Autumn, a game about rape

[CaitSeith]

Companies are "making cash" on war and crime far more often, even portraying it as a fun past time and no one bats an eye.
Does that sicken you too?

yeah i can see how it is hypocritical to say that one is sickening while the other is not but then where do we draw the line? how about abortion doctors because we have games of war therefore we can have games of other traumatic events

while war and rape are in the same category (i.e. traumatic events) one has a purpose for existing (i.e. contra, call of duty, etc being more on self glory and less on the fact that people die) while the other just provides some type of "experience" which quite frankly is not something we really need

TL;DR my argument is that a game has to have gameplay and how do you make gameplay out of rape trauma?

That's the developpers' problem. Besides, If such topics were profitable, the AAA industry would use them instead of violence and war. And if you think those aren't controversial topics, remember Jack Thompson.

 

[EHKOS]

I'd be a lot more impressed if random people were black...perhaps one on the bus. I don't quite see how this can make you feel like a rape victim even if the scene itself is more graphic than the trailer shows. I'm just going to agree with riotguards

TL;DR my argument is that a game has to have gameplay and how do you make gameplay out of rape trauma?

and conclude that it won't have enough of, or the right, impact.

 

[visiblenoise]

Sounds dreadful as a game. I don't understand what the audience for this type of game is - either you have firsthand experience with the "topic" and want some kind of support, or you're simply curious about it, which to me seems uniquely morbid. And in any case, it won't raise much awareness because you're probably already aware if you're interested in the game.

I like that it's free though, so I'll stop there.

 

[Kathinka]

TL;DR my argument is that a game has to have gameplay and how do you make gameplay out of rape trauma?

Imagine the possibilities for the Quick Time Events!

Ok I'll show myself out now..

 

[CaitSeith]

I don't see why an indie developer shouldn't try to experiment with different topics. If the game isn't engaging, too bad for the developer. If it doesn't represent the topic properly, too bad for the developer. If it doesn't find its audience, too bad for the developer.

 

[MysticSlayer]

But if I had to choose between the two, I'd rather play a game with fun gameplay and a non-existent story than a game with a fantastic story but gameplay the makes it a chore to play through. Hell, most 'classic' games have very little story beyond offering a context for gameplay and are popular for no other reason than the quality of their gameplay.

I'm not trying to set up a story vs. gameplay dynamic where one has to be sacrificed for the other. My point was that we can't just look at a game, say it isn't fun, and then assume that it lacks any potential to engage the audience. Spec Ops: The Line engaged many people despite its lackluster gameplay, and some even questioned whether or not the gameplay was intentionally bad in order to drive home the message of the story. The Walking Dead had almost no gameplay, yet its emphasis on characters, choice, and the ways those two interacted resonated with players. Yes, those games aren't universally praised, and the gameplay is often one of the criticisms. But to deny that lackluster gameplay or minimalist gameplay didn't still resonate with players because of everything else around that gameplay is to deny the power those games so clearly had.

But again, this isn't to say that every game that has an engaging story needs to suddenly lose gameplay or make it bad. It is entirely possible that someone has a great story that they can tell, can tell it through more traditionally fun gameplay, and has the resources to do it. Heck, Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time, one of my favorite games of all time, had both a touching story and fantastic gameplay (I would argue among the best of any game in both categories), and those two often played off each other. However, we can't limit ourselves to just these situations, as some stories may require an alternative approach to gameplay.

And if you're not particularly fond of games that aren't traditionally fun, fine. I'm just asking that you don't dismiss those of us who also enjoy seeing the stories that can be told with alternative mechanics, as if we are somehow too blind to see how supposedly little we are enjoying ourselves.

 

[Riotguards]

I believe the point is that it's supposed to make you think about the topic and encourage you to try and see things from a perspective other than your. Consider it a thought-experiment tool or something similar.

I don't know if it's accurate to describe this as a game. Games attempt to entertain you. This looks less like it's trying to be entertaining, and more like it's trying to be though-provoking. I really am curious to see what the finished piece looks like. Not sure what I'd call it if it's not a game though. An Interactive Thought Experiment?

although i agree with your point that its more "though provoking" does it really need to exist?

do we need a simulation for us to understand or question the validity of a rape victims trauma, if anything i would assume its insulting to assume that you know "how they feel" and this game won't help by providing one persons interpretations of this event

for example simulations like an autism simulation or dyslexia, etc, etc can help people visualise and understand how people cope and experience their "faults"

Spoiler: example

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwS-qm8hUxc

a rape simulation is what? we know that rape is bad, we know that its traumatic and within the worst things to happen catagory but do we really need a simulation that recreates said experience (without the physical implications so its STILL not going to show us how traumatic it is)

That's the developers' problem. Besides, If such topics were profitable, the AAA industry would use them instead of violence and war. And if you think those aren't controversial topics, remember Jack Thompson.

my argument is not based on "make more rape happen in games" i'm saying that a game based solely on rape has no justification to exist, there could not possibly be any gameplay to this simulation (otherwise it insults the victims) and the message does not even need to be conveyed as its something we are as a first world country adamantly against (despite what "some" people will say)

and Jack Thompson's argument was that violent games will make children violent (or sexual, etc) Jack Thompson has always made it clear it effects children and thus we should regulate based on that (so basically parents have to check the age label on games before buying it)

 

[Alma Mare]

Finally, a good game about rape. Look forward to be able to rape all the minions I slay for their loot. I hope boss battles allow for extra-hard rape afterwards, for all the trouble we'll have to go through.

Wonder what kind of DLC they'll be able to make, though?

 

[one squirrel]

I've heard after you finish the game once, you can play the dark campaign.

 

[Methodia Chicken]

It looks interesting, clearly it's very early in development but with a bit more variability and choice it could be very powerful.

some simple things like randomizing the identity of your character and/or your attacker each game and even at times (after a few Playthroughs) totally obscuring them.
and conversation and social interaction mechanics (such as needing to leave a scenario where you don't feel safe, or mistrust of a loved one) would give the game a bit more in terms of substance rather than walking about in a crowd.

I look forward to seeing how it is handled.

 

[Rahkshi500]

I don't know, seems a bit too on the nose, but maybe it'll have an effect on others.

Things like rape in games should probably be handled a bit more metaphorical than just 'You're raped now, feel bad/sad/scared'.

I'll have to disagree. I believe that such uncomfortable subjects can very much be told from a metaphorical standpoint, but also from a more explicit standpoint. If we all believe that it can only be told from a metaphorical standpoint, then it can easily be just as pretentious and at worse, sugar-coating the real horror of such subjects. As much as I like Silent Hill 2, as Fox brought up, I didn't really get much out of Angela's torment even with all of the metaphorical stuff happening around the characters(and I would say the tape of him smothering his wife with a pillow was very blunt to be honest). And I'm just talking about uncomfortable subjects in general, not just with what Autumn is trying to talk about.

Now, I just think that, like Hatred, this is more of a wrong time and place for a game like Autumn to be made. We're still not at that point in time to be able to properly cover the subject of rape in fiction, let alone in video games.

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

ITT- a bunch of people who make me question my desire to make video games. Ever. And I don't even want to make art games. Generally speaking. I wonder, if I ever tried to make a game related to my experience with rape, would I get called a pretentious snob as well? Or would I get a pass for having a penis?


OT- Looks decent honestly. The lack of textures actually serves the game well from what I can tell, I like the different bits of visual warping and what not being used to display a rather tortured perception, the last little bit where the hat and glasses show up on the random guy is pretty nice. Hopefully they don't just put you completely on rails with it throughout, as that would be a bit disappointing. The later portions will probably be what it will all have to hinge on though (in my opinion at least). The experience of being raped sucks, but living with it is the thing that honestly is both easier for people to understand and probably a good deal more necessary.

 

[Haerthan]

Snip

... Holy Jesus ..............................

I saw the trailer, what a way to scare the s*** out of the viewers. Usually games that are 'meant' to be scary tend not to, but somehow this simple project with the girl avoiding the guy in the ally ... that was freaken creepy. My heart was racing and i'm a guy (to be fair, guys can be raped too...)

This project doesn't anger me, but i'm just speechless as to why someone's making this. I mean are we supposed to feel bad, scared, or hopeless? I want to understand the victim, believe me but what good shall it do being in their shoes during and after the crime? ... I just don't know. Maybe it's a good thing this game is being made for me to question so many things, but on the other hand, i'm feeling to conflicted to encourage this game in being made. Uncomfortable with how disturbing it is, but maybe that's the goal of the developer. He/she wants us to feel this uncomfortable because that's the reality of a rape victim's case. I even helped people through such harsh situations but to see myself in the girl's shoes as it happens? ... God man ........... I don't know.

Well I believe they are making it to raise awareness of sorts. One of the developers apparently managed to get away from a sexual assault without suffering much (that sounds weird on paper). Even without that, who is anyone to say that such games shouldn't exist? Which is why I am of the opinion that every game has a point (yes even you COD- don't aske me though, no idea what your point would be). The point of this one is to question ourselves, to challenge ourselves. I hope they are successful. I really do. And I hope the troglodytes yelling "this is no game" (or yelling it to Gone Home or other interactive story like that) stay home. I don't want piss in my self-challenging of my thought patterns.

 

[Haerthan]

ITT- a bunch of people who make me question my desire to make video games. Ever. And I don't even want to make art games. Generally speaking. I wonder, if I ever tried to make a game related to my experience with rape, would I get called a pretentious snob as well? Or would I get a pass for having a penis?


OT- Looks decent honestly. The lack of textures actually serves the game well from what I can tell, I like the different bits of visual warping and what not being used to display a rather tortured perception, the last little bit where the hat and glasses show up on the random guy is pretty nice. Hopefully they don't just put you completely on rails with it throughout, as that would be a bit disappointing. The later portions will probably be what it will all have to hinge on though (in my opinion at least). The experience of being raped sucks, but living with it is the thing that honestly is both easier for people to understand and probably a good deal more necessary.

Yea the lack of texture was interesting to say the least. Is that how a survivor sees the world? Devoid of any colour? I mean rape is a really disgusting act so its consequences on the victim must be deeply profound. Are the lack of textures and colour a way to show that profoundness? I am quite interested to say the least.

 

[Scow2]

i hope you get to have revenge on the rapist in the game. i would make him die as slowly and painfully as possible.

That largely defeats the point.

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

ITT- a bunch of people who make me question my desire to make video games. Ever. And I don't even want to make art games. Generally speaking. I wonder, if I ever tried to make a game related to my experience with rape, would I get called a pretentious snob as well? Or would I get a pass for having a penis?


OT- Looks decent honestly. The lack of textures actually serves the game well from what I can tell, I like the different bits of visual warping and what not being used to display a rather tortured perception, the last little bit where the hat and glasses show up on the random guy is pretty nice. Hopefully they don't just put you completely on rails with it throughout, as that would be a bit disappointing. The later portions will probably be what it will all have to hinge on though (in my opinion at least). The experience of being raped sucks, but living with it is the thing that honestly is both easier for people to understand and probably a good deal more necessary.

Yea the lack of texture was interesting to say the least. Is that how a survivor sees the world? Devoid of any colour? I mean rape is a really disgusting act so its consequences on the victim must be deeply profound. Are the lack of textures and colour a way to show that profoundness? I am quite interested to say the least.

Generally a lack of color is used to portray depression and the lack of details could be alienating. Those are definitely two potential responses to rape. For me it was a kind of frightened guilt. I knew something was very wrong, and I wound up blaming myself to some degree.

 

[Dansen]

Aren't most rape incidents carried out by a person(s) whom the victim already knows on some level? It seems like the guy in the beginning was a stranger, on the street no less.

I hope there is a genuine desire to make the game and not just some ill conceived attempt to gain publicity by doing something controversial.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

I could see the game kinda work as a pseudo horror game. Like an open world where you go from home to job and back and days pass by. You may or may not be attacked whenever there is no one around. You can always get away. But when you get raped (I... this sounds so fucked up for a game (-_-') ), you might be "attacked" by "phantoms" in the future. Like the bus scene. Suddenly someone there just starts attacking you in from of the people. He chances into the person that raped you and starts running towards you. The moment he's about to get you he turns back to the normal model and walks by. It would/should simulate the fear.

Though I don't see this ever being a bigger gamer, or even paid game. Seems like a 20 minute experience you could find on Newgrounds for free.

And even with all this, the game would fall into the trap that many crime analysts are warning about. It has a name but I don't know. It's about how TV shows showing the random street rape make people believe that's the only type of rape making it easier for people to overlook other kinds of "silent" rape.

 

[Haerthan]

ITT- a bunch of people who make me question my desire to make video games. Ever. And I don't even want to make art games. Generally speaking. I wonder, if I ever tried to make a game related to my experience with rape, would I get called a pretentious snob as well? Or would I get a pass for having a penis?


OT- Looks decent honestly. The lack of textures actually serves the game well from what I can tell, I like the different bits of visual warping and what not being used to display a rather tortured perception, the last little bit where the hat and glasses show up on the random guy is pretty nice. Hopefully they don't just put you completely on rails with it throughout, as that would be a bit disappointing. The later portions will probably be what it will all have to hinge on though (in my opinion at least). The experience of being raped sucks, but living with it is the thing that honestly is both easier for people to understand and probably a good deal more necessary.

Yea the lack of texture was interesting to say the least. Is that how a survivor sees the world? Devoid of any colour? I mean rape is a really disgusting act so its consequences on the victim must be deeply profound. Are the lack of textures and colour a way to show that profoundness? I am quite interested to say the least.

Generally a lack of color is used to portray depression and the lack of details could be alienating. Those are definitely two potential responses to rape. For me it was a kind of frightened guilt. I knew something was very wrong, and I wound up blaming myself to some degree.

Hmmm. You know I never put much thought into it. I can, however, see how that would work. Now I am definitely interested, definitely interested. If just the trailer makes me put some thought into it, granted that should be taken with a grain of salt, usually I am interested. So yea I really hope they nail it, but considering what I know so far, most likely they will nail it.

Then we will once again have the needless debate of what constitutes a game.

 

[MirenBainesUSMC]

I guess my question is where is the entertainment value in the long run other than some electronic medium that is supposed to educate someone concerning the concept of rape? I'd say a face to face talk with a victim ( I don't like saying victim because it demeans the person, I'd rather say survivor).

I think one of the posters in the thread had already said what I basically support and that is, if you really wanted to convey the horror of a rape, its more hard hitting if you can simply write a very good scene and have it created within the game to give emotional impact.... and since talent like that is very scarce in this industry, I shall not hold my breath. Whomever wrote for The Last of Us could probably do it.

I also believe that attempting to create a traumatic event is also dangerous, particularly if we are dealing with something like the Occulus Rift. You could very well trip someone into believe they actually were raped and now they'll be affected mentally by it ---- I said " COULD" because we really don't know the sensitivity of some people and their mental strengths. This idea can go both ways --- you could even feed into a deviant person's mind and make them worse just as much as you could teach them the other way... the human mind is a very chaotic thing.

I personally think they should just leave it alone but... we live in very experimental and destructive times. The next thing they'll sell you is a re-creation of Abu Grab in which your flogged, beaten, water boarded, and humiliated to teach you that being in a military prison camp is the bad thing. Oh and wait! We have " Prison Camp: North Korea" DLC comming soon!