Are Racist and Sexist jokes ok if they are used purely in a joking manner?

Recommended Videos

UberNoodle

New member
Apr 6, 2010
865
0
0
Alade said:
All jokes should be allowed no matter how horrible, as long as the intention of the joke is to make people laugh and not call out someone. And for people who do take such stuff serious, please get a sense of humor.
Sure, I agree in part, but would like to add that, all jokes MUST be allowed because we are free. However, all joke makers must take responsibility for their words and actions.

Whether or not a person takes things seriously or lacks a sense of humour, is entirely subjective. A comic with real wit and intellect would recognise that and take responsibility for how their words affect others.

That doesn't mean they should hide their opinions or censor themselves, but they must accept that it was their words which caused offense and not belittle the other person for feeling as they did.

Communication is a colaborative effort, and statements of all kinds are never 'fire and forget'. They are guided all way, and if you miss, at least part of that is your responsibility.

How that other person reacts is their own matter, and not your responsibility. How you are understood, for the most part, IS.
 

SovietPanda

New member
Jun 5, 2011
102
0
0
Luthir Fontaine said:
just watch your ass and dont say/make a offenive joke in the presents of the race, gender, or whatever

But really raciest and sexist jokes were funny back in high school find something else to make fun of.....like poltics or something
i disagree, if your unwilling to make a joke about a particular group, be it race sex religion in the presence of those people, then maybe you shouldnt say it at all... i make sexist jokes to the feminst at work, racist comments to my mexican and asian co-workers. Only making n***** jokes when there are no black people around or only making sexist jokes amongst the boys seems like prejudicial behavior to me.

OT: I used to work with a guy in a wheelchair, he loved my joke "paraplegic walks into a bar"
 

Eggsnham

New member
Apr 29, 2009
4,052
0
0
It depends, if it's funny and you keep it in a low-key sort of manner, then there shouldn't be any problem.

But if you're in everyone's faces screaming racial slurs and sexist ideas and expecting people to laugh, then you're both a douche, and an idiot.

I personally think that we shouldn't be afraid of words or phrases, after all, they ARE just words.

But we should also keep a level of respect for the history of these words.

For example the 'N' word (which I won't type out because of some rule that I'm sure exists about it on the Escapist). I don't think white people should be punished or shunned for saying it, but I also don't think that we should say it constantly or with racist intent.

Like every parent who ever existed has once said: "There's a time and place for everything."

Then again, what do I know? I'm a white, male, 16 year old kid living in the suburbs.
 

Berlioz

New member
Aug 2, 2010
33
0
0
NinjaDeathSlap said:
Nouw said:
It's humour and humour is subjective. You can't tell someone to stop laughing at a joke 'because it's racist' because it's a joke. Obviously, context and intent apply greatly.

Food for thought.
I like this guy. Particularly the bit he did on Health and Safety in that same sketch.

"How on earth did you not fall in that hole when there were no signs there?"
"Easy, my parents taught me not to be a dick."
This guy should be president.

Anyone offended by racist or sexist jokes when they're just that, jokes, has no sense of humor and should be shot.

Why shot? Well, since he takes me seriously, I'll take him seriously too. xD
 

SillyBear

New member
May 10, 2011
762
0
0
ChildofGallifrey said:
A word can't offend you unless you let it. One of my very good friends back home in Baton Rouge is black, and he would always jokingly refer to himself as 'the Black'. Eventually it became a running gag between the two of us (and somewhere along the line we started using heavy Russian accents, making it seem even funnier). He embraced the slightly racist joke, so if anyone would try to use it in an offensive manner it would have already lost all its power.
My friends do the same with me, but it's all about the context. I know they love me so I know when they make black jokes they aren't doing it out of hate. However if a shop keeper said it, i'd be pretty badly offended. I guess it is all subjective.
 

-Dragmire-

King over my mind
Mar 29, 2011
2,821
0
0
I find the concept of judging a person based on gender and color strange because it was never brought up when I was a child. I find those jokes funny because of how stupid it sounds to me.

Basically, when I hear a racist/sexist joke I laugh at the concept rather than the person/people it's supposed to make fun of.

A joke is a joke when it's not taken seriously. nuff said.
 

zeldagirl

New member
Mar 15, 2011
177
0
0
I was going to say something but this:

w00tage said:
No. No it is not. Even if you're friends with someone of a different race, even if you've dated people of that race, even if you make a joke that a) is about your friend who is of that race and physically present, b) is not racially insulting at all, c) has everyone of all races in the room laughing (including other, non-friend members of that same race),

but d) uses words that that some members of that race finds offensive from others (even though they freely use it among themselves) for the delivery of the joke...

... it can and will be held against you. Officially, as in on official records. And that's pretty much forever now.

So no. Don't do it. Regardless if no one else will be hurt by it, YOU can, and for a long, long time after the moment has passed. Just drop the thought and wait until another joke comes along.
and this:

funguy2121 said:
Elfgore said:
A few weeks back I was in Social Studies with my friend and I see this vocabulary word. The word was Equal Rights Admenment. (The one for women). I then go "Hey wanna see a good joke." And then I point at the word. Is this okay that I did this. I don't think there is anything wrong with equal rights with women. I just thought it was funny. So opinions?
If you can't explain why you thought a joke was funny, then you don't have enough of a command over the art of humor to make that judgement call. It's like Michael Bay deciding that he's a comedian and putting racist monkeyesque transformers with gold teeth in his movie. The end result: it's not funny, it is racist/sexist, and the only accomplishment is that you look like an asshole. I'm not suggesting that you deconstruct the joke, as that would ruin it (if there really is a joke in there). But if you can't explain at all what makes you laugh about it, and you know you said something bigoted, regardless of whether you meant it, then you must have laughed because you were very naughty and said something derogatory towards a large group of people.

There's 3 types of jokes I've encountered that deal with bigotry. There are those that simply pander (see: Larry the Cable Racist and Jeff Dunham), there are those that pick on people who actually behave sterotypically and make fun of dipshits of all races, religions, genders, sexual orientations etc. (Family Guy, Chappelle's Show, Yahztee, who's review of 50 Cent: Blood in the Sand addressed this very issue better than I've ever heard. Seriously, watch that video right now), and there are those jokes by sophisticated comics who are very good at coming behind someone who's swept some subjects they'd rather not acknowledge under the rug and say, "Hey, what's this ya got here under the rug?" (David Cross, Bill Hicks, Sarah Silverman). What you described above definitely belongs in one of the former categories, and if you can't or won't define why you laughed at equality for women, it would seem that it's an instance of pandering, like when I get to hear all of the wonderful "******" jokes when the black people leave the room (for the irony-impaired, that was sarcasm).
pretty much covered everything. Context is everything, but most of the time, racist/sexist jokes are made out of ignorance, and people don't realize the history behind why the joke was created in the first place.

To those people who say 'take a joke,' try to keep in mind that when you are of an identity that is often insulted or made to feel 'less than' constantly, day in and day out, jokes become less funny. People don't always like their identity being marginalized.

On that note, I don't often hear about specific jokes targeted at rich, straight, white men (though I've often see them tell racist/sexist jokes). Perhaps I've just missed people saying them, but I think it's significant that jokes of that nature are far less prevalent.
 

artanis_neravar

New member
Apr 18, 2011
2,560
0
0
AsthmaticPsycho said:
No, I'm of the view that there's nothing wrong with it when used in this manner. Ya see, if something can't be joked about, then it's just completely ignored as if people pretend it doesn't exist. You have to be able to joke about these types of things, or it's just political correctness gone mad.

Obviously there are still some limits, but my point stands.
This, the good or bad of it lies in the motive behind the act, not the act itself
 

SuperNova221

New member
May 29, 2010
393
0
0
Yes. If you get offended by a joke with no ill intent behind it you are trying to be offended. Only problem is that they are overused and none of them are really that funny if you have some reason and notice that they are (nearly) all based on stereotypes.
 

artanis_neravar

New member
Apr 18, 2011
2,560
0
0
funguy2121 said:
Elfgore said:
A few weeks back I was in Social Studies with my friend and I see this vocabulary word. The word was Equal Rights Admenment. (The one for women). I then go "Hey wanna see a good joke." And then I point at the word. Is this okay that I did this. I don't think there is anything wrong with equal rights with women. I just thought it was funny. So opinions?
If you can't explain why you thought a joke was funny, then you don't have enough of a command over the art of humor to make that judgement call. It's like Michael Bay deciding that he's a comedian and putting racist monkeyesque transformers with gold teeth in his movie. The end result: it's not funny, it is racist/sexist, and the only accomplishment is that you look like an asshole. I'm not suggesting that you deconstruct the joke, as that would ruin it (if there really is a joke in there). But if you can't explain at all what makes you laugh about it, and you know you said something bigoted, regardless of whether you meant it, then you must have laughed because you were very naughty and said something derogatory towards a large group of people.

There's 3 types of jokes I've encountered that deal with bigotry. There are those that simply pander (see: Larry the Cable Racist and Jeff Dunham), there are those that pick on people who actually behave sterotypically and make fun of dipshits of all races, religions, genders, sexual orientations etc. (Family Guy, Chappelle's Show, Yahztee, who's review of 50 Cent: Blood in the Sand addressed this very issue better than I've ever heard. Seriously, watch that video right now), and there are those jokes by sophisticated comics who are very good at coming behind someone who's swept some subjects they'd rather not acknowledge under the rug and say, "Hey, what's this ya got here under the rug?" (David Cross, Bill Hicks, Sarah Silverman). What you described above definitely belongs in one of the former categories, and if you can't or won't define why you laughed at equality for women, it would seem that it's an instance of pandering, like when I get to hear all of the wonderful "******" jokes when the black people leave the room (for the irony-impaired, that was sarcasm).
I find it funny because there are people out there who actually believe it, for me I'm not laughing at the expense of the group that the joke is about, I'm laughing at the people who believe what the joke is about. Where does that fall? (honestly asking not trying to be an ass)
 

quantumsoul

New member
Jun 10, 2010
319
0
0
It really helps to know your audience when making a joke. If they'd find it funny, go for it. If not, then shut up. Of course you don't always know. So use your best judgement in those cases.
 

Vrex360

Badass Alien
Mar 2, 2009
8,377
0
0
Honestly?
No.

For the most part anyway, some jokes just shouldn't be acceptable to make. People who make jokes that ridicule the plight of people starving in the civil war torn sections of Africa for instance are not being clever comedians, they are just being jerks.

Likewise, I have little to no respect for people who decide to casually drop jokes about rape and domestic abuse. Especially when they don't actually have to be in the context of what is being talked about (Jim Sterling, I'm looking at you).

To me, I have no problems with edgy jokes that tackle controversial subject matter, but if said jokes are going to happen they have to be done in a clever, well thought out and actually funny way. None of this 'LOL RAPE' or 'LOL HOLOCAUST' or 'LOL GENOCIDE IN AFRICA' shit. That's just being nasty, not funny, and it doesn't deserve to be defended by 'it's just a joke'.
Because ideally a joke is something that everyone can laugh at, if large numbers of your audience are deeply offended that you would take incredibly sensitive subject matters and ridicule them for shock value, then you have failed at joke telling.

As far as taking edgy subject matters and using them as the basis for clever satire, I have no problem with that either. However it would be nice if more comedians actually knew what satire was.
Satire is the art of social criticism using wit as a weapon. You are to mock one group in particular and try to raise disgust and criticism towards it.

For instance the episode of the Simpsons about Apu almost being deported because of Springfield's newfound hatred of immigrants? That was social satire, depicting the American people as idiots who are ready to agree to hate whoever they are told to hate as a scapegoat against real problems, and it was juxtaposed by the harshness of Apu almost being forced to give up his own sense of personal cultural identity just to stay in the country.
That was satire, mocking the people who oppose immigration. As well as encouraging us to actually be angry about the effect this has on people's lives.

That's why when people tell me Duke Nukem Forever is a satire of sexism, I don't buy that. Nothing about how the game was marketted suggests that they are criticising the idea of sexism or using women as sex objects, and the character Duke himself never becomes someone we are expected to dislike or pity. It certainly isn't critizing Duke, if anything it's celebrating all the sexist imagery.
Especially with that whole 'Capture the babe' thing. The game that makes a woman into a human equivilant of the 'flag' in a CTF gametype. One who you have to clam down by slapping her on the arse.
If this was meant to represent some kind of deep and important criticism of sexism, I'm not seeing it. And if this is some sort of joke, I, and a lot of women's rights groups, are not laughing.

That's the problem I have these days, too many people think the label 'satire' automatically acts as a 'get out of jail free' card. When really satire is a carefully thought out comedic style and can't be applied to everything. In the case of Duke Nukem, they aren't satirizing the idea of using women as sex symbols, they are just DOING it.
Albeit over the top but still...

To wrap this up, I'll give my views on stereotypes in comedy.

To my mind there are two kinds of stereotypes in this world, Apu from the Simpsons and the Mexican Cleaning Lady from Family Guy.
Let's have a look at both:

Apu: An indian man who works at a convienience store. He has a wife from an arranged marriage and eight children.
In essence these are all stereotypical traits, and the Simpsons have done a few episodes that make fun of India. But Apu is also an actual well rounded character. We learn a lot about him, like that he's a vegan, he was once part of the Bee Sharps, he at one point had an extra marrital affair and he's a close friend of Homer's and indeed the rest of the Simpsons family.
He has had whole episodes dedicated to him, most of which have nothing to do with him being Indian. In fact more often when jokes about Indian culture are made, it's at the expense of the Simpsons family themselves, not Apu.
Like when Homer dressed up as Ganesh to try and stop Apu's wedding and got beaten up. Or again when they tried to fix up Apu's marriage by dressing the kids up as Ganesh and ordering the Fudgemahal. Hence with all this characterization and general warm affection he's given by the rest of the cast and how most of the jokes about Indian culture aren't actually mocking HIM, all the little stereotypes don't FEEL as much like stereotypes.

Then you flip over to Family Guy and well:

Cleaning lady: A stereotypical annoying cleaning lady who can't speak english, who they bring in from time to time to pad out the length of jokes.
That's it. That's all she ever amounts to. That's her SOLE purpose on the show is to be the annoying character who they wheel out from time to time to make fun of the Latin-American stereotype.
But of course, given that she has no role in the story or characterization beyond it and is the butt of all the jokes relating to it, she feels much less like a JOKE on Latin-American stereotypes and so much more seems like she just IS a stereotype.
I don't like it, I find it racist and hell... it's not even entertaining to watch.

I guess to wrap this all up, sometimes racist jokes can be okay, but they had better be well told and given good context. If you want to use stereotypes try to give the characters involved a little bit more characterization so that it's less painfully obvious, avoid really controversial issues unless your jokes are actually in some way or another commenting on them in a well thought out way.
And for the love of god, stop using 'satire' as an excuse for everything.
 

ninja51

New member
Mar 28, 2010
342
0
0
A jokes a joke, to me, humor has no limits. One could joke about genoside, and if its funny its funny. Only when person is serious about somthing thats wrong is when things become not ok.
 

Tim Mazzola

New member
Dec 27, 2010
192
0
0
I think it's hilarious. It's just a joke. If people get offended they need to lighten up. And even so, you still have a right to say it. Some people may say it makes you an asshole, but they can't say that you can't say it. I, for one, say it DOESN'T make you an asshole, and if you're clearly just joking, you're just joking. It's funny, and frankly, as long as you don't MEAN those sentiments in a hurtful manner, it's not wrong at all.
 
Sep 14, 2009
9,071
0
0
AsthmaticPsycho said:
No, I'm of the view that there's nothing wrong with it when used in this manner. Ya see, if something can't be joked about, then it's just completely ignored as if people pretend it doesn't exist. You have to be able to joke about these types of things, or it's just political correctness gone mad.

Obviously there are still some limits, but my point stands.
this.

its all just words, its your intent on the use of them is what matters

I could care less if someone came up to me calling me a honky white trash chode midget, hell i'd probably laugh at just hearing it

i make jokes all the time about damn near everything, so if you are around me you better grow some thick skin quick otherwise we are probably going to have problems.
ultrachicken said:
I enjoy racist and sexist jokes, because the concepts of racism and sexism are extremely ridiculous to me, so having a laugh at the expense of these two concepts is perfectly fine with me.
this by far, me and my friends spend a good chunk of our time in public making fun of these very things, hell even making fun of the stereotypes against us ourselves, its all for the lulz and makes for a great time.
 

crop52

New member
Mar 16, 2011
314
0
0
It's not the joke that is a bad thing, it's that these jokes are part of what's keeping stereotypes alive,

so no, it's not okay, but whatever,
 

Luthir Fontaine

New member
Oct 16, 2010
323
0
0
SovietPanda said:
Luthir Fontaine said:
just watch your ass and dont say/make a offenive joke in the presents of the race, gender, or whatever

But really raciest and sexist jokes were funny back in high school find something else to make fun of.....like poltics or something
i disagree, if your unwilling to make a joke about a particular group, be it race sex religion in the presence of those people, then maybe you shouldnt say it at all... i make sexist jokes to the feminst at work, racist comments to my mexican and asian co-workers. Only making n***** jokes when there are no black people around or only making sexist jokes amongst the boys seems like prejudicial behavior to me.

OT: I used to work with a guy in a wheelchair, he loved my joke "paraplegic walks into a bar"
Not all people are as lucky as you my friend, Ive seen people fired for joking with a "friend."
 

Suicidal_Ferret

New member
Aug 9, 2010
40
0
0
Are you kidding me?

I'm all about equality.

I hate all races equally. *budatish*

Seriously though, it's about context and the group of people. A joke that makes one person laugh, will probably offend someone else. Crack a joke about how stupid [insert ethnicity] people are when you're surrounded by [previous ethnicity] and you're bound to get your @$$ kicked.