bad I have to take 2 pills daily just so that I produce "only" a little amount of mucus... Did you know what makes my nose stop running for about an hour? A FREAKING CIGAR!

You complain about the smell of smoke? I complain when I get out of house in the morning the weekend and have to endure the disgusting stink of the vomit that the freaking drunks left there the night before. Sometimes it's so bad I add my own to the pile...

I, for one, smoke for 2 reasons. The first is for purely medical reasons. Nicotine apparently reduces temporarily the amount of mucus one produces, which help me a ton. One per day is enough except when I go out at night, where I smoke another.
The second one, though? I dare you to give me a better morning start than, after a half and hour jogging and a bath, having a coffee, a croissant (no I'm not french...) and a cigar while reading the newspaper. You finish feeling like a gentleman. Smoking feels damn good, and always has (except the first time that I didn't know how to do it right...). I'm not physically addicted, though I might be psychologically, as it's that good.

But I don't force my smoke on others: I only smoke in the open (even when raining, which actually feels nice, gives an awesome nostalgic feel to it), sort of distanced from the non smokers and if one stupidly (yes, some people actually pass-by close to us and complain even though they could easily avoid it) passes by, I actually hold my breath a little longer, hold my cigar behind me and resume only after they pass. And I'm not the only one doing it. I also wash my teeth after I smoke (yes, I carry a toothbrush with me, and believe some non-smokers really need to start doing the same) and I, for some reason, never get the smell of smoke on my hair or clothes.

Just to restate my point: people everywhere do shit. Just because you guys think your habits only affect yourselves doesn't make it so, and I'm a living proof of it. Should some smokers be a little more civil with the way they smoke? Yes. Should people diss us for smoking? No! Unless you ban alcohol and any airborne substance that people might us (for there is always someone feeling sick because of it), every single person has the right to smoke anywhere as long it is in an open, public space or their property.


Oh, and please, some people clearly haven't kissed a smoker before. Unless they are really frequent smokers, the "flavor" is quite tolerable, and hardly noticeable if they chew a gum before hand (or wash their teeth). In fact, I never kissed a smoker and felt bad, but boy do some non-smokers have bad breath...

 

[Azaraxzealot]

I also think people are a bit too harsh on the smokers, while I do not support smokers, I do not believe they should so publicly hated. People argue that they are killing themselves, but are people drinking alcohol and eating fast food not killing themselves, yet I don't see people being as harsh on these people as they do on smokers. I think that the media also has a large role in effecting how people view the topic as well.

well someone who eats mcdonalds once in a while probably won't die of overeating or a heart attack instantly.

also, our bodies are naturally designed to take alcohol [http://www.cracked.com/article_18400_6-human-character-flaws-that-saved-species.html] and that it's actually good for you [http://www.cracked.com/article_18651_the-6-most-surprising-ways-alcohol-actually-good-you.html] (don't take cracked's word for it, it's all backed up by science if you follow those links)

but every time you smoke you CAN instantly develop cancer and it kills some of those little hairs in your body, plus, if smoke was MEANT to be taken by the human body, why do we need entire canisters of oxygen the moment we get caught in a fire?

 

[floppylobster]

Smoking typically indicates one of two things -

(1) Weakness - "I can't give up smoking, I'm addicted to it." Which indicates other weaknesses.

(2) Arrogance - "Why should I give up smoking? I enjoy it. Fuck everyone else, I'm going to smoke, it's my funeral." Which indicates selfishness.

Neither are good traits to have in a partner. And so to most people it's a 'deal breaker'. And even if the two above are not true and the person has some other bizarre reason for smoking, who wants to go out with some one who, (a) is going to have hygiene problems due to their habit (yellowed teeth, lack of taste, 'that' smell), and (b) will probably die an early, possibly painful to watch death and leave you alone in your old age?

These are all very extreme interpretations and sounds harsh, but it has to play in the back of people's heads when they consider dating a smoker. In real life if you love someone you can over come some things but the first smoker I dated had (1) and (a). The second one had (a). And my friend has (2) and can't find a girlfriend. So after a while you start to wonder if it's not an indicator of future problems that you're better off avoiding. (Also I would say that arrogance is the reason he cannot find a girlfriend, not smoking. But his smoking, and refusal to stop, is an indicator of his selfishness). You could say the same for heavy drinkers really.

 

[EtherealBeaver]

I have pretty strong feelings when it comes to smoking because it is hurting people I love for reasons beyond their controle. Astma, allergies, COL and lung cancer to be precise. I have a friend who cant breathe with people smoking within 10 meters of her and she gets steriods for it which must be taken within 10 seconds of her smelling smoke or she has to call an ambulance.

Another friend got lung cancer first when she was 14 because her parents smoked alot and she was predisposed for cancer. She was operated and got it again at the age of 18 in a new place - as in, not the same cancer re-emerging - because her parents refused to stop smoking. She lived for 5 years with on-off chemo therapy so far.

Luckily my astma only shows when allergenes are present so I dont suffer quite as much as I know many others do. But yeah, damn right I mind smoke

There is not ONE person in this world that doesn't affect it's close surroundings and the people that are present there. In fact, 90% of the people are already contaminating the air just by using their deodorants and perfumes before exiting the house, and most make my nose react so bad I have to take 2 pills daily just so that I produce "only" a little amount of mucus... Did you know what makes my nose stop running for about an hour? A FREAKING CIGAR!

Great for you. Im happy you found something which works and as long as you smoke it where others arent bothered I definately support your choice to smoke.

You complain about the smell of smoke? I complain when I get out of house in the morning the weekend and have to endure the disgusting stink of the vomit that the freaking drunks left there the night before. Sometimes it's so bad I add my own to the pile...

That was a side argument which was made perfectally clear in the context and by no means the central point. It is an aestetic discussion and thus per definition subjective.

But I don't force my smoke on others: I only smoke in the open (even when raining, which actually feels nice, gives an awesome nostalgic feel to it), sort of distanced from the non smokers and if one stupidly (yes, some people actually pass-by close to us and complain even though they could easily avoid it) passes by, I actually hold my breath a little longer, hold my cigar behind me and resume only after they pass. And I'm not the only one doing it. I also wash my teeth after I smoke (yes, I carry a toothbrush with me, and believe some non-smokers really need to start doing the same) and I, for some reason, never get the smell of smoke on my hair or clothes.

Then you are one of the few considerate smokers I have had contact with. Most smokers where I live smoke specifically when they are in groups of people who does not smoke, they stand spread out by the busstops and trainstations so you cant be there without getting smoke if you want to be able to catch the transport and generally stand in openings to shops, blow smoke smoke in their childrens faces and dont give a shit.

I wish I could say it is probably a social thing but I see the exact same behaviour by hospitals and larger trainstations where people sit below non-smoking-signs and smoke or even refuse to leave when people with breathing apperatus need to get in and out of the hospital.

Just to restate my point: people everywhere do shit. Just because you guys think your habits only affect yourselves doesn't make it so, and I'm a living proof of it. Should some smokers be a little more civil with the way they smoke? Yes. Should people diss us for smoking? No! Unless you ban alcohol and any airborne substance that people might us (for there is always someone feeling sick because of it), every single person has the right to smoke anywhere as long it is in an open, public space or their property.

I agree with the property part but not with the "public" space. Since "Open space" is always one of either, lets keep that out of it since the microparticles persist regardless of wether it is in- or outdoors.
If it is a public place, everyone should be able to be there. By allowing smoke there, you are effectively forcing people who cant tolerate smoke for medical reasons to stay away. The smokers do not have this problem so what you are in effect doing is to set one social groups "wants" over another groups "needs". Personally I find that ethically wrong.

Oh, and please, some people clearly haven't kissed a smoker before. Unless they are really frequent smokers, the "flavor" is quite tolerable, and hardly noticeable if they chew a gum before hand (or wash their teeth). In fact, I never kissed a smoker and felt bad, but boy do some non-smokers have bad breath...

I had a girlfriend who was a smoker when I was 17. It tasted like licking an ash tray and her clothes smelled even worse - but that is another discussion because it is based on subjective reasoning.

Edit:

Taekro:

There is not ONE person in this world that doesn't affect it's close surroundings and the people that are present there. In fact, 90% of the people are already contaminating the air just by using their deodorants and perfumes before exiting the house, and most make my nose react so bad I have to take 2 pills daily just so that I produce "only" a little amount of mucus... Did you know what makes my nose stop running for about an hour? A FREAKING CIGAR!

I see no reason why other pollution needs to be involved. Its the same old argument - does the fact that Tim, Jenny and Albert does something bad, make it better that Bob also do something bad? Of course it doesnt make Bobs bad actions better. If you have an opportinity to improve health, why not take it? As it stands, cigarettes have no impact on society and does not contribute to anything. You use them for medicinal purposes and that should naturally be possible (just like medicinal cannabis imo but again - another discussion) to retain.

 

[JET1971]

Oh and it smells like crap but I guess that goes without saying. Its just sad that smoking also blocks up to 80% of the smell receptors, making smokers unaware of how much it actually stinks. If you are a smoker, try stopping for just a week, then light up and smoke and note the smell - by then, your smell recepters will be almost in full working order again and you should be able to smell almost what non-smokers smell.

Please cite the sources for that 80% figure. That sounds like bullshit to me especialy considering the websites i looked through for this thread did not mention anything about a loss of the sense of smell as being a side affect.

Oh wait....

making smokers unaware of how much it actually stinks.

Hmm odd i thought it was the fact that once you get used to a smell such as a jocks armpit after playing his sport you ignore it and then dont notice it.

Oh and I hate going inside a gym because of the smell of rancid jock armpit. A real stink compared to a smoker and my -80% sense of smell detects it and I know what a smoker smell like right after they have one and i have not.

 

[zehydra]

Well, smoking sure as hell isn't hygenic.

Hygene and healthy are not the same thing. The smells from smoke are not a hygene issue the same as the perfumes in soap are not or even better perfume/cologne sprayed onto you.

stains on the fingers? Blackberry stains on fingers.
stained teeth? Coffee or tea.

Smoking has absolutly nothing to do with hygene.

Yes it does.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygiene

Hygiene and Healthy are very much intertwined.

But cigarettes do far more to the teeth than temporary stains.

 

[RaNDM G]

Pretty much everyone on my dad's side of the family smokes, so it doesn't really bother me.

 

[Levethian]

Weakness - "I can't give up smoking, I'm addicted to it."

Have you ever been addicted to nicotine/heroin/cocaine?

Not a fair comparison though - Nictoine is more addictive than heroin or cocaine.

I imagine a great many people carry this weakness.

 

[Quiet Stranger]

I think ANYONE who starts up today, like just starts smoking now, are fucking idiots, we have all this information about it and how bad it is for you so why even start?

 

[EtherealBeaver]

Please cite the sources for that 80% figure. That sounds like bullshit to me especialy considering the websites i looked through for this thread did not mention anything about a loss of the sense of smell as being a side affect.

Medicinsk Kompendium Bind 2 page 2740-2749 (a Danish compendium for medicine students. Translates into Medicinal Compendium Book 2 page 2740-2749.

EDIT: cba translate 9 full A4 pages which I have to write in manually but you are free to look up the book and read for yourself.

 

[OutforEC]

Honestly, if smokers were a bit more conscientious towards those who do not share the habit, and non-smokers were a little more informed about the over-hyped 'dangers' of environmental smoke, I don't think we'd have gotten as far as we have in this war on smokers.

 

[Tonythion]

Haaah you know I've never seen a person smoking in a crowd of people. I've never seen someone leave a shop to smoke in front of it. I've never seen a person smoking in front of a hospital and I never seen a person smoking in a persons face.

I live in a neighborhood/town where people smoke pot, do drugs, drink, drink AND DRIVE, beat their families and never have I seen someone smoke in a public place. I live near LA for goodness sakes-I'm fifteen minutes away so you can't say it happens a lot in cities. Dear lord I've never seen this happen anywhere.

I'm a smoker--I don't smoke in public, I don't blow smoke in people's faces, I politely excuse myself to go smoke in an alley or in my room and I never smoke on someones property. If I'm at a friends house even if they are okay with it I won't even smoke in their yard.

Also I can safely say I don't smell. My friends sit on my lap, they hug me, they cling onto me and most of the time they ask what kind of cologne I wear--I don't wear cologne its my soap because I am clean.

People are way to harsh on smokers and their are some idiots that will FOLLOW a smoker preaching about the effects of second hand smoke. I know this first hand. A friend of mine and I excused ourselves and went outside, walked half a block to an alley and lit up--this girl followed us and started preaching about how this was hurting HER. She was the loony one and followed us.

My dad smokes--been smoking for more than 40 years. For the first ten years of my life he used to smoke in front of me--that was bad on his account, I admit that, but my lungs are clean as a whistle, even now. My doctor is amazed at my lung capacity and such.

From what I heard a lot of people say they wouldn't date someone who smokes because they taste horrible--well those people you date must only brush their teeth once a day. Plus my father smells more like alcohol than smoke. His breath smells more like cheap bear than smoke and he's more dangerous to me when he's drinking than when he is smoking but everyone encourages him to drink at a party. Why is drinking more acceptable than smoking?

p.s. My dad and I smell like cherries and smoked wood because we buy NICE tobacco

 

[OutforEC]

I think ANYONE who starts up today, like just starts smoking now, are fucking idiots, we have all this information about it and how bad it is for you so why even start?

Same reasons that people start drinking, or eating poorly, or skydiving, or automobile racing, or...